Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

Mciahel Goodman said:
Facebook announced yesterday that they would make an exception and allow people to use hate speech against Russians in general (not just Russian military/invasion). This is probably Russia's response, in part.
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Is this Reuters article not the reality then:

"As a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine we have temporarily made allowances for forms of political expression that would normally violate our rules like violent speech such as 'death to the Russian invaders.' We still won't allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians," a Meta spokesperson said in a statement.

" "We are issuing a spirit-of-the-policy allowance to allow T1 violent speech that would otherwise be removed under the Hate Speech policy when: (a) targeting Russian soldiers, EXCEPT prisoners of war, or (b) targeting Russians where it's clear that the context is the Russian invasion of Ukraine (e.g., content mentions the invasion, self-defense, etc.)," it said in the email.
 
What is this stuff about Putin inviting middle Eastern fighters a free passage to come fight in Europe?
 
Ekkie Thump said:
Is this Reuters article not the reality then:

"As a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine we have temporarily made allowances for forms of political expression that would normally violate our rules like violent speech such as 'death to the Russian invaders.' We still won't allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians," a Meta spokesperson said in a statement.

" "We are issuing a spirit-of-the-policy allowance to allow T1 violent speech that would otherwise be removed under the Hate Speech policy when: (a) targeting Russian soldiers, EXCEPT prisoners of war, or (b) targeting Russians where it's clear that the context is the Russian invasion of Ukraine (e.g., content mentions the invasion, self-defense, etc.)," it said in the email.
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Yeah, that's what I'm talking about.
 
It is a stupid policy from Facebook because if I were Putin in the Kremlin I would bombard Facebook with bots calling for violence against Russia and use the fake calls for violence to show the Russian people this war is a matter of life and death for the country.
 
botond said:
the turkey wont be happy
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Turkey was given the candidate status a long time ago but they refused to solve the issues (minorities rights, full respect for the judicial system and other cornerstones of the EU:s charter) when they could, and lately had been going the other way..

To be honest I don’t think they will be accepted in the foreseeable future even if they solved these issues. Trump and Banon have managed to create a big alliance of the far right in Europe that sees “Muslims” as the existential enemy of the “Whites” and Turkey is definitely seen as a “big Muslim country”, even more so with the Erdogan regime.
 
Relevated said:
What is this stuff about Putin inviting middle Eastern fighters a free passage to come fight in Europe?
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Ukraine have brought 450~ Syrian rebels to fight for them. Each side is now using M.E. mercenaries which makes no sense when you consider what happened in Afghanistan in the 80s.

Frosty said:
It is a stupid policy from Facebook because if I were Putin in the Kremlin I would bombard Facebook with bots calling for violence against Russia and use the fake calls for violence to show the Russian people this war is a matter of life and death for the country.
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It's a short-sighted policy. Setting precedents that will outlive this specific conflict and which are at odds with other ongoing conflicts.
 
It makes sense from Facebook's perspective. They probably should've just went with it, though, instead of communicating it like this.
 
Mciahel Goodman said:
It's dubious but you could argue they made a cultural distinction for the sake of Eastern European states that will be filled with anti-Russian sentiment and will spread it online.
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Maybe but if the laws are required in Peacetime then they are also required in Wartime. I really don't see the upside to this decision, apart from saving FB the hassle of increasing their team to deal with all of the reported posts.
 
Pintu said:
I missed this from Facebook.

Ironic to say the least.

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Talk about infantilizing Ukrainians. This is great power nonsense. What is happening here is one nation is waging a war of conquest on another nation. There are obviously long-term reasons and short-term reasons and all the other things history teachers like to talk about (I know because I am one), but at the end of the day it amounts to Russia attacking Ukraine. The US is most certainly a warmongering, imperialist state, but this isn't their fight. This is Ukraine's fight. And so, please stop depriving Ukraine of agency.
 
Frosty said:
It is only a precedent if you do not immediately forget about it as a company and deny it ever happened once this conflict is over.
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True.
nimic said:
Talk about infantilizing Ukrainians. This is great power nonsense. What is happening here is one nation is waging a war of conquest on another nation. There are obviously long-term reasons and short-term reasons and all the other things history teachers like to talk about (I know because I am one), but at the end of the day it amounts to Russia attacking Ukraine. The US is most certainly a warmongering, imperialist state, but this isn't their fight. This is Ukraine's fight. And so, please stop depriving Ukraine of agency.
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Don't think anyone is denying any of the above (well, except for the part about it not being the US's fight/EU's fight/NATO's fight as all three see it as such and so do the Ukrainians and Russians).
 
nimic said:
Talk about infantilizing Ukrainians. This is great power nonsense. What is happening here is one nation is waging a war of conquest on another nation. There are obviously long-term reasons and short-term reasons and all the other things history teachers like to talk about (I know because I am one), but at the end of the day it amounts to Russia attacking Ukraine. The US is most certainly a warmongering, imperialist state, but this isn't their fight. This is Ukraine's fight. And so, please stop depriving Ukraine of agency.
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So the USA have been involved for so many years in assisting Ukraine, in whatever capacity, but now suddenly their hands are clean? This is definitely Ukraines fight, but father USA is definitely going to have a say and cannot be dismissed regardless of however compassionate anybody feels for Ukraine. Facts are facts, the USA are tied into this.
 
Relevated said:
So the USA have been involved for so many years in assisting Ukraine, in whatever capacity, but now suddenly their hands are clean? This is definitely Ukraines fight, but father USA is definitely going to have a say and cannot be dismissed regardless of however compassionate anybody feels for Ukraine. Facts are facts, the USA are tied into this.
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I didn't say their hands were clean, in a greater sense, but when it comes to Russia deciding to invade Ukraine, then no that's not the fault of the US. That is solely the fault of Russia.
 
Zehner said:
It makes sense from Facebook's perspective. They probably should've just went with it, though, instead of communicating it like this.
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I think Reuters report was based on a leaked email.
 
nimic said:
I didn't say their hands were clean, in a greater sense, but when it comes to Russia deciding to invade Ukraine, then no that's not the fault of the US. That is solely the fault of Russia.
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Agreed. There’s quite a bit of analysis and writing, especially from the older generation, that treats this as a game of Twilight Struggle.
 
Shakesey said:
Can some economics genius explain to me why the Ruble has strengthened almost 30% over the last four days? Sorry if this has been discussed already.
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The Russian central bank is probably propping it up with whatever resources it has. It's been on a downward slide in general but every morning it gains a huge chunk, probably due to the RCB intervention

It will take a while for the bank to go through the $300 million of reserves it still has, as well as some time for the economic sanctions to really kick in hard.
 
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spiriticon said:
Can't we at least airlift some food, medicine and water to Mariupol in a Red Cross helicopter? Happy to let the Russians check the cargo first before flying in.

The people there need help and they can't evacuate because the Russians keep on shelling the evac routes.
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That's kind of the point. They don't want the people getting food, medicine and water, they want them to suffer and give up resistance. They're not going to let aid get in or people get out.

Relevated said:
What is this stuff about Putin inviting middle Eastern fighters a free passage to come fight in Europe?
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Ukraine said about 16,000 foreign fighters were helping them.

Hey presto, Putin says 16,000 are welcome to come and help the Russians.
 
11101 said:
That's kind of the point. They don't want the people getting food, medicine and water, they want them to suffer and give up resistance. They're not going to let aid get in or people get out.
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That's really quite awful and I hope Putin suffers the worst kind of cancer very soon.
 
spiriticon said:
That's really quite awful and I hope Putin suffers the worst kind of cancer very soon.
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He will kill as many people as necessary to win. The only question is whether winning is so important to him that he would risk suicide to not be perceived as a loser.
 
Lots of noise from Ukrainian authorities in recent hours that Russian planes are firing at Belarusian territory from Ukrainian airspace to try and escalate things:

 
UpWithRivers said:
He wont care. The ex Oligarch that Putin locked up for 10 years said think of Putin like a mob boss or the main gang leader in a prison. They have a different mindset and the basis is to never show weakness or you will be taken out. As far as Putin sees it backing down is not an option.
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Tend to agree with you, Putin is nearing the end of his 'day in the sun' running the country and wants to go down in Russian folk history as the man who restored the Russian Bear's image. The 'macho' image of himself that he has cultivated says it all. He is dangerous for everyone, not just Ukraine, but Russia and the rest of the world. If the Ukraine can fight him to a standstill and they may yet do that, even if they have to concede large tracts of the country, then NATO has to be ready to move in immediately to prove to the world that this type of behaviour will not be tolerated and ironically the thing Putin apparently feared most will have happened, NATO is now really on his doorstep.
 
People calling for a no fly zone should pay heed to this. Although I don’t think 4000 nukes in total would be launched, any nuclear exchange would still be a total global catastrophe.

 
spiriticon said:
The Russian central bank is probably propping it up with whatever resources it has. It's been on a downward slide in general but every morning it gains a huge chunk, probably due to the RCB intervention

It will take a while for the bank to go through the $300 million of reserves it still has, as well as some time for the economic sanctions to really kick in hard.
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sounds like in the meantime we've just destroyed our own economies then
 
DJ Jeff said:
sounds like in the meantime we've just destroyed our own economies then
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Of course. Sanctions are going to hit us as well. It's just that it hits Russia 10 times as hard.

Well we won't be 'destroyed', but fuel and food is sure gonna get expensive.

Which is why it can be argued that NATO ending this quickly is good for everyone in a sense. Otherwise, in a few months time everyone will be poor, Ukraine will be rubble, and Putin may still be mad enough to start nuclear war anyway.
 
spiriticon said:
Of course. Sanctions are going to hit us as well. It's just that it hits Russia 10 times as hard.

Well we won't be 'destroyed', but fuel and food is sure gonna get expensive.
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have you seen the british gas bills running into the thousands going round? People are going to be absolutely destroyed. it'll be a global recession that makes 08 look like a dwarf
 
DJ Jeff said:
have you seen the british gas bills running into the thousands going round? People are going to be absolutely destroyed. it'll be a global recession that makes 08 look like a dwarf
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I know. Luckily, we are going into summer and people can start turning their heating off. That's the only bit of silver lining.
 
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