Well considering Hernandez isn't South American I think we got that, and well, we wouldn't have been very "smartass" if we thought Mexico was in South America would we??
Antonio Valencia... | Will wear #25 shirt from this point onwards by request
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
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I'm not as concerned about Valencia having "lost a step", which I think is the case. He still does a decent job getting crosses in.
What concerns me more is that he has lost the sting in his shot. I'd like to see him score 5-10 goals a year, greedy bastard that I am.
What concerns me more is that he has lost the sting in his shot. I'd like to see him score 5-10 goals a year, greedy bastard that I am.
Don't you know? There's more about a winger then just goals and assists... (according to some)
When thinking of Val that's turning 720 degrees and breaking up attacks by standing and watching and finally playing the ball back to the fullback.
Harsh, but he really has been shit beyond belief this season. Although in his last few outings he has started to look better again.
There's always next season. (I think)
Wtf?
His crossing has been absolutely woeful, he's literally been smashing most of them into the crowd.
It's not just his assists either it's his contribution, or lack of to our attacking play that's the most annoying. With Valencia on the field more often than not he's causing attacks to break down, he either slows the play down to a stop (and 360 spin) or passes a safe ball 30 yards back to Rafael, I bet in those 22 appearances he probably tried to beat his man 1-2 times. He never even runs at the full back anymore his head seems to be completely lost. Lets hope he goes away in the summer and comes back something like the player he was last year, if not he wont be here beyond next season in my opinion.
Because this isnt poor form. Its a total collapse. Even the things he used to do in poor form he doesnt do anymore, ie. run his man and cross the ball in time and again. Back then you could never accuse him of not trying hard enough. Now you can.
He's fecking useless now.
Over the past couple of weeks his performances have been praised by both SAF and Vidic, which I found quite bizarre.
He has had a bad season but some of the criticism over the top now IMO.
He's not getting in any decent crosses whatsoever, even Tomus admits that. And 5-10 goals per year
Hasn't he only scored like 28 goals in his entire 10 year club career confidence building, and he has been better at least.
and according to you there isn't?
What player do you watch? He rarely shoots when on form anyway, his crossing has been abysmal this whole season, and physically he doesn't seem to be any different from last season. The problem seems to be his confidence and mentality.
Thing, is, you did think that.
So did I for years. I went there last year and was convinced I had been to South America.
Ok folks, Mexico is a signatory of the North American Free Trade Agreement, along with the US and Canada. They are neither Central nor South American.
Sounds like manager and captain trying to rally him on and get behind the player. Also, in the past couple of weeks, he's been far better than he has been for a long time.
If only the fans could get behind him too.
Did you watch his three assists for Ecuador? Judging by those, he certainly hasn't lost a step - just as fast as before. It was only this autumn that he made his spectacular run against Liverpool. It must be a mental thing as he seems to think too much. Against Chelsea he had the opportunity to just knock it past Mikel and run for it - he is faster than Mikel even with a broken foot, so why didn't he do it? Either he is overthinking it or has lost belief, or both.
His crossing has been shit either way though
That is does. I think some on here forget what a player he was to be honest, and believe me, I've forgotten at times too.
It wasn't that long ago that the Caf was greatly applauding Valencia getting that number 7 kit. Rightly so too, after the season he had. I'm crossing my fingers and toes he gets back to his best next season, as he is a great player and professional.
He's been praised for his last two games, if we take a look at those games....
STOKE:
PASSING
He made attempted 41 passes against Stoke, completing 31 of them (76%)
Of those passes, every single one was a short pass and he made no crosses. The closest he got and only time he attempted anything from a crossing position was an unsuccessful short cutback into the area
Of those 41 passes, just 13 were forward (32%) although only 8 were successful.
Of those 41 passes, just 6 were square (15%) although only 3 were successful.
Of those 41 passes, 22 were backwards (53%) 20 of which were successful.
OTHER NOTABLE CONTRIBUTIONS
He attempted to go past a player 4 times. Just one time was it successful.
He made just 1 tackle and attempted 1 more.
He made 2 interceptions.
He won just 4/13 aerial duals.
SUNDERLAND:
PASSING
He attempted 42 passes against Sunderland and completed 34 (81%)
Of those passes, 38/42 were short passes.
19 were forward (13 completed), 15 were backwards (15 completed) and 8 were square (6 completed)
He attempted 3 crosses. One was blocked, one flew out of play over the bar and one reached Smalling on the near edge of the area and was impossible to bring down or direct onwards.
OTHER NOTABLE CONTRIBUTIONS
He attempted to go past a player 4 times and completed that twice.
He completed 5/5 tackles.
He made no interceptions.
He won 2/5 aerial challenges.
Compare them to the same games last year:
STOKE:
Passes: 63/71 (89%
Crosses 1/7
Take Ons: 5/7
Tackles: 2/2
SUNDERLAND:
Passes 38/43 (88%)
Crosses 1/6
Take Ons 3/5
Tackles 4/4
Now that's comparing 2 of his so called "better" games this season with the two equivalent fixtures last season which were two average games for him.
Compare it to a game where he played well like this one:
BLACKBURN:
Passes: 49/59 (53%)
Crosses: 6/21
Take Ons: 1/4
Tackles: 4/4
(Goals: 1)
We haven't seen anything like that this season, you could say his confidence is shot but I don't believe it's just that. He's lost his pace and as a result pretty much his whole skill set. I'll be shocked if we ever see him perform to that standard again, delighted, but shocked.
STOKE:
PASSING
He made attempted 41 passes against Stoke, completing 31 of them (76%)
Of those passes, every single one was a short pass and he made no crosses. The closest he got and only time he attempted anything from a crossing position was an unsuccessful short cutback into the area
Of those 41 passes, just 13 were forward (32%) although only 8 were successful.
Of those 41 passes, just 6 were square (15%) although only 3 were successful.
Of those 41 passes, 22 were backwards (53%) 20 of which were successful.
OTHER NOTABLE CONTRIBUTIONS
He attempted to go past a player 4 times. Just one time was it successful.
He made just 1 tackle and attempted 1 more.
He made 2 interceptions.
He won just 4/13 aerial duals.
SUNDERLAND:
PASSING
He attempted 42 passes against Sunderland and completed 34 (81%)
Of those passes, 38/42 were short passes.
19 were forward (13 completed), 15 were backwards (15 completed) and 8 were square (6 completed)
He attempted 3 crosses. One was blocked, one flew out of play over the bar and one reached Smalling on the near edge of the area and was impossible to bring down or direct onwards.
OTHER NOTABLE CONTRIBUTIONS
He attempted to go past a player 4 times and completed that twice.
He completed 5/5 tackles.
He made no interceptions.
He won 2/5 aerial challenges.
Compare them to the same games last year:
STOKE:
Passes: 63/71 (89%
Crosses 1/7
Take Ons: 5/7
Tackles: 2/2
SUNDERLAND:
Passes 38/43 (88%)
Crosses 1/6
Take Ons 3/5
Tackles 4/4
Now that's comparing 2 of his so called "better" games this season with the two equivalent fixtures last season which were two average games for him.
Compare it to a game where he played well like this one:
BLACKBURN:
Passes: 49/59 (53%)
Crosses: 6/21
Take Ons: 1/4
Tackles: 4/4
(Goals: 1)
We haven't seen anything like that this season, you could say his confidence is shot but I don't believe it's just that. He's lost his pace and as a result pretty much his whole skill set. I'll be shocked if we ever see him perform to that standard again, delighted, but shocked.
If he were for sale, no top club would be in for him.
I doubt it.. He would do well at a Roma, Everton, Spurs level.
I almost feel like people are incredibly resilient to accepting this despite it being massively obvious. Getting the ball and immediately looking nervy and uncomfortable stinks of lack of confidence, not lack of pace. It's very odd and pretty sudden.
There's no way we should be selling him though after a season of poor form, mind (think there are people that have advocated that). I do think this season has marked such a huge decline in his game that we ought to be pretty worried, but at the same time it's not impossible that he'll return to form.
Not sure I've ever seen a player of his age appear to go backwards so badly as he has done this season. Am still reeling in shock.
According to me assissts and goals are indeed very important to a winger. So excusing his lack of those with what else he brings to the team is always dumb.
But of course it's also important what else he does on the pitch, just that Val sucks at pretyy.much everything this season and even looked lazy defensively in some games
So yeah as I said incredibly frustrating season for him but there is hoping he is going to bounce back next season
Yeah I won't lie I did think that, learn something new every day
Stewart Downing disagrees with this sentiment.
Yeah I won't lie I did think that, learn something new every day
Don't worry about it, Pexbo went to Mexico and spent the next few years telling people "yeah I've been to South America"
Sadly I think Downing has kicked Valencia's ass in the goals and assists columns this season.
Not sure if you've based your conclusion on those stats or not but they certainly don't support the point you're making.
First of all, you post some stats from last season as evidence of what he can produce on a good day.
Now, the only possible reason a very fit 27 year old footballer like him could have permanently lost his pace as you claim would be as a result of a very serious injury, or multiple muscle injuries (e.g. Giggs or Owen) The obvious serious injury for Valencia was his broken leg. This happened well over a year before he produced those stats. So if we're seeing acceptable performances almost 18 months after that injury, then we can safely assume the broken leg has nothing to do with his under-par performances this season. In the absence of multiple muscular injuries (which he hasn't had) then there's no plausible reason for him losing his pace, or going through some sort of rapid physical decline.
Based on the stats you yourself posted, we can rule out a physical cause for him playing poorly this season. What the stats do show, however, is someone who has become reluctant to take his man on, get to the byline and cross into the area. Stats aside, it's really quite obvious from watching him that he's not playing with any confidence. Feck knows how long it will take him to regain that confidence but lost confidence is a lot less of a worry, long-term, than this mythical loss of pace you seem to think is behind all his woes.
Anyway, does this really look like a footballer who's lost his pace?
Its like nobody has ever had a shit season before. Not Giggs. Not Evans. Not Nani.
There is nothing especially complicated or unusual about it. He's going through a lull, he'll come back as good as ever, just like many others have before him.
There is nothing especially complicated or unusual about it. He's going through a lull, he'll come back as good as ever, just like many others have before him.
I'm confused that anyone thinks he is looking much better in recent weeks. The last couple of games he has been equally as crap as the previous 20 odd.
In parts of the stoke game he picked the ball up deep, then absolutely blasted passed 2 players, suddenly realised he was heading towards goal, then stuttered and passed backwards.
His pace is still there for all to see, he is ridiculously explosive but for some reason refuses to use that speed when against the last defender?.
I dont know if he is worried about being clattered, but even when clear of the defender its like he has tunnel vision and is playing in blinkers.
I do really like Valencia, he works his ass off every game but sometimes that is not enough.
Im sure with perhaps a rest this summer, he will come back after re-valuating his season and wil right his wrongs. No doubt the coaches and himself are aware of his poor season, im sure he will do everything possible to get it back.
His pace is still there for all to see, he is ridiculously explosive but for some reason refuses to use that speed when against the last defender?.
I dont know if he is worried about being clattered, but even when clear of the defender its like he has tunnel vision and is playing in blinkers.
I do really like Valencia, he works his ass off every game but sometimes that is not enough.
Im sure with perhaps a rest this summer, he will come back after re-valuating his season and wil right his wrongs. No doubt the coaches and himself are aware of his poor season, im sure he will do everything possible to get it back.
Even in Giggsy's worst season he was creating and scoring goals, same with Nani. Evans had a tough year but was hardly ever in the side to correct it in fairness.
What has happened to Valencia this year is pretty unusual, he's been basically Stewart Downing for an entire season. His main job is to provide and also to chip in with goals, he just has not done that job all season long. Comparing that with Giggs is just silly.
I can be quite silly. Mind you, reading through this I am certainly not alone.
My point is his problem is one of form, not ability, and he will be back as good as ever in due course, of that I am very confident.
My point is his problem is one of form, not ability, and he will be back as good as ever in due course, of that I am very confident.
Maybe. I was never his biggest fan to start with but he did win me over a little last year. I personally think he doesn't have enough in his locker and doesn't offer enough of a goal threat for a United winger who will help us become the best in Europe again (29 club career goal in 10 years is it?) and I think there's just as much chance that last season's amazing form was not the norm.
He's a good player mind, but I'd prefer out wingers to be players that the likes of Chelsea, Bayern, Barca, Madrid, Juventus would be desperate to take off our hands.
That would be plausible if last season was the only time we've seen him in good form. 9 goals and 12 assists in 09/10 contradicts that theory though.
It's this season that's the anomaly. Even in the season that got written off when he broke his leg he was playing some great stuff in the weeks/months beforehand.
He was also very good at Wigan too. People seem to think his career started at United and nothing came before it. He stood out an absolute mile in that team, and caused big clubs, including us, alot of problems. The amount of times he rinsed Evra was probably the reason we bought him. It's a good job we don't go by that practice last season though, or we'd have bought every right winger in the Premier League.
You've just made that up to be fair. I remember him having one decent game against us and it was Vidic I remember him raping. (it was the 2-1 game that Carrick won for us). Aside from that Valencia did nothing against us in his time at Wigan where we regularly wiped the floor with them.
He was very good at Wigan, but still looked like a Spurs level player, just as he does today. His goals & assists record was still awful, N'zogbia had much better stats there and well, look at N'zogbia now.
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