The whole thing summarizes my feelings exactly. The longer we wait to take action, the higher the price will be.
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
The whole thing summarizes my feelings exactly. The longer we wait to take action, the higher the price will be.
It's a good point but as I personally complained on two seperate occasions about Mr. Glendenning's use of racist language when he wrote for The Guardian he can eat a bowl of dicks.
There's probably many things the public doesn't know. Maybe Putin felt it wasn't the right moment yet. Maybe he wanted to wait out the pandemic.
He won't do anything more than illegally overfly borders of NATO countries no matter what happens in Ukraine.
If the US goes to war with Russia, one outcome is certain to me (and post nuclear collapse of society is not a given in my mind. I reckon any nuclear war will be highly tactical, precise and exceedingly brief before one side surrenders).
Russia will be conquered and broken into smaller states to ensure that it will never resurface. And the US will remain to oversee their development for a lot longer than the seven years they occupied Japan.
Probably because the presence of a NATO hostile US President was enough to help stall the spread of democracy.
Also, the price of oil was very low during much of Trump's term, which would've resulted in far less oil revenue for the Russian state.
It just seems like miscalculation. Unless he determined that trump is so volatile he didn't want to force his hand on such a dilemma.
RT America ceases productions and lays off most of its staff
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/03/03/media/rt-america-layoffs/index.html
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/03/03/media/rt-america-layoffs/index.html
I assume the cease fire is beneficial to both to restock, resupply and importantly get civilians out
More needs to be done for Ukraine. This can not be allowed to go on
fecking hell. :/
That's very optimistic
Not sure I understand this way of thinking. How can the price be higher than nuclear Holocaust?
My thinking is this, the lines are draw on what can be done and what escalates nuclear war. Invading NATO countries = NATO war vs Russia. NATO attacking Russia outside of NATO countries = Russia war vs NATO. Arming other countries, cyberattacks etc get threats but does not escalate the situation to war. So do the sanctions.
It seems to me that the actors kind of know this. Which is why we haven’t had a nuclear war so far despite that NATO bordered Warsaw Pact members and now Russia, and despite that both countries armed the opponents of other countries. We saw this happening since the fifties, just that this is the first time it is happening near home.
And not only will Putin bring back Ukraine under Russian influence, he'll also have fueled another humanitarian refugee crisis. As a result of more refugees coming in, we might witness an even bigger increase in right-wing populism in the West.
I think the response he has seen to the invasion of a non-Nato country have pretty much put to bed any chance attack on an actual Nato/EU country (e.g. Poland/Finland/Baltics).
And, I never bought this Trump was in Putin’s pocket. Trump was the useful idiot but not on his pocket.
Trump was also extremely unpredictable. Safer to invade where the West is more rational. My thinking is that Putin has done the calculations (rightly or wrongly), and in the end it will end with him getting Ukraine. Just that the price is much higher than he anticipated. With Trump in the White House, doing the calculations would have been far harder. It could have ended with the US doing nothing with respect to Ukraine to the US starting shooting Russia’s airplanes. Which is why I think Putin waited.
Another possible scenario is that he waited just in case Trump wins and NATO dies. That makes the job much easier for Russians to invade.
Well, he actually did everything he wanted to do in Syria -with Trump's consent- and all the West watched from the sidelines. I honestly don't think a Trump reelection would have changed Putin's plans for Ukraine. How he sees it as a natural playground for Russia's influence.
During a G7 summit, Trump literally said that Crimea should belong to Russia because people there speak Russian. Nobody in the west has ever come close to expressing such a stupid thing.
Yeah the guy is a clown
Not really sure. These are European refuges, not Arabic ones, so even conservative people in Europe are more willing/tolerant towards them.
I really don’t understand why dead bodies aren’t posted in this thread.
Shouldn’t everyone, everywhere be seeing this? Why cover up the atrocities?
Really don’t get it.
Shouldn’t everyone, everywhere be seeing this? Why cover up the atrocities?
Really don’t get it.
No chance.
A NATO-inclined Ukraine is no threat to Russia. It's a threat - because of the freedom and democracy it sets as an example - to Putin's regime.
This is all about Putin's gangster-state, not Russia.
Climate crisis, Energy crisis, war, economical problems, pandemic, refugee crisis, now maybe wheat crisis and what the feck all that is happening, I think we will have to adjust to new realities in many aspects, all of us. I believe the world we had was the best part. I am happy I grew up in the 80s. Sorry for the pessimism but things do look a tad bleak at the moment. It is getting to me that we are so helpless and have to sit and watch this like some kind of realityshow with a sneaking bad ending :/ What kind of world will our sons and daughters inherit.. We fail as a species.
But for how long until people will complain about housing, welfare and such, and start feeling annoyed about them? Even if ungrounded in reality? Some right wing populist will come along and exploit these resentments.
Not sure I like this world where I'm constantly agreeing first with Marco Rubio and now Glaston
Yep. He may wondered before all this but there can be no doubt about the western resolve around NATO now.
Some thoughts on Putin’s supposed objectives:
1. Keeping Ukraine out of NATO/EU - he has advertised the benefit of full Western alignment such that Moldova and Georgia are also applying to the EU.
2. Ukraine is basically a region of Russia with a funny dialect - Ukraine has probably now the strongest sense of nationhood in Its entire history.
3. Securing the oil and gas pipeline - Europe is now committed to diversification, Nordstream is dead, and, if he does want to occupy or maintain control of southern Ukraine for the transit route, no one will buy it.
4. Projecting regional and global power - his army has performed poorly, shattering the myth of military might, and, in the process of invading, he is reducing his already under- sized economy to third world level.
All in all, a total mess facilitated by 20+ years in office and being surrounded by lackeys.
1. Keeping Ukraine out of NATO/EU - he has advertised the benefit of full Western alignment such that Moldova and Georgia are also applying to the EU.
2. Ukraine is basically a region of Russia with a funny dialect - Ukraine has probably now the strongest sense of nationhood in Its entire history.
3. Securing the oil and gas pipeline - Europe is now committed to diversification, Nordstream is dead, and, if he does want to occupy or maintain control of southern Ukraine for the transit route, no one will buy it.
4. Projecting regional and global power - his army has performed poorly, shattering the myth of military might, and, in the process of invading, he is reducing his already under- sized economy to third world level.
All in all, a total mess facilitated by 20+ years in office and being surrounded by lackeys.
I'd say it's just as likely to swing the other way. Putin sympathy is strongly linked to the far right wing now.
What happened with right wing politics in 1939 when Hitler invaded Poland?
I think that's a generous assessment, considering we're basically watching while Russia flattens a country of 40m people, too afraid to even send unmanned Migs, and our sanctions may be effective, but they still lack conviction, with all their loopholes for diamonds and 30 day warning period.
We are only a week into this and I'd be shocked if in 30 days Kyiv wasn't rubble or surrendered
That's true, but the sanctions are there to stay
Which is a greater reason for my firm belief in term limits in any political domain in the world. No country can evolve nor learn to be better unless it moves on with younger leaders with fresh ideas over time.
I'm guessing it would be more about cyber attacks, propaganda and election tampering culminating in regime change more favourable to Russia.
I suspect if Ukraine goes according to Putin's (now revised) plans the thought process for the next targeted nation would be closer to Belarus than Ukraine.
The biggest miscalculation of course is that in my view nothing would make a country more impenetrable to fascist interference than seeing a neighbour's independence crushed and its people murdered with impunity by a fascist dictator.
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I haven't kept track of the thread today, is there anything major i've missed? Is Kharkiv still being heavily attacked and has the Russian convoy gotten any closer to Kyiv?
Exactly. Are people only saying this because Putin keeps saying this? How exactly would Ukraine joining NATO be a viable threat to Russia? What does it threaten?
This just underscoes that here is no feaasible way out for Putin in all of this. He will never be able to return to pre-invasion normalcy, nor will he be able to intimidate anyone with his farce of a military. He is basically reduced to being an insecure, old man with nukes. Can't see him lasting much longer to be honest.
Not posting graphic sex and violence is fairly standard across forums. Even more so with an ongoing situation where people might know some of the souls involved.
Mental health is not a trivial concern.
No but dictators have been overthrow by the people before.
If a constitution is not enforced in the spirit, it’s not worth the paper it’s written on. Technically Putin had to step down after two terms but instead became prime minister under a puppet president (Medvedev). After 4 years, he then dropped the pretence and returned as president.
How protected is Putin? Is it possible that in near future we see some special forces Ukranian killing him with a sniper or some bomb taliban style? I know it's a long shot and that he is almost impossible to reach but surely many would happily do it, there are many people who hate him even in Moscow.
At least that's seems like Ukraine's and world's biggest hope.
At least that's seems like Ukraine's and world's biggest hope.
@Amar__
Was thinking something similar just now.. What are the odds of the CIA having someone inside the Kreml to take him out should he push the big red button?
I like to think they do.
Was thinking something similar just now.. What are the odds of the CIA having someone inside the Kreml to take him out should he push the big red button?
I like to think they do.