Mikel Arteta | Lego Pep watch

Fair play to him and the team for the recent wins. One can only beat what's in front of you. The reason he got a lot of abuse last season was the fact they lost to these so called smaller sides. Had United beaten Villa, Watford and Everton, they would have had 8 points more. You cannot take these wins for granted.

For his and the team's sake he should make sure he doesn't bring back Auba. Just get another number 9 and bin Auba and even Laca I say. The young guns are doing a good job and Arsenal fans would hope they turn out to be the way to success. The only thing they have to be careful of is hoping none of these sakas or ESR start getting frustrated by lack of CL football. Ultimately they will demand more. A 6th place finish this season may be acceptable but Ultimately you have to kick on.
 
35 from 19 is not bad at all and you have to say he's recovered well. However, I think lack of experience in their side and a not so great MF will eventually cost them.
 
4th for Arsenal would be huge.

Worth remembering they actually haven't finished in top 4 in league since 15/16.

I know they got stick for celebrating it annually in the Wenger years but they've dropped significantly since then as league finishes have shown.

Getting back in CL would allow them scope to get in better quality CF (especially with getting the two senior ones wages off the books in the summer).

Think their wide options are looking really good so don't need much work there, perhaps another CM but looks like Xhaka is staying and defensively they've been pretty solid although it's still exposed a bit v best attacks in the league.

Don't think Arteta could be faulted at all if they make 4th, indeed it would be viewed as overachievement from expectations at start of the season when a title charge for Man. United was viewed as reasonably realistic on here. I'd have tipped Leicester to finish above Arsenal aswell in those times.
 
ThierryHenry said:
The opposition has obviously been poor but we’ve genuinely turned a corner over the past month. For the first time in Arteta’s reign we have a team that has a balanced attack with clear attacking patterns that can consistently create chances.
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This has been a step in the right direction. Chance creation has always been a problem but they're creating consistently at the moment, and while the opponents have been pretty poor they're teams Arsenal would have ground out results against before, as well as spending more time defending. The balance looks good as well, with Martinelli, Odegaard and Saka as a talented and vibrant 3, Xhaka and Partey giving a platform and Lacazette a hard working striker who can drop back and get involved in the build up.
 
SilentWitness said:
That is fair in regards to Spurs but not United. Getting into the EL would be a good season for Arsenal. Getting 4th would be a great season. They bought a lot of young talents and their squad is relatively young. For them as long as they’re progressing on their 8th of last year it bodes well for Arteta. I still feel he is similar to Ole and he will hit a cliff where he can’t take them any further but for now I don’t see why they’d get rid of him.

4th for United would be a poor season.
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4th for United after Ole would be a great season and that's what everyone means. There is a huge difference.

Pretty much everyone has accepted this season has been a major disappointment.
 
RedPed said:
Arsenal fans getting gassed because they beat two seriously depleted teams, a League One side and the PL bottom feeders. Yeah it's better to have the points on the board but they've also played more games than the clubs around them. Understandable why they are hated so much.
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I’m scanning the thread to try and see what all these “gassed” Arsenal fans are saying… but I can’t find any.

Just a few fans happy that their team that was written off is in contention.
 
Points are better than games in hand where it will come thick and fast. Arsenal are in a good position cos losing to those above them but beating the bottom half will put them in a great position especially with no Europe second half of the season
 
bond19821982 said:
4th for United after Ole would be a great season and that's what everyone means. There is a huge difference.

Pretty much everyone has accepted this season has been a major disappointment.
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I don’t think it would be. I’d still expect you to finish 4th despite the poor run under him. 4th and a trophy would be good from this position. 4th and no trophy would be poor still.
 
Greyfog said:
Arsenal fans celebrating being in the Top 4 and Man Utd fans countering with having finished 2nd and 3rd.

Started following the EPL from around 1998 and these two teams were the top dawgs..
Who would have thought that those periods of dominance will lead to this.
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It's almost like two super rich oil teams emerged or something.
 
SilentWitness said:
I don’t think it would be. I’d still expect you to finish 4th despite the poor run under him. 4th and a trophy would be good from this position. 4th and no trophy would be poor still.
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4th would be par.
Anything more would be a cracking result.
Bearing in mind the Fa cup hasn't even started for us yet and is a total lottery, and Europe would be a huge ask.
 
Sandikan said:
It's almost like two super rich oil teams emerged or something.
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Yea. Maybe it's that or I am getting old. As a neutral the excitement from watching the PL has gone down since the emergence of City. Chelsea was at least something new and with Mourinho it was exciting off the pitch.
 
Daydreamer said:
I’m scanning the thread to try and see what all these “gassed” Arsenal fans are saying… but I can’t find any.

Just a few fans happy that their team that was written off is in contention.
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You gotta keep up, we all celebrate top 4 and the emirates cup as if it's the champions league. After a few good results we all talk like we're prime Brazil from the 70s. That's why we're an insufferable bunch.
 
maniak said:
You gotta keep up, we all celebrate top 4 and the emirates cup as if it's the champions league. After a few good results we all talk like we're prime Brazil from the 70s. That's why we're an insufferable bunch.
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Of course, my mistake.
 
maniak said:
You gotta keep up, we all celebrate top 4 and the emirates cup as if it's the champions league. After a few good results we all talk like we're prime Brazil from the 70s. That's why we're an insufferable bunch.
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Its funny because it’s true. And just because they can’t be found on a Manchester United! forum, doesn’t mean it isn’t true.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Arsenal’s results?

Assuming Spurs and United win their games in hand they’re ahead of Arsenal in the league table. After both clubs sacked their managers because of terrible results in the league up until now.
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I don't see Arsenal as rival anymore (sadly or not) so i find myself objective regarding them (well, at least i think that i am objective).
He is doing very good job there. His team on paper looked and still looks few levels bellow us, Pool, City and Chelsea. Even worse than Spurs i would say. So, for not reaching top 4 i can't say that he failed in that. He did won FA cup by beating City and Chelsea which is good achievement.
His transfers, again on paper, don't look powerful (lets be real here, he could not go and buy tier A players like top 4 clubs do) but most of them playing good under him this season. Ramsdale, Partey, White, Odegaard are proving as good buys (for Arsenal) and seems to me that he is good in promoting young players.

Now, i am not saying that he is or will be some new world class coach but he is doing much better than people think on CAF.
 
IrishRedDevil said:
Its funny because it’s true. And just because they can’t be found on a Manchester United! forum, doesn’t mean it isn’t true.
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Maybe Utd fans should do the same, otherwise its likely to be a bit of a miserable existence for both sets of supporters over the next few years.
 
AshRK said:
Fair play to him and the team for the recent wins. One can only beat what's in front of you. The reason he got a lot of abuse last season was the fact they lost to these so called smaller sides. Had United beaten Villa, Watford and Everton, they would have had 8 points more. You cannot take these wins for granted.

For his and the team's sake he should make sure he doesn't bring back Auba. Just get another number 9 and bin Auba and even Laca I say. The young guns are doing a good job and Arsenal fans would hope they turn out to be the way to success. The only thing they have to be careful of is hoping none of these sakas or ESR start getting frustrated by lack of CL football. Ultimately they will demand more. A 6th place finish this season may be acceptable but Ultimately you have to kick on.
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I agree with the Auba part but Lacazette is a very good player for them.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
I don't see Arsenal as rival anymore (sadly or not) so i find myself objective regarding them (well, at least i think that i am objective).
He is doing very good job there. His team on paper looked and still looks few levels bellow us, Pool, City and Chelsea. Even worse than Spurs i would say. So, for not reaching top 4 i can't say that he failed in that. He did won FA cup by beating City and Chelsea which is good achievement.
His transfers, again on paper, don't look powerful (lets be real here, he could not go and buy tier A players like top 4 clubs do) but most of them playing good under him this season. Ramsdale, Partey, White, Odegaard are proving as good buys (for Arsenal) and seems to me that he is good in promoting young players.

Now, i am not saying that he is or will be some new world class coach but he is doing much better than people think on CAF.
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I've always said that the players Pep bought for City weren't exactly superstars. Maybe for the exception of Sterling (being English), Pep didn't really buy any world class players. What he looks for are players that are highly technical and it seems like Arteta has tried doing the same with his transfers.
 
Cascarino said:
I don't know, we have to find out.
I think top 6 is the target this season, but I think they're likely to get 4th.
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I said this back at the start of November, and I’m a little more confident about their chances now than I was then. While I think it’s been advantageous that Spurs and Manchester United have had a troubled season, Arsenal have shown signs since the end of last season, and I think there summer business was pretty good.

Still a long way to go, Manchester United are a very talented side with some quality big names and could definitely put a run together. I’m far less impressed with the Spurs side, but they do have a few quality players and Conte is an excellent manager.
 
AussieDevil said:
Our former player who finished 2nd? And 3rd? But they’re celebrating being in 4th and only due to having played more games then the other contending sides.

What is there to be envy of?
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Arteta won silverware, in all fairness he surely deserves credit for that.
 
FootballHQ said:
4th for Arsenal would be huge.

Worth remembering they actually haven't finished in top 4 in league since 15/16.

I know they got stick for celebrating it annually in the Wenger years but they've dropped significantly since then as league finishes have shown.

Getting back in CL would allow them scope to get in better quality CF (especially with getting the two senior ones wages off the books in the summer).

Think their wide options are looking really good so don't need much work there, perhaps another CM but looks like Xhaka is staying and defensively they've been pretty solid although it's still exposed a bit v best attacks in the league.

Don't think Arteta could be faulted at all if they make 4th, indeed it would be viewed as overachievement from expectations at start of the season when a title charge for Man. United was viewed as reasonably realistic on here. I'd have tipped Leicester to finish above Arsenal aswell in those times.
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That's actually insane. Almost 6 years since they've had champions league football.
 
AussieDevil said:
Our former player who finished 2nd? And 3rd? But they’re celebrating being in 4th and only due to having played more games then the other contending sides.

What is there to be envy of?
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Seriously? You are comparing Ole's reign in United with Arteta's in Arsenal? That is some deluded stuff, mate.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
Wrong choice of words. You can compare everybody, of course. But in terms who done better job; there is no contest
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who was that then?

from my perspective, both have been pretty crap overall with a few flashes of promising stuff at times
 
I think Ole and Arteta had very different challenges.

Ole came into a team that had a lot of talent, but had been through the Mourinho grinder. They had finished 2nd the season before, but he had to lift the side out of their funk, because of it being Manchester United and the squad having quality (albeit in need of additions), combined with him being on able to spend in his first window meant that he was under more pressure. Bruno was an inspired singing, and he did make incremental progress with finishing third and then second. While there were positive signs, I also think he never quite managed to get his side working holistically. I know it’s become a meme on here but often times it was individual quality that got the team results. I think things then slipped away this season and his position became untenable.

With Arteta, I felt that he came into a side that was in desperate need of an overhaul. I’ve long argued in this thread that people were judging the team on the name, and not the actual quality it possessed. Emery did excellently to get 5th, but the wheels came off towards the end of his first season, and then continued into his second season, with the club in free fall it was a tricky job to walk into. There was far less pressure than the United job though, people keep questioning why the board didn’t sack Arteta, and it was because they understood the squad was shambolic and that they had hired a rookie manager and were not expecting immediate results. We’re now into his second full season, and the transfers he has made are clearly done with a long term view. Every signing he made this summer were 23 and under, and his side is statistically the youngest in the league. He has struggled to get his side defensively sound without playing pragmatic football, but he’s turned a corner in this aspect, and they’re now really starting to function as a collective and have got a great balance, with young vibrant players. The football has really improved.

They’re challenging for fourth this season, and if achieved it will show excellent progress.
 
Daydreamer said:
I’m scanning the thread to try and see what all these “gassed” Arsenal fans are saying… but I can’t find any.

Just a few fans happy that their team that was written off is in contention.
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Um, you do understand that not all Arsenal fans have signed up on Redcafe, don't you?
 
Andycoleno9 said:
If we count quality of teams which they had? Arteta did better job. Top 4 for United was bare minimum. For Arsenal, in the same period, trophy and EL spot was above expectations.
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fair enough

I genuinely didn't know who you meant though

what were expectations for Arteta then if it wasn't a EL spot?
 
Tarrou said:
fair enough

I genuinely didn't know who you meant though

what were expectations for Arteta then if it wasn't a EL spot?
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EL spot was bare minimum. With that and trophy he did more than that.
For Ole (team and money which he had) top 4 was minimum of minimum. Trophy and title challenge would have been good season.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
If we count quality of teams which they had? Arteta did better job. Top 4 for United was bare minimum. For Arsenal, in the same period, trophy and EL spot was above expectations.
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EL spot “above expectations” for Arsenal? Jesus wept. One thing Arteta has evidently done a truly exceptional job at so far is in lowering expectations to ridiculous levels.

Qualifying for the EL is the bare minimum Arsenal should achieve, every single season. In fact, failing to qualify for the CL should always be considered a disappointment for a club with their revenue/spending.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
EL spot “above expectations” for Arsenal? Jesus wept. One thing Arteta has evidently done a truly exceptional job at so far is in lowering expectations to ridiculous levels.

Qualifying for the EL is the bare minimum Arsenal should achieve, every single season. In fact, failing to qualify for the CL should always be considered a disappointment for a club with their revenue/spending.
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El spot AND trophy. Not just el spot. El spot is bare minimum as Ole's top4 spot.

I agree that Arsenal must aim top 4 always. But not in terms of team which Arteta inherited
 
Pogue Mahone said:
EL spot “above expectations” for Arsenal? Jesus wept. One thing Arteta has evidently done a truly exceptional job at so far is in lowering expectations to ridiculous levels.

Qualifying for the EL is the bare minimum Arsenal should achieve, every single season. In fact, failing to qualify for the CL should always be considered a disappointment for a club with their revenue/spending.
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That’s a bit unfair. There are 4 teams with higher revenues and spending. Finishing top 6 would be about where you’d expect Arsenal to be with their wage bill. Not to mention it’s probably one of the youngest squads in the league.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
El spot AND trophy. Not just el spot. El spot is bare minimum as Ole's top4 spot
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The premier league table is the only true judge of a manager/teams quality. Nobody ever thought Wigan beating City to an FA Cup proved that Martinez was a top tier manager (which we’ve seen ever since)
 
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