Anderson

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Cina said:
Question, if the same thing happens this season as most others, and he ends up injured for most of it and doesn't get a consistent run going, should we get rid?

I'm asking because the general consensus pre-season was that this was "make or break" time for him.
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It's been make or break for 3 seasons running now.

The only good thing for Anderson this time around is that's its looking like Scholes, Giggs, and Fletcher will/should be going at the end of the season. I don't have a problem keeping him around but we absolutely should not rely on him in the future.
 
Cina said:
Question, if the same thing happens this season as most others, and he ends up injured for most of it and doesn't get a consistent run going, should we get rid?

I'm asking because the general consensus pre-season was that this was "make or break" time for him.
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No, as has been mentioned, we'll probably lose one of Giggs or Scholes (and possibly both) so it makes sense to have him in there as he can be a very good player when he's fit and available. But we have to bring in at least one other midfielder who is quality, consistent and doesn't get injured very often. Relying on Giggs and Scholes at their ages, Fletch who had an appalling illness, Anderson who gets injured often and rarely does 90 mins and Cleverley who seems to pick up a few injuries too is much too big a risk. We've been caught with it too often now.

If the likes of Cleverley or Anderson are genuinely United quality they'll get games regardless of who we bring in.
 
I think we should keep him but also get someone in, maybe two midfielders in. If he ever does get over his injury problems then he'd be a boost to our midfield, so it's no harm in keeping him here as long as we don't have to rely on him.
 
Brophs said:
No, as has been mentioned, we'll probably lose one of Giggs or Scholes (and possibly both) so it makes sense to have him in there as he can be a very good player when he's fit and available. But we have to bring in at least one other midfielder who is quality, consistent and doesn't get injured very often. Relying on Giggs and Scholes at their ages, Fletch who had an appalling illness, Anderson who gets injured often and rarely does 90 mins and Cleverley who seems to pick up a few injuries too is much too big a risk. We've been caught with it too often now.

If the likes of Cleverley or Anderson are genuinely United quality they'll get games regardless of who we bring in.
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Pretty much the same as what I've been saying for the last two years, so I agree.

Anderson staying/going will definitely depend on who does or does not retire. Still, six years will have passed by then, and what the feck will we have from him to show for it? He needs to deliver this season.
 
I'd rather rely on Anderson as backup tha Scholes and Giggs. I'm not rulling out the possibility of letting him go eventually if his injury problems don't clear up, but right now it's building a set of quality midfielders with the right attributes, and he should be a part of that. Of course, we can't rely on him too much and need to add players with similar qualities, which make such a difference for us.
 
Of course there are exceptions with players returning from devastating injuries and doing well short and long term. Valencia being one of the them.

But for the most part, players are never the same. Hargreaves, Joe Cole, Eduardo, John Terry etc.

Yes Anderson's injuries with us have been knee and groin but you have to think a devastating broken leg has fecked with Anderson's fitness.

You break a bone, go lightly on it for a while, other muscles compensate, you injure those muscles and start a horrible cycle.

Anderson's injuries have gotten too much.

Fergie got rid of Saha who was a better and more established player than Ando.

I love the guy but you have to think if this injury isn't just a week or two, Ando's days with us could be over.

And it's a real shame cuz I love the Brazilian flair.
 
RedDevilCanuck said:
I love the guy but you have to think if this injury isn't just a week or two, Ando's days with us could be over.
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No chance.

Even if he's out until the New Year he'll have plenty of chance to show his class and prove he can stay injury free for the run-in.

Now if he gets another injury in the run-in after this, or if this turns into one of thise "3 weeks", "no 4 weeks", "no 8 weeks" "10 weeks" things.... well, that really could spell the end for him. Just hope the poor fecker can catch a break.
 
I'm always right said:
No chance.

Even if he's out until the New Year he'll have plenty of chance to show his class and prove he can stay injury free for the run-in.

Now if he gets another injury in the run-in after this, or if this turns into one of thise "3 weeks", "no 4 weeks", "no 8 weeks" "10 weeks" things.... well, that really could spell the end for him. Just hope the poor fecker can catch a break.
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I admire your faith buddy but as I said before to you and you backed him 100% he'll do well to last as he can't be relied on. Hopefully we buy in the midfield department and lose Scholes Giggs and Fletcher. I see Fergie buying 1 and keeping Fletcher. But even that pushes Anderson further away from being a starter. The guy oozes potential but can't see it being fulfilled here. Massive disappointment his form and fitness since he's been here.
 
Maybe buying someone consistent and reliable will help Anderson, he'll have less pressure and will be able to be managed better. Currently we rely on him and that clearly isn't working, buying someone else could help us get the best out of him without expecting more than he's currently able to offer.
 
Lawman said:
I admire your faith buddy but as I said before to you and you backed him 100% he'll do well to last as he can't be relied on.
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You make out as though as I didn't agree that injuries were a huge problem that he has to overcome, whereas that was the main point I was peddling.

Overcome the injuries and he'll be a superstar I think were my words, I understand how little faith people have in him doing so though, I can't say I have much faith either, Ando just can't get a break with injuries, they just derail him all the time.
 
gza the genius said:
Maybe buying someone consistent and reliable will help Anderson, he'll have less pressure and will be able to be managed better. Currently we rely on him and that clearly isn't working, buying someone else could help us get the best out of him without expecting more than he's currently able to offer.
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We've eased him in as slowly as possible this year, many, me included were screaming for him to be used more from the beginning of the season, but we thought SAF was just trying to "manage" him.

You can't be "easier" on him than the management were this season.
 
3 to 4 weeks according to Fergie. So given it happened a week ago, I'm assuming he'll be back shortly after Christmas.
 
pocco said:
Yeah, I don't dislike Anderson or have an agenda against him, just telling it how I see it. I'd love him to come good. Until maybe the last year or two I held out similar levels of hope, but it gets to a point where you draw the line and accept when you believe he's not going to turn that corner.

I'm out too until we have something more to discuss ie. Anderson starting a few games.
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I'm Always Right, this is what Pocco and myself were talking about with Anderson he can show flashes but yet again he gets injured and unfortunately the cycle has begun again. That is why we have got little faith in Anderson and think he is up against it making it here. We need a stelar midfielder in and this would only push Anderson further down the pecking order competing with Cleverley. Anderson could dazzle all but it looks increasingly like his ship has sailed and he's on his last hurrah 'time to shine or move on' thats how it should be at United.
 
Lawman said:
I'm Always Right, this is what Pocco and myself were talking about with Anderson he can show flashes but yet again he gets injured and unfortunately the cycle has begun again. That is why we have got little faith in Anderson and think he is up against it making it here. We need a stelar midfielder in and this would only push Anderson further down the pecking order competing with Cleverley. Anderson could dazzle all but it looks increasingly like his ship has sailed and he's on his last hurrah 'time to shine or move on' thats how it should be at United.
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Once again, I never once denied the problems with injury. In fact...

I'm always right said:
If he stays injury free then I think he has a great chance.

The chances of him staying injury free though, well.....

You don't ask yourself why we haven't bought anyone yet? I do, and I believe it's because of Cleverley and Anderson and the hope SAF has for them.
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My stance hasn't changed one bit expect that the Reading game showed me once more that a fit Anderson would be a superstar for us. A fit Anderson is so good and has so much potential that his ship won't have sailed until it has truly sailed. As I said earlier today (or was it yesterday) in this thread and you quoted, if this hamstring keeps him out for 2-3 weeks then he still has every chance. If it's an 8-10 week injury though, well then we might just be reaching a "sailed ship" point, although considering the money we paid, his age, his potential, and the money we'd get for selling an injury prone midfielder, I think he'll get many more chances yet.

My main argument with you the other week was you refusing to accept that so much of Ando not doing it here has been down to injury, and yet now you're making out as though that was exactly what you meant. Well, if that was so, why debate? because then we both agree.
 
No the point I argued was you quoted me by saying how strange it was that I said his ship had sailed after his sub performance against QPR. When in reality I said it was over the 5 years I had judged him rather than his 30 min cameo and due to the fact he can't stay fit then............. I have no problem with his ability I'd love him to come good but for the money we paid for him I had higher expectations than what we have seen. He is lucky not to be shipped out already if we had a couple better midfield options than Giggs and Scholes then he wouldn't be getting a look in right now imho. The dearth of talent in the centre midfield is giving him his chance he really needs to step up stay injury free and produce or its bye bye time.
 
I'm always right said:
Nothing yet. Hoping SAF will mention how bad it was in his presser.
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I guess he did. :(

TheBest said:
He will be the surprise inclusion against city :devil:
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I was hoping that might be the case as well but alas there is to be no miracle pro wrestling like recovery.

simonhch said:
3 to 4 weeks according to Fergie. So given it happened a week ago, I'm assuming he'll be back shortly after Christmas.
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Losing him over the busy Christmas period is a blow.
 
Lawman said:
No the point I argued was you quoted me by saying how strange it was that I said his ship had sailed after his sub performance against QPR. When in reality I said it was over the 5 years I had judged him rather than his 30 min cameo and due to the fact he can't stay fit then............. I have no problem with his ability I'd love him to come good but for the money we paid for him I had higher expectations than what we have seen. He is lucky not to be shipped out already if we had a couple better midfield options than Giggs and Scholes then he wouldn't be getting a look in right now imho. The dearth of talent in the centre midfield is giving him his chance he really needs to step up stay injury free and produce or its bye bye time.
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Well how do we make an injury-prone player injury-free? Does it rest at the feet of the player?
 
"Stop getting injured, Anderson."

That should do the trick.

It'll have been really poor man management from SAF if he hasn't had a word with him about not getting injured by now; the fact that he keeps on doing it can't be a case of anything but pure insolence on the player's part.
 
I'm trying to remember what season it was when Ando came on against Wigan and he changed the game. Got a couple of assists as well. I'm sure one of the goals was a massive mazy run where he squared the ball for a tap in.

I'm pretty sure the game finished 5-0 and all the goals came in the second half.

Or is my ailing mind mashing everything together and producing a phantom game in my mind??
 
ghaliboy said:
I'm trying to remember what season it was when Ando came on against Wigan and he changed the game. Got a couple of assists as well. I'm sure one of the goals was a massive mazy run where he squared the ball for a tap in.

I'm pretty sure the game finished 5-0 and all the goals came in the second half.

Or is my ailing mind mashing everything together and producing a phantom game in my mind??
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Probably the 4-0 game at OT in October 2007, all the goals coming in the second half. He played alongside Scholes.
 
Out for 6-8 weeks according to the Times. His injury luck is awful.
 
Ah bollocks I really hope thats not true, he was looking really good lately IMO.

If he's out for 2 months now it'll be september before he recovers his fitness :(
 
We'll have to sell him and bring someone else in who can actually play a few games. Anderson doesn't do minor injuries does he? Always seems to be out for a while then plays one or two games then out again. Gutted because he is an obvious talent.
 
If true, then it's time to invest in a midfielder in January. Even if Nani leaves, I would like a central mid before another wide player.

It's unfortunate, he looked really good and I bought into the whole, "this is going to be the year of Ando" thing......again. :annoyed:
 
well this is frustrating but as someone already pointed out, its hardly surprising!

I'm afraid we need to get rid or at least bring in someone to replace him. As much as I like anderson, we can't afford to have him available for only 6 games a season.
 
I'm still absolutely convinced he's not fit enough to play football at this level, and that his "hard luck" with injuries comes from that fact.

He didn't look like this in his early career.

A shame that him and Cleverley are our only two viable partners to Carrick if we want to pair Rooney with van Persie against any decent side. Should've brought in a midfielder.
 
poisson said:
well this is frustrating but as someone already pointed out, its hardly surprising!

I'm afraid we need to get rid or at least bring in someone to replace him. As much as I like anderson, we can't afford to have him available for only 6 games a season.
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Exactly my thoughts... I'm gutted he's out for two months. You can only imagine what kinda player he could have been if he had stayed fit (barred a few weeks of course) every season since he got here. He's been brilliant recently.
 
marjen said:
I'm still absolutely convinced he's not fit enough to play football at this level, and that his "hard luck" with injuries comes from that fact.

He didn't look like this in his early career.

A shame that him and Cleverley are our only two viable partners to Carrick if we want to pair Rooney with van Persie against any decent side. Should've brought in a midfielder.
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I think that's a bit of a sensationalist view that often gets bandied about. We are speaking about a man who, literally, plays football every day, for a living. Not to mention that he works/plays at a top professional institution too.

Anderson's body many perhaps not be best suited to the intensity, but I think a man who trains hard every day, for years, must certainly be fit enough.
 
Rozay said:
I think that's a bit of a sensationalist view that often gets bandied about. We are speaking about a man who, literally, plays football every day, for a living. Not to mention that he works/plays at a top professional institution too.

Anderson's body many perhaps not be best suited to the intensity, but I think a man who trains hard every day, for years, must certainly be fit enough.
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If your body's heavier than it should be to ideally sustain the pressure it's put under in intense professional sports, then you're going to break down and get injured.

Which I guess is what's happening.
 
feck sake. Pretty much until february then, when we enter the knockouts of the champions league. I don't have high hopes for him playing much more this season. Knew it was going to happen, and now we just have to hope nothing happens to Cleverley again or we really are in trouble.
 
Not surprised. Then again, I don't think we should sell him or anything. Now that Giggs and Scholes are so clearly over the hill, and Fletcher's never going to be first-choice quality again, we can keep Ando as backup, and buy someone world class on top. Basically, we now lack quantity as well as quality. Cheery thought.
 
marjen said:
If your body's heavier than it should be to ideally sustain the pressure it's put under in intense professional sports, then you're going to break down and get injured.

Which I guess is what's happening.
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I really do think it is just unlucky. His fitness has looked fine in recent games lasting most if not all of the game and offering more burst intensity than all but our wingers and wingbacks.
 
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