Chelsea under Conte | Let's sign the next Hazard, literally.

[The Skipper]

So Chelsea spent money and you are giving how they spent it. So Kante is Conte's signing but Batshuayi is boards, please excuse me if I don't buy all this.

Conte woke up old players? Costa, Hazard were already class players and they proved it season before. Their problem was Jose, so it's not like Conte did something magical with them.

So you're giving Conte no credit at all? How bizarre.

Also, you should read up on Emenalo's (Director of Football) transfer dealings with Chelsea. You don't sound too informed on the whole transfer situation at CFC. It's common knowledge Batshuayi was a board signing.

 

[The Skipper]

He's such a defensive manager. Not one to defend Jose blindly, but he's absolutely spot on regarding Conte. If Jose came to United and played the style Conte was playing at Chelsea he'd be slaughtered.

Same style he played when CFC beat United 4-0? Yep, so defensive. We've scored the second most goals in the league this year, and can sometimes play some top football, i.e. just today - but still - we're very defensive. You guys don't understand why Jose made those comments. He's trying to get at the board who sacked him with these remarks. He is a pragmatic manager, just like Jose, but that doesn't mean he's defensive per se. His hands were tied in the recent tie at Old Trafford with injuries. Chelsea don't have a squad as deep as United's to cope with key injuries like that.

 

[B&Wandmore]

It's clear that we have spent poorly the last few years but who do you blame? The board and Woodward seem to have taken the stance of fully supporting the manager. Van Gaal wasted an insane amount of money and left us with a dysfunctional squad. Should the board have interfered? That's easy to say in hindsight. They appointed him and trusted him to make the footballing decisions, after all he should be better qualified than anyone else. Mourinho is now trying to undo the damage done by Van Gaal, which costs time and money.

Either you fully support the manager in the transfer market or you appoint a director of football. Each method has its own advantages and disadvantages. The club chose the former route and it hasn't worked out so far. In my opinion, clubs that anticipate changing managers frequently have everything to gain by appointing a director of football to have at least some measure of continuity. But it's not like we were expecting to have three different managers in the four years since Ferguson's retirement. Only thing we can do now is give Mourinho an opportunity to provide that continuity.

It's easy for Conte to say this. He inherited a squad that completely underperformed last season but was still extremely functional at its core. That squad has been built over a lengthy period of time and a lot of money was spent along the way. It's easy to ignore that now.

Both managers and board have to carry the blame. I understand why MU might have pursued the route of entrusting the manager with all decisions after the experience with SAF. But SAF was unique and I do not think it will be possible even at MU to have a manager for decades.
The club comes always first, before the manager and the players, so while it is good to work with the manager it is not to leave all decisions to him.

Chelsea has lots of holes in its team too and spent relatively little for Top EPL teams standards, the reason why Conte is being succesful nonetheless are in my opinion three:

1) he is by far the best manager and coach in the league, and I think you will appreciate this next year even more than you have this one
2) Chelsea did not have the CL and this especially with a coach like Conte makes a huge difference because he has been able tp work on the players a lot
3) The other top teams especially MU and City have wasted most of their money on average players that do not make the difference, the only exception being Pogba who has been paid a lot but will become the best in the world in his role even though so far he has not performed to his potential thanks some weird tactics from Mou

Net spend doesn't tell full story without context and putting any time frame is also flawed method as players like Hazard, Cahill, Azpi, Courtois and few others were all signed before 3 years.

There is no doubt ManUtd didn't do well with money spent but what Conte said is wrong. He is deluded if he thinks Chelsea are in the same bracket as Spurs when it comes to money spent. They spent around 120 Million this summer.

You are right net spend especially on a single season does not tell the whole story, but on a sufficiently long period is a great indicator of a clubs' management skills.
If you are constantly overachieving vs your net spend ranking it means that both manager and boards are doing a good job. Conte's remarks are being a bit misinterpreted here I think. His point was not that money is not important but that is not the most important thing and most of all it is key to spend it well. I am sure he will ask to invest a lot to the board next summer

 

[TheReligion]

Same style he played when CFC beat United 4-0? Yep, so defensive. We've scored the second most goals in the league this year, and can sometimes play some top football, i.e. just today - but still - we're very defensive. You guys don't understand why Jose made those comments. He's trying to get at the board who sacked him with these remarks. He is a pragmatic manager, just like Jose, but that doesn't mean he's defensive per se. His hands were tied in the recent tie at Old Trafford with injuries. Chelsea don't have a squad as deep as United's to cope with key injuries like that.

So now we are pretending you had an injury ravaged squad for the game at Old Trafford? Leave it out. Have you seen United's injury list lately? Then you can complain..

Ultimately if Conte can't manage his squad that's his problem. If his 'hands are tied' just because Marcos Alonso pulls out before kick off then I genuinely worry how he'll cope when he has to balance a squad in Europe.

 

[Z_Wolf]

Didn't he bid 70m quids for Koulibaly at some point?
The man is deluded. He thinks he's the best thing since sliced bread but that will end.

 

[Kentonio]

He's probably just fecking with Jose and Pep. They're all more than capable of winding each other up.

 

[Robbie Boy]

They are so spectacularly unexciting to watch. I'll hedge my bets that they will finish well behind next seasons champions.

 

[roonster09]

So you're giving Conte no credit at all? How bizarre.

Also, you should read up on Emenalo's (Director of Football) transfer dealings with Chelsea. You don't sound too informed on the whole transfer situation at CFC. It's common knowledge Batshuayi was a board signing.

Luiz, Alonso, Kante were signed who are all first team players who played almost every min. So whatever excuses you are giving, it was money that solved the problem. Credit to Conte for getting the system right but his system is nothing without players and the players he signed spending big money.

When was the last time Chelsea lost players they wanted to retain? You are overplaying Conte's hand way too much.

You can't even read, how bizarre.

So how do you know Kante is Conte's signing and Batshuayi is board's? Like I said, this game was played by Liverpool long back.

 

[roonster09]

They are so spectacularly unexciting to watch. I'll hedge my bets that they will finish well behind next seasons champions.

That's how I see it as well. It looked like give the ball to Hazard and expect something to happen.

Funny how Chelsea fans were so pissed off when Jose said Chelsea are counter attacking team, they are exactly that and it's not even criticism.

 

[Ainu]

Both managers and board have to carry the blame. I understand why MU might have pursued the route of entrusting the manager with all decisions after the experience with SAF. But SAF was unique and I do not think it will be possible even at MU to have a manager for decades.
The club comes always first, before the manager and the players, so while it is good to work with the manager it is not to leave all decisions to him.

If you're not leaving the decisions to him, that means working with a director of football. There's no middle ground here, non-football people should not be making any decisions in terms of which players to target. They can and should block transfers if it's not financially viable, but that's not an issue at Manchester United.

Chelsea has lots of holes in its team too and spent relatively little for Top EPL teams standards, the reason why Conte is being succesful nonetheless are in my opinion three:

1) he is by far the best manager and coach in the league, and I think you will appreciate this next year even more than you have this one
2) Chelsea did not have the CL and this especially with a coach like Conte makes a huge difference because he has been able tp work on the players a lot
3) The other top teams especially MU and City have wasted most of their money on average players that do not make the difference, the only exception being Pogba who has been paid a lot but will become the best in the world in his role even though so far he has not performed to his potential thanks some weird tactics from Mou

Chelsea's team does not have lots of holes in it, the notion itself is absurd. This is a team that will be champions for the second time in three years. Their first XI is very strong, just as it was 2 seasons back. As for your other points;

1) Absolutely ridiculous to state he is "by far the best manager" in a league that has, among others, a man who's won a Champions League with Porto, a treble with Inter and league titles everywhere he went. Let's see again in 10 years time. For now there's no point having this discussion.
2) This is undoubtedly a massive factor.
3) Wasted money on average players? Such as Ibrahimovich who is among the top scorers in the league this season? Or Mkhitaryan who was a standout player in a strong Bundesliga team? Or Bailley who was relatively cheap and impressed early on before he started picking up some injuries? These transfers were absolutely necessary and have certainly made a difference, even if Mkhitaryan and to a certain extent Pogba have not really shown their true colours yet. Our squad was a mess, you can't solve that in a single transfer window. I'm more or less confident we're on the right track though.

 

[africanspur]

You can't even read, how bizarre.

So how do you know Kante is Conte's signing and Batshuayi is board's? Like I said, this game was played by Liverpool long back.

Its seemingly played by fans of all English clubs that have a dof. We had the same at Spurs when we had one.

Like the manager : he bought the good players, the board / dof bought the flops.

Don't like the manager: that bastard is the one wasting our money on flops. The Dof is the one keeping some stability and continuity.

Its quite transparent.

 

[roonster09]

Its seemingly played by fans of all English clubs that have a dof. We had the same at Spurs when we had one.

Like the manager : he bought the good players, the board / dof bought the flops.

Don't like the manager: that bastard is the one wasting our money on flops. The Dof is the one keeping some stability and continuity.

Its quite transparent.

Exactly. If Conte flops next season then narrative will change regarding transfers.

 

[KM]

Same style he played when CFC beat United 4-0? Yep, so defensive. We've scored the second most goals in the league this year, and can sometimes play some top football, i.e. just today - but still - we're very defensive. You guys don't understand why Jose made those comments. He's trying to get at the board who sacked him with these remarks. He is a pragmatic manager, just like Jose, but that doesn't mean he's defensive per se. His hands were tied in the recent tie at Old Trafford with injuries. Chelsea don't have a squad as deep as United's to cope with key injuries like that.

You got two injuries in that match. It's extremely embarrassing that you're moaning about that. Have a word with yourself.

 

[africanspur]

Also, I thought conte spent 100-120 million last summer? So behind the two Manchester clubs only?

And it's a bit silly to say that there were lots of holes in the squad imo. Every squad has holes in it. But this was a squad that had won the league literally one season ago.

Conte has done a great great job, even excluding certain circumstances, almost certainly win a double in his first season. But I think some people overplay things slightly. You get the impression he's taken a perennially midtable club to the top on peanuts.

 

[duffer]

Also, I thought conte spent 100-120 million last summer? So behind the two Manchester clubs only?

About 112 mil spent.

Batshuayi - 33 mil
Kante - 30 mil
Alonso - 19 mi
Luiz - 30 mil

We recouped about 90 mi from Oscar, Salah and various others. I'd say was massively improved the squad with not a large overall outlay.

 

[PepG]

He's probably just fecking with Jose and Pep. They're all more than capable of winding each other up.

This. Bizzare comments from Conte but he obviously thinks that he, Klopp and Pochettino are doing far better job than Jose and Pep. It's not a dig at the Manchester clubs and their spendings. It's a dig at their managers. I am surprised..

 

[duffer]

You got two injuries in that match. It's extremely embarrassing that you're moaning about that. Have a word with yourself.

Indeed. He should be moaning about the plague that swept through the squad, the criminal hand-ball decision and the almost gravity-defying deflection for hte second goal.

 

[Insanity]

Everyone is such a bitch these days. Shows how much under pressure these managers are to show results. Not a surprise that the shelf life of a manager with a particular team is getting shorter and shorter.

Chelsea spent around 120m in the summer, have been the top PL spenders since Roman and are on the way to the title this season but still Conte felt the need to have a dig.

 

[KM]

Indeed. He should be moaning about the plague that swept through the squad, the criminal hand-ball decision and the almost gravity-defying deflection for hte second goal.

True, also add the the manager's complete inability to change the tactics when someone finally countered it, the attacking lineup hitting no shots on target throughout 90 mins and Hazard's lack of intelligence in countering man marking.

 

[Kentonio]

Chelsea spent around 120m in the summer, have been the top PL spenders since Roman and are on the way to the title this season but still Conte felt the need to have a dig.

I think it's City who have spent the most now.

This was from last August, and they outspent us this year too.

http://www.kicktv.com/the-premier-leagues-top-net-spenders-since-1992/

 

[cheeky_backheel]

About 112 mil spent.

Batshuayi - 33 mil
Kante - 30 mil
Alonso - 19 mi
Luiz - 30 mil

We recouped about 90 mi from Oscar, Salah and various others. I'd say was massively improved the squad with not a large overall outlay.

That money was spent well before Oscar was sold. There was no expectation of the Oscar windfall when those other players were bought. Already there are rumors he is willing to break the bank for Lukaku.

Also while at Juve, Conte wasnt tight with the purse. He was top spender over the 3 seasons he was at Juve.

Conte is just like any other coach at a top club, spending money to bring in the talents to help deliver the results expected of him. This in of itself is no sin, but him taking shots at others on money spent is highly hypocritical. It simply spewing BS that irritates the ear. If he is that frugal, he can try leading Burnley to the EPL title

 

[africanspur]

About 112 mil spent.

Batshuayi - 33 mil
Kante - 30 mil
Alonso - 19 mi
Luiz - 30 mil

We recouped about 90 mi from Oscar, Salah and various others. I'd say was massively improved the squad with not a large overall outlay.

Ah right sure. Yeah that's not unreasonable to say

 

[TheReligion]

1) he is by far the best manager and coach in the league, and I think you will appreciate this next year even more than you have this one
2) Chelsea did not have the CL and this especially with a coach like Conte makes a huge difference because he has been able tp work on the players a lot
3) The other top teams especially MU and City have wasted most of their money on average players that do not make the difference, the only exception being Pogba who has been paid a lot but will become the best in the world in his role even though so far he has not performed to his potential thanks some weird tactics from Mou

1) that's very knee jerk and will come back to haunt you. By far the best manager in the PL? He started poorly and doesn't seem to have a plan B. Too early to make such ridiculous comments given the level of coaching we have in England.

2) correct. I do not believe that you would be top of the league if you were balancing Europe too. Conte couldn't cope with Alonso pulling out against United. No way he could rotate.

3) JM has made some great signings all of which have improved us. Zlatan, Pogba, Mkhitaryan and Bailly. He's also recouped wages and fees on Schweinsteiger, Depay and Schneiderlin. Very good business for me and this will continue into the summer. If you want to look beyond that then outside of JMs reign we have wasted some money but so have Chelsea so let's not pretend otherwise. This term Batshuayi must be one of the most expensive flops in the PL.

 

[Kentonio]

He started poorly and doesn't seem to have a plan B. Too early to make such ridiculous comments given the level of coaching we have in England.

Err what? He won 4 on the bounce at the start of the season, then had a small run of 1 draw and 2 losses which led to a tactical change following which he equalled the PL record of 13 straight wins. Since then he's used various tactical solutions and has dropped very few points while maintaining a decent lead at the top of the table.

I agree its way too early to make sweeping statements about him being the best in the league, but he's not exactly doing a bad job.

2) correct. I do not believe that you would be top of the league if you were balancing Europe too. Conte couldn't cope with Alonso pulling out against United. No way he could rotate.

"No way he could rotate"? Dear god..

 

[TheReligion]

Err what? He won 4 on the bounce at the start of the season, then had a small run of 1 draw and 2 losses which led to a tactical change following which he equalled the PL record of 13 straight wins. Since then he's used various tactical solutions and has dropped very few points while maintaining a decent lead at the top of the table.

I agree its way too early to make sweeping statements about him being the best in the league, but he's not exactly doing a bad job.



"No way he could rotate"? Dear god..

Well could he rotate or not? Your 30 odd million pound striker can't get a game off the bench let alone a start. We have already had some of your fans saying 'Contes hand was forced at OT due to injures..'

I mean if you can't manage your wing back pulling out of a game and the whole team crumbles then that's not right surely?

 

[Kentonio]

Well could he rotate or not? Your 30 odd million pound striker can't get a game off the bench let alone a start. We have already had some of your fans saying 'Contes hand was forced at OT due to injures..'

I mean if you can't manage your wing back pulling out of a game and the whole team crumbles then that's not right surely?

There were reports that there was a bug going around the squad at the time. It's not an excuse for losing, you guys were better on the day, but given that Cahill was hospitalized briefly shortly afterwards its relevant in terms of accusations that we 'crumbled'.

The idea of making judgements on a single game is ridiculous anyway. Other players have missed games during the season and we've managed just fine, but apparently this one proves some point because.. reasons?

 

[TheReligion]

There were reports that there was a bug going around the squad at the time. It's not an excuse for losing, you guys were better on the day, but given that Cahill was hospitalized briefly shortly afterwards its relevant in terms of accusations that we 'crumbled'.

The idea of making judgements on a single game is ridiculous anyway. Other players have missed games during the season and we've managed just fine, but apparently this one proves some point because.. reasons?

Non of our players have picked up this 'bug' so I find that hard to believe. You just lost the game plain and simple. The point I am making is your own fans are saying that Conte was powerless against United due to injuries. That's nonsense. If you can't deal with what he faced in the game then I seriously worry long term.

 

[tomaldinho1]

I don't get why Chelsea fans are biting at the comments they are defensive and counter attacking - they're top and that system works. At the end of the day they won the Champions League by being the most boring team on the planet but it worked - like Greece in the Euros. Trophies are everything in football.

Fair play to Conte, he has managed his squad well (albeit not having the same game volumne as other clubs) and could be set for a double in his first season. You feel there will need to be 3-4 more signing in the summer given how sthin they seem (Basically if Hazard or Costa gets injured it's curtains at the moment)

 

[Sunspear17]

It is silly for Conte to talk about money spent. He has said a couple odd things this week, including rather losing than having a selfish player. The problem is, player price inflation is creating the problem of clubs spending a lot of money, not that the clubs want to. For a player who is above average it costs 3 times what it would have cost 5 years ago, it's madness. I am sure he'll look back at this comment and realise it was silly considering we'll probably end up spending big this summer to reinforce too. I don't know anything about the Batshuyai buy, whether that was Conte or the board, but whatever the case he hasn't been played and we've pretty much thrown away 30+ million on a bit part player.

 

[Kentonio]

Non of our players have picked up this 'bug' so I find that hard to believe.

No, you're right. We clearly hospitalized Cahill and claimed it was gastroenteritis purely because we couldn't handle the idea of losing a game of football. We were so careful, we even withdrew a player before the game to embellish our carefully plotted fiction. And we'd have gotten away with it too, if it hadn't been for you darn kids..

 

[Claude Makélélé]

1) that's very knee jerk and will come back to haunt you. By far the best manager in the PL? He started poorly and doesn't seem to have a plan B. Too early to make such ridiculous comments given the level of coaching we have in England.

In terms of points earned - this season - he is the best. His team earns the most points now. Doesn't matter if his team was lucky in terms of injuries or his spending was big or not and so on whatever reasons given. If Tottenham take more points than Chelsea at the end of the season - then Poch is the best at earning points. And if football is not about results - it is not football. Jose is the one who knows that best.

Even if Jose (or Pep) spends 300M this summer but next year he earns the most points and so wins the tittle: He is the best - no matter how much he would have spent. It just shows he dared to change the squad, bough good players and managed the team well. Again, Jose knows it best.

 

[TheReligion]

No, you're right. We clearly hospitalized Cahill and claimed it was gastroenteritis purely because we couldn't handle the idea of losing a game of football. We were so careful, we even withdrew a player before the game to embellish our carefully plotted fiction. And we'd have gotten away with it too, if it hadn't been for you darn kids..

Notice how you ignore the rest of what I'm saying though about your own fans claims that poor old Conte was powerless against United due to the injury of Alonso. Ridiculous huh?

And Cahill was fine in the game. He even gave a post match interview. The only thing that made him ill was being anhilated by Rashford and Lingard.

 

[TheReligion]

In terms of points earned - this season - he is the best. His team earns the most points now. Doesn't matter if his team was lucky in terms of injuries or his spending was big or not and so on whatever reasons given. If Tottenham take more points than Chelsea at the end of the season - then Poch is the best at earning points. And if football is not about results - it is not football. Jose is the one who knows that best.

Even if Jose (or Pep) spends 300M this summer but next year he earns the most points and so wins the tittle: He is the best - no matter how much he would have spent. It just shows he dared to change the squad, bough good players and managed the team well. Again, Jose knows it best.

The best at earning points? He said he's by far the best manager in the PL.

He's not 'by far' anything. And as for the best its too early to tell.

 

[rocks13]

No, you're right. We clearly hospitalized Cahill and claimed it was gastroenteritis purely because we couldn't handle the idea of losing a game of football. We were so careful, we even withdrew a player before the game to embellish our carefully plotted fiction. And we'd have gotten away with it too, if it hadn't been for you darn kids..

Aw. Did the ickle Chelsea boys have sore tummies? Had they eaten too many sweeties?

 

[Kentonio]

Aw. Did the ickle Chelsea boys have sore tummies? Had they eaten too many sweeties?

Erm, that was weird.

 

[Claude Makélélé]

The best at earning points? He said he's by far the best manager in the PL.

He's not 'by far' anything. And as for the best its too early to tell.

If it is not to earn the most points (= title) then what is the goal do you think for a top 6 manager to go for at the beginning of the season?

Everyone was looking for that target: earn more points than everyone else. So any in top 6 manager who gets it will be the best - no matter how luck or amount of money they spend as I explained above. Next season, Jose, Pep, Klopp or Wenger - no matter who - will the best if he meets that target.

Unless another manager who take a middle club like Southamton to top 4 then he is the best AT that season.

 

[BlueViper]

You guys are crying over something so minor! He's just affirming that catering to a system is much more important than throwing money and hoping something sticks i.e. he's saying "it's important to bring in the right players", a relatively simple concept I'm sure all managers will agree with. Saying that they are spending money isn't a pot-shot at the two Manchester clubs. Neither club are throwing away their cash. United fixed up some glaring issues while City's squad is being rejuvenated. This is the spending that they needed to do and he acknowledges that it's fine for those clubs to continue to do that if they feel the need to. It just so happened that Chelsea needed to spend less than those two clubs to have a genuine, title-contending team this season.

If Conte earmarks transfers for next season and thinks that spending $200mil is necessary to improve the team, he'd go right ahead and do it (obviously provided he had the funds available).

 

[AllezLesDiables]

Yes, Conte is talking to you Redcafe! Clearly, seeing as the opinion of redcafe has massive impact on Chelsea's transfer business.

Or maybe just maybe, he was trying to hint to Roman that money needs to be spent to avoid another 2015-2016 season and to be competitive in the CL.

As for the comments about defensive counter attacking football does anyone really think this would have been an issue had it been said by anyone else other than the king narcissist himself, Jose.

 

[The Outsider]

I don't get why Chelsea fans are biting at the comments they are defensive and counter attacking - they're top and that system works. At the end of the day they won the Champions League by being the most boring team on the planet but it worked - like Greece in the Euros. Trophies are everything in football.

Fair play to Conte, he has managed his squad well (albeit not having the same game volumne as other clubs) and could be set for a double in his first season. You feel there will need to be 3-4 more signing in the summer given how sthin they seem (Basically if Hazard or Costa gets injured it's curtains at the moment)

I was checking out the fightingcocks forum the other day after the FA semis and caught a comment by a Spurs fan rubbishing the Conte just plays counter attacking football claim.
I found I agreed with his statement that Conte only plays counter-attacking when his team cannot control the midfield and certainly against Spurs and United that has been the case.
I suspect with Liverpool too though cannot recall the match.

Agree that squad strengthening is needed for taking on the CL.

Re the champions league win yes it was often defensive yet beating Barcelona on their own turf and Bayern Munich in Germany is still pretty special.

 

[Prometheus]

We all can't talk about spending (United/City/Chelsea fans). First it was just us, but now we're all in the same boat.