Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

RedDevil@84 said:
People need to understand war and death. People living in areas of peace casually talk about war as if it were a game where they can pick sides and cheer when their side wins.
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Not on this forum they don't need to, and certainly not through people posting horrific images.
 
Truth is, if it was Israel, they're not going to admit to it anytime soon, and they'll have the social media team doing damage limitation/sowing seeds of doubt.

If it was Hamas or someone similar, they're not going to own up to it either.

It's highly likely it was Israeli - but the only real rock solid known fact is that the Gaza people have got even more terror and destruction to deal with, and it highlights further proof that violence isn't going to solve shit in this region.
 
Newtonius said:
The we need proof of beheadings crowd sure believed hamas claims real fast
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It’s easy to get carried away in the emotion of the moment. Best to see what the evidence is in the coming days
 
Avatar said:
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@JPRouve see what I meant...

This will have very bad consequences for Biden, Netanyahu, and the part of the Israeli public/army that would like to see Gaza flattened, burned or even just invaded.

I can't see the invasion not happening but it'll probably be toned down because Israel blasted a hospital, [or maybe it didn't? ahhh whatever, they must have. feels like it was them, anyhow].
 
To all Pro-Israeli's trying to act smart saying "oh where are all the where's the evidence folk now", the major difference is Israel has bombed hospitals before, time and time again, and hit the same hospital last week, so there is pretty easy to understand them doing it again. Hamas, as evil as they are, though have never beheaded any babies before so ofcourse it was going to be hard to believe.

Hope that clarifies things for you.
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
@JPRouve see what I meant...

This will have very bad consequences for Biden, Netanyahu, and the part of the Israeli public/army that would like to see Gaza flattened, burned or even just invaded.

I can't see the invasion not happening but it'll probably be toned down because Israel blasted a hospital, [or maybe it didn't? ahhh whatever, they must have. feels like it was them, anyhow].
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Hopefully this incident at least causes Israel to take pause, no matter the cause, casualties in Gaza will continue to mount international pressure. I think the biggest worry though is that Hezbollah may used this for justification to escalate.
 


Changing their story, nothing shifty here
 
Nothing hamas has could destory a hospital.

Their home made rockets use steel pipe dug from the ground and rely on shrapnel for most of their damage.

It would be weird for them to have this kind of ordinance available and never once fired one at Israel in the last 17 years.
 
sullydnl said:
I really dislike that I have no idea how reliable 99% of the tweets posted in this thread are. They could be true, they could be from biased accounts, they could be deliberate lies, they could be the opinions of some random idiot who hasn't a clue what he's talking about but tries to sound like he does on twitter.
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War in the social media age feels even more disorientating. I remember being quite disturbed when the Ukraine-Russia conflict blew up and it felt like memes were being added to warfare disinformation for the first time in history (i might be wrong there but it felt like it). It's like, what the actual feck am I reading?
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
@JPRouve see what I meant...

This will have very bad consequences for Biden, Netanyahu, and the part of the Israeli public/army that would like to see Gaza flattened, burned or even just invaded.

I can't see the invasion not happening but it'll probably be toned down because Israel blasted a hospital, [or maybe it didn't? ahhh whatever, they must have. feels like it was them, anyhow].
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On that front I agree with you. Though I don't think that it's limited to the hospital incident, earlier I almost quoted you to have your opinion on all your ambassadors, ministers and IDF officers making sure that Israel's image is damaged with wild talking point that they generally limit to the national audience. Up until this week I think that a lot of people didn't realize what Israel far right actually looked like which was a good thing in terms of image but now you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube.
 
sullydnl said:
I really dislike that I have no idea how reliable 99% of the tweets posted in this thread are. They could be true, they could be from biased accounts, they could be deliberate lies, they could be the opinions of some random idiot who hasn't a clue what he's talking about but tries to sound like he does on twitter.
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Yup. It makes it impossible to have a handle on what’s going on. I’m ignoring my own advice by getting sucked into looking at a load of tweets on here. That video of a rocket being shot down, right before a large explosion on the ground does look very plausible but stuff like that must be so easy to fake now. Anyone can do it. So what about a high tech nation state, trying to spread disinformation?
 
hasanejaz88 said:
To all Pro-Israeli's trying to act smart saying "oh where are all the where's the evidence folk now", the major difference is Israel has bombed hospitals before, time and time again, and hit the same hospital last week, so there is pretty easy to understand them doing it again. Hamas, as evil as they are, though have never beheaded any babies before so ofcourse it was going to be hard to believe.

Hope that clarifies things for you.
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Yes, there are obvious distinctions between these two events and you put it nicely.
Still, this doesn't negate the fact that people jump to conclusions based on past events and current emotions.
Not facts. we're not gonna get those.

Your saying "Israel has hit this hospital days before" makes no more or less sense than someone else here who said, "This might have been a failed launch that has hit some oxygen tanks thereby causing a bigger explosion that can bring an entire hospital down".

I'm not all that pro-Israel and I'm not acting smart.
 
dinostar77 said:
They wont pause, because there is no punishment, no sanctions, no consequences. They can carry on doing what they want with impunity. Whos going to stop them?
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There is a limit, have no doubt. I dread to think what that number (of dead) is, I dunno, but Israel is reliant on international support and they know it. Intentionally bombing a packed hospital would threaten even US support.
 
hasanejaz88 said:
To all Pro-Israeli's trying to act smart saying "oh where are all the where's the evidence folk now", the major difference is Israel has bombed hospitals before, time and time again, and hit the same hospital last week, so there is pretty easy to understand them doing it again. Hamas, as evil as they are, though have never beheaded any babies before so ofcourse it was going to be hard to believe.

Hope that clarifies things for you.
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This
 
The IDF guy on the beeb just now tying himself in knots. And then just flat out lying denying they've attacked any healthcare sites. Then covers himself by saying they don't do it intentionally. And they only attach Hamas. Ends with slagging off the press.
 
hasanejaz88 said:
To all Pro-Israeli's trying to act smart saying "oh where are all the where's the evidence folk now", the major difference is Israel has bombed hospitals before, time and time again, and hit the same hospital last week, so there is pretty easy to understand them doing it again. Hamas, as evil as they are, though have never beheaded any babies before so ofcourse it was going to be hard to believe.

Hope that clarifies things for you.
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They are either ignorant of the reality of this conflict or playing dumb. The latter is more likely from what I read in this thread in the last 10 days.
 
Simbo said:
There is a limit, have no doubt. I dread to think what that number (of dead) is, I dunno, but Israel is reliant on international support and they know it. Intentionally bombing a packed hospital would threaten even US support.
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It won't.

America has a current homelessness crisis and drug problem, thousands living in destitution. Post fires, they offered $750 each to the victims in Hawaii. Because there is no money apparanetly.

They give Israel $3,3 Billion a year. And they will next year too.
 
Someone needs to put a stop to this before things get really fecked up.

Bombing a hospital is fecked to the core, I fear things might get even crazier.

Israel must slow down, surely they can see they're losing the public, and if things go even worse, they're effectively targeting their own citizens in other countries.

The world needs this to stop asap.

We need some peace man, come on.
 
JPRouve said:
On that front I agree with you. Though I don't think that it's limited to the hospital incident, earlier I almost quoted you to have your opinion on all your ambassadors, ministers and IDF officers making sure that Israel's image is damaged with wild talking point that they generally limit to the national audience. Up until this week I think that a lot of people didn't realize what Israel far right actually looked like which was a good thing in terms of image but now you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube.
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My opinions of the Israeli far right are quite simple and straightforward- they're scum. They wish on the entire population of Gaza what Hamas wishes to happen to the entire state of Israel. That's nothing new. What's new is that they hold key positions in our government, whereas before they were more fringe figures.

The more significant thing is that many people who have "centric" views (i.e. don't give much of a crap about politics and don't like the extremes or the Israeli left or right) seem to have adopted a right-leaning view like never before.

I have close family members, most of whom will be considered lovely people by all of you, and they freely say "It's us or them cnuts, I stopped caring what happens to anyone in Gaza, we need to rescue the hostages and then this place can burn".

Now for you guys, it's laughable because no "lovely person" can say such a thing... but alas.
Things are very peculiar around here.
 
Putting aside the hospital massacre, there is still no fuel or water for 2 million people.

People on 'safe' routes in gaza heading south(as advised by the Israelis) are being bombed.

And armed settlers on the rampage - with an uninterested israel state security watching on - in the West Bank.

Why the feck is there no immediate call for a ceasefire.
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
My opinions of the Israeli far right are quite simple and straightforward- they're scum. They wish on the entire population of Gaza what Hamas wishes to happen to the entire state of Israel. That's nothing new. What's new is that they hold key positions in our government, whereas before they were more fringe figures.

The more significant thing is that many people who have "centric" views (i.e. don't give much of a crap about politics and don't like the extremes or the Israeli left or right) seem to have adopted a right-leaning view like never before.

I have close family members, most of whom will be considered lovely people by all of you, and they freely say "It's us or them cnuts, I stopped caring what happens to anyone in Gaza, we need to rescue the hostages and then this place can burn".

Now for you guys, it's laughable because no "lovely person" can say such a thing... but alas.
Things are very peculiar around here.
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Stay strong and be safe.
 
Simbo said:
I think so, I wouldn't go so far as suggesting it would be cut off, but with the aid they give, the influence they have, if Biden says stop...
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That would also be a bad idea.

The Arab countries would suddenly be in a great position of power and we don't want that either.

Only a small spark could cause another full out war against Israel and all hell could brake out.

We need a deescalation. A peaceful solution with a shit load of compromises on both sides.

We need reasonable people running the show.
 
DickDastardly said:
Someone needs to put a stop to this before things get really fecked up.

Bombing a hospital is fecked to the core, I fear things might get even crazier.

Israel must slow down, surely they can see they're losing the public, and if things go even worse, they're effectively targeting their own citizens in other countries.

The world needs this to stop asap.

We need some peace man, come on.
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They can see that, but won't let it stop them. Once your higher-ups claim that the enemy is elevated to the evilness of the Nazis,
then "the world" once again doesn't understand how serious a threat the Jewish nation is dealing with,
and so it's in their interest to not listen to the public and defend themselves to the hilt.

This, I suspect, is the Israeli mindset.
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
My opinions of the Israeli far right are quite simple and straightforward- they're scum. They wish on the entire population of Gaza what Hamas wishes to happen to the entire state of Israel. That's nothing new. What's new is that they hold key positions in our government, whereas before they were more fringe figures.

The more significant thing is that many people who have "centric" views (i.e. don't give much of a crap about politics and don't like the extremes or the Israeli left or right) seem to have adopted a right-leaning view like never before.

I have close family members, most of whom will be considered lovely people by all of you, and they freely say "It's us or them cnuts, I stopped caring what happens to anyone in Gaza, we need to rescue the hostages and then this place can burn".

Now for you guys, it's laughable because no "lovely person" can say such a thing... but alas.
Things are very peculiar around here.
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I've found something similar. People who I previously thought were relatively reasonable and centrist or even quite progressive suddenly are asking for blood. A few I'd even consider some of the nicest people I knew. It's quite disheartening to experience that.
 
ScholesyTheWise said:
They can see that, but won't let it stop them. Once your higher-ups claim that the enemy is elevated to the evilness of the Nazis,
then "the world" once again doesn't understand how serious a threat the Jewish nation is dealing with,
and so it's in their interest to not listen to the public and defend themselves to the hilt.

This, I suspect, is the Israeli mindset.
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Ah, the Nazis.

Yeah I get that they want to avoid the suffering and humiliation, but they need a hard look at the mirror, they're becoming what they hated the most.

Slowly, but surely, if they continue to act like this, it's effectively resembling the final solution.

And that's a horrible thing to do.
 
Simbo said:
Longer thread of analysis (he means read his thread, not the Yousuf troll).

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I'm confused, was it a missile or a rocket? They are not the same. Also seems crazy on the face of it that it exploded in mid air, and only a piece if it fell on the hospital, and still that was enough to do 100x the human damage that any other rocket fired from Gaza has ever done.

I'm not saying it's wrong, it just seems more of a stretch to believe.
 
Redplane said:
I've found something similar. People who I previously thought were relatively reasonable and centrist or even quite progressive suddenly are asking for blood. A few I'd even consider some of the nicest people I knew. It's quite disheartening to experience that.
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Yeah. Depressing as hell.
The only thing I seem to be in agreement within my social circles is,
that Bibi should be hounded out of politics once this shite is over (for me he ideally dies the most horrible death, but ok, I'll settle for less).

Anything other than that, I'll get scorned by my closest of friends.
I don't know a single person from my surroundings who doesn't personally know at least one person who's been massacred by Hamas.
So to a degree, it's understandable, but still...

I have to remind myself to not voice my opinions. sucks.
 
American officials said they believed the deployment of aircraft carrier strike groups has, at least for now, deterred Hezbollah from opening a new front in the war.
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DickDastardly said:
Someone needs to put a stop to this before things get really fecked up.

Bombing a hospital is fecked to the core, I fear things might get even crazier.

Israel must slow down, surely they can see they're losing the public, and if things go even worse, they're effectively targeting their own citizens in other countries.

The world needs this to stop asap.

We need some peace man, come on.
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There’s no recourse for Israel as they’re backed by the US pretty much to the hilt. And the EU is in the US’s shadow. I’m not surprised that there’s a lot of blame directed at the US for this as well.
 
Redplane said:
I've found something similar. People who I previously thought were relatively reasonable and centrist or even quite progressive suddenly are asking for blood. A few I'd even consider some of the nicest people I knew. It's quite disheartening to see that.
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I think outsiders don’t have a full appreciation for the shift in Israeli mindset about getting rid of Hamas once and for all. If left wing anti-government types are calling for the end of Hamas you can bet nearly all of Israel is as well.

None of us are truly prepared for what is about to happen in the coming weeks. It will be savage and unprecedented. The fact that it will all unfold on social media will only amplify anxiety levels for those who spend their lives doomscrolling their Twitter feeds.
 
I now really wonder how quickly the US intelligence community can work now and get all facts ahead of the scheduled Biden visit in Israel. Seriously, I think Biden should have postponed the meeting between him and Israeli authorities for the time that we can get more answers about what happened in that hospital bombing. There is a matter of image for POTUS to worry about here as well.

Either the IDF made a massive feck-up or Hamas somehow killed their own people. Whatever the truth is, it has to come out.
 
DickDastardly said:
Ah, the Nazis.

Yeah I get that they want to avoid the suffering and humiliation, but they need a hard look at the mirror, they're becoming what they hated the most.

Slowly, but surely, if they continue to act like this, it's effectively resembling the final solution.

And that's a horrible thing to do.
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Exactly, so many Jews died during WW2 but Israel have no empathy for people they are murdering themselves.

What the feck is wrong with these murdering scumbags once they are in power
 
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