I wonder if a similar thread will arise for Alexis if we wait enough.
Was Veron a flop?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Yes, obviously.
He was bought to strengthen our first XI but couldn't.
He was bought to strengthen our first XI but couldn't.
His superb pass to Forlan vs Chelsea to win the game was a pivotal moment in the title race in the 2002/03 season. He was an absolutely brilliant player that was bought due to a lack of creativity at the champions league level. Sadly it didn't work out at United but La Brujita still left fond moments for me as a fan and even the players that played with him. It also showed how brave Fergie was in the transfer market that even when he had Scholes he wanted to sign someone better to improve the first 11. And he had no problem doing that for the entirety of his managerial career. Now a section of the fan base have developed a mentality that just because we have such and such we shouldn't sign player x. God forbid we try and improve the first 11..
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Flop is way too strong a description. He'd be in a Berbatov like bracket where it wasn't a huge success but i'd be surprised if any supporter was sorry we bought him. He was incredibly talented and a lot of fun to watch. And it wasn't all bad, actually very little was bad. It was mostly good and occasionally outrageously brilliant.
100% flop. Didn't live up to the expectations. A shadow of the player he was at Lazio. Couldn't handle the pace of the PL, was unmotivated and lazy.
For 28 mil pounds which is like 40 in todays market, i would not call him flop.
We bought VDB for same, hmm.
I thought back then when Becks left he would stay, he had good US pre-season.
We bought VDB for same, hmm.
I thought back then when Becks left he would stay, he had good US pre-season.
JSV was considered the second best playmaker in the Serie A after Zinedine Zidane. Sir Alex signed him because Keane was growing old so he wanted to divert from the very direct 4-4-2 system and turn it into a more conservative 4-4-1-1 system.
I think that JSV's experiment failed for three reasons
A- JSV was used to a slower tempo and a specialised style of football. Playmakers were seen as artisans whose job was to dictate tempo and create chances. Concepts like dropping deep and winning the ball were alien to him. You only need to listen to Scholes's and Keane's criticism at Pogba to understand how our midfield react to someone like him in our midfield.
B- JSV was quite happy in Italy. He left the place because he risked a huge suspension because of the dual passport scandal. That was hardly a motivation to do well with us. Soon enough there were solid rumours of him suffering from home sickness.
C- Scholes was initially a no 10. He was moved in midfield due to him being too young to succeed Cantona. Sir Alex genuinely that Paul could build upon the stellar performances he showed when Eric was suspended. It wasn't the case. By that time Paul was well settled in midfield and in no mood to be uprooted from there. JSV fount Scholes constantly playing in his areas and he was surrounded by a close knit group who were pretty much pro Scholes. That became a problem.
The JSV's signing failed to reach the high expectations set. However I wouldn't consider it as a total failure.
A- JSV did very well in the CL.
B- JSV gave Scholes a huge kick on the backside. Pre Veron Scholes was a top talent whose main aim was to score goals. Post Veron Scholes was more mature and more aware of other aspects of the game like long range passing etc. We can say that JSV was instrumental in Scholes development. In fact Scholes in his later years played very much like JSV did.
I think that JSV's experiment failed for three reasons
A- JSV was used to a slower tempo and a specialised style of football. Playmakers were seen as artisans whose job was to dictate tempo and create chances. Concepts like dropping deep and winning the ball were alien to him. You only need to listen to Scholes's and Keane's criticism at Pogba to understand how our midfield react to someone like him in our midfield.
B- JSV was quite happy in Italy. He left the place because he risked a huge suspension because of the dual passport scandal. That was hardly a motivation to do well with us. Soon enough there were solid rumours of him suffering from home sickness.
C- Scholes was initially a no 10. He was moved in midfield due to him being too young to succeed Cantona. Sir Alex genuinely that Paul could build upon the stellar performances he showed when Eric was suspended. It wasn't the case. By that time Paul was well settled in midfield and in no mood to be uprooted from there. JSV fount Scholes constantly playing in his areas and he was surrounded by a close knit group who were pretty much pro Scholes. That became a problem.
The JSV's signing failed to reach the high expectations set. However I wouldn't consider it as a total failure.
A- JSV did very well in the CL.
B- JSV gave Scholes a huge kick on the backside. Pre Veron Scholes was a top talent whose main aim was to score goals. Post Veron Scholes was more mature and more aware of other aspects of the game like long range passing etc. We can say that JSV was instrumental in Scholes development. In fact Scholes in his later years played very much like JSV did.
Juan Veron was a hugely expensive signing at the time. He was far expensive then Lampard, Thuram, Pippo Inzaghi, Toldo, Pirlo, Stam and RVN and more at par to the signing of Rui Costa, Mendieta and Pavel Nedved.
Yep. I think he also kind of gave up. At the end of the day, during the second season we went on a title run - without him.
Not really something we do regularly, though... I only remember it happening once more, against Barcelona in 1998. I think it was a case of the referee deciding the two home sets clash, and the away team not having their away kit around.
People barely remember he ever played for us.
If he were in the team now he would be a superstar
more like £90-100m
we couldn’t buy someone with his pedigree for anywhere close to £40m.
28 million is not 40 million in today's market. It was around 20% of our total revenue, so it would be around 100 million in today's market.
He was the 7th most expensive player of all time at the time we bought him behind Zidane, Figo, Crespo, Buffon, Vieri and Mendieta.
Total flop, remember him coming from Lazio and thinking we’ll see nothing but bangers from his guy for years. Didn’t happen.
Yeah, but it opened the door for the practice of wearing our away kit when we don’t need to for entirely promotional purposes, which we’ve done several times in the last year alone - one of which in a European Semi-final - and I ain’t about that life ‘son!
I was a massive fan of the golden era of Serie A
Loved watching Veron at Samp, Parma, Lazio and the Argentina national team.
I watched alot of him.
I think i was the only one not entralled when we bought him though.
Not because I didnt think he was a top player, he was.
I just didnt know where he would fit in our midfield. As i thought Keane and Scholes who played in his postion were better alot than him.
My transfer wish list that summer 2001 apart from RVN was Sol Campbell (to partner Stam), Lilian Thuram and Rivaldo.
Loved watching Veron at Samp, Parma, Lazio and the Argentina national team.
I watched alot of him.
I think i was the only one not entralled when we bought him though.
Not because I didnt think he was a top player, he was.
I just didnt know where he would fit in our midfield. As i thought Keane and Scholes who played in his postion were better alot than him.
My transfer wish list that summer 2001 apart from RVN was Sol Campbell (to partner Stam), Lilian Thuram and Rivaldo.
I agree he couldnt handle the pace and high pressure of the Prem.
He wasnt lazy though.
He covered alot of ground in the midfield and closed down the opposition alot.
he couldnt tackle for toffee mind.
Still worked hard
Tell you who wasnt a flop William Salibas mate.
I was a massive fan of the golden era of Serie A
Loved watching Veron at Samp, Parma, Lazio and the Argentina national team.
I watched alot of him.
I think i was the only one not entralled when we bought him though.
Not because I didnt think he was a top player, he was.
I just didnt know where he would fit in our midfield. As i thought Keane and Scholes who played in his postion were better alot than him.
My transfer wish list that summer 2001 apart from RVN was Sol Campbell (to partner Stam), Lilian Thuram and Rivaldo.
A man of taste
With you all the way on that one!
My transfer wish list that summer 2001 apart from RVN was Sol Campbell (to partner Stam), Lilian Thuram and Rivaldo.
I remember we were linked with Thuram a lot during that summer, before he went to Juventus. Just imagine how that would have been like today with Twitter and all that crap.
Not at all. You buying him broke the British transfer record. He was literally the most expensive player in the history of the league back then.
An equivalent signing would be Pogba (or any other record breaking one), not VDB who was signed for less than half the record.
He was a flop for you and a flop for Chelsea.
Twitter would've gone into absolute meltdown!
There was HUGE transfer activity going on throughout Europe that summer tbf. Alot of big names going for big fees
Wish I was one of those.
A player of Veron's quality and status would go for at least double your 40M number. He'd be like United signing Pogba from Juve.
I think the fact that we were prepared to sell for half what we paid, and to a league rival in Chelsea which we almost never do says it all. We bought the wrong player from Lazio. I think Nedved would have been amazing for us and could cover RW/LW or No.10. Veron was a good player but not as good a premier league player than Scholes and not very versatile to be a good squad member.
More than double. He was a British record transfer back then and we paid around 19% of our annual revenue for him. The equivalent today would be a 110m player.
Not a success, but not a flop for me.
Especially when he was part of this game.
https://www.skysports.com/football/...3-5-manchester-united-relive-famous-2001-game
Think there was a spurs fan who bet his house on a spurs win when it was at 3-0.
Especially when he was part of this game.
https://www.skysports.com/football/...3-5-manchester-united-relive-famous-2001-game
Think there was a spurs fan who bet his house on a spurs win when it was at 3-0.
We don't seem to appreciate players with skill. I think he would have been a brilliant player for Arsenal under Wenger. As another OP said Scholes threw his toys out and refused to play in a Cup game because he didn't want to play in the position SAF wanted him to play. SAF wanted Veron to play in that position. He was a joy to watch.
He was a great player but there's no doubt that he was an underwhelming signing. I was a massive fan of us, and didn't give up on him whilst he was a United player but it didn't really work out for him. He had some great games in Europe, and also, he started really well but ultimately struggled with the pace of the league. It didn't help that he came to a settled midfield, and we had to move players around. I'm convinced if he was born 5-6 years later, and we signed him during Fergie's second run at the Champions League, he would have been ace. His passing, technique, and vision were first rate. Also chipped in with great goals here and there.
The combination of Di Maria, Berbatov and Pogba
Dont think he was a flop, he like other posters have said, SAF bought him to try and improve the first 11, the premier league pace was maybe a bit quick for him, but he had a great pass on him, scored very good goals was very good with both feet. And dont forget who we had in CM back then.
No he wasn't a flop, and wasn't a massive hit either.
No he wasn't a flop, and wasn't a massive hit either.
How would Veron have fared at Arsenal?
Better suited to his talents?
Get in the way of Vieira?
Better suited to his talents?
Get in the way of Vieira?
He was never a flop. He just didn't meet his biggest expectation due to his price tag. But he did alright for us.
Sanchez
Di Maria
Schneiderlin
Mhkitaryan
anymore?
Veron
based on fee and impact. He contributed. But remember we sold at a lose of 1/3 his fee.
He was an excellent player but just didnt make enough impact
Di Maria
Schneiderlin
Mhkitaryan
anymore?
Veron
based on fee and impact. He contributed. But remember we sold at a lose of 1/3 his fee.
He was an excellent player but just didnt make enough impact
Not really. He was just annoyed at being sent to play with essentially what was a reserve team, after being left out on the bench in a big game at Anfield.
The interview has already been posted, but here are some more quotes:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...elsea.html?ico=amp_articleRelated_with_images
Similar to Forlan he made some crucial contributions in the tight title race in 2002/03.
He was a brilliant player but it just didn’t work out for him in England.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...elsea.html?ico=amp_articleRelated_with_images
Similar to Forlan he made some crucial contributions in the tight title race in 2002/03.
He was a brilliant player but it just didn’t work out for him in England.