Thats your opinion. Feel free to express it but dont expect me to take any notice of it.
Antonio Valencia... | Will wear #25 shirt from this point onwards by request
- Thread starter NextSeason
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
- Status
Thats your opinion. Feel free to express it but dont expect me to take any notice of it.
Even the biggest doubter/haters of him probably have to admit he is doing far better than they expected he would be. That neither Rooney or Owen put away two chances against Leeds that he served up on a platter don't get reflected in stats. Stats are good and all but, his performances have been plainly in front of us - very effective and a constant threat down the right.
Who is to say once we actually start playing better - his stats won't be far better. Missed some great chances earlier in the season when on goal and with the way he's been doing recently, any such chances that come his way, must feel he'll bury them this time around.
In the words of Ronnie "God only knows" - how he'll do rest of the season or career with us but, no one can say he hasn't become better as the season has gone along. Got to really hate him not to at least have some optimism with how well he has done so far.
Who is to say once we actually start playing better - his stats won't be far better. Missed some great chances earlier in the season when on goal and with the way he's been doing recently, any such chances that come his way, must feel he'll bury them this time around.
In the words of Ronnie "God only knows" - how he'll do rest of the season or career with us but, no one can say he hasn't become better as the season has gone along. Got to really hate him not to at least have some optimism with how well he has done so far.
As for set pieces and advanced roles?
Valencia has played advanced roles in a 4-3-3.
He hasnt led the line like Arshavin, so fair enough there.
But something like Milner being drafted into the middle where if anything central midfielders tend to end up being less productive than wingers... It makes little sense to discount him. If anything that should skew his numbers in a bad way, not be seen as an advantage.
And, if Valencia were any good at taking set pieces, he'd take set pieces. So that hasnt a great deal of importance here. Did he take set pieces at Wigan? If so, when people were trying to work out how good he'd been at Wigan did anyone care to discount his stats because he took some corners and freekicks? Or does it only come into things when its a non-United player looking a bit better in a comparison with one of our own?
I have to agree with Shimo. From what I've seen I've been pleased with the start to his United career in a very disjointed team due to injuries etc. He's stood out in a lot of games which is always positive to see with a new player, his confidence has grown too has the games have come and I'm confident he'll push on even more in the months/years to come.
And for the stat freaks amongst us on the Caf, they don't fair too badly at all.
And for the stat freaks amongst us on the Caf, they don't fair too badly at all.
Whoever plays in his position he can be compared to. Arsenal's two most played wingers this season wouldn't include Arshavin, I'd think, and even then he's been more productive than Arshavin in the league this season. If you can't see that's impressive then there's clearly something wrong there.
Chelsea don't play with wingers. Lennon, Giggs and Krancjar have all had great seasons, on doubt, but in the league he's been more productive than Krancjar and he's only one and two contributions behind Giggs and Lennon this season, the two best wingers in the league up until now. It's pretty clear he's done well for himself going forward compared to other wingers in one of the two best leagues in the world.
And then there's his defensive contribution compared to the rest of them...
Oh and eh, it's not just my opinion, nor is it about just this. There's a pretty clear opinion about you that's shared by the vast majority, and if you don't care about what other people think about your opinion then there'd be no point in you being here.
People come on here to have their opinion noticed. I'm sure you do too. Never mind that though, just pick out one irrelevant sentence in my post to reply to with another entirely irrelevant point. It's what you do well.
Before you start smugly saying "the majority have an opinion on you" to Ekeke, Brwned, I'll point out the mass-rejoicing that went on a year or so back when people thought you'd been banned.
The viewpoints others hold on particular posters are, essentially, meaningless, since not enough people on here actually read enough to make informed opinions - they just follow the majority in adoring certain posters and hating others. Please don't bring internet politics into a debate.
The viewpoints others hold on particular posters are, essentially, meaningless, since not enough people on here actually read enough to make informed opinions - they just follow the majority in adoring certain posters and hating others. Please don't bring internet politics into a debate.
Thats a perfect post from you Brwned. Well done for speaking for the people.
I'm here to talk about football. There have been plenty who disagreed with my opinion, some who have agreed, some who have revisited things we've disagreed about in the past and come to see that I was right sometimes and then there are others like you, who seem to assume that everyone is like you and has the same reason for doing things that you do. Well thats just not the case, sorry.
I give my honest opinion to be involved in discussion and to later come back to that opinion and discussion and see who was right and to learn from it. Whether someone agrees with me right now, I'm not too bothered. If they dont agree with me in a year or two years then I was more likely mistaken.
I'm human, I make mistakes and if Valencia goes on to do, not good, but truly great things at this club - recognised by not just manchester united supporters, but football supporters around the globe as one of the best couple of wingers in the world, I will have been mistaken.
Agreed. I can't really say more than that. However i've been pleased and supprised with his perfomance in the last 1 month and a bit... but really for £17m I shouldn't be, but I am!
Eh? His best game of the season, by far, was playing 442 against Wigan.
You have this habit of tripping yourself up by trying to crowbar in potshots at your usual suspects. You should really stop. It makes you seem kind of dim and totally distracts from the main thrust of your argument.
The thing is we have paid a lot more for people who have delivered less, certainly in their first six months. You get so used to justifying sub standard performances as evidence of a settling in period that anyone who can do anything decent so soon after arriving seems wonderful. That is for me, I think, the crux of it. I am working on the assumption that what I am seeing now is not the finished article for Valencia. I am confident he will continue to improve. If this was it then yes, I would say he is probably good but not quite United quality. I dont think we as a team have been United quality this season, by and large. But I think he will improve because I think it is natural that it takes time to acclimatise to a new environment. And if he continues to improve on his current trajectory then I think he is going to be a very decent player for us.
You do the exact same thing with the likes of Nani. Its funny for you to bring something like that up.
That's just so typical of you.
You're absolutely desperate to avoid admitting that you might be wrong about anything, ever.
Hence, you move the goal-posts to the point where you will only accept that you might be wrong about Valencia (describing his productivity as currently "pretty average" and saying he won't grow and improve much etc.) if he goes on to become "one of the best couple of wingers in the world"
For feck's sake.
I like Valencia.
Trains hard, works hard on the pitch, and doesn't look for any attention outside of football.
Trains hard, works hard on the pitch, and doesn't look for any attention outside of football.
That's just so typical of you.
You're absolutely desperate to avoid admitting that you might be wrong about anything, ever.
Only you could quote a post where I say the exact words "I make mistakes" and suggest that if Valencia does great things here I would have been wrong about him, and then underneath that quote accuse me of being desperate to avoid admitting I might be wrong about something, ever. Well done.
Where have I said he wont go on to be one of the best wingers in the league?
See, you just create your own imaginary arguments and I only play a bit-part in whats actually going on in your head.
I dont believe he will be one of the best few wingers in europe, like I believe Nani could have been (I'm fast coming to the conclusion thats not going to happen, at least not at United). I just dont think he's as talented as some other players in his position. Even if you put Ronaldo and Messi to one side as phenoms, and just look at the rest there are still a small bunch of wingers who are doing better this season and will do better in the future than Valencia.
"couple of" means one of two.
"in the world" means out of all the professional footballers in the world.
"in the world" means out of all the professional footballers in the world.
Alright then. Looks like I made a mistake! <-------
I dont think Valencia will ever be in the next tier after the likes of Ronaldo and Messi, where someone like Ribery falls and where Nani could have fallen if he'd have come here and played brilliant stuff.
When I talk about "in the world" and "in europe" I dont really think too hard about it, because 99% of the time the best players in the world are in europe. So to be one of the best wingers in europe generally means being one of the best wingers in the world.
Yeah he sounds like he would be a great wife... fecking shit Mistress though!!
To be fair Pogue, not many are as one-footed as he is. Indeed, I don't think I've ever seen a professional footballer so one-footed. I'm sure there are some out there, but none spring to mind. He's been here half a season and as far as I know he has only touched the ball with his left foot three times. And that's not an exageration.
So yes, if he started using his left foot more often, even if it was only to the level that other one-footed players normally do, you would think he would improve further. Yes, there have been numerous times where I think his refusal to use his left has broken down a move or turned a great chance into only an average one.
Yet despite that he has still been very effective and is up there alongside Evra, Fletcher, Giggs and Rooney as our best players this season. Overlooking how good he has been simply because he could be even better is ridiculous.
Thought he played very well today, got stuck in really well and managed to get some progress on the right. Both him and rafael are playing very well together down that side.
He was good today. Ridgewell got stuck into him today though and gave him very little space to run into.
Yep, did very well today. Growing as each match comes along.
Park seems to be going backwards.
Park seems to be going backwards.
I'm a big fan but i thought he was poor overall in the second half bar a few moments
Did a half decent job on the left as well, even though he managed to play there and not use his left foot.
Thought he was average in the 2nd half. Did alright in the 1st but went downhill fast after the break.
He didn't play badly, but he was entirely the wrong choice today. Him and Rafael had a lot of the ball, and put in a lot of crosses, which I'm sure they were told to do. Problem is, we only Rooney and first Park then Giggs to get on the end of those crosses - ie, two short players hardly renowned for their heading ability against a 'keeper in brilliant form and two big defenders.
Our biggest threat in first half,poor in second but couldn't understand why he was shifted to the left when giggs came on
I'm eagerly awaiting him to unleash some kind of vicious long range effort - I take it he's well capable of them, from the amount of (amazingly horribly worked) freekicks this year where we've tried to slide it to him in space.
It'll make Robert Charlton lot like a pea shooter.
Seriously though, those freekicks annoy me, and I'd like us to stop them in their current format.
The whole point of doing the 'Scholes freekick' as I call it, is that you take the wall out of the equation by sliding it to the player in space. The purpose of which is entirely fecking defeated if the shooting player is about two feet to the left of the passing player. Have him stand in space FFS if we're going to persist with this idea.
The whole point of doing the 'Scholes freekick' as I call it, is that you take the wall out of the equation by sliding it to the player in space. The purpose of which is entirely fecking defeated if the shooting player is about two feet to the left of the passing player. Have him stand in space FFS if we're going to persist with this idea.
Valencia with two very impressive crosses today, inch-perfect really. Just after a good cross into a great area at the weekend, and a great cross immediately after coming off the bench against Milan.
Hopefully people will learn he's actually quite a good crosser...
Hopefully people will learn he's actually quite a good crosser...
And that Berbatov is good, without him getting an assist or a goal.
Nah that'll never happen unfortunately, that one's a lost cause.
Berbatov would be liked more if it wasn't for the fact that many people, including me, find him completely unlikable.
Excellent crosser.
Excellent winger, in fact. Strong, quick, good passer, scores a few...
I still think he's the best in our team for consistent delivery, never really understood the crossing criticism.
He's far exceeded my expectations though, I'd be surprised if anyone expected more from him in his first season.
Hopefully he builds on a great first season rather than has the 'second season syndrome' that often happens with wingers.
He's far exceeded my expectations though, I'd be surprised if anyone expected more from him in his first season.
Hopefully he builds on a great first season rather than has the 'second season syndrome' that often happens with wingers.
He's improved his crossing in the past few games since he's come back to the side for sure. Nani raised the bar in his spell on the right and Valencia has accepted the challenge. Looked like he might be injured at the end of the match though.
But what exactly has he done? Talked shit on the club, the players, the fans, had sex with a player's missus? What?
So, how long before anybody in the press stops saying that he's a mediocre journeyman who's not good enough for United?
Spot on. I think he's done extremely well in his first season so far.
Great game tonight.
- Status