The gay camp
couldn't make it up.Feel like that for a few posts in this thread.
Gay footballers | Czech Republic international Jakub Jankto comes out as gay
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
The gay camp
couldn't make it up.Feel like that for a few posts in this thread.
Funny thing is that if I were asked to do a “Top 5” list of players who could be closet homosexuals, Rakitic would be on that list.
Do you feel the same about racial abuse? I'm sure Raheem Sterling is perfectly comfortable in his skin but still gets bothered when he has abuse thrown at him.
it was rhetorical because I know there are no openly gay footballers in the UK
You can keep changing the point of discussion if you like.
On one hand you want gays to come out for the good of gaykind...
On the other you want them outed on the internet if they don’t do what you want?
There are plenty of openly gay footballers in the uk. I’m sorry if they’re not parading themselves in front of cameras and subjecting themselves to Daily Mail articles for you.
He's Eastern European, though. I don't want to be guilty of generalising, as I'm quite that there are many enlightened Eastern Europeans, but how many times have we seen racism in football in this part of the world? So it's not that surprising to me that he would be bigoted in this way. I just wasn't aware of what he'd said.
He's Swiss, born and raised and moved to Germany in his late teens.
He plays for Croatia due to ancestry and talked shit about gay people because he is a moron.
Oof. Do you accept and understand that there are openly gay footballers in England?
I think I can still see the point off in the distance, over there! You might still be able to get it!
Im struggling to understanding the point of anything youre saying. If there was an openly gay footballer in the Uk, it wouldnt be his choice that he would subject to cameras and daily mail articles, the british cutter press being what they are. So if there are openly gay footballers in the Uk, how is it that you know about them and the daily mail doesnt?
No, hence why I asked you to name one. I don't actually want or need you to name one, I just asked to illustrate the point that if there were openly gay footballers in the UK their names would be known the general public.
As long as these so openly gay footballers don't have their partners cheering them on in the stadium, as long as they don't get married, because they fear the repercussions, they are not open. Being on grindr does not mean they are out. The whole idea that the life they are living is even close to being open about their sexuality, is just ignorant and insulting.
Top of your head;
- How many games did Ipswich win last year?
- Who was the top scorer in League 1?
- Name the starting 11 for Yeovil
99% of football fans seem to think the league begins and ends with the top 20.
There are footballers in the UK, openly Gay. The fact that you don’t know who they are simply means you don’t have the information.
If people are taking ‘Openly Gay’ to mean “Earning more than £100,000 a week, famous, gay and celebrating it”.... that’s a monumentally different set of criteria.
It is naive because abuse can come from people who you may find quite intimidating. This can be homosexual abuse, sexist abuse, racist abuse or whatever.
You could have just said "I dont know". It would have been less to read. I know of Liam Davis who was labelled "Englands only openly gay footballer" in 2017. So, without all the bullshit, how is it that you know what the gutter press doesnt?
I'm guessing most are referring to professional footballers, and as far as I'm aware, there are no openly gay professional footballers in England.
Excellent. Casual isms, even unintended, are so harmful to those on the receiving end. I can't imagine how tough it would be to come out in the macho pro footy world.
This is an ignorant post. It is an issue because many people who are gay face this very real struggle on a daily basis. You have no right to project how gay people should react.
The whole "if I'm comfortable then it shouldn't bother me" argument is nonsense. Should black people also be asked to brush off racism, "if they're comfortable in their skin"?
Bigotry, ignorance and hate in all forms should be denounced.
Ridiculous post. Thats like saying black people shouldn’t care about being racially abused if they didn’t care that they were black.
There’s some worryingly unintelligent views littered all over the place in this thread.
I suppose that's a fair comment! I'm not an expert on Rakitic's background, I just assumed he was Croatian.
Yeah, but you kind of made a very non-enlightened comment about the situation, which is ironic because of what you are accusing us of. A lot of people that like to talk and bash our region have absolutely no idea of its' history.
I think what a lot of people who hold the view of "just live your life as a gay person, don't announce it" are missing, is that just living your life as a gay person IS coming out. Constantly. Every day, and it's fecking exhausting. As a gay woman I'm forever making small calculations in my mind as to whether I'm going to use "her" or "them" to refer to my girlfriend, for example, or whether I'm going to hold her hand in public given the environment. I'm still having to make the decision whether or not to "come out" in these ways, just as I would have to make that same decision when making a formal announcement. All that is different is the scale that one chooses.
HOWEVER, that's only true for a nobody like me. For someone in the public eye, this doesn't hold. For example, Kelley O'Hara, recent winner of the Women's World Cup, who has never publicly stated her sexuality and has always been very very private on social media, kissed her girlfriend in the stands after winning the final. That one moment was photographed, and now if you google her name, the first link (after her wikipedia, twitter, and instagram) is about her kissing her girlfriend, and the 3rd image on google images is of that photo as well. Just "living her life as a LGBTQ person" ended up being no different in end result to Megan Rapinoe's more forward style. So if someone wants to control their own coming out and their own narrative, who are we to judge?
HOWEVER, that's only true for a nobody like me. For someone in the public eye, this doesn't hold. For example, Kelley O'Hara, recent winner of the Women's World Cup, who has never publicly stated her sexuality and has always been very very private on social media, kissed her girlfriend in the stands after winning the final. That one moment was photographed, and now if you google her name, the first link (after her wikipedia, twitter, and instagram) is about her kissing her girlfriend, and the 3rd image on google images is of that photo as well. Just "living her life as a LGBTQ person" ended up being no different in end result to Megan Rapinoe's more forward style. So if someone wants to control their own coming out and their own narrative, who are we to judge?
What are you on about? We said there are not any openly gay footballers because they are scared. You said there are but they hide it. So how is that open?
In the same way that 'kick it out' etc have had an impact on racism in the game, it seems obvious that a gay players association (e.g. the IGLFA) running a similar campaign, could be the way to go. If we had a number of players signing up or publicising at the same time, it might reduce some of the stigma compared to the focus that would be on the first player to come out as an individual. Similarly, in the same way that all players will get themselves involved in anti-racist campaigns, the PL (for example) should organise an anti-homophobia campaign. Not a solution in itself I know (and I'm aware of opinion that these campaigns pay mere lip service to the larger issue), but it would at least get the ball rolling.
Great post.
I don’t think players are afraid to come out because they’re scared of abuse. This is football and the sad reality is players being abused by supporters is part of the job regardless of race, religion or sexual orientation, no one is spared. It’s the same in other sports as well. I’ve sat in stands for Premier League, NBA, NFL and WWE and there’s always that small group
of people who are going to be abusive. Particularly with social media where you have access to these players like never before, these people have another avenue besides the stadium to spit their venom.
The other thing I always wondered is how many players are actually gay? It seems an obsession for a player to come out but what if they’re not actually gay? When boys get into sports seriously there’s usually 2 motivating factors: the lure of potentially earning millions and the other is the girls. I played American football in Canadian winters and a large reason why I put up with the pain and blistering cold was the access it gave me to girls and parties.
If there is any reason players might not come out is because they don’t want the constant attention it brings them or maybe they’re uncomfortable being different when everyone else in the locker room is boasting about models. To put it on Neanderthal fan abuse is wrong. Fellaini, Ronaldo, Beckham and a host of others have received vile abuse from supporters. It’s how it was and how it always will be.
of people who are going to be abusive. Particularly with social media where you have access to these players like never before, these people have another avenue besides the stadium to spit their venom.
The other thing I always wondered is how many players are actually gay? It seems an obsession for a player to come out but what if they’re not actually gay? When boys get into sports seriously there’s usually 2 motivating factors: the lure of potentially earning millions and the other is the girls. I played American football in Canadian winters and a large reason why I put up with the pain and blistering cold was the access it gave me to girls and parties.
If there is any reason players might not come out is because they don’t want the constant attention it brings them or maybe they’re uncomfortable being different when everyone else in the locker room is boasting about models. To put it on Neanderthal fan abuse is wrong. Fellaini, Ronaldo, Beckham and a host of others have received vile abuse from supporters. It’s how it was and how it always will be.
Genuinely can not be bothered - everything you raise has been answered and explained calmly in this thread already and yet you still bang on about shock value and the gay camp. Next you’ll be telling a story about your gay mate, your homophobia may primarily passive rather than overtly aggressive, but it’s homophobia all the same.
Good luck getting the rainbows out of your throat.
EDIT you couldn’t make this up, I’ve just read on through the thread and yes there’s the story about your gay mate who came out in a way you didn’t approve of. You’re so fecking predictable all you passive homophobes.
I call a spade a spade. It generally tends to work for me in my experience.
You’re also a brainless homophobe. The world would be a better place without your ilk.
I think that is likely to be utter bullshit because you obviously can't imagine what it is like to be targeted as part of a long tormented minority.
It is good that you are against homophobia but I think you need to review you use of race based language
He's luckier than he knows @Wibble
I don't see any logic in thinking more successful players are less likely to be gay. I would say there are some members of the press that are aware of some gay players at the top level but they would never report it as it would be career suicide as well as being morally abhorrent. Media outing somebody as gay would unquestionably strike a chord of it being something to be ashamed of kind of in a "he's one" kind of thing, and it's nothing of the sort.
The same goes for teammates.
Doesn't matter if you're a part of a minority or majority, being abused over something you have no control over, sexuality or skin colour will hurt. Anyone who says otherwise is lying.
great post.
I actually think that route (O'Hara) is probably the best to take. Rather than being made to feel like an announcement has to be made, if a footballer chose to come out as gay I think the best way to do it would be to just live life, hold their boyfriend's hand while shopping, kiss them in public getting out of or into a car etc just normal things all couples do. Doing normal things and just being seen doing them is the best way to normalise it in other people's eyes, in some eyes it doesn't even need normalising. In doing so, the front foot/upper hand whatever you want to call it is being taken and one thing bigotts don't like is being put on the back foot. Most bigotts retreat or go into their shell when confronted in my experience. They like being the ones to offer their opinion and being the aggressor, the best route is to take that away from them.
Maybe a good way to see this as wrong is to "fix" your post wby changing just a few words and see how it reads....
I know there are differences between racism and homophobia - but maybe this is a way of open ing people eyes to show that these opinions are not OK