So he is the only one who seems to be against the "West" helping the Ukraine in your government? The article was a bit confusing. What about the general opinion of your country on this issue?
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I'm not sure, looking at the internet there's quite a lot people who spout similar stuff but havent kept track of some polls on the subject to know in general. Government is strictly pro Ukraine. In the parliament recently the main opposition party and other left parties plus one right wing party abstained from the vote on training of UA soldiers here and far right parties voted against it.
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I don’t understand the reasoning behind not supplying modern fighter jets. We’re sending MBTs?
The guess I’d make is that the West are worrying about escalation. Tanks are not going to hit targets inside Russia. Modern fighters might. There might also be issues related to the cost of replacement, cost-efficiency etc
Presumably this - planes have missiles on them that if they miss - could be devastating. Tanks don't have that range.
Political and strategic incompetence.
I get that you’re more emotionally invested than most, but do you really think that the above is true? Because it sounds very much like you are saying that YOU have the answers, and no-one else gets that. So all of the advice eg Biden is getting from his generals, from the CIA, from his diplomats abroad, is trumped by your individual understanding of the situation.
I say this as someone who really wants to see Ukraine given the most modern weaponry possible. But I also recognise my own ignorance.
Edit- by the way I mean this in a non confrontational way. There are surely factors we just aren’t aware of. I want to see Russia and Putin get absolutely humiliated here.
Someone's been barking up the wrong tree?
If Erdogan was my neighbour, I’d keep my tanks too.
Aaand the police has initiated 2 cases for “discredit of the Russian army” based on this video
They don't trust Ukraine not to use them to fire missiles into Russia and escalate things further.
Also, most nations cant spare jets and any sent to Ukraine will be unlikely to return. Without the full support package of NATO capabilities they would be very vulnerable flying over Eastern Ukraine.
You know the famous experiment about the frog in slowly heating water who just stays there until he dies. This is basically the same, slowly increasing support so that Russia doesn't do anything really stupid but just lives with it.
I think it's understandable, but obviously there are massive differences in how people view this and which speed of escalation they think is right.
In general it looks like the further west in Europe you look the more cautious governments get.
Did you miss the post that it's Germany's fault that Turkey is a threat to Greece because Germany doesn't support Greece enough?
I don’t think fighter jets would be that effective given their missile requirements for firing above a certain altitude and Russian SAMs
For all the the talk about F-16s and fighters generally, there seems to be next to no chat around NATO attack helicopters (although could easily have missed it).
Feel like helicopters could generally be more useful, although appreciate they're pretty exposed targets to Russian air defence. Training might be difficult, but can't imagine it's any harder than learning to fly F-16s for an already trained pilot.
Feel like helicopters could generally be more useful, although appreciate they're pretty exposed targets to Russian air defence. Training might be difficult, but can't imagine it's any harder than learning to fly F-16s for an already trained pilot.
The Russians have suffered pretty steep attack helicopter losses to Ukrainian air defense, so with even less air superiority, I couldn’t imagine attack helicopters in Ukrainian hands faring much better.
Probably. Greece has been in an arms race with Turkey since the 70s and kept it up despite the near financial meltdown of the country. From their POV, the only way any significant equipment (tanks, jets, IFVs or arty) could be donated to Ukraine is if Greece gets given (i.e. donated) something in return that leaves Greece either better off or at the very least, not worse off. Like the deal to send old Soviet BMP-1s to Ukraine in exchange for receiving German Marders.
And cause of lots of Turks in Germany.
To be honest the chances of a Turkish land invasion were always extremely low. There's only a small strip of land border between Greece and Turkey, 60kms length, where the river Maritsa is the natural border. The two banks of the river mark the most militarised region of the whole of Europe. A pretty ludicrous amount of artillery, tanks, IFVs, combat helis etc. sit there. Passage is near impossible for either side without suffering monstrous level of casualties.
If ever there was to be a conflict it would certainly be a naval and air conflict over the Aegean Sea. Therefore the key to the heart of any Greek General or Politician, if you want them to give up tanks or arty, is to offer ships and airplanes instead.
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I've watched this and the previous videos in the series and it struck me how amateur (and I don't mean this disparigingly) the resistance efforts were early on in the war. I have a tonne of respect for these foreign volunteers who rocked up, banded together with strangers and fought to defend Ukraine.
The alternative I have seen is that the super powers of the west do not want to trigger a coup/revolution in Russia and create a power vacuum in a country with their Arsenal so they are content for it to be contained to Ukraine and happening relatively slowly at the moment.
But surely the coup/revolution is the only way of ending the war?
I get that it's risky someone even more mental than Putin comes in but it's less risky than lengthening the war I'd have thought.
Genuine close quarters combat footage often looks amateurish compared to the pictures we have in our heads of how things should go, even if its special forces involved, not that we ever get to see much.
I always think back to the SAS Iranian embassy siege which skyrocketed their notoriety. They got pretty lucky with that raid in between setting fire to themselves and getting stuck on ziplines.
Switzerland might trick its own rules and help Ukraine
https://www.srf.ch/news/schweiz/kri...-panzer-ringtausch-dank-schweizer-sonderregel
The idea: Switzerland will send Leopard tanks to another country that keeps those, and this third country can send their existing stock to Ukraine. This way Switzerland would follow it's own law to stay neutral and not deliver (or allow deliveries, see the Gepard ammunition drama) to countries at war, but still would enable delivery of more tanks to Ukraine.
Poland might be the third country for this deal, if it should happen.
https://www.srf.ch/news/schweiz/kri...-panzer-ringtausch-dank-schweizer-sonderregel
The idea: Switzerland will send Leopard tanks to another country that keeps those, and this third country can send their existing stock to Ukraine. This way Switzerland would follow it's own law to stay neutral and not deliver (or allow deliveries, see the Gepard ammunition drama) to countries at war, but still would enable delivery of more tanks to Ukraine.
Poland might be the third country for this deal, if it should happen.
Thats what I had been thinking till Ukraine regain so much territory in september
Lets suppose that Ukraine conquers all territory Crimea included. Victory, great. Lets say that russia just dedicates his days bombing Ukraine from its borders as they are virtually untouchable in their homeland
What Ukraine/the West will do in that case?
Ask Israel how to deal with that kind of situation. That scenario would be more or less the same than what Israel is living under.
Bigger problem is building up Ukraine to being self sufficient and having them take themselves off the West leash.
There’s only so far down the years Russia can hide behind their border before the war comes to them
Russian rockets are far better and stronger than whatever Palestinians can throw at Israel. Even if Ukraine somehow manages to get as good systems as Israel, it will be impossible to defend considering the larger space from where Russia can throw them (compared to Palestinians), and Russia even have hypersonic ones which are not defendable. They also won’t have the option to demilitarize Russia every few years.
So it will be a very shitty position for them.
Israel isn't Ukraine in this situation, but I see what you mean.
Yes, living under constant threat of missile attacks. Surely would be for different reasons and yes, Ukraine is much bigger and the Russian missiles much more capable, but the basic idea is the same.
Meanwhile (but probably a bit offtopic) the integration of the Dutch Army into the German is ongoing and increasing: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...erge-land-combat-units-with-germany-this-year
This is in so far relevant to Ukraine as for example the shared Patriot battalion is currently in Slovakia and allowed Slovakia to give their S-300 to Ukraine (quite early in the war). Obviously people seem to be content how this cooperation goes and further cooperation might also yield some synergies that could free stuff to be delivered to Ukraine? No idea, just a hope.
Might be. For now the now confirmed delivery of the GLSDB for the M142/M270 is the next important capability increase for Ukraine. Looking at its longer range (150km instead of 90km, effectively enabling hits roughly 130km instead of 70km deep into Russian territory) it will push back Russian logistics bases much deeper and will quite effectively lower the amount of supplies the Russians can bring to the front line (assuming they keep using the same number of trucks as they currently do, and an increase seems difficult considering the old garbage they already have to use).This makes sense. So fighter jets in 6 months then
If supplied in sufficient numbers the GLSDB should have a similar effect on the battlefield as the GMLRS originally had. Still missing is the ATACMS but hopefully that will finally follow soon.