City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches
- Thread starter VanGaalEra
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Doesn't work for me either
ok. I apologise to anyone that the link doesn’t work for then.
You could just check the BBC Twitter account and it’ll still be there.
It’s from 22.16 on 20/05
I feel they should be thrown out of the football league altogether, but maybe Im biased.
On a side note, I saw a video last week covering the news of two high profile competitive fishermen being caught red handed with weights inside the fish they caught.
The anger from the other competitors around them as the fish were being cut open was palpable, and it was surprising that it didn’t break out into violence.
They were put in jail and banned from competition for 3 years, among other things.
PL has reputation around the world by being the most honest league (playing by the rules).
So if in Italy (lets be real, Seria A was always dodgy league) biggest club gets 10 point deduction for one crime then City should be relegated. Every other punishment will be a farce.
They can't just be relegated.
As far as I know, the PL can only kick them out, at which point they would have to reapply to the football league for membership. The FL can then decide whether or not to allow them in and also at which level they can enter at. Which could be anywhere from the 9th or 10th tier to the Championship.
I totally agree. And its not like PL loses it appeal from City being kicked out. No one fecking supports them anyway. I would honestly rather have Arsenal win the league since they are actually a proper club.
In Italy Juve was just that; relegated in Seria B. That was sentence. Fa can do that without question.
Although that is easily done with point deduction also. Fa can punish them with 100 point deduction which puts them on 20th place.
Also (just like Seria A did with Juve) they can get point deduction for next year's season in Championship (Juve started with -30).
They can expel, but they can't just relegate them to the football league.
The only way they can, is with an insurmountable points deduction. 100 points sounds fair.
City have been responsible for a few really marketable moments over the past decade though, chief among the Aguerooo goal, by stripping City of titles (more so than relegation) they'd be saying to everyone ''disregard all that, it never happened'' - which is definitely a double-edged sword in terms of how it effects the Premier League and its reputation. Of course we'd love it, being fans of some of the most negatively-affected-by-City rival clubs, but the effect on the more casual consumer and how it looks in the eyes of corporate sponsors is the big question mark. Binning a lot of the last decade of Premier League 'lore' is like producers of a blockbuster TV show telling viewers to disregard the last few seasons (and not on GOT where that'd be an undeniably good thing).
That’s great but then other teams with money, like Utd or Newcastle will then be being told, ‘you can cheat for 10 years and all it’ll cost you is 1 season in the Championship, you can keep all your ill-gotten gains’.
And the same must be applicable to all teams.
They need to strip City of at least half the PL titles they’ve ‘won’ and relegate them.
It needs to send out a message globally that the PL is fair and competitive, if not the PL is literally done.
Agree, their utter contempt and disregard for the rules need to be punished to the maximum to set an example. Moreso with ME money arriving in Newcastle and probably Manchester.
It is ridiculous really. I know that it is not short/easy process but what is the plan here? Let them buy and sell players, play all competitions another year and then what if they are found guilty?
This should have been investigated and done quickly. Them playing PL next season is just stupid.
This should have been investigated and done quickly. Them playing PL next season is just stupid.
They should be thrown out of the premier league. Simply because the panel don't have the power to relegate them.
Football League has different governance and in the above scenario City would have to apply to be let in. Football League could drop them into the championship or to the bottom of the ladder or force them to do a wrexham and gain promotion by normal means.
Were on 15 years of systemic cheating and deceit and will be more by the time this is done. If that doesn't justify expulsion i dont know what does.
My preference in the whole scenario
Go after the administrators and executives first - lifetime ban from the sport. Owner is obviously involved so has his fit and proper status rescinded and has to pass on to administrators to sell club.
I like JPRouve's idea about 70 point deductions that guarantee relegation basically. I'd want to protect the club as a community and cultural asset basically. Giving them a year to strip away some wage bill before relegation. Maybe follow it up with a point deduction in the championship that guarantee's they cant be promoted. Or just flat out deny them promotion to the premier league for a period of time. That would be the sporting punishment.
I'd disqualify them from previous seasons but i dont think it matters. I dont think you can set them seasons right after the fact when your denying Leicester, West Ham, Everton multiple champions league runs and matches against Real, Bayern, Milan and so on. A bit of prize money wont set that right. Then theres the relegated teams. How many times have teams been relegated because of worse results against City then their competitors? Maybe its just never happened but you cant compensate that. Trying to would just be inadequate. Put a big disqualified next to their name and just move on.
If found guilty of 115 charges, I don't see how the ownership can continue.
If they're found guilty, they have to be stripped of everything they've won in the period they were found to be cheating for. They have to be. Otherwise, what's the deterrent?
If you're Newcastle you basically get given the choice to do the same, win half a dozen league titles, maybe a European Cup, attract loads of the world's best players, establish yourself as one of the world's top clubs, in return for maybe losing one title due to a points deduction and a fine which is completely inconsequential to you anyway. What choice are you gonna make?
I don't believe for a second that this will actually happen but if it doesn't then it's a green light for anyone else.
If you're Newcastle you basically get given the choice to do the same, win half a dozen league titles, maybe a European Cup, attract loads of the world's best players, establish yourself as one of the world's top clubs, in return for maybe losing one title due to a points deduction and a fine which is completely inconsequential to you anyway. What choice are you gonna make?
I don't believe for a second that this will actually happen but if it doesn't then it's a green light for anyone else.
Relegate them but also impose a complete transfer ban in and out so all their players are stuck in the championship for a season.
We discussed this in the Juve thread... I think we were onto something with @Rayman96
Lets do it properly though. 750 point deduction starting next season. They have to gain 750 points to break even so every season they just get relegated again and again with 0 points.
Bearing in mind all their players will leave, I would say we are talking 15 relegations minimum so they should be sorted for run at the Manchester Sunday pub league by 2039.
If only
Would be impossible and illegal (heh) to implement but the players are somehow getting off easy on this. They all know who they are signing for and what is going on.
They are legally shielded "they offered i accepted" but morally they're just as low as the owners.
Why would you force City to keep their best players which would allow them to easily win the division and get promoted with a bang?
It would be much better to enforce a wage cap on them within their actual budget and watch them all flee like rats off a sinking ship.
This. The only way to truly establish precedent and future fear is expulsion. I would go as far to say a minimum 20-year ban from the league. Let them toil for two decades in lower divisions. Sheikh will pull up roots and go elsewhere, maybe.
Would those players even wanna stay there if they're relegated ?
And revoke them from all their oil money titles.
Just wanna point out, again, the issue ISN’T oil money.
The issue is that they’ve cheated and lied around FFP.
The origin of their money is literally irrelevant in this.
That's right. But the same owners probably can't be trusted in future either.
Perhaps, but using ‘oil money’ as a synonym for ‘cheating’ isn’t right.
If they choose to, any owner could cheat and lie around FFP, it has nothing to do with the money’s origin.
So when are we expecting to hear the outcome of all this.
Half time at the CL final when city are 3/0 up would be appropriate I think
When they could feasibly return to the PL within one season and stay on big fat salaries? I would suggest so, just look at what happened when Juventus went down.
yes, fully agree. I saw that posters suggestion of the 70 point deduction for the next few seasons. good idea.
I also agree about protecting the club as a cultural asset therefore putting the emphasis on their shady owners and upper management. There are some genuine city fans out there who supported when they were a normal club, and just feel that they won the lotto and are there for the ride, would be unfair to punish them by killing the club entirely.
nah sorry have to disagree, sounds a bit like when the glazers were on about 'legacy fans' and all that weird commercial marketing talk.
I think most people who love sport would want to see cheating as heavily punished as possible.
If anything it might attract some disillusioned fans back to the sport.
The players who stayed there had a true and sincere love for the club but still many left them when they went down.
In order to expel them the Premier League would need the other 19 clubs to vote on it if with at least 15 voting in favour of expulsion.
If they are expelled they would have to apply to join the EFL but there is no guarentee that the EFL would allow them in.
Relegated to League 2, minimum 4 window transfer ban and all titles stripped during their cheating years.
Disgusting cheating club and disgusting doping cheat of a manager.
Disgusting cheating club and disgusting doping cheat of a manager.
Bearing in mind other clubs have had points deductions between 3 and 30 points for tiny handfuls of offences, if even half of those 115 charges stick, then there would have to be the all time biggest punishment.
Transfer bans, stripping of titles and very probably explusion from the premier league, potentially a Rangers style multiple league relegation.
You suspect they'll deflect and delay for a couple of years though, and fight off the majority of it all, using trickery like claiming most evidence was from "hacking" and thus can't be used.
I actually think either they'll get a proper punishment, or in a few years there will be a splinter league set up with certain agreed rules, of which City either won't get invited into it, or they'll be massively clamped down on.
The English lot allowed themselves to be trampled over, but once City start winning the Euro and start brushing off Real Madrid level clubs, something changes.
Transfer bans, stripping of titles and very probably explusion from the premier league, potentially a Rangers style multiple league relegation.
You suspect they'll deflect and delay for a couple of years though, and fight off the majority of it all, using trickery like claiming most evidence was from "hacking" and thus can't be used.
I actually think either they'll get a proper punishment, or in a few years there will be a splinter league set up with certain agreed rules, of which City either won't get invited into it, or they'll be massively clamped down on.
The English lot allowed themselves to be trampled over, but once City start winning the Euro and start brushing off Real Madrid level clubs, something changes.
Oh yeah they have all the tricks in the book and despite those charges I see them getting off without losing titles,transfer bans even points deductions which is a joke
Most they'll get is a fine and temp transfer ban.
The footballing authorities have zero interest in anything other than keeping the gravy train running.
The footballing authorities have zero interest in anything other than keeping the gravy train running.
The surprising thing is that the 115 charges have been brought. That's something. Although you'd barely know it from the media.
You'd think in amongst the "best team ever, legends" type reviews they might say "who are facing the hughest set of charges ever seen in sport".