Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

Slevs said:
I don't think anything will happen, cause if they wanted to, they'd have done it already.

A few missiles being hit between both parties at the borders is the status quo, nothing damning. Its their way of saying "we're with you but can't go all in right now".
Israeli recon/spy plans are all over Beirut though 24/7 for some reason, donno what they want to check, its not as if anything has changed for the last 30 years. Gets annoying hearing the noise every night, sometimes you wake up and can't sleep again because of it, goddamn Israilis. Ah of course, invasion of foreign air space is met with nothing from governing bodies, US will just veto anything anti-Israel.

Even the public, its all normal here. Christmas decorations being set up most places, no one is worried because we know nothing will happen, because it (logically) should've happened already.
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Are you in Beirut slevs? Can you hear the munitions from there?
 
RedTiger said:
Are you in Beirut slevs? Can you hear the munitions from there?
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I'm in Byblos but work in Beirut 3 days a week + have most of the friends/family in Beirut (I lived there for 29 years until I got married 3 years ago and moved away).

Munitions? Not a chance. Its too far away in the south. You can only hear the airplanes when they fly over our airspace (again illegaly) for recon missions on us or to bomb Syria. Bombing Syria happens by directly flying from above my house. One of these days the motherfecker will land on my rooftop for tea or something. Sometimes we hear the bombing in Syria if its a biiiiiiiig explosion. Irony is now I can actually hear the planes in this very second.

You can also clearly hear the bombing in Lebanon when they decide to bomb something here, as they did in 2006 when they bombed all bridges in the country and communication antennas.
 
2cents said:
As you might expect, Israeli media are reporting it a bit differently from the Quds News Network:

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“Police say they removed graffiti in Jerusalem’s Mea Shearim neighborhood which expressed support for Hamas’s murderous attacks on October 7.​
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In addition to Palestinian flags, graffiti included the slogan “1400 Zionist terrorists neutralized,” a reference to the death toll in the devastating attacks in southern Israel, and “Zionists = Nazis.”​
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“Police who worked Wednesday morning to remove Palestinian flags and erase offensive graffiti in the Jerusalem ultra-Orthodox neighborhood of Mea She’arim were attacked by residents.​

According to a police statement, "During the course of the officers' activity, a disturbance ensued, which included throwing various objects such as eggs, water, bottles and stones."​
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The police announced that with the help of the municipality, inscriptions such as "1,400 Zionist terrorists neutralized" and "Zionists=Nazis" were erased throughout the neighborhood.”​
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Tbh even if the Israeli report was true(Imo it’s extremely doubtful) some flags, eggs and bad taste graffiti doesn’t give the police the right to attack people
 
Sweet Square said:
Tbh even if the Israeli report was true(Imo it’s extremely doubtful) some flags, eggs and bad taste graffiti doesn’t give the police the right to attack people
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No, the police in that video are out of control. But knowing Mea Shearim I don’t see much reason to doubt the reports.
 
Thought this was a pretty decent read from someone that appears to have some credentials.

Opinion: There’s a smarter way to eliminate Hamas

Obviously, doesn't have all the answers, but speaks well to what Israel is likely doing wrong right now, and why their strategy isn't conducive to long-term safety for their nation. It doesn't really delve into the situation on The West Bank, though, which obviously also has to be resolved somehow.
 
Mike Smalling said:
Thought this was a pretty decent read from someone that appears to have some credentials.

Opinion: There’s a smarter way to eliminate Hamas

Obviously, doesn't have all the answers, but speaks well to what Israel is likely doing wrong right now, and why their strategy isn't conducive to long-term safety for their nation. It doesn't really delve into the situation on The West Bank, though, which obviously also has to be resolved somehow.
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In my opinion Israel know it's not working but it suits them just fine.
 
Murder on Zidane's Floor said:
In my opinion Israel know it's not working but it suits them just fine.
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Yeah, I'm of the opinion that the objective isn't to defeat or weaken Hamas, but to make the situation completely untenable in both Gaza and the West Bank for the Palestinians, to the extent leaving is their only choice.
 
Murder on Zidane's Floor said:
In my opinion Israel know it's not working but it suits them just fine.
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I don't know. This approach seems destined to lead to another October 7th attack, whether it's a year from now, five years or ten years, but maybe Israel just believes that if they beef up border security it cannot possibly happen again.

I think it's just as likely that in their rightful rage after the attack, they have started something they don't really know how to finish, and absolutely doesn't know how to handle afterwards. There has still been no talk about who governs Gaza once/if Hamas are defeated, where the 2 million Gazans will live, etc.
 
Mike Smalling said:
I don't know. This approach seems destined to lead to another October 7th attack, whether it's a year from now, five years or ten years, but maybe Israel just believes that if they beef up border security it cannot possibly happen again.

I think it's just as likely that in their rightful rage after the attack, they have started something they don't really know how to finish, and absolutely doesn't know how to handle afterwards. There has still been no talk about who governs Gaza once/if Hamas are defeated, where the 2 million Gazans will live, etc.
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I am not saying Israelis, but is the Israeli government interested in another october 7th not to happen? the retaliation is just speeding their plans with the excuse of defensing themselves
 
2mufc0 said:
That's fine and upto you. But doesn't give you the right to tell others how to react to such a morally bankrupt position.
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That is not what I said.

Iker Quesadillas said:
What Amir is expressing in his posts is hardly unfathomable. There is nothing strange or novel about his perspective. It's just standard conservative arguments.

None of this is unusual. The same thing happened after 9/11. Plenty of U.S. liberals set aside their principles, temporarily or permanently, in order to advocate for wars and 'civilizational clash', because they were scared after the attacks and because of the pressure around them. They were wrong.
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I like reading your posts. Articulated and balanced.

I think that 9/11 is a shortcut currently used for the wrong reasons. It's catchy but I'm not sure it really is appropriate. There are undeniable similarities: the surprise, the shock, the amount of vicitms. The trauma is comparable and most certainly even bigger for the Israelis when you take into account their smaller population. However the context is very different.

In one case it was an attack carried by a terrorist islamist organization determined to change the current world order and unite the muslims under one banner, Islam's, resulting in the creation of the (new) Caliphate. By hitting the leader of the other world hard, but also western and even muslim countries under corrupt regimes on their own soil, they hoped to pit world populations against each other based on their religious background. They were in a logic of civilizational cash, or at least a religious one. Al Qaeda was also a transnational nebula without real roots, operating from and mostly in failed muslim states. Same for its even worse spawn, namely ISIS.

7/10 is something entirely different. It was an attack carried by an independentist palestinian islamo-nationalist movement using terrorist, and downright barbaric methods against an occupying, nationalist ethno-state using its own terrorist methods in both Gaza and the West Bank. All of it in a push to change the course of a losing colonial war which conclusion was considered to be already foregone by too many. 7/10 was not the start, but the climax of a much longer on-going conflict. And that's what you get when you have entrenched extremists on both sides. Both the Hamas and the current Israeli government don't even remotely consider the existence of the other country as an acceptable option.

Two different issues requiring two different solutions, something that doesn't sit well with many who just don't and won't accept it.

But I digress. What Amir's experienced is something that about 99% of the posters here never had and will never do. For which they should be thankful I might add, and I don't even want to touch on the Palestinians decades long suffering. You can and should rightfully expect from the government members and elected representatives to have a more nuanced view, keep a cool head and reign their own population in. Uphold the principles they were voted for. That's actually their job.

I find it however harder to demand the same level of restraint on normal people, they can express their anger, suffering but ultimately aren't deciding how war is going to be made. That's was my last my take on it and I don't think we should dwell on it any further.
 
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calodo2003 said:
Jfc, just an embarrassment…

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The crazy thing about isn't what he says but the fact he can say it because people are under the impression that palestinians haven't been vicitimized on a daily basis for decades by IDF and settlers. If you ignore the oppression it's easy to totally change the narrative.
 
JPRouve said:
The crazy thing about isn't what he says but the fact he can say it because people are under the impression that palestinians haven't been vicitimized on a daily basis for decades by IDF and settlers. If you ignore the oppression it's easy to totally change the narrative.
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It's gaslighting and treating people like they are dumb which could be very well the case with the base they're addressing.
 
calodo2003 said:
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ThIs has been a constant from day one, I have seen similar things in videos published by Le Monde. They level entire neighborhoods and then claim that they were targetting a specific person or building.
 
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