Chelsea 2016/17 - Very Content

They're faster, play with even more energy, and technically better. They're a better match for you than spurs, but still a bad match-up

Spurs players are actually more faster than Pool ones. Rose and Walker are like the fastest wingbacks in the world.
 
Moses was shite today ... responsible for the 1st goal and generally way off the pace.
Courtois was poor on the 2nd.

Chelsea cracking?

Spuds were good today but not great. Was Dyer even on the pitch? ( I know he was)

I can't see them losing to Leicester but maybe a draw (fingers crossed) - they're in ridiculously good form and I don't think a loss at Tottenham will derail them. It's not like they were battered, they are two very evenly matched teams IMO.

Yh I meant Blind vs Moses with Moses attacking - will go past him every time. Agreed about Courtois, I think he bottled it as he thought he was going to headbutt the post.
 
I agree that Chelsea looked pretty devoid of creativity in the absence of Fabregas. Tottenham totally cut off their passing lines and unsettled Hazard thoroughly and forced him to play deeper than normal. He wasn't allowed to have the ball. That's why they struggled to create chances. And Conte paid the price for adopting a defensive mindset with two DMs instead of Fabregas.

Also, Pedro truly is a terrible player. So over rated, he has some skills but totally doesn't have the right mentality for the PL. he must have some compromising photos of Conte, there's no other explanation why he is still in their first team. Seriously I have seen him play 3-4 times this season and he has been totally anonymous.

Conte has been exposed, he is still a young and inexperienced coach and will need time to learn. All the posts on the Caf claiming that he is world class were very much premature, at this stage I think he deserves to be ranked slightly above Giggs, Neville and Howe, and significantly below second tier coaches like Benitez, Ranieri and Blanc. Which puts him on the level below the level below Jose.
So harsh on Conte! He took over a Chelsea team in disarray and made competitive again.
 
I can't see them losing to Leicester but maybe a draw (fingers crossed) - they're in ridiculously good form and I don't think a loss at Tottenham will derail them.

Leicester have been absolutely pathetic this season bar the game against City so I can see Chelsea winning quite easily.
 
So harsh on Conte! He took over a Chelsea team in disarray and made competitive again.

I know right. He has matched the PL record for wins in a row in his first season, sits top at New Years and has brought in a new system (we love a new tactical system to talk about) but apparently that's rubbish.

What has the world come to?
 
Leicester have been absolutely pathetic this season bar the game against City so I can see Chelsea winning quite easily.

They have been awful against all the top clubs so far. Wonder if Ranieri will even bother watching Spurs tactics? His head is way into the CL clouds. Saying that never discount confidence crises.
 
They have been awful against all the top clubs so far. Wonder if Ranieri will even bother watching Spurs tactics? His head is way into the CL clouds. Saying that never discount confidence crises.
They gave up on the league long ago and are still patting each other on the back for last season. They'll do just enough to stay up but beyond that they don't seem to care. An air of now we've proven ourselves and don't need to do it again.
 
I'd be so annoyed if he does not get a chance. We've turned down a few fairly big bids for him AFAIK so I hope to see him next season.
I can imagine Conte giving him a chance. One reason I'm hopeful is that Christensen strikes me as being similar to a well-rounded Italian center back: A neat, intelligent and disciplined defender with good technique.
 
Seriously though Conte has ONE system and plan. It was a new system as far as the PL was concerned and no one really knew how to counter it. But I think Pochettino figured it out and Conte had no response. How else do you explain that you never looked like scoring at all, and Hazard and Costa were kept totally quiet and forced deep to try and get the ball. He also severely exposed the flaws of Azpilicueta as a CB (he is a full back and not a CB) which was bound to happen when someone is played out of position.
He lost one game. And I don't think he exposed the flaw of Azpilicueta at all. It was 1v1 at the back post and a cross from that position with Cahill not in the box is tough to deal with. Beckham provided lots of assists from that position, with the fullback on the farside not tucked in, just as Moses wasn't tucked in last night.
 
I know right. He has matched the PL record for wins in a row in his first season, sits top at New Years and has brought in a new system (we love a new tactical system to talk about) but apparently that's rubbish.

What has the world come to?
That's probably because many people didn't expect such a great first part of the season from them and so they couldn't wait to celebrate his first defeat after a long time.
 
They have been awful against all the top clubs so far. Wonder if Ranieri will even bother watching Spurs tactics? His head is way into the CL clouds. Saying that never discount confidence crises.
Vardy back should help them.
 
Conte has been exposed, he is still a young and inexperienced coach and will need time to learn. All the posts on the Caf claiming that he is world class were very much premature, at this stage I think he deserves to be ranked slightly above Giggs, Neville and Howe, and significantly below second tier coaches like Benitez, Ranieri and Blanc. Which puts him on the level below the level below Jose.

Wow, now how have I missed this gem.
 
All it needs is a bit of tweaking, telling those morons in Cahill and Luiz that they don't leave the shortest of CBs with somebody who's over 10 cms taller than him at the far post. It's easy to blame it all on Moses yesterday but for the first goal Luiz was marking space that literally nobody was attacking and for the second goal they leave it for Moses/Azpi against Alli, who as I've already said, is a lot taller than both of them. In a system with 3 defenders against two strikers (because Alli simply played as a SS yesterday) you want your taller defenders to go for aerial duels, not the shortest one.
I interpreted it as Alli playing as a LW yesterday, with Eriksen as the RW just dropping into the midfield.

Luiz was marking Kane for the first goal. I think that his positioning was fine, the problem was that there wasn't another man to get in line on the other side of Azpilicueta.

I wouldn't say it was Moses and Azpilicueta against Alli. I think it was just Azpilicueta and Moses was focussing on Rose. In Carragher's analysis of the first Chelsea goal in this video
he says how Navas is concentrating on Alonso, not Costa. I think that might be just how it lines up in those situations.
 
I interpreted it as Alli playing as a LW yesterday, with Eriksen as the RW just dropping into the midfield.

Luiz was marking Kane for the first goal. I think that his positioning was fine, the problem was that there wasn't another man to get in line on the other side of Azpilicueta.

I wouldn't say it was Moses and Azpilicueta against Alli. I think it was just Azpilicueta and Moses was focussing on Rose. In Carragher's analysis of the first Chelsea goal in this video
he says how Navas is concentrating on Alonso, not Costa. I think that might be just how it lines up in those situations.


It might've been Cahill then who was in no man's land, can't remember really. One of those two though.

Edit: actually checked it, the moment when Eriksen crosses it's Luiz who's not really marking Kane, he was running with him in the box first but then eventually he's stuck between Eriksen and Kane, if the cross was at the near post it's a free header from Kane.

Even if we don't treat Alli as the SS yesterday but more as a CAM alongside Eriksen behind Kane, then when one of the three (in this case Eriksen) is crossing and the other two are in the box, you'd pretty much expect your CBs to follow them, especially given that the only guy more in the box was Rose who was outside of the goal. I don't know if it's a tactical mistake by Conte or just the two reminding us that, man for a man, they're pretty shite. I took a look at 442's stats zone heatmap and it seems that Alli seems to be doubling Kane's average position whereas Eriksen is more wide.
 
Didn't think Chelsea were shockingly bad, it was always going to happen that they would lose a game. I still think they will go onto win the title, especially if they strengthen in the window which is likely. Everyone has off-days.

I agree with those saying Pedro is terrible, why does Willian not start over him, he's much better in an attacking sense and defensively. I would have Young over Pedro tbh.
 
It might've been Cahill then who was in no man's land, can't remember really. One of those two though.

Edit: actually checked it, the moment when Eriksen crosses it's Luiz who's not really marking Kane, he was running with him in the box first but then eventually he's stuck between Eriksen and Kane, if the cross was at the near post it's a free header from Kane.

Even if we don't treat Alli as the SS yesterday but more as a CAM alongside Eriksen behind Kane, then when one of the three (in this case Eriksen) is crossing and the other two are in the box, you'd pretty much expect your CBs to follow them, especially given that the only guy more in the box was Rose who was outside of the goal. I don't know if it's a tactical mistake by Conte or just the two reminding us that, man for a man, they're pretty shite. I took a look at 442's stats zone heatmap and it seems that Alli seems to be doubling Kane's average position whereas Eriksen is more wide.
I think that Luiz would have cut out the ball in front of Kane and Azpilicueta would have cut out the ball behind him. It's just that Azpilicueta doesn't have cover for Alli's far side. You could say that those two are pretty bad man for a man but I think most players are. I think the manager should prevent that and his tactical mistake was not going 3-4-1-2/3-5-2 with Hazard not going into the No. 10 position or Fabregas not coming on.
 
I agree that Chelsea looked pretty devoid of creativity in the absence of Fabregas. Tottenham totally cut off their passing lines and unsettled Hazard thoroughly and forced him to play deeper than normal. He wasn't allowed to have the ball. That's why they struggled to create chances. And Conte paid the price for adopting a defensive mindset with two DMs instead of Fabregas.

Also, Pedro truly is a terrible player. So over rated, he has some skills but totally doesn't have the right mentality for the PL. he must have some compromising photos of Conte, there's no other explanation why he is still in their first team. Seriously I have seen him play 3-4 times this season and he has been totally anonymous.

Conte has been exposed, he is still a young and inexperienced coach and will need time to learn. All the posts on the Caf claiming that he is world class were very much premature, at this stage I think he deserves to be ranked slightly above Giggs, Neville and Howe, and significantly below second tier coaches like Benitez, Ranieri and Blanc. Which puts him on the level below the level below Jose.
Arguably worse than the content of your post is the conviction that you write this with. Among the worst posts I have ever read on this forum. Nice.
 
Why hasn't Conte come out and apologized to the fans / supporters for that abysmal performance?

He was tactically naive and had no answer to Pochettino's formation and system, which was set up specifically to nullify Chelsea. Spurs have done the whole league a huge service now, he has found the antidote so to speak, and I believe Conte now faces an uphill task.

The next one to get found out will be Klopp. I won't even mention Guardiola because he has already been found out.

So much for those who insisted that Jose was an old-fashioned manager and that Conte / Klopp were better equipped for the modern game. When was the last time Jose was tactically outclassed and had no response whatsoever? At least he changes his system and shows some flexibility, depending on what is happening in the game. His subs / tactical changes in the Boro and West Ham games were decisive. Conte failed to make any impact despite the fact that his team was losing. Spurs completely suffocated them. I have never seen Hazard and Costa so anonymous.
 
Jesus its one loss. People on here need to really grow up and stop seeing managers as being finished or found out after a rough patch and those on a good run as football Gods.
 
Why hasn't Conte come out and apologized to the fans / supporters for that abysmal performance?

He was tactically naive and had no answer to Pochettino's formation and system, which was set up specifically to nullify Chelsea. Spurs have done the whole league a huge service now, he has found the antidote so to speak, and I believe Conte now faces an uphill task.

The next one to get found out will be Klopp. I won't even mention Guardiola because he has already been found out.
I was very surprised that Conte couldn't turn things around at half time, I actually thought Spurs scored too early and it would give them a chance to shake things up and turn the game around. Klopp on the other hand, and I'm not the guys biggest fan, but I think he is more of a motivator and the only way he can get found out is if his players let him down. He's the perfect coach for them because he is like a tactically competent Brendan Rodgers on steroids.
 
Jesus its one loss. People on here need to really grow up and stop seeing managers as being finished or found out after a rough patch and those on a good run as football Gods.

Sure, but how can he carry on justifying the fact that he plays a full back as a centreback, a forward as a wing back, and leaves a player with 100 PL assists on the bench in favor of a water carrier who passes sideways and has poor technique? How can he justify having the most error prone DM in all of football as the main lynchpin in this back line?

His team selection is poor and finally he has been exposed by someone who knows how to counter his Plan A, which admittedly caught some folks off guard. And he doesn't appear to have a Plan B.
 
Why hasn't Conte come out and apologized to the fans / supporters for that abysmal performance?

He was tactically naive and had no answer to Pochettino's formation and system, which was set up specifically to nullify Chelsea. Spurs have done the whole league a huge service now, he has found the antidote so to speak, and I believe Conte now faces an uphill task.

The next one to get found out will be Klopp. I won't even mention Guardiola because he has already been found out.

So much for those who insisted that Jose was an old-fashioned manager and that Conte / Klopp were better equipped for the modern game. When was the last time Jose was tactically outclassed and had no response whatsoever? At least he changes his system and shows some flexibility, depending on what is happening in the game. His subs / tactical changes in the Boro and West Ham games were decisive. Conte failed to make any impact despite the fact that his team was losing. Spurs completely suffocated them. I have never seen Hazard and Costa so anonymous.
How much of Chelsea did you see last season? You're massively overreacting to one loss in three months - one loss, they're still clear on top and favourites for the title.
 
Sure, but how can he carry on justifying the fact that he plays a full back as a centreback, a forward as a wing back, and leaves a player with 100 PL assists on the bench in favor of a water carrier who passes sideways and has poor technique? How can he justify having the most error prone DM in all of football as the main lynchpin in this back line?

His team selection is poor and finally he has been exposed by someone who knows how to counter his Plan A, which admittedly caught some folks off guard. And he doesn't appear to have a Plan B.

He didn't appear to have a plan B last night but who does. Pep doesn't, Klopp doesn't, Poch maybe and Jose's is boot the ball up to Fellaini which rarely works. Teams are so bred into their systems now and tactics so important they find it hard to adjust. I'd never have predicted Azpilicueta, Moses as weak in the air till it was targeted last night and they have done really well in their positions till then. United also play a right winger in an even more defensive position than Moses and Liverpool play Milner as a fullback.
 
"Founded", "Rubbish", "Average".... those are words I would not associate with Conte.

It's a loss. Let's not forget that he had 13 straight wins in his first season.
 
He didn't appear to have a plan B last night but who does. Pep doesn't, Klopp doesn't, Poch maybe and Jose's is boot the ball up to Fellaini which rarely works. Teams are so bred into their systems now and tactics so important they find it hard to adjust. I'd never have predicted Azpilicueta, Moses as weak in the air till it was targeted last night and they have done really well in their positions till then. United also play a right winger in an even more defensive position than Moses and Liverpool play Milner as a fullback.

Where's the evidence of this exactly, sure you're not confusing Jose with LVG/Moyes?
 
He didn't appear to have a plan B last night but who does. Pep doesn't, Klopp doesn't, Poch maybe and Jose's is boot the ball up to Fellaini which rarely works. Teams are so bred into their systems now and tactics so important they find it hard to adjust. I'd never have predicted Azpilicueta, Moses as weak in the air till it was targeted last night and they have done really well in their positions till then. United also play a right winger in an even more defensive position than Moses and Liverpool play Milner as a fullback.
Strange comment to make when Jose brought on Rashford and Mafa over the last few games and successfully changed the dynamics of the match
 
Sure, but how can he carry on justifying the fact that he plays a full back as a centreback, a forward as a wing back, and leaves a player with 100 PL assists on the bench in favor of a water carrier who passes sideways and has poor technique? How can he justify having the most error prone DM in all of football as the main lynchpin in this back line?
With 49 points in the first 19 games and being top of the table 5 points ahead of second place after 20? I mean, you're a troll, right? Please tell me you're a troll
 
I know right. He has matched the PL record for wins in a row in his first season, sits top at New Years and has brought in a new system (we love a new tactical system to talk about) but apparently that's rubbish.

What has the world come to?

Everytime a manager loses a big game, he's been "found out."

I thought we'd all learned that by now.
 
Everytime a manager loses a big game, he's been "found out."

I thought we'd all learned that by now.

Indeed. You'd swear we never had any God awful games under SAF, in title winning seasons. every team has them, it's how you bounce back that's key.
 
Everytime a manager loses a big game, he's been "found out."

I thought we'd all learned that by now.
They have conceded 4 goals in 2 games from diagonal balls into the box. That's after a run of 2 goals conceded in 12.
If there is a problem going forward it's when their defence becomes less superhuman and they are forced to chase goals and create more.
There's not an awful lot of creativity through the middle and as good as Moses and Alonso have been it's still Moses and Alsonso that provides most of the width
 
Indeed. You'd swear we never had any God awful games under SAF, in title winning seasons. every team has them, it's how you bounce back that's key.
I wonder if José will be found out too if United lose a game or if the magnetic field of Mother Earth just wasn't right, bad karma of the opponent or poor refereering will be blamed. I've learned already from Treble_Winning that thanks to José, United will have no blip by his sheer force but IMHO a single loss might still occur.
 
Spurs have done the whole league a huge service now, he has found the antidote so to speak, and I believe Conte now faces an uphill task. The next one to get found out will be Klopp. I won't even mention Guardiola because he has already been found out.

Given two of these managers have now been found they're quite fortunate to be sitting in the top 4. I guess they'll start plummeting down the table now right?

When was the last time Jose was tactically outclassed and had no response whatsoever?

Probably the game against Chelsea earlier this season where the young exposed noob Conte somehow stumbled his way to a 4-0 win.

Sure, but how can he carry on justifying the fact that he plays a full back as a centreback, a forward as a wing back, and leaves a player with 100 PL assists on the bench in favor of a water carrier who passes sideways and has poor technique? How can he justify having the most error prone DM in all of football as the main lynchpin in this back line?

He can justify all of this with his recent record of 13 wins and 1 single loss over the last 3 months.

Either you're posting from the future where Chelsea have just lost 10 games in a row or you're massively overreacting to a single loss. Or you're a troll. Probably the latter.
 
Strange comment to make when Jose brought on Rashford and Mafa over the last few games and successfully changed the dynamics of the match

Indeed he did but he didn't change tactic to a plan B, more 2 good players but United played the same style and plan of football. Not a criticism of Jose btw, Pep has been known to throw both Otamendi and Pique up front and do the same.
 
Why hasn't Conte come out and apologized to the fans / supporters for that abysmal performance?

He was tactically naive and had no answer to Pochettino's formation and system, which was set up specifically to nullify Chelsea. Spurs have done the whole league a huge service now, he has found the antidote so to speak, and I believe Conte now faces an uphill task.

The next one to get found out will be Klopp. I won't even mention Guardiola because he has already been found out.

So much for those who insisted that Jose was an old-fashioned manager and that Conte / Klopp were better equipped for the modern game. When was the last time Jose was tactically outclassed and had no response whatsoever? At least he changes his system and shows some flexibility, depending on what is happening in the game. His subs / tactical changes in the Boro and West Ham games were decisive. Conte failed to make any impact despite the fact that his team was losing. Spurs completely suffocated them. I have never seen Hazard and Costa so anonymous.
:lol:

Rarely seen such a massive chip on someone's shoulder.
 
Can't believe i have to defend Chelsea! How can you criticize Conte after first defeat in more than 3 months, 13 straight wins and 32 goals scored and only 4 conceded? How can you criticize someone who was able to make Moses and David Luiz look world class?