New tax laws come in in 2019 I believe? Leading figures want us out before then.
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
New tax laws come in in 2019 I believe? Leading figures want us out before then.
They are clearly doing it for themselves and the rush is probably linked to your suggestion, obviously others saw it as a way to elevate their political careers.
The UK is definitely going to crash out now.
Looks like the plans is to draft these papers, or whatever, that have no actual depth or logic or solutions behind them and tell the EU "here's what we want", and then go to the EU with it knowing they'll say "nope", and then rinse and repeat up until March, so that when you do crash out the Gove can say "well look, we tried but the pesky EU just won't negotiate with us!"
Looks like the plans is to draft these papers, or whatever, that have no actual depth or logic or solutions behind them and tell the EU "here's what we want", and then go to the EU with it knowing they'll say "nope", and then rinse and repeat up until March, so that when you do crash out the Gove can say "well look, we tried but the pesky EU just won't negotiate with us!"
It's a fix, and has been from the start.
Fixed
- Theresa May has told MPs that dozens of documents spelling out the actions needed to prepare for a no deal Brexit will be published this summer. Giving evidence to the Commons liaison committee, she said:
Would that be dig a hole in your back garden, melt down your saucepans and grow your own.
A bit like that old couple in “When the Wind Blows”.
One of my colleagues used to work for easyjet as a network engineer, he told me they make all their money in the summer months and run at a loss for the rest of the year.
Nothing to do with this thread but cant be arsed with all the doom mongering.
It's one of the great contributions Trump has made to modern discourse where expert opinion and fact is dismissed as doom mongering or 'fake news'. People still believe that there are unicorns waiting and that if there isn't it'll be the fault of people who 'talked down' the unicorns instead of having faith in the unicorns. Experts in industry, finance, economics, trade, health, transportation, science, medicine and agriculture are all pretty much as one on how disastrous Brexit is going to be if we either get no deal or get a deal that differs even slightly from our current arrangement.
Yet people who two years ago probably had never uttered the words customs union or single market in their life still think their faith that they weren't duped by a man whose political ambition knows know moral boundaries and the hardline of the conservative party, trumps all of that. It's quite an extraordinary state of psychosis to the point where you wonder if it's sheer embarrassment that's keeping it going. If I believe Brexit would be a success because: 'let's get on with it', or I thought I could dismiss the opinion of the overwhelming majority of expert opinion in pretty much every relevant field because of something Boris Johnson used a bus to communicate to me, I'd probably feel pretty fecking embarrassed myself.
Yet people who two years ago probably had never uttered the words customs union or single market in their life still think their faith that they weren't duped by a man whose political ambition knows know moral boundaries and the hardline of the conservative party, trumps all of that. It's quite an extraordinary state of psychosis to the point where you wonder if it's sheer embarrassment that's keeping it going. If I believe Brexit would be a success because: 'let's get on with it', or I thought I could dismiss the opinion of the overwhelming majority of expert opinion in pretty much every relevant field because of something Boris Johnson used a bus to communicate to me, I'd probably feel pretty fecking embarrassed myself.
There is austerity and then there is austerity. An economic shock caused by a hard Brexit would be much much worse than any thing Cameron did. I grew up in the 80s, don’t want to see that all again.
It'll be worse than the 80s. But some people will be okay with that as long as it happens and nobody criticises Corbyn. I think the poster you quoted seems to want only that out of life.
If your big sell is austerity will be bad, don't cuddle up to people who gleefully voted for it long before the referendum was dreamt up by the pig fecker. There is a reason nobody bought it at the last referendum.
There is also Austerity when there was no need for it, it hasnt delivered anything.
Are people still going to be begging for no deal once they've had notices through the door telling them to stockpile food and prepare for power cuts?
I’m not sure if you’re serious but that’s an outrageously flawed piece of logic.
Austerity is a (controversial and hopefully short-term) response to an economic downturn, Brexit will (probably) be the cause of an economic downturn.
Even if someone thinks austerity is a reasonable way to balance the books, why on earth can’t they speak out against a decision which they think will prolong the need for austerity?
Austerity is simultaneously an awful thing that must be avoided (in regards to Brexit) and so instantly forgettable that the architects of the last lot of cuts get cheered to the fecking rafters.
If you want to argue Brexit needs to be stopped for the good of the poorest in this country, surely you can find better bosom buddies than the bunch of cnuts that gleefully voted for austerity for years - alongside tax cuts for the wealthiest and have shown not even a solitary atom of remorse. What next, Tony Blair on the importance of people believing politicians? Sir Peter Viggers to lead a campaign against frivolous spending of public money?
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Nice obfuscation but you haven’t really answered the question - why is the Labour Party leadership enabling a policy that will hit hardest those it is supposed to look out for?
I seem to remember there was a referendum and one side won and the other lost. There is such an urge to reverse the outcome of that, after seeing the 2 years since, from the electorate that the only party who have come close to calling for a second referendum is polling at about 9%, whilst the Tories have had their numbers hit by people apparently returning to UKIP because the plans aren't tough enough. Similar to how Corbyn isn't keen on the monarchy or Trident, but can't make it party policy because he doesn't have the numbers, there isn't the numbers in trying reverse or soften it. Partly because of Leavers in the party, who we did try and make it easier for local parties to get rid of, but you know deselections are what Stalin did or something and partly because of the wet lettuce rebels in the government, who don't rebel. But yeah, it's definitely Labour who are enabling Brexit.
I'd love to go back to the glory days where Corbyn was leading a party of protest and wasn't interested in power and show people how quickly he'd be criticised for literally the exact opposite.
These issues - while important symbolically - don't have too much of an impact on the day-to-day lives of people within the country. Indeed part of the case for advocating for both to be scrapped is that they're seen as huge wastes of public money, mostly just there either as nostalgic relics or as a meaningless show of force.
A hard Brexit should it occur will have a massive impact on the daily lives of Brits and will likely lead to a significant economic downturn. If that happens then those who advocated for it or defended it will likely be out on their arses for their lack of foresight/lying to the public. Considering Corbyn has mostly advocated a hard Brexit there's a somewhat reasonable chance he'd be included in that.
You're talking about how the numbers aren't there for it but then this is all stuff that could've been said about Corbyn in the latter stages of 2016 and early 2017 when his polling numbers were dire and everyone assumed the Tories would walk the election. Anyone thinking he can just change his position on a whim and advocate a soft Brexit is being naive and fails to understand a lot of the changes we've seen within the UK, but at the same time Labour and Corbyn certainly aren't helping fight back against anti-immigration sentiment by basically placating those who dislike immigrants, and saying the numbers aren't there for it strikes me as an excuse that's about as strong as a Blairite arguing the same thing in regards to austerity.
Again - there's some sense in his approach because he's ultimately not in power right now, but I struggle to see him doing particularly well if the worst no deal scenario does end up occurring and he's not been seen to have done anything about that.
That and supporting Brexit all his life, yeah.
Funny, someone freaking out over Brexit could use these exact words as justification for why they're terrified
Inflation fecks the small man, the BOE will let us eat high inflation, it has since 2008 and there's no reason why it wouldn't now
Professor Minford who is often the go-to for the Brexiteers: "it seems likely that we would mostly eliminate manufacturing, leaving mainly industries such as design, marketing and high-tech. But this shouldn’t scare us”"
How many people who work in the car factories voted to "mostly eliminate" manufacturing?
How many people who work in the car factories voted to "mostly eliminate" manufacturing?
I’m past the point of caring what people voted for in the referendum. My focus now is on taking steps to protect myself and my family from a possible hard Brexit. It’s no longer a theoretical risk and you can’t rely on the politicians to protect you. If you had any sense, you would be doing the same.
Minford's the cnut who convinced Thatcher to destroy half of British industry in the first place, for no better reason than to put the working class in their place.
Remember what the EU did to Greece? That’s austerity.
But what about these super duper trade deals the UK will be doing with the rest of the world that they are prevented from doing now.
But if there is no car manufacturing and their biggest current exports to the USA, China , Australia etc are cars what will they be exporting instead - not only to make up for the loss of their car exports but to increase their overall exports . Whoops another Brexit cock-up.
The public will not blame themselves for supporting Brexit. They will blame the politicians who misled them and it will be vicious.
Look at Iraq. There was widespread popular support for the invasion. Blair even won a re election. Try to find someone who supported it now.
Well yeah, that was exactly the point I was making. May/Corbyn/Boris/Rees-Mogg/everyone else who's tacitly backed Brexit won't be judged kindly after this. Albeit Corbyn (obviously and sensibly) won't take as much flak as those in government because he's only supported its implementation and not been the one actually implementing it.
I'll pass on hoping the likes of Anna Soubry and Vince Cable find political Jesus and go back on every single vote they nodded through for the last decade. I've only got so much breath to hold. They don't care about anybody but themselves and cuddling up to them won't change it, it doesn't even change their votes.
Still discussing angels, pins and dancing I see.
How has the cheering masses lauding Soubry and Cable at the Brexit march changed their approach since? Other than the latter being so stirred by the scenes and cause that he missed a vote, obviously.
Angels, pins, dancing. Obtusely.
No. High inflation fecks everyone. If anything it's one few negative financial metrics that do affect the rich as well as poor. If you mean that they are felt more by the poor, then well...duh. If you're poor anything that hits your finances will be felt with greater impact to your lifestyle that to a rich person.
And what high inflation since 2008? Are you thinking straight? We had one short period with high inflation if I recall in 2010? Heady heights of 4.5% or something. We've had average inflation of 2.7% over the last 10 years. Well within normal rates. And that's despite having to navigate a period where we had a financial system in collapse that required saving, an economy that needed QE to keep operating, a massive budget deficit and finally unemployment figures at double of today's numbers. I'd say all things considered, inflation was somehow kept at pretty low levels despite a highly unstable economy.
I suppose You think that the fact that the very people who are responsible for planning, strategizing and stearing us away from complete chaos have jumped ship after realising the inevitable is cause for concern?
Your a typical doom merchant...
So we've averaged above target and almost always ahead of wages, really helps the little man that
I'm at the point where my answer to that question is "who cares". If you're a turkey who voted for Christmas I'll nominate you for a Darwin award when they next come up.
Aye. Cause a seized up financial system helps the little man even more, eh?
We should have let the banks collapse and not brought down the interest rates to 0 and printed money, you're right. Definitely the wrong response from the government and the BoE on that. We should have sent the economy back to the middle ages cause you know... the little man would've fecking loved that.
That's sarcasm by the way.
You seem aware of all the steps they took to combat the crash but when it happens after a hard Brexit you seem to think inflation will be foremost in their minds, it won't