Antonio Valencia... | Will wear #25 shirt from this point onwards by request

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Count Duckula said:
Ah, yes, as R Nick has already posted. That's the first time he's done it, hence R Nick mentioned he "chuckled" when he saw it. So, the first time he's ever hit a cross with his left foot is in the previous game, and yet that means he's two-footed?
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Huh? Did anyone say he's two-footed? Are you itching for a row or something?

You said he never uses his left-foot, it was pointed out that this isn't true. Simples.

Nobody is denying that he favours his right foot. The fact remains that he is one of many wide players who is very one-footed, not least some current and past United players who have been a huge success.

In terms of productivity and overall contribution to our season so far, Valencia has also been a huge success. He's played almost every game, he has - I think - scored more goals than any other winger in the league. He's also racked up a fair few assists and you don't need me - or, at least you shouldn't - to point out how much effective work he puts in defensively. He's done all this as part of a team that has been slightly below par, for all sorts of reason, almost all of which were outside his control (i.e. defensive injuries, unsettled central midfield, lack of quality left wingers, problems up front etc.) Sure he's had some bad individual performances but who hasn't? Rooney? Giggs? Carrick? Evra? Rio? Vidic? I can't think of a single player in our squad who hasn't had some really poor games this season (ok, maybe Fletcher?)

But hey, if you think the fact he is one-footed is good enough reason to belittle what he's achieved already, go right ahead.
 
Actually I think the fact that he's shite is good reason enough to belittle what he's "achieved".

But hey ho, we're not going to agree. I'll shit here with my Valencia and Berbatov voodoo dolls getting more and more frustrated when they feck up; you sit blithely with your head in the clouds singing your songs.
 
He was 2nd or 3rd in player of the month for December iirc and top in November I think, yet you actually think he's shite?!
 
Count Duckula said:
Actually I think the fact that he's shite is good reason enough to belittle what he's "achieved".

But hey ho, we're not going to agree. I'll shit here with my Valencia and Berbatov voodoo dolls getting more and more frustrated when they feck up; you sit blithely with your head in the clouds singing your songs.
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What are you basing that on though? Clearly he has not been shite this season, clearly he wasn't shite at Wigan.

If you think he's shite because he can't use his left foot as well as his right, then perhaps you should stop watching football and start playing more World of Warcraft.
 
esmufc10 said:
What are you basing that on though? Clearly he has not been shite this season, clearly he wasn't shite at Wigan.

If you think he's shite because he can't use his left foot as well as his right, then perhaps you should stop watching football and start playing more World of Warcraft.
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If I played any more Warcraft Elvis I'd have no time to eat or sleep :)
 
Count Duckula said:
If I played any more Warcraft Elvis I'd have no time to eat or sleep :)
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And you're still dodging the question. It's more probably based down to the fact he doesn't have a fancy name and wasn't bought from a foreign club as it is with many of you on here.

Evra didn't come straight in and set the team alight, nor did Vidic, nor did Fletcher, nor did Rooney (Granted he scored a hat-trick on his debut, but he was very hit and miss), nor did Ronaldo, nor did Ferdinand. You can't expect him to come to the biggest club in England, one of the biggest in the world, and be the new Ronaldo in his first 6 months. If you did expect that, then you're a bit silly, and football isn't the sport for you.
 
esmufc10 said:
And you're still dodging the question. It's more probably based down to the fact he doesn't have a fancy name and wasn't bought from a foreign club as it is with many of you on here.

Evra didn't come straight in and set the team alight, nor did Vidic, nor did Fletcher, nor did Rooney (Granted he scored a hat-trick on his debut, but he was very hit and miss), nor did Ronaldo, nor did Ferdinand. You can't expect him to come to the biggest club in England, one of the biggest in the world, and be the new Ronaldo in his first 6 months. If you did expect that, then you're a bit silly, and football isn't the sport for you.
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GREAT post.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
He likes a WUM, does CD.

Stopped for a while but seems to be up to his old tricks again.
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If this were a WUM I'd be arguing a far more ridiculous opinion, and I wouldn't be baiting you either; I'd be baiting people like Ekeke or Alex. Much more fun.

No, this is simply a case of me really, really not liking Antonio Valencia.
 
Count Duckula said:
If this were a WUM I'd be arguing a far more ridiculous opinion, and I wouldn't be baiting you either; I'd be baiting people like Ekeke or Alex. Much more fun.

No, this is simply a case of me really, really not liking Antonio Valencia.
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Why is he shite?
 
I've explained my opinions already; I'm not going through them all over again. We won't agree, so it's pointless rehashing the argument I've already had with Pogue and R Nick.

Shouldn't be so late to the party if you want to join in, Elvis :nono:
 
Count Duckula said:
Is this where I indulge in Caf tradition and respond with something along the lines of "you do love talking shit, don't you Brophs"? Not sure I've got the antagonistic reply down pat!

But I disagree entirely. Fletcher is stronger on his right foot but he doesn't make a habit of solely using his right to the detriment of his game. He does use his left, he's just not as good with it. That's fine, the same way Giggsy does use his right he's just much weaker on it. Valencia never uses his left. If he were presented with a tap-in on his left he'd still probably try and wrap his right foot around it somehow.

Evra is a left-back. That's not so much bother; his first job is to defend, and if he's playing in crosses or passes it'll generally be on the run from the left hand side where his one-footedness isn't such an issue. Valencia isn't like that - he needs to be able to create things, and being two-footed (or at least being able to fecking use your weaker foot) is a huge advantage in that situation. It makes you so much less predictable.

There's a clear difference between strongly favouring one foot (as those players both yourself and Pogue listed do), and actually been utterly incapable of using the weaker one.
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Surely his cross with his left the other day shows he's not "utterly incapable of using the weaker one"?

And I don't tend to get involved in those narky comments, although I remember aiming one at you a few days ago, which I have no problem apologising for now. I like talking/arguing about football on here, making it personal is silly. If we don't agree, so be it.
 
Valencia uses his left foot about as much as Berbatov. Neither one uses it a lot and will regularly use the outside of their right boot instead of the left if they can get away with it. It would be better if they had the confidence to use their left foot in situations which clearly suit using the left foot instead, but most of the time its alright that they choose to use the right foot still. For example his, the last goal against Wolves.




That strike actually suited him allowing it to come to his left hand side and having a left footed shot. But he chose to adjust his body and used his right foot to finish well.

He's not one of the most two footed players we have, he's not been nearly as good this season as some on here are suggesting, although he has improved a lot as the season has gone on and has been producing well in the last few months. But he's 1000 miles from shite. He's a good player, he just doesnt have as much variety and cutting edge to his game as some other, better wingers.
 
Ekeke said:
Valencia uses his left foot about as much as Berbatov. Neither one uses it a lot and will regularly use the outside of their right boot instead of the left if they can get away with it. It would be better if they had the confidence to use their left foot in situations which clearly suit using the left foot instead, but most of the time its alright that they choose to use the right foot still. For example his, the last goal against Wolves.




That strike actually suited him allowing it to come to his left hand side and having a left footed shot. But he chose to adjust his body and used his right foot to finish well.

He's not one of the most two footed players we have, he's not been nearly as good this season as some on here are suggesting, although he has improved a lot as the season has gone on and has been producing well in the last few months. But he's 1000 miles from shite. He's a good player, he just doesnt have as much variety and cutting edge to his game as some other, better wingers.
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Wingers like Ronaldo, for example? Which probably explains why Valencia has got so much unjustified criticism.

What I'd like to know is - apart from Ronaldo - who fits the description of "other, better wingers". Apart from Giggs and, maybe, Lennon - I can't think of a better winger in the PL.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Wingers like Ronaldo, for example? Which probably explains why Valencia has got so much unjustified criticism.

What I'd like to know is - apart from Ronaldo - who fits the description of "other, better wingers". Apart from Giggs and, maybe, Lennon - I can't think of a better winger in the PL.
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Well I'm sure it depends on preference. For me the most important thing from a winger is that they are producing something in the final third and helping to alleviate the pressure of doing that off the strikers, who obviously have to do the bulk of that work themselves - at least, when it comes to the league.

Giggs
Lennon
Milner
Arshavin
Bellamy
Wright-Phillips
Kranjcar

Have all been more productive than Valencia in his appearances in all competitions.

I know several of those players have played in other roles at times this season, but so did Ronaldo for us. And Giggs. And so would Valencia if he could play multiple roles well enough.

Over the course of the season and in all competitions Antonio Valencia has produced a goal or an assist in every 2.25 appaearances. Which, at least until last night was the exact same number as Joaquin who is Valencia's backup right winger. Joaquin played again last night which puts the number off at least until our next match. But I mean, this shows Valencia's slow start because he has been producing well in recent months and yet on the whole, thats not an impressive amount he's produced in his time on the pitch in the full season. It's a pretty average amount overall despite his good form in recent times.

When it comes to the champions league it can be a more cagey, cautious affair and you're more indepted to players who help make you solid in your formation such as Park and Hargreaves on the wings. And yes Valencia does a better job tracking back and helping back than some other wingers and he's our second top scorer in the champions league. So he's done well so far in that competition.
 
Ekeke said:
I know several of those players have played in other roles at times this season, but so did Ronaldo for us. And Giggs. And so would Valencia if he could play multiple roles well enough.
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He plays in the middle for Ecuador sometimes I believe, so he's clearly capable of that.

Over the course of the season and in all competitions Antonio Valencia has produced a goal or an assist in every 2.25 appaearances. Which, at least until last night was the exact same number as Joaquin who is Valencia's backup right winger. Joaquin played again last night which puts the number off at least until our next match. But I mean, this shows Valencia's slow start because he has been producing well in recent months and yet on the whole, thats not an impressive amount he's produced in his time on the pitch in the full season. It's a pretty average amount overall despite his good form in recent times.
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He's scored as many goals so far this season as he did in three years at Wigan, which shows he's stepped up considerably now he's surrounded by better players. It also takes time to get used to a new team and team mates, not even you could have expected him to be able to slot in as if he's been playing with our lads for years. His start with us has been very impressive.
 
R_Nick said:
He plays in the middle for Ecuador sometimes I believe, so he's clearly capable of that.
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You're absolutely right, I've seen him play decently there for Ecuador and I believe Sir Alex spoke about his ability to play in a central midfieldish role recently. But at the end of the day he hasnt played there for us - if he was better in that role than he is already, he might well have played there for us.



He's scored as many goals so far this season as he did in three years at Wigan, which shows he's stepped up considerably now he's surrounded by better players. It also takes time to get used to a new team and team mates, not even you could have expected him to be able to slot in as if he's been playing with our lads for years. His start with us has been very impressive.
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Thats fair. And I think he settled in well, just hasnt been one of our few players of the season.

To me he's simply not been as good overall as Giggs, Fletcher, Evra and Rooney. Is that an embarrassment on his part though? Obviously not. There are 11 players on a team and I've only listed 4. Clearly he's done very well in recent months. However, I dont feel we'll see him grow too much and do better than he has been doing recently. But anyone can be surprised and I'm no different. I just wont be holding my breath.
 
Ekeke said:
You're absolutely right, I've seen him play decently there for Ecuador and I believe Sir Alex spoke about his ability to play in a central midfieldish role recently. But at the end of the day he hasnt played there for us - if he was better in that role than he is already, he might well have played there for us.
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It could be that, or it could be more to do with the fact that he's been doing a good (very good imo) job on the right wing and moving him inside would necessitate putting somebody else out wide. To make that decision you'd have to be of the mindset that whoever was out there would do a good enough job that it was worth taking him away from there, and I'm not sure who we'd put out there in his place that would be good enough to warrant putting him elsewhere.

That make sense in my head, but I may not have got it across very well.


Thats fair. And I think he settled in well, just hasnt been one of our few players of the season.

To me he's simply not been as good overall as Giggs, Fletcher, Evra and Rooney. Is that an embarrassment on his part though? Obviously not. There are 11 players on a team and I've only listed 4. Clearly he's done very well in recent months. However, I dont feel we'll see him grow too much and do better than he has been doing recently. But anyone can be surprised and I'm no different. I just wont be holding my breath.
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I think those other names are all fair, most people will probably agree on the best 'bunch' and the order you put those 4 or 5 names is all just personal preference, everyone will likely disagree slightly.

I'm more optimistic about his progression, I think once he gets more used to the other player and more importantly they get used to him, it will be an extremely fruitful role. You are critical of his crosses but for me he puts crosses into very good/dangerous areas of the box, and once our forward players get used to expecting that kind of ball they'll be on the end of them a lot more.

Time will tell which of us is right though I guess.
 
At the start of the season, the whole one footed thing about Valencia was the one thing that played the biggest doubt on my mind on how good he can be. Right now he's got that drop the shoulder and beat the left back for pace and strength.

Too many times kept seeing him take it right then come back, has a lot of room to either take a shot or a cross and he hasn't because the ball is on his left foot.

That to me makes him easier to defend against. For a full back close out the outside, get a bit of help so he can't run infield with the ball if he does cut back but, not necessarily press him with 2 players.

Against a fullback like Figueroa he will be lethal, productive and a man of the match but, against more pacey full backs that can match him, he'll have difficulties in having an impact.

At least that is/was my feeling earlier in the season.

Recently though I think as his confidence has grown he's not limited to his "one move". He now drives infield more or will run through the middle of the field with the ball.

I've got a sneaky suspicion that he read the Caf before he started the season and saw how much people bashed Nani for not using the ball effectively and just cross the ball in however he could. He must have thought, hmm well I am not going to let the Caftards bash me, I am going to keep the ball and worst case I'll lay it off - at least I can't be crucified for losing the ball.

To me though this guy has a freaking brain. He's figured out that hey, there really isn't anyone that is going to meet my high crosses. So he tries to hit them hard and low across and more so he's learned that Rooney, Berbatov are more likely going to be further back in the 18 yard box and he needs to look up to see if a cut back is in order. That he looks to where the players are more before getting the ball in is what is making him a lot more effective.

The use of his left foot - I am sure United supporters around the world cheered. I certainly did, once I got my jaw off the floor. But, then I cheered some more because I know Valencia is supremely confident. He knows now the Caf is behind him and other than a Count, Duke or whatever titled person or two think - he's going to be able to take a few more risks. He doesn't always have to play the safe route, he can look to put a cross in with his left and if it doesn't come off, we'll just cheer because he used his left.

Yes, folks - Valencia reads Red Cafe ;)

His progress from the start of the season to now has been very good. He'll have the occasional blips but, for the most part I am not going to be worried with what we'll get with him on the pitch. Now, we just need to get the left side as stable and reliable and we should really stretch defenses.

My only other small negative about Valencia is that his involvement makes us less likely to swap players around during a game. This was one of the things that when we had Ronnie and Nani on the wings, gave us an extra edge. He does come in centrally letting Berba or Rooney move out to the right but, for the most part defenders are able to keep tabs on their assignment with him on the pitch. Just a small downside.
 
Ekeke said:
You're absolutely right, I've seen him play decently there for Ecuador and I believe Sir Alex spoke about his ability to play in a central midfieldish role recently. But at the end of the day he hasnt played there for us - if he was better in that role than he is already, he might well have played there for us.
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The reason he's not played anywhere other than the right wing for us is not because Valencia lacks versatility, it's because there's feck all meaningful competition for his place on the right wing, while SAF has an abundance of central midfielders to choose from. This is one of the reasons why Valencia has played more games than almost any other player in our squad.

I'm sure SAF is well aware that if he moves Valencia inside, his absence from the wing would harm us more than his presence in the middle would benefit us.


Thats fair. And I think he settled in well, just hasnt been one of our few players of the season.

To me he's simply not been as good overall as Giggs, Fletcher, Evra and Rooney. Is that an embarrassment on his part though? Obviously not. There are 11 players on a team and I've only listed 4. Clearly he's done very well in recent months. However, I dont feel we'll see him grow too much and do better than he has been doing recently. But anyone can be surprised and I'm no different. I just wont be holding my breath.
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Seriously?

You don't think it's reasonable to expect a new signing to build on and improve on his first 6 months with a new club? A new signing who has already improved to the extent where he scored as many goals in the first half od this season as he did in all of the the previous three? A new signing who has barely played two consecutive games with the same full-back? A new signing who only turned 24 at the beginning of this season?

You don't think you're being just a tiny bit negative?
 
Ekeke said:
Well I'm sure it depends on preference. For me the most important thing from a winger is that they are producing something in the final third and helping to alleviate the pressure of doing that off the strikers, who obviously have to do the bulk of that work themselves - at least, when it comes to the league.

Giggs
Lennon
Milner
Arshavin
Bellamy
Wright-Phillips
Kranjcar

Have all been more productive than Valencia in his appearances in all competitions.

I know several of those players have played in other roles at times this season, but so did Ronaldo for us. And Giggs. And so would Valencia if he could play multiple roles well enough.

Over the course of the season and in all competitions Antonio Valencia has produced a goal or an assist in every 2.25 appaearances. Which, at least until last night was the exact same number as Joaquin who is Valencia's backup right winger. Joaquin played again last night which puts the number off at least until our next match. But I mean, this shows Valencia's slow start because he has been producing well in recent months and yet on the whole, thats not an impressive amount he's produced in his time on the pitch in the full season. It's a pretty average amount overall despite his good form in recent times.

When it comes to the champions league it can be a more cagey, cautious affair and you're more indepted to players who help make you solid in your formation such as Park and Hargreaves on the wings. And yes Valencia does a better job tracking back and helping back than some other wingers and he's our second top scorer in the champions league. So he's done well so far in that competition.
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So he makes a telling contribution with goal or an assist pretty much ever other game? Fine with me.
 
R_Nick said:
That's what I was trying to say with my rambling post above.
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Meh. You put it just as well as me.

One more point on the whole improvement thing. I reckon that if Rafael can build on his last performance and hold down his place in the team for 5-10 games in a row, we'll see Valencia take his game to a whole new level. People accuse him of being one-dimensional and predictable but IMO that's largely been down to the lack of an attacking full-back to keep defenders in two minds.

So far this season Valencia has often found himself as the lone attacking presence against one or two defenders. It's no wonder he's sometimes struggled to get to the byline. The addition of someone Rafael alongside him makes him a considerably more potent attacking threat.
 
Agree with that, he makes good use of a full back of that style. He played well with Neville behind him earlier in the season as well, not sure how well Neville can do that on a regular basis any more though. Can't remember who it was against now but Valencia was regularly pulling two defenders away and towards the corner flag then laying it back to a wide open Neviller to put peachy crosses in all day.
 
He will almost certainly have a better second half of the season than the first as he settles and and gains more confidence.

The first half of the season has been good.


Needs to smile more the the miserable fecker!
 
Trigg said:
So he makes a telling contribution with goal or an assist pretty much ever other game? Fine with me.
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Just over. Which is less than 7 other premier league wingers (maybe more, I didnt check everyone) and countless more plying their trade in other leagues.

Yes Pogue, I'm sure I am being negative.

But thats just my honest opinion and I dont believe it'll have any bearing on what actually happens with Valencia in the future.

If there was any indictation that what I say now will affect Valencia, his footballing ability and his form in the future then I'm sure I'd have a few glowing posts about him. But I know that like anyone else's opinion here, it's not really going to change what happens with a professional footballer.

So I might as well be objective and honest. And if my post has more of a tint of pessimism than optimism, it wouldnt surprise me. And I doubt it'll change.
 
R_Nick said:
Agree with that, he makes good use of a full back of that style. He played well with Neville behind him earlier in the season as well, not sure how well Neville can do that on a regular basis any more though. Can't remember who it was against now but Valencia was regularly pulling two defenders away and towards the corner flag then laying it back to a wide open Neviller to put peachy crosses in all day.
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That was the problem I noticed - he'd get ball back to Nev (and other times whoever was playing at right back) and they'd not whip a cross in for whatever reason even with time.

We'd be laughing if we had an Evra behind him but, more so I think Rafael is going to be be the key as to how good our right side can be going forward. At least recent games he's shown to be a better crosser of the ball.

I guess if "back in 3 weeks" comes back fit and is behind Valencia - that work as well, that guy has/had one hell of a cross on him.
 
Ekeke said:
Just over. Which is less than 7 other premier league wingers (maybe more, I didnt check everyone) and countless more plying their trade in other leagues.
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Actually, it's more like 4, seeing as three of the players you listed have played up front more often than on the wing this season, and even then they play further forward when they're on the wing in a 4-3-3 which obviously gives them more licence to go forward. I know you mentioned it, but if you realised it you really should've not included them.

Not trying to twist the stats a it there? 'Course not.

So I'd say 5th most productive in the league's not half bad for a player in his first season.

Oh, and then there's the fact that another one played in centre mid more often this season, and seems likely to continue doing so, so isn't really a valid comparison.

So that'd be 4th. And then there's the fact that Krancjar and Giggs haven't had better starts to a league season in a long while, so them being on such great form isn't really something useful to criticise Valencia with.

So the only player that's worryingly produced more is Wright-Phillips. Which isn't actually worrying at all because Wright-Phillips got two of his assists in a competition that Valencia's not even started a game in, and is undoubtedly a weaker cup in which he played against Scunthorpe, so it's almost as if you're once again trying to twists the stats here as well. Hmm.

Oh, and by the way, I thought since you were being overly negative as you readily admitted I'd do the same. See how silly it is? You can still make valid points but they won't look it if you're looking at it from a glass 3/4 full or 3/4 empty, when the glass is clearly only filled up halfway, point of view.
 
Brwned said:
Actually, it's more like 4, seeing as three of the players you listed have played up front more often than on the wing this season, and even then they play further forward when they're on the wing in a 4-3-3 which obviously gives them more licence to go forward.

Just an unintentional mistake there though, right? Not trying to twist the stats a it there? 'Course not.

So I'd say 5th most productive in the league's not half bad for a player in his first season.
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The same 4-3-3 which Valencia has played a bunch of times this season while Berbatov was injured and we've seen him play his best football in.

And what do you mean trying to twist things? I made the point of stating that several of the people listed have played other roles as well this season. And if Valencia was as good up front as Arshavin or in central midfield as Milner this season he may have had a few games out of position too. We dont know.

If we just discount those players who are wingers or have played on the wing, then of course suddenly Valencia's stats suddenly look better because he has very few good wingers to be left to compare against. If anything, thats twisting things.
 
Brwned said:
So that'd be 4th. And then there's the fact that Krancjar and Giggs haven't had better starts to a league season in a long while, so them being on such great form isn't really something useful to criticise Valencia with.
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What the hell does that have to do with their form and how good they've been this season compared to Valencia? If you want to bring in pointless stuff like that, then how about the fact that Valencia hasnt had as good a start to a season before and is playing at a better club than Kranjcar. You just forgot to mention that stuff right, not trying to twist things? Course not.

So the only player that's worryingly produced more is Wright-Phillips. Which isn't actually worrying at all because Wright-Phillips got two of his assists in a competition that Valencia's not even started a game in, and is undoubtedly a weaker cup in which he played against Scunthorpe, so it's almost as if you're once again trying to twists the stats here as well. Hmm.

Oh, and by the way, I thought since you were being overly negative as you readily admitted I'd do the same. See how silly it is? You can still make valid points but they won't look it if you're looking at it from a glass 3/4 full or 3/4 empty, when the glass is clearly only filled up halfway, point of view.
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I dont care what they look like. They are factual and my opinion is honest. Couldnt give a rats ass what you think of it to be quite honest. Half of the stuff you're accusing me of, for some weird reason, you're doing all the while.
 
Ekeke said:
The same 4-3-3 which Valencia has played a bunch of times this season while Berbatov was injured and we've seen him play his best football in.

And what do you mean trying to twist things? I made the point of stating that several of the people listed have played other roles as well this season. And if Valencia was as good up front as Arshavin or in central midfield as Milner this season he may have had a few games out of position too. We dont know.

If we just discount those players who are wingers or have played on the wing, then of course suddenly Valencia's stats suddenly look better because he has very few good wingers to be left to compare against. If anything, thats twisting things.
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Yeah, you're right, comparing a player to other players who have played in the same position regularly this season is twisting things.

Definitely. Makes complete sense.
 
Ekeke said:
What the hell does that have to do with their form and how good they've been this season compared to Valencia? If you want to bring in pointless stuff like that, then how about the fact that Valencia hasnt had as good a start to a season before and is playing at a better club than Krajkar. You just forgot to mention that stuff right, not trying to twist things? Course not.

I dont care what they look like. They are factual and my opinion is honest. Couldnt give a rats ass what you think of it to be quite honest. Half of the stuff you're accusing me of, for some weird reason, you're doing all the while.
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A rats ass? You're turning into the chief mate, I'd be worried.

They're tainted facts. Carling Cup stats aren't worth including. Compare them in the league since that's the only competition they've all started in, then see if Valencia looks better off.

My money's on yes.
 
Brwned said:
Yeah, you're right, comparing a player to other players who have played in the same position regularly this season is twisting things.

Definitely. Makes complete sense.
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Makes more sense than comparing him with the 3 wingers left over after you discount all the wingers who have played in a 4-3-3 this season, in midfield or up front.

Oh look everybody we have the best winger in the league, because he's been more productive than Wade Elliot and Damien Duff. At least give Valencia the respect of comparing him with the better players in the league.
 
Ekeke said:
Giggs
Lennon
Milner
Arshavin
Bellamy
Wright-Phillips
Kranjcar

Have all been more productive than Valencia in his appearances in all competitions.
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This appears quite misleading.

After a quick glance the goal/assist:minute ratio for the Prem is pretty close between Valencia and some of those on the list. In fact I'm fairly sure Valencia has a better ratio than a few of them...

Not sure why you've mentioned other competitions. I assume it's so you can include a few more players, but then it doesn't really make sense to include Valencia's CL stats in comparison to other players' Prem or Europa League stats...

Plus, as others have mentioned, several of them play a more advanced role. And I think a few take set pieces more regularly also.
 
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