Religion, what's the point?

Roane said:
This is a logical fallacy.

Everything that has a beginning has a cause.
Click to expand...

The issue is you assume the cause is some supernatural invisible bloke. This isn't what science means by cause.

The universe has a beginning and it has an end. Science will tell you that for the last 80 odd years.
Click to expand...

Sort of. Maybe. But probably not in the way you mean.

If events depend on events this is not rational or logical as there would be no be no end
Click to expand...

What on earth are you talking about?

The cause of the universe must be uncaused itself. It can't have a beginning and it can't have an end.
Click to expand...

Only in the sense that time was created during the Big Bang. Not in the sense you seem to mean.

Asking this question is a question of category. The creator and the created are not the same.
Click to expand...

You start from the assumption that some supernatural being is a creator. Which is nonsense.

One is dependent on many factors the other cannot be. You can ask what paint looks like or what it smells like but you can't ask what it sounds like. That isn't in the paint category.
Click to expand...

I imagine paint (drying or otherwise) has or makes a sound. Just because you can't hear it, any more than you can see UV or x-rays, means little.
 
Burning the Quran's a big thing for the Muslims. I know free speech and all that but it's about time the west stop propagating or at least giving asylum to these shit stirrer.

It might not meant much if you're a Swede but every incident like this brought a whole load of Jihadist and extremists. The bible might not mean much and you can burn it without repercussions in most cases but the Qur'an are something else. Most of the western world probably dont feel anything, but for minorities living in a predominantly Muslim world all these burnings bears more and more hatred towards the west and the Christians, and being made as a propaganda for retaliation

They should at least claim that they do not condone any burning of other people's book of beliefs and should just stop the whole thing. There's free speech and there's burning Qur'an, and it has nothing to do with free speech.

Imho
 
Sky1981 said:
Burning the Quran's a big thing for the Muslims. I know free speech and all that but it's about time the west stop propagating or at least giving asylum to these shit stirrer.

It might not meant much if you're a Swede but every incident like this brought a whole load of Jihadist and extremists. The bible might not mean much and you can burn it without repercussions in most cases but the Qur'an are something else. Most of the western world probably dont feel anything, but for minorities living in a predominantly Muslim world all these burnings bears more and more hatred towards the west and the Christians, and being made as a propaganda for retaliation

They should at least claim that they do not condone any burning of other people's book of beliefs and should just stop the whole thing. There's free speech and there's burning Qur'an, and it has nothing to do with free speech.

Imho
Click to expand...

The west will never understand why some random feckwit burning a book is a big thing for the Muslims, so round in circles we will go.
 
Sky1981 said:
Burning the Quran's a big thing for the Muslims. I know free speech and all that but it's about time the west stop propagating or at least giving asylum to these shit stirrer.

It might not meant much if you're a Swede but every incident like this brought a whole load of Jihadist and extremists. The bible might not mean much and you can burn it without repercussions in most cases but the Qur'an are something else. Most of the western world probably dont feel anything, but for minorities living in a predominantly Muslim world all these burnings bears more and more hatred towards the west and the Christians, and being made as a propaganda for retaliation

They should at least claim that they do not condone any burning of other people's book of beliefs and should just stop the whole thing. There's free speech and there's burning Qur'an, and it has nothing to do with free speech.

Imho
Click to expand...

Sounds like Islam is the problem here. I don't see why the world should bow to it.
 
Causality is something that exists within our laws of physics, which began at the moment of the big bang. Technically, before these laws were created there didn't need to be a cause.

My brain hurts now.
 
Sky1981 said:
Burning the Quran's a big thing for the Muslims. I know free speech and all that but it's about time the west stop propagating or at least giving asylum to these shit stirrer.

It might not meant much if you're a Swede but every incident like this brought a whole load of Jihadist and extremists. The bible might not mean much and you can burn it without repercussions in most cases but the Qur'an are something else. Most of the western world probably dont feel anything, but for minorities living in a predominantly Muslim world all these burnings bears more and more hatred towards the west and the Christians, and being made as a propaganda for retaliation

They should at least claim that they do not condone any burning of other people's book of beliefs and should just stop the whole thing. There's free speech and there's burning Qur'an, and it has nothing to do with free speech.

Imho
Click to expand...
Govenrments in countries where Qur'ans are burned constantly say that they do not agree with the act, but can't ban it because of various basic principles - although I think Sweden did try to introduce some legislation now. It's also always fringe groups or individuals that do the burning. The reason this causes such uproar and hatred is predominantly because of how these acts are portrayed to Muslim communities by populists and others; cause in reality, it makes no sense to get angry at, say, the country of Denmark and all Danes because some individual burned a Qur'an. (Yes, there are underlying issues that makes masses erupt this way, but again, those issues are not Qur'ans get burned.)
 
Last edited:
Sky1981 said:
Burning the Quran's a big thing for the Muslims. I know free speech and all that but it's about time the west stop propagating or at least giving asylum to these shit stirrer.

It might not meant much if you're a Swede but every incident like this brought a whole load of Jihadist and extremists. The bible might not mean much and you can burn it without repercussions in most cases but the Qur'an are something else. Most of the western world probably dont feel anything, but for minorities living in a predominantly Muslim world all these burnings bears more and more hatred towards the west and the Christians, and being made as a propaganda for retaliation

They should at least claim that they do not condone any burning of other people's book of beliefs and should just stop the whole thing. There's free speech and there's burning Qur'an, and it has nothing to do with free speech.

Imho
Click to expand...
Seems like overkill on the Muslim side.

Not everyone else holds that same opinion of the Quran.
 
It's a fecking book. A book of fictional tribal nonsense, just like all other religious texts. I feel the same about burning national flags, just get over it. It's a fecking symbol, a fabric piece. Let them release their emotional rage on some inanimate object and symbol, it does not physically hurt you.

Muslims needs to get over it, not everyone else must hold it as sacred.
 
MrMarcello said:
It's a fecking book. A book of fictional tribal nonsense, just like all other religious texts. I feel the same about burning national flags, just get over it. It's a fecking symbol, a fabric piece. Let them release their emotional rage on some inanimate object and symbol, it does not physically hurt you.

Muslims needs to get over it, not everyone else must hold it as sacred.
Click to expand...

The super cool thing is that the new law in on order to be inclusive includes the bible and the torah as well. And actually the new law states that inappropriate treatment of objects of significant religious value can land you 2 years in prison. There are satire theater shows in the past and currently that uses the cross in such way just to be mention 1 example that could land you 2 years in prison in 21st century Denmark. Usually one of the most secular and progressive countries in the world. And its not like its the Danish goverment or a lot of Danish people who have been burning Qur'ans. Its literally just a handfull of very very few idiots . And when you have big musllims countries trying to pressure Denmark and Sweden to change our laws in the name of "religious tolerance and respect", it rings a bit hollow when almost none of those countries have actual religious freedom. How can they talk about tolerance and respect of other religions when they dont even allow propagation of religions like Buddhism and Hinduism in their own countries? Ie religions that are "not of the book". And in a lot of those countries its hardly like christian minorities have it easy either.
 
Last edited:
do.ob said:
Sounds like Islam is the problem here. I don't see why the world should bow to it.
Click to expand...
calodo2003 said:
Seems like overkill on the Muslim side.

Not everyone else holds that same opinion of the Quran.
Click to expand...
MrMarcello said:
It's a fecking book. A book of fictional tribal nonsense, just like all other religious texts. I feel the same about burning national flags, just get over it. It's a fecking symbol, a fabric piece. Let them release their emotional rage on some inanimate object and symbol, it does not physically hurt you.

Muslims needs to get over it, not everyone else must hold it as sacred.
Click to expand...

It's not about the book, it's not about the cartoons, it's about the middle finger you give us by disrespecting us. That disrespect - it's taken personally, and that is what triggers the reaction, whether it's justified or not.

If I stood on the street and called threw verbal abuse at passers by, it's only words - but i think it'd be 10 minutes before someone knocked my teeth out.

It's the same thing.

Again before people get their knickers in a twist - not justifying anything.

Also it's a very convenient hate crime, express hatred for Muslims by burning their religious symbols and hide it as free speech.

I'm sure that'd be a matter of free speech if the religious texts of other communities were being burned.
 
Last edited:
Zlatattack said:
It's not about the book, it's not about the cartoons, it's about the middle finger you give us by disrespecting us. That disrespect - it's taken personally, and that is what triggers the reaction, whether it's justified or not.

If I stood on the street and called threw verbal abuse at passers by, it's only words - but i think it'd be 10 minutes before someone knocked my teeth out.

It's the same thing.

Again before people get their knickers in a twist - not justifying anything.

Also it's a very convenient hate crime, express hatred for Muslims by burning their religious symbols and hide it as free speech.

I'm sure that'd be a matter of free speech if the religious texts of other communities were being burned.
Click to expand...
:lol:

Nope, it's not just focused specifically vs. Muslims. Stop with the manufactured narcissism. I'd think exactly the same way if / when we are at the same point with the babble & koran.
 
Zlatattack said:
Burial, burning, and in olden times they'd put them in water so the ink would wash away.
Click to expand...
OK...
Zlatattack said:
It's not about the book, it's not about the cartoons, it's about the middle finger you give us by disrespecting us. That disrespect - it's taken personally, and that is what triggers the reaction, whether it's justified or not.

If I stood on the street and called threw verbal abuse at passers by, it's only words - but i think it'd be 10 minutes before someone knocked my teeth out.

It's the same thing.

Again before people get their knickers in a twist - not justifying anything.

Also it's a very convenient hate crime, express hatred for Muslims by burning their religious symbols and hide it as free speech.

I'm sure that'd be a matter of free speech if the religious texts of other communities were being burned.
Click to expand...
Dude. You burn you own Quran when it's at the end of their life.

The Quran they are burning isn't your Quran. More than anything else, they've purchased that Quran themselves, so they can decide the end if that Quran"s life.

How is that disrespect?

They disagree with the contents of that Quran, ok, fine, provide them with a new one and convince them why they are wrong.

If someone knocked your teeth out, they'd deserve to be punished, disrespect is not worth violence.

If I said I hated all religions including Islam, burned all of the holy books, other than the Quran, would that make me disrespectful or respectful to the Quran?
 
Zlatattack said:
It's the same thing.
Click to expand...
The fact that you think that directing offense at a piece of paper, a material possession the same as directing offense at actual people is highly problematic and needs to be eradicated.

It's like a football fan being violent towards someone for disrespecting their football club saying it was an act against them because they love this club so much and blah blah. Uncivilized behaviour in each case.
 
Moby said:
The fact that you think that directing offense at a piece of paper, a material possession the same as directing offense at actual people is highly problematic and needs to be eradicated.

It's like a football fan being violent towards someone for disrespecting their football club saying it was an act against them because they love this club so much and blah blah. Uncivilized behaviour in each case.
Click to expand...

Rasmus Paludan is obviously a dickhead(and a far right troll) and I disagree with what he is doing, but I dont think its should be illegal for a lot reasons, one of them being, people who flee Iran because of the oppressive theocratic regimes and are perhaps atheist and some flee because they are homosexual. Some come here to be completely free of religion and perhaps because of their history they may perhaps want to express the suffering they have witnessed because of the oppressiveness of that religion by burning a Quran. I personally have no qualm with them having the legal right to do so.
 
Last edited:
It's the old "respect and freedom for me, but not for you, because my book of fairy tales said so."
Sprinkled with a bit of narcissism for emphasis.
 
Peter van der Gea said:
OK...

Dude. You burn you own Quran when it's at the end of their life.

The Quran they are burning isn't your Quran. More than anything else, they've purchased that Quran themselves, so they can decide the end if that Quran"s life.

How is that disrespect?

They disagree with the contents of that Quran, ok, fine, provide them with a new one and convince them why they are wrong.

If someone knocked your teeth out, they'd deserve to be punished, disrespect is not worth violence.

If I said I hated all religions including Islam, burned all of the holy books, other than the Quran, would that make me disrespectful or respectful to the Quran?
Click to expand...

They are burning the Qur'ans outside embassies and in some cases muslim majority neighborhoods. Its a bit different than doing it in your backgarden. They are obviously trying to provoke reactions which they have succesfully. The terror threats and averted terror attacks have been high.
 
Last edited:
Someone, somewhere, should do the equivalent of "Jesus Christ Superstar" (including drag queens) and "Life of Brian" for the other religions, too.
 
Gehrman said:
They are burning the Qur'ans outside embassies and in some cases muslim majority neighborhoods. Its a bit different than doing it in your backgarden. They are obviously trying to provoke reactions which they have succesfully. The terror threats and averted terror attacks have been high.
Click to expand...
But they're burning one of the most published books on earth, the verses aren't going anywhere.

Threatening harm or death over burnt paper is a joke
 
Peter van der Gea said:
But they're burning one of the most published books on earth, the verses aren't going anywhere.

Threatening harm or death over burnt paper is a joke
Click to expand...
Godwins Law Being Approached, Urgent Warning!

I wonder if they said that back in May 1933.
 
Peter van der Gea said:
But they're burning one of the most published books on earth, the verses aren't going anywhere.

Threatening harm or death over burnt paper is a joke
Click to expand...

Im not condoning terror threats or attacks at all. I was merely pointing the few guys doing this are doing it for maximum effect or reaction so to speak.
 
Gehrman said:
Im not condoning terror threats or attacks at all. I was merely pointing the few guys doing this are doing it for maximum effect or reaction so to speak.
Click to expand...
Nobody should or could control someone else's actions, however, we have full control over our own reactions.
 
Zlatattack said:
It's not about the book, it's not about the cartoons, it's about the middle finger you give us by disrespecting us. That disrespect - it's taken personally, and that is what triggers the reaction, whether it's justified or not.
Click to expand...
It's not.

There's no rule that someone must respect a choice you've made, and there's no rule that someone can't criticize a choice you've made or the object of your choice.
 
Carolina Red said:
It's not.

There's no rule that someone must respect a choice you've made, and there's no rule that someone can't criticize a choice you've made or the object of your choice.
Click to expand...

Ive honesty never gotten a reasonable explanation on why on the topic of tolerance most muslim majority countries dont even have freedom of religion. Imagine if the western world said no you cant propagate Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Sikhism and even fecking Scientology here. Yet that tolerance doesnt swing the other way or is even considered for a second.
 
Gehrman said:
Ive honesty never gotten a reasonable explanation on why on the topic of tolerance most muslim majority countries dont even have freedom of religion. Imagine if the western world said no you cant propagate Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Sikhism and even fecking Scientology here. Yet that tolerance doesnt swing the other way or is even considered for a second.
Click to expand...

If Western countries had said that, we wouldn't be living here. It's not hard.
 
Zlatattack said:
If Western countries had said that, we wouldn't be living here. It's not hard.
Click to expand...

The question was if Islam is open and tolerant as advertised why isnt there actual freedom of religion in muslim majority countries?
 
Gehrman said:
The question was if Islam is open and tolerant as advertised why isnt there actual freedom of religion in muslim majority countries?
Click to expand...
Of course there is. If you weren't so ignorant, you'd know.

Here we go with "Saudi Arabia", yet you never hear any mention of Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, Morocco, Eygpt, Bangladesh.

Muslims Ruled every inch of India for over 1000 years - there are more than a billion Hindu's still in India. Why is that? How did that happen? Did they forget about the mandatory religious discrimination?
 
Zlatattack said:
Of course there is. If you weren't so ignorant, you'd know.

Here we go with "Saudi Arabia", yet you never hear any mention of Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, Morocco, Eygpt, Bangladesh.

Muslims Ruled every inch of India for over 1000 years - there are more than a billion Hindu's still in India. Why is that? How did that happen? Did they forget about the mandatory religious discrimination?
Click to expand...

You know that the muslim invasion into India was one of the main reasons Buddhism was wiped out and classified as possibly one of the greatest genocides in history?

Buddhism aside the Muslim invasion and rule into the Indian subcontinent was classified as the bloodiest chapter in human history by the historian Will Durant. And yes that includes millions and millions of hindus.

But going into the 21st century it doesnt take much research to see the state of freedom of religion today in muslim majority countries.

Can people who dont worship the Abrahamic god build sites of worship in most of the countries you just mentioned? No they cant.
 
Last edited:
Seems you can make fun of any religion you like apart from Islam, If you want to believe In one God or ten God's I don’t care that's your choice, and that's what being in a free country is about, you can believe In what you want.

I believe Religion is a cancer to the human race, the sooner it's removed from humanity the better.
 
The issue with religion, is that It was undoubtedly "created" and then moulded to form narratives that backed up a preferred belief system. I am a complete atheist in the Ricky Gervais mould, and can argue against any religion to the point that the only retort is a matter of "faith" or "that's the way our god intended". Bullshit, it's all a bunch of absolute nonsense.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.