It would be nice to see them stripped of their titles even if it’s just to see his reaction to it. He would spend the rest of his days ranting about conspiracies and corruption against him and his overlords.
City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches
- Thread starter VanGaalEra
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
It would be nice to see them stripped of their titles even if it’s just to see his reaction to it. He would spend the rest of his days ranting about conspiracies and corruption against him and his overlords.
He's not wrong about other clubs being poorly run with huge riches. Which makes it harder to say it's all about the money they splash, when we have 2 perfect counterexamples in this league, and Barcelona with their levers elsewhere...
Leicester's rise wasn't organic
. City's rise not being "organic" is not unique to them; clubs like Chelsea and Blackburn and Milan and Madrid have benefited from "artificial" injections of money. They just had the misfortune of doing it in the last decade instead of 20-50 years ago. Oh, and doing it after rules were implemented to officially prevent clubs from going bankrupt, with the innocuous side effect of locking in a certain elite (but we know that was just an innocent mistake from UEFA and co). If they beat the charges/don't get punitive punishment, the nature of their funding will be forgotten as time goes on.
City's financial pull is a secondary/tertiary factor in the market being distorted; the primary factor is the collective wealth of the PL relative to the rest of Europe.
It would be a thing of beauty. He’s become so incredibly bitter.
Amd being backed by a State, which you've conveniently ignored but is a huge issue for most people that see an issue with City's rise.He's not wrong about other clubs being poorly run with huge riches. Which makes it harder to say it's all about the money they splash, when we have 2 perfect counterexamples in this league, and Barcelona with their levers elsewhere...
Leicester's rise wasn't organic
City's rise not being "organic" is not unique to them; clubs like Chelsea and Blackburn and Milan and Madrid have benefited from "artificial" injections of money. They just had the misfortune of doing it in the last decade instead of 20-50 years ago. Oh, and doing it after rules were implemented to officially prevent clubs from going bankrupt, with the innocuous side effect of locking in a certain elite (but we know that was just an innocent mistake from UEFA and co). If they beat the charges/don't get punitive punishment, the nature of their funding will be forgotten as time goes on.
City's financial pull is a secondary/tertiary factor in the market being distorted; the primary factor is the collective wealth of the PL relative to the rest of Europe.
The checks and balance in money expenditure between a sovereign State and a company, as rich as it might be, are just ridiculously different and can't be ignored when discussing this topic. State backing should not be allowed in (competitive) sports.
Your third paragraph is just sports washing propaganda bullet points as has been discussed several times before, but that you just keep bringing up for some reason.
He would go full Laurence Fox I reckon
And the political power as well. If United or Arsenal had been done for 115 charges it would have been done and dusted long ago. But it’s City, and it’s basically the PL vs the UAE.
It probably wasn't clear in my message but yes that's also what I meant. It's just a completely different entity with too many ramifications and ties, Beyond the political power, their mindset is also drastically different, as attested by their systemic cheating - they don't believe rules should apply to them. Other teams have breached rules of course, but not in the same manner or with the same scope as Abu Dhabi has.
He doesnt like his idol Pep being targeted.
I've argued for much more restrictive financial controls that eliminate extreme forms of wealth in the game, whether they are from countries or companies. I'm not twisting myself about to say 1 is ok and the other is evil. That's nonsensical. Wealth inequality driving football success is bad for the game, period.
No it isn't, If you think City's wealth is the primary factor in the distorted market, and not Bournemouth being able to outbid Milan for talent, then I don't know why you're even bothering replying my post.
You think Bournemouth outbidding Milan is the primary reason why the market is distorted?
Strapline checks out
I'm far, far from a PL fanboy as you will see from my posting history.
But 'small' English clubs outbidding European giants comes from their great television deal. This is a result of the PL excelling at marketing, delivering a good product at friendly kickoff times for other markets and ultimately, being the best and biggest league in the English speaking world. English being the lingua franca of the world it's not a surprise they are the easiest to follow for most neutrals around the world. There's a cultural/language disadvantage there for the other big leagues no matter how much English language content they produce.
How you can compare that form of inequality with the Abu Dhabi (or Saudi) government investing in football for sportwashing purposes is beyond me. And for me there is a fundamental, essential difference between a state investing as opposed to a a private individual. The latter can with greater ease lose interest, go bankrupt or simply not be able to sustain the relentless spending that City has had. I suppose if you're in the Musk, Gates or Jeff Bezos level you could, but you don't get to be that rich by buying guys who kick a ball for a living. They know better. Even Abramovich had to stop his spending at one point as will the crazy yank who owns Chelsea now. Abu Dhabi can just keep on going as long as there is oil in the ground.
And just for the record, it has nothing to do with being evil or not as you put it.. I would be just as critical if it was the Norwegian national oil investment fund owning the City group.
I'm not arguing it's not from the great TV deal. I'm saying that it is the primary factor of distortion, not a single club throwing money around. They can only have so many players in their squad.
When you think of big purchases that have shifted the market, what comes to mind: Neymar, Lukaku, Haaland, Caicedo, Rice, and so on... This is imperfect but I'm sure someone can pull up a spreadsheet. Now when you look at a list of such transfers, do you solely see City as the boogie man, or do you see a league flush with (deserved) cash using cash to hover talent up, increasing player prices? Inflation: too much money chasing too few goods/players.
Ok, blame City for full backs being over £50M, but that's about it.
Look, for some, being state owned is their red line, and they trust that the potential for billionaires to go bankrupt prevents the worst cases of inequality that a state owned club can get into. I for one think that line of thought is compromised personally (it pretends that all was well before 2010) but to each their own. My red line is that any form of wealth disparity (earned/unearned) that can be used to overcome sporting incompetence is harmful to sport, and beyond that line I can't be arsed splitting the diff between Abramovich and Mansour.
No. I think that the rush of money into the game from multiple sources coupled with a paucity for genuine talent is the cause for market distortion. As it is in nearly any economic market.
It's more complicated than pointing at City as the primary reason why the European football market is out of whack. Maybe I'm not seeing the boogieman under the bed
Ah, gotcha. So it's the PL's collective revenue deal which is the chief culprit, rather than City & PSG spending silly money from a bottomless pit.
Ah yes, I too feel that rapists are unlucky to live in an age when anti-rape laws were implemented.He's not wrong about other clubs being poorly run with huge riches. Which makes it harder to say it's all about the money they splash, when we have 2 perfect counterexamples in this league, and Barcelona with their levers elsewhere...
Leicester's rise wasn't organic
City's rise not being "organic" is not unique to them; clubs like Chelsea and Blackburn and Milan and Madrid have benefited from "artificial" injections of money. They just had the misfortune of doing it in the last decade instead of 20-50 years ago. Oh, and doing it after rules were implemented to officially prevent clubs from going bankrupt, with the innocuous side effect of locking in a certain elite (but we know that was just an innocent mistake from UEFA and co). If they beat the charges/don't get punitive punishment, the nature of their funding will be forgotten as time goes on.
City's financial pull is a secondary/tertiary factor in the market being distorted; the primary factor is the collective wealth of the PL relative to the rest of Europe.
Wow really??
Thats rubbish. Everton's 1 charge which they were cooperating on involved over 20,000 bits of paperwork to be went through. To think 115 charges over 10+ years would be dealt with swiftly for anyone is naive and even more so when one side it stalling.
Beautiful post.
I wish someone would put it to him that certain clubs felt they HAD to spend that amount of money to get anywhere near what City have done with their spending, and yes they've wasted the money horribly, but it was felt to be a necessity to keep up with a state backed club that have got 115 charges of financial corruption leveled against them.
So why haven't they made a start, or bundled some similar charges together? Surely the PL doesn't need to deal with all 115 charges at one sitting. Everton had 2 different charges, dealt with at separate times during the season.
It's ridiculous that a start hasn't been made, some of the charges must be relatively straightforward to deal with.
If you think any other club could push back and legal up to the extent that City have then you’re the one that’s naive.
That’s basically it. Other clubs in the PL spent more to try to keep pace, but they just weren’t any good at it and in cases like United, they’ve created a lot of problems for themselves in doing so. City set the bar for the current state of play in the PL, similar to Chelsea in the 00s. Chelsea’s wasn’t sustained for long though.
Not true, while City have more money the number of charges alone meant a long process, even before City started stalling everyone said it could be 3-4 years before the hearing. The commission and PL will have done quite well to get it sorted by this winter which looks likely.
The biggest issue is the way the charges are set and this is super important and no one seems to understand or pay attention, Everton didn't contest the charge, neither did Forest. Everton were like "Yup we're guilty but heres our excuse" so were Forest, City are taking the stance of "We're not guilty at all". They are completely different circumstances and trying to equate them is pointless. Even the charges themselves are not the same.
Everton were charged with failing FFP, city are pretty much charged with fraud.
Then all the journalists will start giving it loads about how it was always known what they did when they start piling into them after the event.
When the truth is you'd barely know they have these charges amongst all the fawning.
Not sure about that. If it ever all truly comes to light, a lot of people who were charmed and dined off of the... hospitality... will be keeping a very, very low profile indeed trying their damnedest not to be implicated in anything that'll be damaging to them or their reputation.
Only those who have kept their integrity this entire time might get on their soapbox, and even then, I think it'd be rather muted and matter of fact. They're a state masquerading as a football club, and there are lines not to cross because of that, even in giving out told you so's, lest they turn their Death Star on you as an individual and cripple you in the courts for the fun of it.
Talkshite were fawning over these cheating cnuts to a nauseating extent earlier on this evening, I couldn't listen to it. I turned over to 5live where there was a preview of the weekend's big fight.
Completely ignores the fact that clubs such as United, Chelsea and Arsenal have had to spend over the odds competing with a State sponsored sports washing project who have been cooking their books since 2008.
Pep knows he's ruined his legacy with City. He must be getting paid 2-3x his declared salary as a minimum for "consultancy" work in the UAE to accept destroying his reputation.
I‘ve always been super impressed with your honesty @padr81 and your seemingly legitimate disappointment in the whole situation.
Have you ever experienced comeback on Bluemoon for your posts here? I commend you for being so frank
£100m transfer and £600k every week for a Nordic mutant whose goals have won fewer points than McTominay's.
It's alright, he scored 5 against Luton.
It's alright, he scored 5 against Luton.
Will there be another investigation into their dealings from 2018 onwards?
I'm not on Bluemoon. Someone did tag me to tell me their was a thread calling me a rag over there couple of years ago but thats about the height of my interaction with the place. I do occasionally browse it and have friends there but I like being in places where the debate is more neutral and for all my issues with the ups and downs of this place, it is about as fair to oppo supporter as you could possibly expect. I mean you guys even put up with Dumbstar. I couldn't see many City or Pool forums putting up with some of you guys the way you guys do with us.
Almost certainly when the findings are made about 2008-2018.
Fair debate must be hard to come by and I can understand why own teams forums will be obviously weighted.
But again, fair play to you for your balanced views
PL must be delighted with their product being won 4 times in a row for the first time ever.