Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
feck Israel and feck any supporters of their sick, genocidal policy
At what point do we expect to see some diminishing returns over holding Hamas culpable for absolutely anything and everything, namely the scale of killing and devastation inflicted by Israel? Its surely getting ridiculous at this point hearing virtue-signalling Politicians and Israeli apologists caveating with the whole 'Oh I don't like seeing dead babies or parents desperately searching for their kids in rubble, but Hamas brought this on'. How far do they intend to stretch that line of reasoning - when we reach 30,000 dead? 50,000? When Gaza is reduced to nothing but ash and cinder?
Its the cold and complete lack of empathy which I find most disturbing. We watch our politicians literally sobbing on their podiums when describing the plight of the Ukrainians, as well as the Israeli hostages being separated from their families, but when the topic shifts to the Palestinian casualties its merely demoted to a series of statistics and a quick condemnation of Hamas as an almost necessary prelude to any consideration of the Palestinian suffering.
I want to see Hamas gone, not just because of who they are and what their heinous objectives and methods involve, but also so I can see what creative means Israel and its apologists conjure up to justify the ongoing oppression and murder of the Palestinian people without the convenient Hamas scapegoat they use to absolve them of the crimes and atrocities they will inevitably continue to commit.
Its the cold and complete lack of empathy which I find most disturbing. We watch our politicians literally sobbing on their podiums when describing the plight of the Ukrainians, as well as the Israeli hostages being separated from their families, but when the topic shifts to the Palestinian casualties its merely demoted to a series of statistics and a quick condemnation of Hamas as an almost necessary prelude to any consideration of the Palestinian suffering.
I want to see Hamas gone, not just because of who they are and what their heinous objectives and methods involve, but also so I can see what creative means Israel and its apologists conjure up to justify the ongoing oppression and murder of the Palestinian people without the convenient Hamas scapegoat they use to absolve them of the crimes and atrocities they will inevitably continue to commit.
Its a sad state of affairs. Politicians, particularly in the US and Europe, are constrained by being perceived as either on the side of Israel (their ally) or Hamas; so when they see massive casualties on the Palestinian side, they are not likely to view them on equal terms to Israeli casualties on 10-7. Another issue is that among western politicians, the war is largely being framed through the lens of Israeli interests, which is mainly down to the fact that the Palestinian side don't have a very good media ground game in western countries.
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The above quotes are from 3 people in this thread on this one page calling what the Israeli's are doing genocide.
Here is the definition of genocide.
Genocide: The systematic and widespread extermination or attempted extermination of a national, racial, religious, or ethnic group.
The situation in Gaza is horrible. But it is NOT a genocide. Since, 1967 when the Israeli's first gained control of Gaza the population of the territory has more than doubled. Population numbers do not increase during a genocide.
There are many adjectives that can accurately describe the violence, destruction and death currently being inflicted on Gaza. But, genocide is not one of them. Repeatedly calling it that diminishes the suffering of the Tutsi's, the European Jewish population of Nazi occupied Europe, the Armenians and others who have genuinely been victims of genocide.
Yeah I'm calling bullshit on that
No it doesn't.
It diminishes the idea that Israel are the innocent party, and it diminishes the idea that Israels allies are also a peace loving, fair and honest, bunch.
This is such a tone-deaf thing to post when Armenians are being threatened by Israeli settlers in Jerusalem.
This is the definition under the Genocide Convention:
Genocide Convention said:
Only one of the above conditions needs to be satisfied. I don't think the situation quite reaches the threshold of any one of them at present, but for me the scale of its bombing campaign, forced evictions and dire limiting of life's essentials means Israel is getting increasingly close to fulfilling condition (c).
It's a few days old but the videos of hostages leaving Hamas is quite surreal.
feck it, just throw more petrol on the fire.
It really doesn’t. There’s nothing to support this claim it’s just something you’ve made up.
it's genocide and it's fecking abhorrent.
John Bolton, the former Republican US national security adviser, has proposed to the UK’s foreign affairs select committee that the Gaza Strip be split into two territories, with Gaza north of the Wadi Gaza river administered by Israel and an area to the south run by Egypt.
Bolton added that he would abolish the UN relief works agency UNRWA, which he said had “developed an institutional culture of sustaining the refugee status of Palestinians”.
Bolton’s proposal would involve large numbers of Palestinians leaving Gaza permanently.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...s-killed-israel-ground-attack-gaza-strip-news
Bolton added that he would abolish the UN relief works agency UNRWA, which he said had “developed an institutional culture of sustaining the refugee status of Palestinians”.
Bolton’s proposal would involve large numbers of Palestinians leaving Gaza permanently.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...s-killed-israel-ground-attack-gaza-strip-news
Please let's discuss some more though about the subtle legal intricacies of genocide or how we're disrespecting the memory of Tutsis while people in power actively talk about forcible population removal and ethnic cleansing and pretend that it's actually out of the goodness of their heart.
Can't wait until the Palestinians have genuinely been through a genocide though or (another round of) ethnic cleansing to finally cleanse them from the land so we can add them to the list with Armenians and Jews as an example In abstract Internet discussions in 50 years time, to provide a veneer of respectability to whatever people are undergoing it then.
You're getting ahead of yourself thinking that it will be considered a genocide in 50 years
Please let's discuss some more though about the subtle legal intricacies of genocide or how we're disrespecting the memory of Tutsis while people in power actively talk about forcible population removal and ethnic cleansing and pretend that it's actually out of the goodness of their heart.
Can't wait until the Palestinians have genuinely been through a genocide though or (another round of) ethnic cleansing to finally cleanse them from the land so we can add them to the list with Armenians and Jews as an example In abstract Internet discussions in 50 years time, to provide a veneer of respectability to whatever people are undergoing it then.
Oh poor things...they are reluctant! The highest moral value, reluctance to participate in genocide and then do it anyway!
"One of the most common tropes in US media is that the US military always goes to war reluctantly—and, if there are negative consequences, like civilian deaths, it’s simply a matter of bumbling around without much plan or purpose." FAIR.
Even by this definition, it would only be genocide if one of the above conditions as well as the opening clause that it is done with the intent to destroy the target group were met. The Israeli's likely have the ability to commit genocide if they chose to but they haven't.
There are lots of nasty words people can use to describe what the Israeli's are doing. Genocide is not one of them.
Fab. So first BDS is legislated as illegal and now this. Soon they'll legislate to ban the Palestinian flag as a hate symbol.
The same right wing bulwarks of free speech and small government once again at it with the consistency.
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So what is their intent when they drop tons of bombs over heavily populated areas? It seems pretty obvious it's to kill palestinians.
So I guess we will have to wait till is considered a genocide. When is all done and wrapped up....Oh well! now is genocide! but is too late. Move on
Killing is certainly an appropriate adjective to use. Genocide is not.
Then all good. go on
5 Palestinians have been killed in the West Bank today, death toll is up to 467 since the beginning of the year.
You are saying that jewish people aren’t indigenous to the historic entity called Israel, or that they are but it doesn’t count? Of course if they were it would certainly explain their fondness for seeking safety in that specific part of the world. But hey, “colonialism”. Just like “genocide” - funny how words get weighted with new meaning when Jews are involved.
Not sure what that is about, I was too busy wading through all the criticism of that propaganda you stupidly posted, to notice.
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"Not a genocide".
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Pretty harrowing stuff.
How is colonialism and genocide weighted with new meaning when Jews are involved?
Those Israeli officials are taking the western leaders to the cleaners.
They are leveling the city. Only donkeys or ethnic cleansing apologists do not understand what is the objective of leveling the city.