Does anyone actually regret missing out on the top 4?

If we had managed to scramble to 4th or even 3rd I believe we would still have moved for Mourinho, given how disappointing the season was leading up to the final weeks - before our fate had been sealed. If we had beaten West Ham for example we would probably have qualified for the CL but the overall tone of the season wouldnt have changed significantly. Clearly we were not on the right path. And as long as we brought Mourinho in, the same players would have followed. We would have had even more money and it would have been an even easier decision for the players to make to come to us, if we were in the CL.

So I reject the whole premise of the OP.
 
Tiber said:
So the question is simple. Would any of you give up 5th place plus Jose, Pogba and Zlatan to have finished 4th and qualified for champions league?
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Yes I would - but its an easy decision for me since I didnt really want Jose or Zlatan plus I dont see why Pogba wouldnt have come anyway
 
adexkola said:
Does the above logic apply if you change 4th to 3rd or 2nd, or even winning the title? What's the threshold beyond which we hope the team does worse in one season so that another manager that may do better, comes in?

I like the position we are in now but I'm not a fan of the mental gymnastics used to justify the poisonous attitude shared by a lot of fans last season.
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This is a great post, succinct, and complete. Close thread. We are where we are now, and I'm excited about the season to come. The "what ifs" don't matter, because they are as relevant to our future as they are to our past.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yes and no. In terms of "relative conditions of the league" you don't get a bigger open goal than a league campaign where Leicester fecking City end up as champions. Moyes took over when most of the big teams were relatively strong but Van Gaal was in charge when there was a once in a lifetime alignment of the stars that saw City, Chelsea and Liverpool all sack their managers in the same season. He finished higher up the league than Moyes did in his debut season but it was arguably a worse campaign (which is where the goals/points per game stats are also useful)

Which is all the more damning when you consider that this season came when the team should have been kicking on, after Van Gaal had had more than enough time (and money) to get them playing exactly as he wanted.
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Interesting argument. Do you think someone could realistically argue that a team that won the league in one year, with 80 points and scored 80 goals, is in fact inferior to the team that came say 3rd the year after, with say 84 points and 84 goals scored? I'm not personally so sure that they could, and the circumstance could quite conceivably occur.
 
Yes, because Mourinho was coming with or without top 4 imo. We were 1 point from finishing 4th and our play was unexcusable.
Lvg had one more year on his contract and continue with him wasn't an option.
 
Why would anyone regret it? They weren't responsible.
 
Nah. Champions League is rubbish without United in it anyway.

Let's knock Sevilla off their f*cking perch this year!
 
adexkola said:
Does the above logic apply if you change 4th to 3rd or 2nd, or even winning the title? What's the threshold beyond which we hope the team does worse in one season so that another manager that may do better, comes in?

I like the position we are in now but I'm not a fan of the mental gymnastics used to justify the poisonous attitude shared by a lot of fans last season.
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Couldn't have put it better myself. You'd think we already won the league this year. For all we know, we might still fail to achieve our targets. The way people talk about the transfer window, you would be forgiven to forget that it is only the means to an end as opposed to an end itself.
 
Theonas said:
Couldn't have put it better myself. You'd think we already won the league this year. For all we know, we might still fail to achieve our targets. The way people talk about the transfer window, you would be forgiven to forget that it is only the means to an end as opposed to an end itself.
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Yeah we won the transfer window! Where's our trophy?? :lol:

Yes I regret United missed out on the top 4 because it means we are not in the Champions League which is a travesty given the club's standing in the game and history with the competition. As others have said, even if we pipped City to 4th, I think the likelihood is Mourinho would have been brought in anyway.
 
gav81 said:
Yeah we won the transfer window! Where's our trophy?? :lol:

Yes I regret United missed out on the top 4 because it means we are not in the Champions League which is a travesty given the club's standing in the game and history with the competition. As others have said, even if we pipped City to 4th, I think the likelihood is Mourinho would have been brought in anyway.
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Exactly. If we were willing and capable to pay that much for Pogba and Bailly, I don't think we'd have just gone "naah, not interested" if we made it to the CL. I am not sure about Mourinho as Woodward seems to decide his managerial moves with the top 4 as the cut-off but so what? Let's at least wait and if we are indeed playing dominant football and creating a lot of chances while winning football games, then sure, the justification that "whatever happened to get us Mourinho" would at least make sense but as it stands now, we might still have problems producing good winning football. I suppose it's the frustration of the LvG regime mixed in with the usual excitement over summer signings making people a bit overly giddy.
 
Fergus' son said:
Interesting argument. Do you think someone could realistically argue that a team that won the league in one year, with 80 points and scored 80 goals, is in fact inferior to the team that came say 3rd the year after, with say 84 points and 84 goals scored? I'm not personally so sure that they could, and the circumstance could quite conceivably occur.
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No. A team that gets 84 points would generally win the league. No team has ever got 84 points and come 3rd.

If you get 84 points and no league title you've come up against an excellent champion.
 
I regret not being able to have a go at the CL with this great team. However, if we got 4th we'd still have LVG, no DDG, no Zlatan and no Pogba.
 
Top 4 and winning the FA Cup would almost certainly mean Van Gaal would still be in charge as that's seen as a successful season at most clubs and our levels of success have dropped since Sir Alex retired.
 
No. Which is why I was ready to take a defeat or two last season for the greater good. Granted this is hindsight we're talking about and there was no guarantee then that things would turn around, but I think this is often the case at a club like ours - if you've been under-achieving for so long, you will be binned sooner rather than later.
 
Even if we did finish fourth LVG would've gone anyway. I think as soon as Mourinho was free, he was always going to be our manager come summer 2016. If Mourinho never got dismissed at Chelsea, LVG would probably still be here.
 
I can't predict what would've happened if we got top 4. Maybe LVG would've still been fired.

One thing I know is that CL is boring as hell till the quarter finals and sometimes even till the semis. Group stages are hopelessly pointless. So if we don't have a realistic chance of winning it, I couldn't care less if we qualified for it or not.
 
RedCurry said:
I can't predict what would've happened if we got top 4. Maybe LVG would've still been fired.

One thing I know is that CL is boring as hell till the quarter finals and sometimes even till the semis. Group stages are hopelessly pointless. So if we don't have a realistic chance of winning it, I couldn't care less if we qualified for it or not.
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We do have a realistic chance to win whatever.

If we don't, then we should sack on the spot whoever is responsible.

We should feel and we should act like we are the greatest club in the world. Moyes and his mentality is not for us. We are the best in the world. We demand the best.
 
It was leaked that Mourinho was going to be the new manager literally seconds after the FA Cup win. The negotiations with Mourinho had to be already underway for more than a week for the leak to happen so quickly.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
It was leaked that Mourinho was going to be the new manager literally seconds after the FA Cup win. The negotiations with Mourinho had to be already underway for more than a week for the leak to happen so quickly.
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They agreed with Mourinho before Christmas. However, Mourinho never takes over a new team in the middle of the season.
 
Heck, I wouldn't mind being relegated and play in the Championship for a season if it meant we're getting Mourinho, Pogba and Zlatan.
 
nick2004 said:
We do have a realistic chance to win whatever.

If we don't, then we should sack on the spot whoever is responsible.

We should feel and we should act like we are the greatest club in the world. Moyes and his mentality is not for us. We are the best in the world. We demand the best.
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10 on 10 for sentiment but we aren't a team that can win CL. Not yet. But we have an immensely talented squad that is very young. We will have a realistic chance in a year or two I have no doubt. But this year we would have no chance, not even with all the new players.
 
nick2004 said:
They agreed with Mourinho before Christmas. However, Mourinho never takes over a new team in the middle of the season.
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In his latest interview he has confirmed that he was contacted after the FA cup final. Whether or not he was posturing, I will continue to think it is fanciful that he'd be here if LVG didn't qualify for the CL. I still highly doubt LVG would have sacked if he achieves fourth place regardless.
 
tartanbornandred said:
No. A team that gets 84 points would generally win the league. No team has ever got 84 points and come 3rd.

If you get 84 points and no league title you've come up against an excellent champion.
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Make it 60 and 64 points then and choose whatever league positions you want.
 
Yes.

I think LvG would still have got the sack, Jose, Ibra and Pog would still have came. So now, in the 2 seasons before Jose inevitably implodes we'll only get 1 crack at CL rather than 2. Unless he's actually planning on not pissing everyone off and aiming for longevity, in which case I couldn't give a shit. But if we go on and have a storming season and look like we could have done well in CL and we're fighting to avoid relegation the season after next, I'll probably look back and be pissed off.
 
Does anyone actually regret missing out on the top 4?

Yes, especially since we would have ended above City.

No, if it meant keeping van Gaal.

Yes, if we would still get Mourinho and the four players we brought in.

I would love us being in the CL rather than the Europa League(EL). That said I understand we don't have an EL Cup in our trophy room. I expect us to win the EL this year.
 
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