Celebrity Allegations, #MeToo etc

2 Man Midfield said:
I thought the reason teachers couldn't date students was because they are technically in their care, not necessarily because it would be an abuse of power, which it still is of course. But that sort of thing does happen, my current girlfriend was once under me at work (pun not intended) which many might see as an abuse of power. Some companies have a policy on it and some don't, hence my curiousity about it being a company issue rather than a legal one.
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Teachers are a special case due to the imbalance of power part due to the nature of the relationship making it virtually impossible for there to be true consent. The legal treatment of this varies from country to country. We recognise that power imbalance can get in the way of free choice decisions and where there is no true informed consent to sexual activity it is (or should be) a crime when a reasonable person would know that they were coercing someone to do something they otherwise wouldn't do of their own free will.
 
entropy said:
I️ am pretty sure majority of the posters here are treating it as a serious crime. You just need to curb your enthusiasm and stop rushing to lecture us at every turn.
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I'm not lecturing you. I'm saying dismissing more "minor" sex crimes is a huge part of the problem. It reinforces the misogynist culture that allows this to occur, that creates the glass ceiling, that demands that women be twice as good as males to get a promotion, that then pays them 20% less for the same job and that allows such widescale domestic violence to occur largely unfettered. You are debating a symptom and not the cause.
 
Will Absolute said:
Because the various accusations are not all of the same degree. Conservatives will see some of them as part of the inevitable abrasions of relations between the sexes, and judge them differently. A lot of the stuff O'Reilly is tasked with, for instance, might fall into the category of him acting like a jerk. Conservatives might be less ready to end his career for that.

Perception of bias in the reporter will also factor in. Conservatives hardly take everything the mainstream media say as gospel. But they figure that if the media is condemning a well-known liberal, it's probably overdue, and based on plenty of evidence.
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$32 million to settle for being a jackass?

Seems legit.
 
Will Absolute said:
A little more coherence in your presentation would help.

In my first post I said there was 'at least one important difference'.

The passage of time is another one. The Clinton story is old hat and everybody has come to terms with it at this stage. The accusations against Trump and O'Reilly are new and hot from the fire, and, as such, more likely to evoke purely partisan responses.

There's also the obvious divergence in the way conservatives and liberals view this whole issue. Conservatives see it in a more commonsense light. An inevitable consequence of human imperfection, dating from the expulsion from the Garden. Men and Women, trees and apples, attraction and repulsion. Liberals see it in the light, if it can be so called, of ideological feminism. Something to make speeches about, and pass laws, and institute enlightened programs.

Simplistic conclusions about the supposedly greater 'open-mindedness' of one group are not warranted.
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Why do misogynist social norms exist again? I forget.
 
Will Absolute said:
Because the various accusations are not all of the same degree. Conservatives will see some of them as part of the inevitable abrasions of relations between the sexes, and judge them differently. A lot of the stuff O'Reilly is tasked with, for instance, might fall into the category of him acting like a jerk. Conservatives might be less ready to end his career for that.

Perception of bias in the reporter will also factor in. Conservatives hardly take everything the mainstream media say as gospel. But they figure that if the media is condemning a well-known liberal, it's probably overdue, and based on plenty of evidence.
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Firstly, many (all?) of the women who accused o'Reilly of harassment are conservatives, which means the commonsense conservative understanding of sexual assault may lead to misunderstandings about what is a crime and what is an inevitable abrasion, among these very commonsense conservative minds.

About the bias of the mainstream media: as usual the right is to be commended for its defining trait: skepticism!
It is interesting whom they are skeptical towards and when. They seem to be generally happy to believe news from the Fox network, but raise their guards when the Fox network negotiates exits for Ailes and o'Reilly. They are happy to hear a conservative woman talk about the colour of Santa Claus' skin but are extremely guarded when she says she was harassed at her commonsense conservative workplace. Clearly the conservative mind detected something significant in the neuronal activities of the Murdochs and Megyn Kelly before and after these events.


Finally, given that this is the 3rd explanation for one disparity that you've used, a little more parsimony would be useful.
 
berbatrick said:
Firstly, many (all?) of the women who accused o'Reilly of harassment are conservatives, which means the commonsense conservative understanding of sexual assault may lead to misunderstandings about what is a crime and what is an inevitable abrasion, among these very commonsense conservative minds.

About the bias of the mainstream media: as usual the right is to be commended for its defining trait: skepticism!
It is interesting whom they are skeptical towards and when. They seem to be generally happy to believe news from the Fox network, but raise their guards when the Fox network negotiates exits for Ailes and o'Reilly. They are happy to hear a conservative woman talk about the colour of Santa Claus' skin but are extremely guarded when she says she was harassed at her commonsense conservative workplace. Clearly the conservative mind detected something significant in the neuronal activities of the Murdochs and Megyn Kelly before and after these events.


Finally, given that this is the 3rd explanation for one disparity that you've used, a little more parsimony would be useful.
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Well, yeah. Basically any post by @Will Absolute is just him saying, in an extremely verbose way, "liberals are dumb and i don't like them".
 
Lena Dunham getting blasted on twitter for this statement defending the executive producer on her show accused of rape-

During the windfall of deeply necessary accusations over the last few months in Hollywood, we have been thrilled to see so many women’s voices heard and dark experiences in this industry justified. It’s a hugely important time of change and, like every feminist in Hollywood and beyond, we celebrate. But during every time of change there are also incidences of the culture, in its enthusiasm and zeal, taking down the wrong targets. We believe, having worked closely with him for more than half a decade, that this is the case with Murray Miller. While our first instinct is to listen to every woman’s story, our insider knowledge of Murray’s situation makes us confident that sadly this accusation is one of the 3 percent of assault cases that are misreported every year. It is a true shame to add to that number, as outside of Hollywood women still struggle to be believed. We stand by Murray and this is all we’ll be saying about this issue.
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Especially since she said this 3 months back -

sbcdrnyxmvwkdxecvusj.jpg


I also noticed african american women in US especially seem to hate Dunham a lot...
 
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That's a really ugly statement. The pitfalls of picking loudmouthed cretins as your feminist idols.
 
Her previous tweet makes her a bit of a hypocrite but I'm not sure there's that much wrong with the point of view in the statement. I'm not sure she actually needed to make a statement at all, mind. It's one thing to believe your friend, it's another to use your celebrity status to essentially accuse someone of making a false accusation.

Looking at twitter though a lot of the criticism towards it seems to be referencing race, which is a whole other layer of stuff.
 
It's that me, me and people like me, entitled viewpoint that is bound to disproportionately exclude black women. Pulling up the ladder style of activism that is depressingly common.

To support your friend and request due process seems fine to me. But to use your fame to rubbish a serious accusation and denigrate another woman in that way, while falsely claiming an exclusive insight to a greater truth is insidious, disturbing and prejudicial.

The comment is Trumpesque.
 
crappycraperson said:
Lena Dunham getting blasted on twitter for this statement defending the executive producer on her show accused of rape-



Especially since she said this 3 months back -

https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-medi...ogressive,q_80,w_800/sbcdrnyxmvwkdxecvusj.jpg

I also noticed african american women in US especially seem to hate Dunham a lot...
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Black women don’t like Lena Dunham because she is a physical form of white feminism that has always excluded women of colour.
Plus she has a history of ignorance and racist statements but hides behind feminism as her pillar of oppression.

She just needs to shut up.
 
Russell Simmons now outed too. Brett Ratner involved in his allegations. Also, Terry Crews showing a screenshot of Simmons telling him to ease off on his accuser previously.
 
roseguy64 said:
Russell Simmons now outed too. Brett Ratner involved in his allegations. Also, Terry Crews showing a screenshot of Simmons telling him to ease off on his accuser previously.
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He was chasing Kimora Lee when she was like 15/16 and he was at least 33. I wish I was surprised.
 
Silva said:
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Goes to shake the hand of a man well known for behaviour that is inappropriate and overtly sexual.

Is left shaking after being exposed to inappropriate, overtly sexual behaviour.
 
jesus...

charlie rose is who I feel personally disappointed at given i've watched his show for years and one of my favorite broadcasters.
 
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