Which part? Where you said it was racism or where you said the video does not show any racism?
Cop in America doing a bad job, again
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Which part? Where you said it was racism or where you said the video does not show any racism?
Why are you purposely simplifying this? I said, there was no evidence in the video, but what has gone on in the past, has lead to me believe, that this is quite possibly of a racist nature. What's so hard to understand about that?
'Too look into the future[/now] you must look into the past'
I've changed the thread title. Feck my life. You guys are just being tricky here with a technicality.
Yes, please read the thread where @Sigma says there is racism, yet won't say or point out the actual racism, but still insists the racism is there because the cop could possibly be racist and some stats show that racism is actually a real thing.
On the other hand, don't go back and read it - you will be smarter for it.
Thanks for that post. Is she allowed to not cooperate because she considers that she didn't crossed over the line?
But why? Other than having preconceptions about white police officers, what evidence is there that this is racially motivated?
None (I haven't denied this). That's why I said I think, for the reasons you outlined in your post. Obvisouly, if I was part of the police I would have evidence at hand, but as I am not, I can only speculate
So you've come to a conclusion based solely on the colour of the police officers skin. Do you see the irony in this?
lol at the back tracking.......
It's a racist video because its racist..... even though the video is not racist, but because racism exists in the world and the people involved are different races it has to be racist lol........
As has been implied previously, creating an assumption of an event solely based upon the race of those involved is the sheer definition of racism and racial profiling lol..... Oh the cruel hand of irony
It's a racist video because its racist..... even though the video is not racist, but because racism exists in the world and the people involved are different races it has to be racist lol........
As has been implied previously, creating an assumption of an event solely based upon the race of those involved is the sheer definition of racism and racial profiling lol..... Oh the cruel hand of irony
The war on drugs and the prison complex supporting it isn't sort of an industry, it's a massive one. But that's for another day...
As for this, it sounds like she felt too entitled to be pulled over, didn't want to cooperate, and he raised his voice leading to her geting scared. Both probably should've handled it better.
But if you've driven in Houston much, you'd wish people got pulled over for traffic violations much more often...
You are right. I should wait until there is more evidence.
I don't need 5 people telling me the same stuff.
Perhaps the cacophony of similar responses will eventually sink in lol....
He's been kidnapped!
It's Karl Pilkington's code word that he's in trouble if he got kidnapped in 'An Idiot Abroad.' So I'm guessing he's asking for help in this thread...?
Good Lord - that was funny.
gotcha!I think that's the Damascus Gate at the beginning. Funny thing... when I went there in college, I had to sign a waiver about getting killed or kidnapped while there.
The real question is, would a white person have been pulled over for a similar bylaw infraction? If the answer is no, because it's less likely that the white person would be driving a stolen car, under the influence or in possession of drugs, then yes, it's racism.
In Toronto, it was well documented that police were more likely to pull over black drivers for minor infractions in the hopes of landing a big fish...and also to 'card' them.
There is a subtle difference between being 'racist' and 'racially profiling' someone as part of your profession. To 'racially profile' someone you don't necessarily have to act nor harbor any racist beliefs, it is a product of the system. The 'system' itself creates an inherent link between minorities and crime, the link is actually more proportional to economics rather than simply race alone, however, as the vast majority of low income impoverished families within major US cities are people of minorities, it is often seen as a singular problem.
But again, while this perspective has merit, the answer to the question simply cannot be ascertained from the video alone.
No, not at that moment. That's what a citation is for. It's a "promise to appear" to traffic court and plead your case if you feel you did not commit the violation or the cop was in the wrong.
Now if she was in fear of her safety, there's nothing wrong with requesting that another officer respond to the location. Better yet, request a supervisor (sergeant, lieutenant) to respond to the scene. The officer should have had the lady stay in the car and let her know that a supervisor was en route. Upon arrival, the officer should explain to the Sgt what's going on. The sup should advise her that she needed to cooperate, present ID, etc., and she can be on her way with a court date. If she still refused to comply or sign the ticket, then she would be arrested.
Thanks again, that's what I had in mind.
Edit: The same thing happened just in front of my house two months ago and they did what you described, after 10 minutes three police cars arrived and they convinced the man to comply.
guessing based on the trend is fine, but don't treat it as a fact unless there's evidence for it in this case.
How likely is it that a supervisor will do that though? How likely is it that the cop will just wait around?
As for the court summons, I found out the hard way that even if you weren't in the wrong you still have to pay a court fee when the case is dismissed. It's a racket alright.
That isn't the real question because thats irrelevant to this discussion. This discussion isn't about if cops pull black people over more than whites (they do, but it isn't racist). This is about the police officer's conduct once the stop had already happened. Her race has nothing to do with how the cop acted after she was pulled over, which is what the entire video was about. She was pulled over for breaking the law and the cop acted how he did because of how she acted, not because the color of her skin.
congr-never mind
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Very likely. It's in the best interest of all parties, including the dept to have a supervisor respond to a scene if there's potential misconduct or a complaint, or if the situation is escalating to something bigger than a simple infraction. Of course this depends on the area where one works, geography size, and manpower,etc.
They may do things different there, but in liberal CA where ppl love to sue sue sue, it's better to CYA (cover your ass). In the past year or so I've seen more people pull the race card. Once someone starts with that I always tell the person how offended I am, and that I can call my supervisor over if he/she wishes. If not able to come, then I make it a point to call my sergeant after the fact and let them know what happened and a heads up in case they get a phone call for a complaint.
As far as the wait time, it's usually the person being detained that has somewhere to go and is being inconvenienced. I usually tell uncooperative people on traffic stops that I'll have to call a supervisor over and it may take X amount of time.and if they still refuse to ID themselves or sign the citation, then it'll be jail and their car being impounded. Most sensible people don't want that and do comply.
What state do you live in? Yeah, you're right, it's a straight up robbery IMO. I wrote a lot of tickets when I was in training, and went to court for some of them. The fines I heard being thrown around were just extortionate. I've gotten tickets before I became a cop and yeah it sucks. I don't write cites anymore unless they were doing something very dangerous/reckless or they were being absolute assholes.
these cops are as bad as the mods
Was not aware of Sandra Bland case. Disgusting!
How is the officer racist? If any shouldn't the woman be the racist one for being prejudice that the cop who hasn't even spoken anything other than standard police lines.
I got stopped by Australian cops, Singaporean cops, Indonesian cops, UK cops, and most of the time I just adhere to the usual standard of being polite and cooperate, and there's never be any problem. That's the one principle that I believe that if you behave there will be less trouble that might comes your way.
If you run away from cops without a good reason and resisting to cooperate, then you're probably asking for it. It's time that the black parents and society (as well as the whites) teaches everyone to respect the law and innocent until proven, instead of respecting it only if the officer is (insert skin color here).
Not every white cop that stops you wants you dead
Not every black individual you stop is a criminal
Failing to understand the two points above will increase the likelihood of things going FUBAR.
I got stopped by Australian cops, Singaporean cops, Indonesian cops, UK cops, and most of the time I just adhere to the usual standard of being polite and cooperate, and there's never be any problem. That's the one principle that I believe that if you behave there will be less trouble that might comes your way.
If you run away from cops without a good reason and resisting to cooperate, then you're probably asking for it. It's time that the black parents and society (as well as the whites) teaches everyone to respect the law and innocent until proven, instead of respecting it only if the officer is (insert skin color here).
Not every white cop that stops you wants you dead
Not every black individual you stop is a criminal
Failing to understand the two points above will increase the likelihood of things going FUBAR.
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WTF???
ops. i mean innocent
If you behave differently towards people based only on the colour of their skin yes it's racist. The black person who drives perfectly, behaves impeccably, etc should have a higher chance of being pulled over than other people? No way.
In this particular incident there's nothing to suggest racism however. If I got pulled over as a white man in England and got my phone out instead of handing over my license, I'd expect to have my phone taken away. It does appear the officer over reacted but aren't they trained like this? Maybe if he approached it differently (talking rather than shouting) it could have worked out better but it's all assumption.
By that definition of racism affirmative action is racist.
There is a difference, it might seem like semantics but racism is a belief that one race is superior to another and the carrying out of actions based on that belief. It's an ideology and not an action. The example that LuisNaniencia provided is racial discrimination, an action. They are not interchangeable terms. That doesn't take away from how wrong what happened was, and it's still fecked up but behaving different towards people based only on the colour of their skin is not racist by default, it's racial discrimination which may or may not have stemmed from racism and most of the time does. Take for example somebody who stops a black person because he doesn't trust black people. The act of stopping him is not racist, it's racial discrimination. His distrust of black people as a race is what is racist. People have started to use the words racist and racism more broadly to encompass anything that involves somebody of a different skin colour, though that's not really the meaning of the word. It doesn't really matter, because either way it still needs to be sorted out but that's why the word doesn't cover all examples and scenarios.
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So black people, and other minorities can be racist too though right? They can discriminate against other racial groups even if they don't "have power" institutionally?
This seems like a really silly question, of course they can. If a black person says 'I believe that the white race is inferior to the black race' then they are being racist. That's the definition. There are many forms of racism and many different forms of racial action that are not by definition racist. People often just use the one word to encompass all of them. It doesn't really matter, but when trying to tackle one form over the other I guess it might if people aren't being specific but on the whole it's not really something to lose sleep over the semantics.
Which is what I was getting at. Yelling "racism" every single time a black person is pulled over doesn't fix things for anybody.
Based on this response I would argue that the system is racist.
True that the video, any video, really, doesn't give us enough nuance to truly judge the situation.
It doesn't, but using the data that black people are pulled over disproportionally does. The fact that people yell racism every time a black person is pulled over does not detract from the fact that it is happening and needs to be addressed. It's semantics, whether it's racism or racial discrimination it still needs to be addressed.
A shitty little bylaw that hundreds of people violate every day in the US. Sounds so much more valid when you characterize it as "the law", though. It's not a felony, not even a misdemeanor. Frankly, the woman is within her rights to request another officer, considering the current climate, and the subsequent charges seem like a waste of everyone's time and money and all because she made a cop look like a dick.