Has Martial done enough to be backed as our long-term #9?

TrustInJanuzaj said:
When he plays like he did last season and again today he’s absolutely good enough to be our number 9. The question is though, why has he had such a poor season? Ultimately that is the conundrum and it’s cost us massively this season. Ole clearly loves him as a player but Martial has let him down big time and I’m not sure Ole will risk entering the next campaign putting in the same faith again. What a massive shame though as I really thought he would kick on from last year and we would have an absolute world class player. It’s clear that at his best he facilitates some fantastic football and most of our play goes through him.
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Exactly. Can ole take the very real risk that he loses form for a long period of time again in the future? Who knows what’s happening behind the scenes but I really don’t see us going for a striker if we have Cavani and Martial as underwhelming as that sounds for another season. Maybe with more quality around them it’ll be different. Here’s hoping haaland doesn’t move this summer because I reckon we will just let him off
 
Kaos said:
I don't get the plaudits from the City game. Yes he played much better and was mostly a nuisance for their defenders but he still has failed to one thing you'd expect number 9 to do - score, something he's failed to do pretty much all season. And that's after gifting him two chances on a plate.

Unless he goes on a freak goalscoring romp between now and the end of the season I'm still learning towards selling him and making way for a number 9 who reliably bags us 20+ goals a season. I'm a big converted Cavani fan and would be happy for him to have another season here, but he's not the solution going forward, nor is Martial.
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This. Tony did raise his game yesterday from an abysmally low floor, but a decent 9 has to put that ball into the back of the net.

It's unlikely that we could find another club willing to take on his 250k/week wage so he's going to to remain at OT for the foreseeable future. If somehow the gods allow us to bring in Haaland let's do so and we can have Rashford and Martial compete for the LW spot and, Cavani serve as Haaland's backup and Greenwood and Diallo compete for the RW spot. James can come in either at LW or RW as circumstances allow. But we can't go into next season with Martial our first choice 9. It's not a natural role for him.
 
VeevaVee said:
Yeah, he was decent. I don’t really see what he did as much more that that. While a penalty was fantastic for us, I don’t think it makes his performance that much better.

Wonder how much the consensus would change if he’d fluffed the shot at 1-1 but still played the same the rest of the game?
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I don’t care much about the consensus, but I thought Martial played very good yesterday, certainly more than decent. I had him down as one of our two best players with Maguire, slightly ahead of Shaw and Lindelöf. And whereas this was the kind of game (United vs City) where the three latter will often have good conditions to shine, I had expected Martial to struggle, particularily given his form.

What did I like about his performance? He was strong, held up the ball well, was precise, all of which is crucial and very hard against City. In addition to that, he several times managed to open up spaces that took us from ‘under pressure’ to good attacking possibilities, which for me was crucial to our good second half.
for me it was a bonus rather than a minus how he four times got into finishing positions without scoring.

This doesn’t remove the last dismal months, but it is certainly a step in the right direction.
 
He played well against City but I still don't think he's a CF and his numbers prove it. We need to address that situation and potentially shift Martial on the wing or have him as our back-up.

It's really a shame, I hoped he would kick on from last season's success.
 
Imagine if that chance had mattered. Did people expect him to finish it? I didn't, which sadly sums him up as a number 9. Did a lot of good stuff yesterday, but he hasn't got it where it counts.
 
A natural finisher would have not missed that sitter in the second half as that was harder to miss than it was to score.
He played well but he is just inconsistent
 
Had a decent game for once. He’s paid fortunes to do a job but more often than not he fails to do it.
 
Kaos said:
I don't get the plaudits from the City game. Yes he played much better and was mostly a nuisance for their defenders but he still has failed to one thing you'd expect number 9 to do - score, something he's failed to do pretty much all season. And that's after gifting him two chances on a plate.

Unless he goes on a freak goalscoring romp between now and the end of the season I'm still learning towards selling him and making way for a number 9 who reliably bags us 20+ goals a season. I'm a big converted Cavani fan and would be happy for him to have another season here, but he's not the solution going forward, nor is Martial.
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Agree with all this but we’d 100% need a striker that can be our number 9 and Cavani can support from the bench and rotation
I think Cavani has been class but he is missing too many games to be our first choice
 
Ali Dia said:
Telling ye he’s looked motivated at least in the last few games and he’s going to start scoring again soon. Mental how long his latest bad patch lasted though
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I'm going to respectfully disagree. That City game was his best game in months, better than the one he actually scored it, and he still missed a sitter.
 
Judas said:
I'm going to respectfully disagree. That City game was his best game in months, better than the one he actually scored it, and he still missed a sitter.
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fair enough he’s been below par for way too long and I’ve been driven mad by him but I can still see him scoring against West Ham and taking confidence from it. I don’t know if it’s his body language or if he’s moving a bit more aggressively but I feel like there’s goals coming again soon and have done for a few weeks. At least he’s getting into dangerous positions again.
 
SwedishFish said:
He played well against City but I still don't think he's a CF and his numbers prove it. We need to address that situation and potentially shift Martial on the wing or have him as our back-up.

It's really a shame, I hoped he would kick on from last season's success.
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Check his numbers playing up front this season, against those on the LW. It’ll show where he is superior - and this is in his worst season. Sadly all our strikers aren’t clinical but I know we play our best football when he is ticking.
 
Judas said:
I'm going to respectfully disagree. That City game was his best game in months, better than the one he actually scored it, and he still missed a sitter.
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It was his best game in months but he wasn't anything special, still was probably 5/6th best player in the team.

He done things we expect a ST at United to do, hold the ball and bring players into play.

I dont get why fans think he was amazing, he missed a glaring chance, if Rashford missed that it would be a different narrative.
 
A better game from him but it's still obvious we need a serious upgrade. Lewa and Halland don't miss those type of chances every week.
 
look at his stats for the last five years. It tells the whole story why Martial is not a striker. I am surprised it is becoming a discussing issue.
 
Ali Dia said:
Exactly. Can ole take the very real risk that he loses form for a long period of time again in the future? Who knows what’s happening behind the scenes but I really don’t see us going for a striker if we have Cavani and Martial as underwhelming as that sounds for another season. Maybe with more quality around them it’ll be different. Here’s hoping haaland doesn’t move this summer because I reckon we will just let him off
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Cavani is leaving at the end of the season, by the looks of it.
 
He's an enigma. Some of his play yesterday took the absolute piss. For me he was miles ahead of any attacking player on the pitch. Really should hate buried that chance though. Martial before this year would be gobbling up those for fun. Used to be so damn calm in the box.
 
Yeah, he should have taken that one chance but when people belittle his overall play in yesterday's game it seems very biased. To be that strong, composed, creative and precise in his hold-up play when under constant pressure and often isolated takes serious skill. He was under extremely difficult working conditions yesterday and did very, very well.
 
He was phenomenal yesterday. As I've always said, his hold-up play is one of his key attributes. He's a player that likes it into feet.

However, we do need a different option. Not only that, but we need someone ruthless in front of goal. Martial used to be so good at finishing, especially those one on ones but he seems to have lost a lot of confidence in front of goal.

With Cavani aging, I think a striker may well be our priority in the summer now.

We have a decent enough foundation but as Keane said, we need that player who will go and produce for us on a consistent basis.

Whilst I like Martial, unfortunately, I just don't know if he's going to be the man to do that but I do think he'd be a fantastic squad player to use up top and on the left.
 
He was in the perfect position for him not to score. Edison got it right. He went the right way. If Martial was in the inside left position he would have scored. I think he should taken a an extra touch or shifted it to the left. When you don't score for a long time this happens. He is low on confidence now. He is not a CF He is not a left winger either. He doesn't have the pace of Rashford or James. He is only quick in short burst. His best position is as a second striker where he can come deep and collect the ball and run with it.
I think he is eventually going to be sold and do extremely well with a club that plays two up front. As one of the pundits said when he plays like this he is unplayable. But it was a game made for him because he had to come deep to get the ball.
 
I find it annoying what people feel the liberty to call a sitter, it makes them sound ignorant as to what an actual sitter is or the fact that strikers miss those chances all of the time, even the deadliest strikers out there. He had a bad miss, but he didn't have any sitters.
 
Has Martial done enough to be backed as our long-term #9?
No.

One decentish game doesnt change the fact that he has been mostly terrible all season. Overall he has had one season here where he has scored goals, and I think he ended on 17, which is decent.

But we need strikers and forwards that are 20 or more if we're gonna challenge. Martial isnt close to that. He should be sold while he still has value. We dont have unlimited money, so we should move him on, but I'd like to have him as a backup for Rashford
 
Sayros said:
I find it annoying what people feel the liberty to call a sitter, it makes them sound ignorant as to what an actual sitter is or the fact that strikers miss those chances all of the time, even the deadliest strikers out there. He had a bad miss, but he didn't have any sitters.
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its a recurring theme with Martial though.
 
Aren86 said:
Check his numbers playing up front this season, against those on the LW. It’ll show where he is superior - and this is in his worst season. Sadly all our strikers aren’t clinical but I know we play our best football when he is ticking.
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He's superior there but he's not a number 9, at least not one that can start for Manchester United on a regular basis.

He's had his chances and we need to look at a new permanent solution up front. I wouldn't mind keeping him though if he wants to stay on after that.
 
He did well against City. It was the sort of performance I'd expect from a player like Welbeck. Hard working whilst showing good strength, good pace and good ball retention. But shockingly poor composure in front of goal.

If he could do that predictably every match, I'd be happy with it. But this was only a specific match against a unique opponent. I don't have much faith in him being able to replicate it in different kinds of games.
 
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Martial was our best attacker last season, this season he is poor. As is Rashford. I would not play either of them as a CF, but if I had to pick one it would be Tony. Hopefully, Rashford improves next season, so does Anthony and Mason. Ideally, we need to get Haaland, with Rashford, Greenwood and Martial fighting for the 2 spots on wings.
 
Mr H said:
its a recurring theme with Martial though.
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He's been abysmal as a finisher since the end of last season, but I wouldn't say he's missed sitters. A sitter is basically empty net and no one in front of you and you find a way to screw it up, which even some of the greatests of all time have been guilty of once in a blue moon. Somehow here it means you're 1v1 with the keeper and miss, that's not a sitter; goalkeepers get paid for a reason and it's to come out on top in those situations as well.

Martial has had horrible misses, misses that you can reasonably expect to end in goals, but I don't really consider any of them actual sitters.
 
No, I don't think he is ever going to take off like we all hoped he would. The next Thierry Henry wasn't it? I think he has the ability and potential to do amazing things, but not as a centre forward. He is at his best cutting in from the left. Unfortunately, this is also Rashford's best position. We have seen in the short time that 34 year old Cavani has been here, what a center forward should be doing. Making countless runs in behind, turning defenders round, holding up the ball and bringing others in, closing down defenders. Martial doesn't seem to me to have a football brain. He constantly runs into dead ends and tries to dribble through brick walls. He is really easy to mark because he is just so predicable in his play. He tries the same thing every time. His shooting is way off at the moment. Mostly because he is firing at the defenders legs. You put Vardy, Kane, Calvert Lewin, Salah in that same one on one that Martial had yesterday and they all would have burst the back of the net. We need a Ruud Van Nistlerooy, someone who lives and breathes goals. The closest to that is Haaland at the moment. So the question for United fans is, who do you prefer on the left? Rashford or Martial?
 
I really thought he’d kick on this season after last season but he’s regressed so much it’s untrue, Rashford has got 19 goals and 10 assists this season despite playing through injuries and being shunted all over the forward line to fit others in yet has apparently been inconsistent and poor according to many so what has Martial been ?

Reality is though that unless we sell him this summer we won’t be buying a new striker as the need for a right sided attacker and a quality centre back with pace is far greater and I think signing Sancho means we can go with Greenwood, Martial and Cavani as our centre forward options next season, three options for one spot and then go all out for Haaland in the summer of 2022.
 
Ali Dia said:
I just saw that. I’d say he’s looking for a bigger deal and no better man than Ed to step in
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Perhaps we have a deal agreed with someone else, already? (I know this sounds far fetched, but still a possibility)
 
Long way to reach Lewandoski, Suarez, Shearer or Vardy. If i m head coach. Against tight defend i will only use him as LW, because of his one on one skill or as. LCF in a 2 upfront.

Diallo/James- McTom - Bruno - Martial

Greenwood- Martial/Rashford

Not alone upfront sorry. To be really honest. Nowhere consistent good enough.

As a nr.9. I want a sharp clinic sniper with killer instinct upfront. Martial is lacking the killer instinct. Which Thierry Henry had beside his curling goals. Martial need support up there. With another CF, which is helping to stretch the back line and let the opponents work theirs socks off.

About the killer instinct. You might can train it up. But as natural born killer/sharp sniper. I can see if you have it or not.

And about Rashford. If Rashford keep playing as left winger. You don‘t practice your sniper and killer instinct really often as a CF, naturally you will lose and it fade away by time.
And Ole keep hoping that Martial to become a top and sharp CF, at the same time keep Rashford away from CF role. If Martial doesn’t turn out to be top, then slowly Ole will reduce Rashford instinct too. You just have to practice as often as you can. In matches. Rashford has that killer instinct, but not consistent and sharp enough. But obviously Rashford is a better finisher than Martial.

So I really hope against tight defend. Hope to see Martial as a left winger, not as a CF.
 
NinjaZombie said:
How did he miss that chance? All he had to do was find the bottom left corner.
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He's never going to be our main goal scorer. He could be good playing in a team with 2 strikers. One classic number 9 and him as the second striker. That's the only way I think.
 
Wheato said:
No, I don't think he is ever going to take off like we all hoped he would. The next Thierry Henry wasn't it? I think he has the ability and potential to do amazing things, but not as a centre forward. He is at his best cutting in from the left. Unfortunately, this is also Rashford's best position. We have seen in the short time that 34 year old Cavani has been here, what a center forward should be doing. Making countless runs in behind, turning defenders round, holding up the ball and bringing others in, closing down defenders. Martial doesn't seem to me to have a football brain. He constantly runs into dead ends and tries to dribble through brick walls. He is really easy to mark because he is just so predicable in his play. He tries the same thing every time. His shooting is way off at the moment. Mostly because he is firing at the defenders legs. You put Vardy, Kane, Calvert Lewin, Salah in that same one on one that Martial had yesterday and they all would have burst the back of the net. We need a Ruud Van Nistlerooy, someone who lives and breathes goals. The closest to that is Haaland at the moment. So the question for United fans is, who do you prefer on the left? Rashford or Martial?
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Yes, Anthony Martial was supposed to be the next Thierry Henry. It's clearly not going to happen.

He could make an excellent squad option for us, but if it's true he's on 250k/week that's a pretty expensive squad man.

Every single statement in your post, Wheato, is true. As for the question you ask, I'd prefer Rashford but Martial would be an outstanding Plan B when Rashford needs rest or it isn't working for him and he needs to come off in the 65th minute.
 
Wheato said:
No, I don't think he is ever going to take off like we all hoped he would. The next Thierry Henry wasn't it? I think he has the ability and potential to do amazing things, but not as a centre forward. He is at his best cutting in from the left. Unfortunately, this is also Rashford's best position. We have seen in the short time that 34 year old Cavani has been here, what a center forward should be doing. Making countless runs in behind, turning defenders round, holding up the ball and bringing others in, closing down defenders. Martial doesn't seem to me to have a football brain. He constantly runs into dead ends and tries to dribble through brick walls. He is really easy to mark because he is just so predicable in his play. He tries the same thing every time. His shooting is way off at the moment. Mostly because he is firing at the defenders legs. You put Vardy, Kane, Calvert Lewin, Salah in that same one on one that Martial had yesterday and they all would have burst the back of the net. We need a Ruud Van Nistlerooy, someone who lives and breathes goals. The closest to that is Haaland at the moment. So the question for United fans is, who do you prefer on the left? Rashford or Martial?
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I have to agree with most of what you've said, I think Martial's movement isn't best suited for CF, like he wished he was. At best, I could see him as a false 9, paired with someone like Haaland. It would require a change of formation but I'd actually really like to see that. As far as moving him to the left to compete with Rashford, that can only be a good thing in the long-term for Rashford. He is getting worn out far too quickly at his age, and there's an over-reliance on him when I don't think he's been 100% in years now. There's also a slight change in effort and attitude that I think competition would fix, as I think he's getting a bit comfortable.
 
eire-red said:
Kane is one of the best forwards in the world. I don't understand what is to gain from comparing his performance against Palace to that of Martial against City?

I've been heavily critical of Martial this season, but if that was his level of performance all season you'd have to think he'd have found that goalscoring touch and would be having a much better season.

Let's take yesterday as a positive, because he's set the bar so low this season that even though yesterday was the 'baseline level' you'd expect from a United forward, its actually a performance to build off for once.
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My point wasn't to compare the players, as you say there'd be no point, Kane is clearly superior.

I was comparing two centre forward performances to highlight what is truly outstanding and what was just decent.

But yeah it's a positive sign. I actually think his hold up play has been decent for the last month so carrying that on against City wasn't a great surprise.
 
Martial can be the main striker going forward. He is still growing in the role.
I don’t think we’ve dealt with him well as a player, the club continues to put him a doubtful state of mind. Every season we bring in an older more experienced guy for him to learn from and how does that say lad you are the man. Strikers have to feel the man.
Not a fan boy but he is our best striker right now. Greenwood might be competition going forward but he is two years away. CavanI am not a massive fan, not at this point in his career. We’ve been doing the same nonsensical signing Falcao and Zlatan. I know Utd is not a daycare but we sure have been bringing in some babysitters.
The lad is already one of the best out there. Unless we bring in a top notch guy in his I’d say he deserves to be. Students have to graduate at some point.
 
Feel like he’s turning into a bit of Firmino type. Which would be great if he had prolific wingers. But as it stands we need our cf to at least chip in.
 
Sayros said:
I find it annoying what people feel the liberty to call a sitter, it makes them sound ignorant as to what an actual sitter is or the fact that strikers miss those chances all of the time, even the deadliest strikers out there. He had a bad miss, but he didn't have any sitters.
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It's the frequency. the amount of 5/10 difficulty chances he has missed this season is not ok.
 
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