What’s that going to achieve? They should be handing out masks instead of fining or arresting people for not wearing one.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Either way, something needs to be done. It's piss poor to not wear one.
60,000 excess deaths
That’s the only way to ensure there is some level of public awareness. Have cops work with mayors, local authorities and hand them out around stores, subway stations etc. It’s both stupid and dangerous to issue a mandate and expect it to magically work. Any form of public policy is bound to fail when you don’t reinforce it with boots on ground working towards the same goal. It is literally what the govt is there for.
It’s not even about the masks. If they can’t even be arsed to follow such a simple request, does anyone think they’re taking the necessary steps to minimise spread in other areas of their life? Masks (lack of) are the canary in the coal mine to identify lazy, selfish turds.
(Apart from me on the multiple occasions I forget to bring the fecking thing with me to the shops, obvs...)
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Or people could behave like actual grown adults and take responsibility for themselves, instead of constantly needing everything done for them.
Here in Sweden they do a run once a month through the death register with all of the national ID’s for Covid-19 positive patients. If they find any in the register it’s put down as a Covid-death.
Sweden is almost bang on the money for excess deaths in 2020 and Covid-19 confirmed deaths so appears this is working.
24th of July onwards they will do but I expect some to slowly enforce it, some smaller shops to not bother. Will be interesting if big shops will hand them out instead turning customers away on the day.
Maddox is a star. I had hopes for Woodfin (B’hams mayor), but he fukced up the COVID/BLM situation based on what my friends back in Bama say.That’s awesome
And flu deaths will have been reduced so covid deaths will be quite a bit higher.
Yes.
That is what the experts predicted since January though. With its quick reinfection rate, people who won’t want to get vaccinated, the vaccines probably being only 50% effective etc, the disease won’t get eradicated. Hopefully it will evolve into something milder though.
Was the anxiety caused by covid or do you think it was because of the fear of having caught it?
It's easy to get into the swing of wearing a mask, and having one with you all the time. Leave one in the car, have one where you keep your keys or in your bag - just like you'd pick up your phone when you go out, you soon get used to picking up a mask too.
An enterprising little shop in our village is selling washable masks with our crest and village name printed on them. Simple surgical mask prices have been capped by the government and cost very little now, or you can get a mask for free from the Comune office.
If the UK wants people to wear a mask, they have to make it easy and very cheap to buy or get hold of masks.
An enterprising little shop in our village is selling washable masks with our crest and village name printed on them. Simple surgical mask prices have been capped by the government and cost very little now, or you can get a mask for free from the Comune office.
If the UK wants people to wear a mask, they have to make it easy and very cheap to buy or get hold of masks.
Yeah, but why give out masks when they can give us a £10 voucher for Nandos.
So they have halted the release of daily deaths. They can't even get something as sensitive as this right.
There is a big question mark over whether such vaccines would be accepted to be distributed on a massive scale by a loy of countries. WHO have stated 50% as a bare minimum.
I'm convinced it's a symptom. I'm a very relaxed person and I wasn't bothered about catching Covid. I didn't get the anxiety until lunchtime on day 5. I lost my sense of smell and taste that morning. On top of the anxiety, I got huge nausea and unbelievable hunger simultaneously. It was a really horrible day. Others have told me since that they also experienced a day like it during their infection.
No coincidence usa have pulled their figures the same week.
Me thinks they have agreed to try to fudge the numbers and say theyve be doing it all wrong.
Watch them nunbers magically reduce to disappear in the next few weeks and months
Brilliant. Christmas around the tree whilst granny is in the spare room gasping her last
In England, up until a couple of weeks ago, masks weren't in the shops - not in the typical supermarket anyway. They were available online, though stocks of the normally priced stuff ran out fast, they were back in stock in late April - but online shopping does knock out a significant percentage of the population, and the sheer number of options will have put off some others.
The first time I saw masks for sale in a supermarket was in late June, in a B&M (don't judge - the catsan is cheap in there
) at £3.99 for 2 of the basic disposable surgical masks - yes, the sort that sell for 50 for £10 online. I suspect that when the regulation comes in we'll have a couple of weeks in which the big supermarkets give unmasked people a mask at a stall outside the door or ask for a charity donation or something. Eventually, especially if the supermarkets start selling washable ones for a couple of quid, the actual grown adults will take responsibility for themselves.The government prevarication really hasn't helped - if they'd mandated it earlier, the habit would be there by now and the masks would be on sale everywhere. As it was, even a month ago, people were going to out-patient hospital appointments without a requirement to wear a mask, and without being given a mask at the door. Asking people to wear them routinely in shops now will have been a surprise to some people.
When I go to my local hospital for blood tests, they have:
Social distancing markers and chairs at those points outside before you even go in the door
At the door, a lady greets you and gives you a mask to wear if you don’t have one. She also takes your temperature
Reception has been cleared out so only 10 people can sit inside the reception area at one time
I can’t believe it when I read other hospitals aren’t even asking you to wear a mask!
Social distancing markers and chairs at those points outside before you even go in the door
At the door, a lady greets you and gives you a mask to wear if you don’t have one. She also takes your temperature
Reception has been cleared out so only 10 people can sit inside the reception area at one time
I can’t believe it when I read other hospitals aren’t even asking you to wear a mask!
Are you suggesting that all efforts to return to some level of normal should be scrapped until the virus magically disappears?
If this thing stays with us forever and does not become weaker any time soon, we could potentially have to live like this for decades.
Ultimately, people will perhaps be faced with a difficult choice between living longer and having extremely reduced human contact.
Same here. My usual appointments have been relocated to a private hospital to better safeguard patients.
When I arrive I have to wait outside and ring reception - someone then comes to escort me through and before I’m allowed in, I’m given a mask, temp check and hand sanitiser.
So how long did those symptoms last, mate? And when did/do you decide to quit self-isolating?
In England, up until a couple of weeks ago, masks weren't in the shops - not in the typical supermarket anyway. They were available online, though stocks of the normally priced stuff ran out fast, they were back in stock in late April - but online shopping does knock out a significant percentage of the population, and the sheer number of options will have put off some others.
The first time I saw masks for sale in a supermarket was in late June, in a B&M (don't judge - the catsan is cheap in there
The government prevarication really hasn't helped - if they'd mandated it earlier, the habit would be there by now and the masks would be on sale everywhere. As it was, even a month ago, people were going to out-patient hospital appointments without a requirement to wear a mask, and without being given a mask at the door. Asking people to wear them routinely in shops now will have been a surprise to some people.
That’s so strange. Masks have been in shops everywhere here for ages. A bit of price gouging in March/April but that went away once the initial supply crisis eased. They’re all over the place now. With a cottage industry built up around cotton reusable face coverings.
Still, though, they are available in the UK. Online and in bricks and mortar stores. So I’m not buying lack of availability as an excuse. The recommendations have been muddled/unclear for a while now but that’s not an excuse now either. People really should be buying/wearing masks in shops and I stand by my lazy/selfish description of those who do not.
I think most people are optimistic enough to think that something will change - a (mostly) effective vaccine will arrive, a better treatment option will appear, or the virus itself will change in a way that benefits us. So the best we can do for now is stall it. I also suspect we'll see massive improvements in testing methods and turnround times - maybe even reaching the "test while you wait" point for air travellers etc, and certainly reaching a point where weekly tests and/or overnight tests are an option (that maybe even allow you to do things like go to a pub, cinema, football match, ride on public transport etc).
It then comes down to the (largely political) options on how you allow people to move closer to normal life without pushing the R rate up past one. If you want businesses operating again, for example, what's the problem sticking with a "work from home when you can" and a "flexible working times" mandate as the standard - with employers having to prove why it doesn't work for them and showing how they'll make it safe? Rather than this wishy-washy hope that employers are more responsible/scientifically aware than the government.
At the beginning of all of this I made some decent no-sew masks from an old tee-shirt. The advantage of those is that they fit any face size!
I doubt they'll bring them back at all, all part of their let's just move on approach. It also conveniently feeds into this narrative of the numbers being misleading that the right wing fringe media are using to defend the government.
I actually fully agree with you, but, as you said yourself, there are no guarantees in regards what will happen. By Western Christmas, between 9-11 months have passed since shit hit the fan, depending on where you live. This is not a negligible amount of time for anyone and it is a huge amount of time for young children and the elderly. For example, my older son, who is two, is missing out on developing social skills by not having had contact with other children for months, while my grandmother, who is 84, has spent a half of what could be one of her final years on this world in isolation.
So, while I agree on waiting until seeing what the vaccines can do for us, there has to be a point of time when people will pick quality of life over life expectancy and I see no reason for such cynical responses to any news that suggest that countries are trying to restore some level of normalcy. There is a reason other than depression and existential angst why suicide is a thing.
Also, Johnson has clearly stated that his plan was predicated by things not taking a sharp turn for the worse, so really cannot see why there should be any vitriol in response to such news.
The trouble is that the government hasn't got a lot of credibility in this area. Sluggish and incomplete responses in some areas, and an air of "making it up as they go along" when it comes to trying to spin their way out of mistakes. A dangerous mix of complacency and arrogance - trust in Boris's words comes a long way behind suspicion and cynicism.
That said, I do agree with you on the general principle - we continue to face a choice between quality of life and duration. Usually those choices are about our own personal health. Unfortunately this time it's tougher than usual because the risks we take for ourselves impact other people. We already know why we can't hug grannny, what we can't yet admit is that we're heading into a time when we need to choose between going to a pub on Saturday or visiting granny on Sunday. Similarly when the kids go back to school, we have to find ways to avoid granny as babysitter, or at risk teacher as collateral damage, or disabled/ill kids/parents being left behind completely.
Those themes need leadership and honesty (and in some cases money) because "normality" means choices and people need to face what those choices really mean. They also need to have real choices - and things like a packed tube/metro/bus journey during the rush hour takes those choices away. Which takes us back to leadership again.
Reinfection is the one area we are still totally in the dark about. Other than a handful of anecdotal stories there has been no proof of reinfection, and we do know antibodies are not the whole story when it comes to immunity. It looks likely its here to stay in one form or another, but far from certain.
I don’t disagree with you, I just hate Johnson’s sound bites, Trump style, winging it.
How about instead saying something like “IF everyone gets onboard with face masks now, we may jolly well have a semi normal Christmas”?
Instead his message comes across as “we will be fine by Christmas” when clearly we won’t be.
I’m just sick of the bollocks from Trump and Johnson
12 days overall. I was allowed to return to work after day 8, provided I didn't have a temperature for 48 hours and felt well enough. As it turns out, my rota had me back on day 12 so I went back then.
In the US as well. Everything is so confusing. Don't know what to think.
That’s not death by natural causes is it?
I am just glad that everything will be back to normal by Christmas . Will we have football crowds back next season now ?
Boris says fans could be back by October. I wonder how many will be dead by Christmas?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/53441670