City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches

Judas said:
Football really is a horrible grim fecked up sport now isn't it.
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It's pointless trying to compete with a club that have been playing with an infinite money cheat for a decade.

When you're going against a club that have two first team lineups, who overnight went from also-rans into hiring managers like Mancini (where we know for certain he was paid under the table, otherwise he wouldn't have given them a second thought) and then luring Pep and his Barca backroom team, throwing all the money under the sun at him, fake sponsors, with a dozen custom built feeder clubs at their disposal so they can further circumvent FFP... Really, what is the fecking point?

I don't even want United to win everything - we had our time at the top. If it happens again then great, but I won't lose sleep over it. That's life. But the drama of the Premier League - arguably the thing that has made it so popular across the world - is gone. Arsenal would win in any normal season (especially without the questionable ref decisions that seem to do City favours as well). Nothing will change next season either; it's just a parade* towards City winning another title.

*A parade that's bigger than their end of season ones where nearly feck all people turn up because the one thing they can't buy are fans.
 
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padr81 said:
The Gross National Product of Uk is about 3.8 billion dollars. The GNP of “Manchester City” 115 is 830 Billion Dollars, that’s 218 times that of Britain. - This guy must be a City fan then.
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Must be the City bookkeeper.... could explain part of the irregularities over there.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
It's pointless trying to compete with a club that have been playing with an infinite money cheat for a decade.

When you're going against a club that have two first team lineups, who overnight went from also-rans into hiring managers like Mancini (where we know for certain he was paid under the table, otherwise he wouldn't have given them a second thought) and then luring Pep and his Barca backroom team, throwing all the money under the sun at him... Really, what is the fecking point?

I don't even want United to win everything - we had our time at the top. If it happens again then great, but I won't lose sleep over it. That's life. But the drama of the Premier League - arguably the thing that has made it so popular across the world - is gone. Nothing will change next season either; it's just a parade* towards City winning another season.

*A parade that's bigger than their end of season ones where nearly feck all people turn up because the one thing they can't buy are fans.
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It's basically like F1 racing. Lots of glitz and glamour with no real excitement.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
It's pointless trying to compete with a club that have been playing with an infinite money cheat for a decade.

When you're going against a club that have two first team lineups, who overnight went from also-rans into hiring managers like Mancini (where we know for certain he was paid under the table, otherwise he wouldn't have given them a second thought) and then luring Pep and his Barca backroom team, throwing all the money under the sun at him, fake sponsors, with a dozen custom built feeder clubs at their disposal so they can further circumvent FFP... Really, what is the fecking point?

I don't even want United to win everything - we had our time at the top. If it happens again then great, but I won't lose sleep over it. That's life. But the drama of the Premier League - arguably the thing that has made it so popular across the world - is gone. Arsenal would win in any normal season (especially without the questionable ref decisions that seem to do City favours as well). Nothing will change next season either; it's just a parade* towards City winning another title.

*A parade that's bigger than their end of season ones where nearly feck all people turn up because the one thing they can't buy are fans.
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Or respect from rival fans and clubs, which must really grind their gears.

I remember reading that the PL would end up ruining itself one day, I never thought it would be like this, but seems like it could be.

The final nail could well be the PL been lily livered over the punsihing City, as rival fans have invested alot into this, and if they come out the other side unscathed then it's going to be bleak to say the least.
 
OldSchoolManc said:
If City do get off lightly, there’s absolutely no reason why every other team shouldn’t make up sponsors so they can spend whatever they want.
Not that anyone can compete with an entire states spending.
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We could get a rich backer then get slapped with a 3 window transfer ban a decade down the line you’d think yeah sure. That’s fine.

If they get sent down to the fourth or fifth tier which should happen then yeah sure that’s the price of ill gotten gains surely. Give them 5 years to get their house in order and return.

Their fans are in complete and utter denial I have never seen a more rapid unapologetic fanbase when it comes to defending their club. Apparently they aren’t owned by a state and it’s just a company so that’s absolutely fine..

Anyways if they get let off we should start the super league with Real Madrid very simple. I’m not wanting to play in a league that’s already corrupt when we can just bar City from a Super League regardless.

If they want their own system / rules we make our own with other clubs I say. United do not need the premier league that’s a fact. They need us.

Amazon deals all that good stuff Id just put in motion right away if they get a slap on the wrist.
 
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Changeisgood said:
Must be the City bookkeeper.... could explain part of the irregularities over there.
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I don't think the City bookkeeper would be poor enough to think that Britains' GNP is only 3 billion personally, else he'd have been cooking the books so far backwards he'd have passed FFP.
 
PL used to be the most competitive and exciting league in the world which enable it to generate incomes far above other leagues.

PL is sabotaging itself if they let City's have their way. PL will be like Bundesliga - BM, Ligue 1 - PSG, PL - City. These 3 teams are too far ahead of the rest and it kills the competitiveness and excitement.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
PL used to be the most competitive and exciting league in the world which enable it to generate incomes far above other leagues.

PL is sabotaging itself if they let City's have their way. PL will be like Bundesliga - BM, Ligue 1 - PSG, PL - City. These 3 teams are too far ahead of the rest and it kills the competitiveness and excitement.
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As much as I dislike everything about post-2008 City and yearn for a charge/rule-based backlash, let's be honest....so much of their current level is because of Pep. If/when he leaves and they're forced to play the managerial merry-go-round market like everyone else, this does become a somewhat different-looking issue. City could easily be present-day Chelsea.

Maybe the Premier League, ever bollocks-less, are hoping this will just be a temporary problem and when Pep's dominance ends there'll be less heat on them to resolve....
 
Wengerista said:
As much as I dislike everything about post-2008 City and yearn for a charge/rule-based backlash, let's be honest....so much of their current level is because of Pep. If/when he leaves and they're forced to play the managerial merry-go-round market like everyone else, this does become a somewhat different-looking issue. City could easily be present-day Chelsea.

Maybe the Premier League, ever bollocks-less, are hoping this will just be a temporary problem and when Pep's dominance ends there'll be less heat on them to resolve....
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Vastly underestimating the advantages they have over the rest of the league.

The fact that a half cooked City won titles under coaches like Mancini and Pellegrini says enough.

Now, full blown super-City reporting the biggest profits in football in legitimate financial documents?

They don’t need Guardiola or anyone else. Not anymore.
 
Maluco said:
Vastly underestimating the advantages they have over the rest of the league.

The fact that a half cooked City won titles under coaches like Mancini and Pellegrini says enough.

Now, full blown super-City reporting the biggest profits in football in legitimate financial documents?

They don’t need Guardiola or anyone else. Not anymore.
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Yeah. A lot of short memories and delusion on here.
 
Yakuza_devils said:
PL used to be the most competitive and exciting league in the world which enable it to generate incomes far above other leagues.

PL is sabotaging itself if they let City's have their way. PL will be like Bundesliga - BM, Ligue 1 - PSG, PL - City. These 3 teams are too far ahead of the rest and it kills the competitiveness and excitement.
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United won the whole thing all but two years between 92 and 2000 didn’t they?

After that, Chelsea joining the party is the only thing that kept it from being a 3 team league.

City is on a decent run, but they gave t even locked down the title this year …. Yet, and the competition for spots, all the way into the middle of the table, is extremely strong.

United isn’t winning like they used to, but the league is a lot more competitive than it was “back then” as a whole.

The PL should never put themselves in a position of losing out on talent and market share to other leagues just to compensate for bad owners at historic clubs.

If they want to set spending limits? Fine, but those limits should be high. There should be more concern with the best teams in England competing with the best teams in Europe than there is over the spend budget of the Luton Town’s of the world; that’s ridiculous.

And the spending limits should be fair. The idea that one team should be able to spend more money than another because their money came from Jersey sales is stupid. It was an obvious attempt to cement the position of certain teams.

City should get busted, but because they committed fraud, not because the FFP rules are in any way a remotely fair or good idea.

Didn’t the City of Madrid once sell Real land for 30m then buy it back from them for like 500m?

On a larger scale FFP is an artificial way to keep historic leagues from getting passed over as well.

It’s all a joke, and United would be benefitting from this incredibly, but you have the worst owners in Pro Sports. But that isn’t every other team in Englands fault. That problem is hopefully being remedied with Ineos.
 
Maluco said:
Vastly underestimating the advantages they have over the rest of the league.

The fact that a half cooked City won titles under coaches like Mancini and Pellegrini says enough.

Now, full blown super-City reporting the biggest profits in football in legitimate financial documents?

They don’t need Guardiola or anyone else. Not anymore.
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Not true.

Keep in mind that Klopp pushed them in 2 title races to within a point at the final whistle. Arteta is most likely going to have Arsenal finish within 2 points of City. And this is a City with Guardiola. I don't think Mancini or Pellegrini, as good as they were, finish with this City team ahead of Liverpool back then and Arsenal

City's wealth and back-office expertise guarantees their minimum base level. To really be elite, regardless of the wealth, you need elite coaching. So remove Pep and replace him with Emery... And City have 2-3 less titles, and the bitching about competitiveness of the league dies down

And what I'm really saying is that Arsenal/Liverpool/United need to hire a squad of goons that kidnap Pep, take him to a remote island full of resources and tactics white boards, and maroon him there for 3 years
 
Bluelion7 said:
United won the whole thing all but two years between 92 and 2000 didn’t they?

After that, Chelsea joining the party is the only thing that kept it from being a 3 team league.

City is on a decent run, but they gave t even locked down the title this year …. Yet, and the competition for spots, all the way into the middle of the table, is extremely strong.

United isn’t winning like they used to, but the league is a lot more competitive than it was “back then” as a whole.

The PL should never put themselves in a position of losing out on talent and market share to other leagues just to compensate for bad owners at historic clubs.

If they want to set spending limits? Fine, but those limits should be high. There should be more concern with the best teams in England competing with the best teams in Europe than there is over the spend budget of the Luton Town’s of the world; that’s ridiculous.

And the spending limits should be fair. The idea that one team should be able to spend more money than another because their money came from Jersey sales is stupid. It was an obvious attempt to cement the position of certain teams.

City should get busted, but because they committed fraud, not because the FFP rules are in any way a remotely fair or good idea.

Didn’t the City of Madrid once sell Real land for 30m then buy it back from them for like 500m?

On a larger scale FFP is an artificial way to keep historic leagues from getting passed over as well.

It’s all a joke, and United would be benefitting from this incredibly, but you have the worst owners in Pro Sports. But that isn’t every other team in Englands fault. That problem is hopefully being remedied with Ineos.
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The key point here is that Man Utd won fair and square. Man Utd didn't cheats, inflated the market artificially, create unsustainable competition with constant "extraordinary" revenues. They are going to get stronger and stronger because since Covid they are now the highest revenues club in PL. Their revenues are even higher than BM and close to RM and Barcelona too (if not surpassed them).

The monopoly monster will become bigger and bigger. Man Utd didn't compete with such vast advantages that's almost impossible for others.

PL need not only spending caps but also need to punish whatever wrong doings of City. Wrong is wrong, not ifs and buts.
 
SER19 said:
The Lance Armstrong of football, without the mitigating sympathy of illness - other than what seems to be mental illness among the fans who still drudge on, arguing any way possible that their rotten club hasn't ruined football and will be forever associated with cheating. They'll hoover up a new generation of YouTube fan types who are too young to remember the sport when it was any other way, and will celebrate their empty success every year with that hollow, pretend joy that has become the norm.
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Absolutely spot on comparison
 
Mr Pigeon said:
It's pointless trying to compete with a club that have been playing with an infinite money cheat for a decade.

When you're going against a club that have two first team lineups, who overnight went from also-rans into hiring managers like Mancini (where we know for certain he was paid under the table, otherwise he wouldn't have given them a second thought) and then luring Pep and his Barca backroom team, throwing all the money under the sun at him, fake sponsors, with a dozen custom built feeder clubs at their disposal so they can further circumvent FFP... Really, what is the fecking point?

I don't even want United to win everything - we had our time at the top. If it happens again then great, but I won't lose sleep over it. That's life. But the drama of the Premier League - arguably the thing that has made it so popular across the world - is gone. Arsenal would win in any normal season (especially without the questionable ref decisions that seem to do City favours as well). Nothing will change next season either; it's just a parade* towards City winning another title.

*A parade that's bigger than their end of season ones where nearly feck all people turn up because the one thing they can't buy are fans.
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This was really what pushed me over the edge with city. When it was just the money they were spending on players and managers, it was whatever for me (Not aiming to debate that point) but then stories started to come out about the sketchy things they were doing with all these other clubs they owned, and honestly it just all became appalling to me. I guess it makes sense if you are trying to do what they're doing, but I can't see how you can enjoy that unless you don't have a soul. I would hate to see us go down this multi club ownership route regardless of any benefits it might have for us.

And as for the rest of your post, I agree with you. The PL is the real farmer's league these days. We start every season expecting city to win. Even if a team leads the league for most of the season, you still expect city to win. The PL title 'race' is very boring.

For me personally, I attribute a lot of that to pep, because he is on another level when it comes to dominating league campaigns, and I suppose we'll see what the drop off is when they have to go from pep to a mortal manager, but regardless of that, it is hard not to say that the pl is very boring as a spectacle these days.
 
The panel judging them only has to decide on the balance of probabilities. Did Man City probably cheat? Did Man City probably corrupt the PL? Did Man City probably money launder through artificial sponsorships and fake companies?

Yes.

15 years of wide scale corruption, damaging the revenues of so many other teams operating within the rules. They'll have to be expelled from the PL. Ideally permanently, but at least for a period reflective of the long-term nature of their corruption; i.e. 5-10 years.

Do the EFL accept them? If so, how does that work? Most likely outcome is still that they end up out of the football pyramid. At least there's no FFP for them to worry about below League 2?
 
In 21/22 they lost one match in the PL from October to the end of the season

In 22/23 they lost one match in all competitions, a dead rubber on the final day of the season with the title already won, from the start of February to the end of the season

in 23/24 they've lost one match in all competitions from the start of December, to Real Madrid on pens in a game they probably should have won, and we're almost at the end of the season.

It's just fecking mental, how do you compete with that?
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
In 21/22 they lost one match in the PL from October to the end of the season

In 22/23 they lost one match in all competitions, a dead rubber on the final day of the season with the title already won, from the start of February to the end of the season

in 23/24 they've lost one match in all competitions from the start of December, to Real Madrid on pens in a game they probably should have won, and we're almost at the end of the season.

It's just fecking mental, how do you compete with that?
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I take your broader point, but these seemingly monstrous sporting achievements didn't come without massive assistance from the refs. There've been quite a few games in which they've been bailed out some ridiculous refereeing decisions. With them winning the title by very close margins in 3 recent seasons (including this one), that's easily been the difference between them and Liverpool/Arsenal.
 
erikcred said:
I take your broader point, but these seemingly monstrous sporting achievements didn't come without massive assistance from the refs. There've been quite a few games in which they've been bailed out some ridiculous refereeing decisions. With them winning the title by very close margins in 3 recent seasons (including this one), that's easily been the difference between them and Liverpool/Arsenal.
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That's the advantage you gain by corrupting the likes of Michael Oliver with bribes by over invoicing their services with all expenses paid trips.

They can't afford to take any risks with the FA Cup Final so had to get their inside man on VAR for it.
 
The fact City's owners also own Etihad who are the team's main sponsor should be all the evidence needed that something is amiss.
 
padzilla said:
The fact City's owners also own Etihad who are the team's main sponsor should be all the evidence needed that something is amiss.
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I remember plenty calling out such an obvious inflation of market rates when Etihad first signed on as a stadium rights sponsor, along with the obvious family connection. The craziness in it was claiming their naming rights* were legitimately worth double the then world record amount for Madison Square Garden rights and dwarfed similar naming rights deals across the globe. The club was now claiming it was a global brand appeal through such high fee paid, utter nonsense in 2011. It was obvious to anyone with an honest view they had inflated the market to cook the books, meet FFP rules, and immediately compete for big signings and wages.

*Including a revised kit deal which had been around 4m per year previously.
 
MrMarcello said:
I remember plenty calling out such an obvious inflation of market rates when Etihad first signed on as a stadium rights sponsor, along with the obvious family connection. The craziness in it was claiming their naming rights* were legitimately worth double the then world record amount for Madison Square Garden rights and dwarfed similar naming rights deals across the globe. The club was now claiming it was a global brand appeal through such high fee paid, utter nonsense in 2011. It was obvious to anyone with an honest view they had inflated the market to cook the books, meet FFP rules, and immediately compete for big signings and wages.

*Including a revised kit deal which had been around 4m per year previously.
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:lol: Sponsoring and setting rates for yourself. What could possibly go wrong? Nothing to see here so long as the cutbacks come in on time per week.
 
Son said:
We could get a rich backer then get slapped with a 3 window transfer ban a decade down the line you’d think yeah sure. That’s fine.

If they get sent down to the fourth or fifth tier which should happen then yeah sure that’s the price of ill gotten gains surely. Give them 5 years to get their house in order and return.

Their fans are in complete and utter denial I have never seen a more rapid unapologetic fanbase when it comes to defending their club. Apparently they aren’t owned by a state and it’s just a company so that’s absolutely fine..

Anyways if they get let off we should start the super league with Real Madrid very simple. I’m not wanting to play in a league that’s already corrupt when we can just bar City from a Super League regardless.

If they want their own system / rules we make our own with other clubs I say. United do not need the premier league that’s a fact. They need us.

Amazon deals all that good stuff Id just put in motion right away if they get a slap on the wrist.
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Yeah I could definitely support that because let's face it whatever the "official" verdict everyone knows they are absolutely corrupt as feck
 
Yakuza_devils said:
PL used to be the most competitive and exciting league in the world which enable it to generate incomes far above other leagues.

PL is sabotaging itself if they let City's have their way. PL will be like Bundesliga - BM, Ligue 1 - PSG, PL - City. These 3 teams are too far ahead of the rest and it kills the competitiveness and excitement.
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Yeah couldn't have put it any better
 
If there was ever a case in football that stunk of corruption, this is it.

Everton and Nottingham Forest cases wrapped up in no time, almost costing them relagation.

City with 115+ charges, FFP all over the place, and theyre left to keep winning trophies and p**sing all over the rule book, that everyone else must stick too.
 
Nori- said:
If there was ever a case in football that stunk of corruption, this is it.

Everton and Nottingham Forest cases wrapped up in no time, almost costing them relagation.

City with 115+ charges, FFP all over the place, and theyre left to keep winning trophies and p**sing all over the rule book, that everyone else must stick too.
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Yeah City are absolutely corrupt but they have scared authorities into doing pretty much nothing
 
adexkola said:
And what I'm really saying is that Arsenal/Liverpool/United need to hire a squad of goons that kidnap Pep, take him to a remote island full of resources and tactics white boards, and maroon him there for 3 years
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I don't have any problem with this!
 
Is this the same organization that had no problem with Abramovich for so many years?
 
He's not wrong about other clubs being poorly run with the money at their disposal. What he's conveniently forgetting is that City shouldn't be eating at that table to begin with. Theirs is not an organic rise a la Leicester or Bayer Leverkusen, but an artificially pumped sportswashing project.

City's financial pull distorts the market and is making a mockery of the league. Their second XI could finish in the top 5 in the PL.
 
Real Name said:
He'll be the 1st rat to abandon ship when (if) they get punished.
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They'll get a slap on the wrist at most. The league doesn't have the stomach to take the fight to the courts and their army of lobbyist's will make sure politicians on both sides of the aisle don't raise too much of a fuss.
 
duffer said:
It's not about the money guys.

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The worst hypocrite of them all. So obsessed with football, legacy and quality of play, he doesn’t even realise his success with City is completely meaningless for the game itself. If there ever was a football person who sold their soul, it’s Pep.
 
HTG said:
The worst hypocrite of them all. So obsessed with football, legacy and quality of play, he doesn’t even realise his success with City is completely meaningless for the game itself. If there ever was a football person who sold their soul, it’s Pep.
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He’s too far up his own arse to acknowledge the fact they’ve spent more money in the PL than any other club, ever.
 
Zen86 said:
He’s too far up his own arse to acknowledge the fact they’ve spent more money in the PL than any other club, ever.
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Yep. He’s the perfect frontman for a dirty business like this one. So narcissistic, so far up his own ass, he’ll do everything to deny his bosses wrongdoings, simply because he won’t ever be able to acknowledge them himself.
 
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