True, the league would be more exciting if they picked up Sarri though(would be better for Hazard too).
Chelsea 2017/18 thread - FA Cup Champs, League chumps
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Precisely, he seems to have accepted the bumpy start this year and moved on, now trying his best and expecting a steady cruise. No doubt the redde rationem with the board will be tough, much probably he is gone already in his mind, but leaving the house in order will however score a point for his CV.
it ended with juve not selling despite a massive offer because left backs of that quality are rare and not for sale
do you know who starts for other top clubs at that position?
pretty odd to see alonso as some kind of culprit who sums up the board incompetence
Alonso has been your best player for awhile and you want to replace him? Not only is that stupid, but shows you have no idea what youre talking about.
I think City will stumble and can be caught, the question is who will be best placed to try and take advantage.
That couldn't be further from reality. Plenty of internet Chelsea fans, including myself, have been wishing he'd get dropped because he's not doing his job anymore. How did you get to that conclusion he's our best player for a while when he's in his roughest bit of form in a Chelsea shirt?
He's not our best player, he's not our best defender, he's not even our best Spanish defender. I like Alonso but he's nowhere near our best player.
Do enlighten us, oh wise one, on what makes Alonso our best player "for awhile". Seriously, you call people stupid and having no idea what they're talking about, but that describes your post more than anything else.
Alonso is a good player, but not that great. He scores a fair amount of goals for a LB/LWB, but still has several flaws. Conte wasn't looking to upgrade on him without reason, but of course, you are wiser than him
This is a fairly meaningless stat as it doesn't tell the whole story. It doesn't account for some of the none measurable stuff certain players and team formation/tactics do. Perfect example is Lukaku. Everton fans were going on about how taking away Lukaku goals they would still have finished 7th. But what they failed to account for was what how the need to put at times two defenders on him opens the game up for those around him, in addition to constant arial threat he posses which opens the game up etc (and indeed look at them now without Lukaku). Same thing with Pogba or Zidane for example. There are things that they bring to the table which result in victories for the team outside of scoring goals and so called assists.
However massive it was (or not), the fact remains Chelsea failed in securing Sandro. As for plan B options, that's for the scouts to propose and not me.
Not upgrading Alonso is just ONE of several things that make up the Board's incompetence in buying players especially top players.
Alonso better than Kante and Hazard? Looks like you are stupid one.
I doubt any of the top 6 managers would've thought 12 games in that they would have no/minimal chance at the title, but city are really strong this year.
I wouldn't say its meaningless, especially as whilst the other variables you are speaking about taking into consideration Morata excels at. His movement throughout a game is quality and draws defenders out as we've seen Hazard get a lot more space the last few games. His technique and build up play which might not be quantified in stats very well are both excellent as Chelsea fans I'm sure can see.
Then on top of that he doesn't score stat padding goals or goals when the game is over, but goals that actually contribute to points and are decisive.
Other 5 managers have no relevance to what I was posting about. Chelsea/Conte would be ahead of City if the board had bought a good CM and a decent second striker.
And this is not a one off either. Our board has shown a pattern of fecking managers over in the last 7-8 seasons. That is why in my opinion Conte would (and should) leave if he wants to win big trophies consistently.
You can't just assume that.
Why not? Chelsea dropped points against Palace, Burnley (at home) due to injuries and being over run in midfield and against Arsenal due to not having a good fall back striker. It can be argued that with Matic on the pitch the City game could have been a draw too.
I agree, being ahead of city is a bit of an exaggeration but the 6 points vs Palace and Burnley would have put Chelsea within touching distance to City.
How exactly did they fail when there was no serious intent or negotiations to sell him in the first place? That's like claiming Utd failed to secure Ronaldo.
Alright so you actually don't know a suitable replacment, but expect some magic. In reality there are just more clubs with top aspirations than top tier side backs available.
How do you know there were no serious intentions to sell Sandro? For all we know, Marina might even have pulled out of the deal for the sake of a million or two and that is certainly not beyond her to do just that. Conte wants an upgrade and that’s the job of the club to find and buy that player for the team to improve. No excuses.
Everything that came out in Italy pointed to juventus not even picking up the phone and talking to his agent to give him a big fat raise and make him the third highest earner on the team...
PS really? What if this player doesn't exist?
For me we didn't strengthen enough depth wise in the summer which everyone can see, but the players we did by for me have definitely improved our team, Bakayoko brings so much more than matic has in over 2 years in the middle and pairs well with Kante.
Obviously at the moment there starts are similar but Morata we know Morata is a confidence and comfort player and is going to continue to get better. Actually happy with the business we did in the summer there just should have been more of it.
Obviously at the moment there starts are similar but Morata we know Morata is a confidence and comfort player and is going to continue to get better. Actually happy with the business we did in the summer there just should have been more of it.
Alonso is really overrated by non Chelsea fans. Shouldn’t it be the other way round?
Good Point
Well put. The age of fantasy football and the goal/assist stat religion drives me up the wall. It ruins the appreciation of football and what makes players great IMO.
What a lot of bollocks. Apologies for the late reply.
The idea that Chelsea in 2011/12 is better than Chelsea 2017/18 is just wrong. We finished 6th that season, fluked a Champions League and was full of average players and old past it legends. For comparison:
Cech > Courtois
Ivanovic < Azpilicueta
Terry < Luiz
Luiz = Cahill
Cole < Alonso
Lampard < Fabregas
Ramires < Kante
Bosingwa < Moses
Mata < Hazard
Meireles < Bakayoko
Sturridge < Pedro
Torres < Morata
Lampard was past it. Luiz was a much worse player then he is now. Cole was at the end of the line and Terry was crap that season. Hazard is much better than Mata as is Morata to Torres. Kante beats Ramires easily and Bakayoko is better than Meireles was bang average. Its quite clear that we have improved in every department as the side is better, younger and more balanced than it was 5 years ago.
That said, I agree with the notion that we could be a lot better than we currently are if the board had been willing to pay a little more for a higher quality of player.
Cech > Courtois
Ivanovic < Azpilicueta
Terry < Luiz
Luiz = Cahill
Cole < Alonso
Lampard < Fabregas
Ramires < Kante
Bosingwa < Moses
Mata < Hazard
Meireles < Bakayoko
Sturridge < Pedro
Torres < Morata
Lampard was past it. Luiz was a much worse player then he is now. Cole was at the end of the line and Terry was crap that season. Hazard is much better than Mata as is Morata to Torres. Kante beats Ramires easily and Bakayoko is better than Meireles was bang average. Its quite clear that we have improved in every department as the side is better, younger and more balanced than it was 5 years ago.
That said, I agree with the notion that we could be a lot better than we currently are if the board had been willing to pay a little more for a higher quality of player.
That is generally my opinion too. Our squad is quality and most importantly young, we don't have to worry about replacements for anyone really but instead can just build on it. This is a good squad and most importantly with everyone fit and conte as manager it plays good football. Hazard & Morata is my favourite attacking combination in absolutely years.
I guess that is what frustrates people more though, the fact that we have a slightly extra push we could be seriously elite.
Terry Gibson makes a good point in Sky today about Morata being an obvious choice to make first XI right now given that Madrid basically are a shell of the team they were last season. If Morata goes back, which im sure he happily will (he made a comment about how "madrid is always in his thoughts" or something like that last week) then Mou's Lukaku buy would be even more fantastic. I don't care that Lukaku is going through a bit of a rough patch right now. he can be big for United
That's a fair point, if Morata continues to play well and score frequently (currently looks like he will) then with an aging Ronaldo and an injury prone Bale it is perfectly likely that Madrid might come knocking. I doubt CFC would not stop him leaving so would hope to recoup a 'king's ransom' to purchase another quality front man.
I'm not convinced by Lukaku's all round game though undoubtedly if he gets the right service he will score regularly.
When i look back at that squad i can't believe how bad we let the situation get. We literally let all the old guard grow old together and didn't sign any real quality to replace them when they were stagnating and losing their physical edge right in front of our eyes. Luiz, Cahill, Ramires, Zhirkov and Mata were decent players but not a patch on what we had before and Torres was the worst striker in the league.
It was only in 2012 when we signed Hazard and Azpilicueta we started to get it right in terms of replacing the world class old guard with comparable quality and since then we have done quite well with the quality we have brought in.
The fact that your banking on Morata going back to Madrid to show Lukaku being the better bit of business is testimony to there performances so far. Morata is here for the foreseeable future most likely 3/4 years minimum. By that time who know what strikers will be about but I can guarantee he will still be at Chelsea as he has come out and clarified since he is happy to be here and said he would sign a 10 year contract if given the chance.
Enough to know the delusion is strong in this one.
They are worse. At least in 2012 they were.
John Terry spent 80% of his season getting completely destroyed because he couldn't handle playing a high defensive line. His lack of pace was exploited and he was turned inside out by almost every striker he came against, Bent for Aston Villa comes to mind. Its a big reason why his 2014/15 form was a shock because of how terrible he was in 2011/12. In fact, I would argue keeping Terry for so long actually held our team back as we had to play a ridiculously low block to hide his weakness.
Luiz on the other hand had his best season ever last year, was as solid as any defender out there and also a key part of our build up play. He was much better than Terry circa 2011/12. If you want, switch Luiz with Christensen and we clearly have the much better option now.
Cole is closer but he had dropped a few levels from his best and Alonso (Especially in the second half of the season) was our second most important player going forwards as Costa dropped his level and Moses didn't offer the width Alonso offered later in the season. He was our only out ball to stretch defences and scored a lot of important goals. Lets say Cole is better then, that's still only two positions and my point still stands. It's also the area I agree with you that we should've broke the bank for Sandro. Hopefully next summer we do.
Firstly welcome to Caf.
Secondly, I get a feeling you're overrating Alonso though. There's a reason why Conte kept on wanting Sandro, Cole even at his decline was a much, much better player than Alonso. Keep in mind that Cole didn't have the attacking freedom that Alonso had due to the system.
Thank you for the welcome (Also, last post for today so cant reply to Ashford, in case you think I'm being rude)
I agree that it could go either way and you could definitely put Ashley Cole ahead, I just cant remember much from Cole that made me think he was one of the best in the league that season whereas Alonso was clearly one of the best left sided defenders in the league last season. Although thinking back I do remember Cole making some great clearances vs Barcelona and maybe time has made me forget how good he was that year. It was the beginning of the end for him though and the next season he was quite poor the year later (It's why Mourinho gave his place to Azpilicueta, a right back). Yeah, you can definitely switch those two places around but the point still stands, we are clearly a better side now than we were 5 years a go and that's reflected in the league positions (1st vs 6th).
Sarri's style of play would be the polar opposite to the Chelsea way. Can't see that happening. Simeone would be great.
Matic helped bring you 2 PL titles, an FA Cup and League Cup (in two years).
Let's see what Bakayoko delivers...
Might need to wait a bit, the guy is only 22. Its interesting how I’m the same age as him, I feel like some times we forget how young these guys are.
Interesting stuff
Article on Abramovic, Trump, Putin and all the others.
https://medium.com/@murcanidealist/the-kushners-russian-friends-bf3b2417e69c
Also Roman’s yacht was seen yesterday docked in Florida a few miles away from Trump’s resort in Mar-a-lago. With the holiday weekend of Thanksgiving coming up, there might be some meeting taking place...
Article on Abramovic, Trump, Putin and all the others.
https://medium.com/@murcanidealist/the-kushners-russian-friends-bf3b2417e69c
Also Roman’s yacht was seen yesterday docked in Florida a few miles away from Trump’s resort in Mar-a-lago. With the holiday weekend of Thanksgiving coming up, there might be some meeting taking place...
Even if Morata did go back in a season or two, the price Chelsea would get for him would probably be enough to buy two elite players. Those who give themselves this false sense victory in that transfer battle totally fail to realise that. Chelsea paid £11m for Lukaku in 2011 and essentially that same money (increased through sales of Lukaku and Costa) has got them Morata this summer. An almost elite level striker with much lower mileage on his legs than Lukaku.