The shadow cabinet have decided to abstain (against party policy).
Jeremy Corbyn - Not Not Labour Party(?), not a Communist (BBC)
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The shadow cabinet have decided to abstain (against party policy).
what is current policy? - the manifesto said renewal, but didn't Corbyn say its a matter of conscience therefore a free vote?
though presumably Corbyn will vote against and therefore against policy (or at least the manifesto they were elected on and as yet there has been no new "official" policy) - that said its probably the lesser of two evils for him as he will be damned even more if he votes against his stated beliefs anyway hopefully the mess will be enough to get lots of more moderate potential labour voters to see what a liability he is and then they can pay their £25 tomorrow to boot him out.
Though I doubt it and it will be just another factor in the inevitable split of the party
Pretty much. Both sides have made an absolute mess of this, and anyone who wants an electable alternative to the Tories should be disappointed and frustrated by both wings of the party.
It's the equivalent of the Tea Party in the US. Threatening or actually forcing primaries for anyone who isn't ideologically pure enough for the most extreme. Instead of RINOs, they just call them "Red Tories" or "Tory Lites." It's a major part of why our Congress is so dysfunctional.
Its bad enough when the media are gunning against the leader as they have always done in recent times "oh look he cant eat a bacon sandwich". Adding voices within the party to that and no one stands a chance. The public are very easily influenced by such headlines but then of course they knew that.
Im starting to become defeated by it all. Think ill vote Smith just so we dont have to listen to the backstabbers within the party constantly moan. Although it sounds like some on the right of the party wont even be happy with him so we'll see.
It actually makes sense for Labour, though. The party is ideologically split, so deselections wouldn't be a bad thing, considering an actual split is on the way. The deselected candidates can run as part of the new-new-new Labour, or whatever they call themselves. They might even win (probably).
Another detailing of how he behaves as leader by a former shadow cabinet member - http://www.liliangreenwood.co.uk/lilian_s_speech_to_nottingham_south_labour_party_members
Embarrassing shambles from Corbyn waffling on in the commons at the moment. He is a pillock....doesn't seem to understand what his own party policy is. Thank god his MP's do.
Corbyn getting it from his back stabbers.
Can't believe the £25 voting fee isn't getting the backlash it deserves. Its clearly a engineered means to stop students and low income voters (ie those most inclined to vote Corbyn) from voting.
The Labour Party in its current state seems completely resentful towards democracy.
The Labour Party in its current state seems completely resentful towards democracy.
I thought there were hustings today? Are we not going to get an announcement from that?
Tory scumbag pretending that there's a fecking difference between the submarines and the nuclear weapons that go into them.
It's disgraceful, but most on here won't care as they're blinded by their hatred for Corbyn.
So to disarm we have to waste billions of pounds increase our nuclear arsenal.
Another Tory revising history. Churchill wanted to use gas before the Germans. It's a documented fecking fact. One of his staff members had to tell him it was out of the question.
Yeah....how dare they tell Comrade Corbyn the actual Labour Party Policy.Why won't they say how much this will cost.
Austerity, we're all in this together, etc.
Because they're worried people will then ask how it can be justified while people rely on foodbanks and others die because they can't afford the electricity to keep their insulin refrigerated. But you know, Corbyn and... stuff. Look at Corbyn.
There were, both Smith and Eagle did well apparently and it's looking closer than it had done prior (Smith was previously expected to be clear frontrunner of the two). Think Yvette has proposed a ballot to measure support and that should happen within the next day.
Website to sign up as a supporter for Labour is down 
Ta mate.
I don't understand why this isn't the headline anti-argument - how can they get away with not even releasing an estimate?
Well some Tory as given a figure of 179billion
Didn't May cite the costs in her speech?
Well said.
Does that include ensuring the telephone bill has been paid, should they need to ring America to get permission to fire them?Well some Tory as given a figure of 179billion
Imagine the amount of job cuts that amount of money requires, alternatively could invest in Nuclear energy and then there'd be no need for fracking...
Fear mongering now.
John Woodcock drama queen.
Why does it cost so much? And why does it need renewed? Are the ones we've got going rusty or something?
The subs, like other ships, have a limited working lifespan. It's the subs that are getting replaced, not the weapons.
Richard Benyon saying that people need nukes in case of 9/11, etc. Yeah, sure. Idiot.
We need Trident because Iraq has the ability to deliver chemical and biological weapons within 45 minutes...oh no sorry that was something else, my bad.
Fallon said: "Together the four new boats will cost around £31bn, spread over 35 years. That’s around 20 pence in every £100 that the government spends. The replacement Trident will see us through the 2020's, 30's, 40's, and 50's.
There are reasons to oppose new submarines, but cost isn't one of them. The same amount spent on conventional weapons would have very limited deterrence value in comparison.
Manufacturing is about the only reason I can think of for renewing Trident. It makes sense on no other logical level, except in the minds of scarlet majors.
It varies on who you ask . IMF say £167bn in total, CND say £205bn , The RSUI say 70 to 80bn . All in all it's a lot of money that could be spent else where.
Thomas Tugendhat was sensible on Question Time. Turns out he's actually a moron. Pity.
Thats just the build cost, running costs add another 130bn
Before you attack me I'm in favour, but to pretend it doesn't cost a fortune is daft
Good.