Jeremy Corbyn - Not Not Labour Party(?), not a Communist (BBC)

Cascarino said:
He’s probably alluding to the territorial disputes and that Corbyn by saying he stands with the people of Kashmir he’s somehow saying it’s not part of India. He’s taking offence at things that weren’t there.
Click to expand...
Charlie Foley said:
So is it you can’t give an explanation to someone who asks a genuine question or you just don’t want to?
Click to expand...

I apologize for being snarky in my previous post. It wasn't my intention but I'm getting Kashmir overload everywhere. I'd say it's not a trivial topic and I would actively advice against you taking any explanation you find here (Especially people like @Zlatattack @VidaRed or myself because we tend to be partial)

My point about Corbyn is it is a self inflicted own goal. He had no reason to put that tweet there, especially one that is painfully vague. As UK's leader of opposition and a person with some responsibility for international relations, the tweet is beyond stupid. It does nothing to either address the historical issues around Kashmir or address the immediate tragedy which is a crime against the Indian army. It further gives ammunition to his detractors that he's soft on terrorism, especially from certain religious groups.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
To be fair, it is quite a good example of Corbyn's tendency to stick his foot in it. It's not as though he tweets about every act of terrorism, anywhere in the world. So it is depressingly typical that when he does stick his head above the parapet he ends up pissing a bunch of people off. I know nothing about the sensitivies here but someone with Corbyn's aspirations certainly should. And it's better to say nothing at all than wade into an obviously contentious issue like this with an ambiguously worded tweet, surely?
Click to expand...

What I wanted to say essentially.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Went back through his tweets since the beginning of this month. It's the only tweet regarding terrorism. Quick google reveals at least one other terrorist massacre this month. Then you have the language he used. Specifically avoiding any use of the word "terrorism" and how he stands with the "people of Kashmir" (in a region that a number of countries claim sovereignty over) when the people who died were all Indian citizens. As you can see in the various threads on redcafe this is a seriously contentious issue, which triggers strong emotions in people of Indian or Pakistani descent (i.e. a decent chunk of the UK electorate)

Bearing in mind the Labour party is currently already in the process of tearing itself apart; his decision to tweet about this incident, in the way that he did, is another great example of his uncanny knack for creating divisiveness when unity is needed, now more than ever. What you want from an opposition Labour leader is someone who can heal divisions and bring all the party members together to rally round and oust the Tories. Time and time again, Corbyn fails the basics of this job description.
Click to expand...

Interesting post, I agree with a lot of it, I’ll post my full thoughts when I’m back from work mate.

harshad said:
I think you are trivialising the incident by saying it's just violence. The same thing that Corbyn did in that tweet of his.
Click to expand...

It’s not my intention to trivialise anything, what happened in Kashmir and is happening is heartbreaking.

fishfingers15 said:
I apologize for being snarky in my previous post. It wasn't my intention but I'm getting Kashmir overload everywhere. I'd say it's not a trivial topic and I would actively advice against you taking any explanation you find here (Especially people like @Zlatattack @VidaRed or myself because we tend to be partial)

My point about Corbyn is it is a self inflicted own goal. He had no reason to put that tweet there, especially one that is painfully vague. As UK's leader of opposition and a person with some responsibility for international relations, the tweet is beyond stupid. It does nothing to either address the historical issues around Kashmir or address the immediate tragedy which is a crime against the Indian army. It further gives ammunition to his detractors that he's soft on terrorism, especially from certain religious groups.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the reply, I can understand where you’re coming from regarding the tweet, I guess what I saw as being vague in order to appease all parties, can also be easily seen as inflammatory/insulting by others, especially given Corbyn’s history.
 
fishfingers15 said:
As Zlatattack has pointed out, it's a heavily biased version of events. Unfortunately, my version will also be heavily biased.
Click to expand...
Fair enough! My initial question was not a challenge of your position and I’m sure it is an emotional one...I was just curious why you thought what you thought. I like to ask people from the region involved their views, even if they are biased it is useful to understand what it is they believe
 
Cascarino said:
Interesting post, I agree with a lot of it, I’ll post my full thoughts when I’m back from work mate.



It’s not my intention to trivialise anything, what happened in Kashmir and is happening is heartbreaking.



Thank you for the reply, I can understand where you’re coming from regarding the tweet, I guess what I saw as being vague in order to appease all parties, can also be easily seen as inflammatory/insulting by others, especially given Corbyn’s history.
Click to expand...

I'll just say that he isn't appeasing all parties with that tweet for obvious reasons. Unwanted attention too, he could have let that slide and no one would have noticed with all the Brexit noise.
 
fishfingers15 said:
I'll just say that he isn't appeasing all parties with that tweet for obvious reasons. Unwanted attention too, he could have let that slide and no one would have noticed with all the Brexit noise.
Click to expand...

Out of interest, if you were in his position and wanted to convey sympathies, what would you have written? (Ignore that he could have said nothing)
 
Cascarino said:
Out of interest, if you were in his position and wanted to convey sympathies, what would you have written? (Ignore that he could have said nothing)
Click to expand...

Not sure why silence is not an option, but if I had to write something, I thought of this in a couple of minutes without any PR delegation.

"I condemn the cowardly terrorist attack in Kashmir. Our hearts go out to the families of the bereaved. I call for an immediate de-escalation of violence and urge all parties to redouble their efforts for a long standing resolution through negotiations"
 
fishfingers15 said:
Not sure why silence is not an option, but if I had to write something, I thought of this in a couple of minutes without any PR delegation.

"I condemn the cowardly terrorist attack in Kashmir. Our hearts go out to the families of the bereaved. I call for an immediate de-escalation of violence and urge all parties to redouble their efforts for a long standing resolution through negotiations"
Click to expand...

I like it, reads better than his anyway. Going from that, am I right to assume your main problems with the original tweet (again ignoring that he could have chosen to say nothing) was that he didn’t specify it was terrorist related violence, the I stand with the people of Kashmir remark and his mention of British government playing a role in a possible resolution?
 
jeff_goldblum said:
I fear this thread might be suffering some overspill from the closure of the India thread
Click to expand...

There's a Kashmir thread wide open if anybody wants to move the discussion in there? Might not stay open long though.
 
7 blairites have left the party. If this isn't the best news I've heard in ages i don't know what is.

Goodbye and good riddence.
 
fishfingers15 said:


What is this then, Jeremy? How does he keep making unforced errors like this to give further ammunition to his haters? A simple google search could tell him that the people killed were soldiers from different parts of India and it's not violence that killed these people but a terrorist attack. What does he mean he stands with the people of Kashmir, it's a part of India ffs..

Utter buffoonery.
Click to expand...

I don't remember a terrorist attack that didn't involve violence to be honest.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Went back through his tweets since the beginning of this month. It's the only tweet regarding terrorism. Quick google reveals at least one other terrorist massacre this month. Then you have the language he used. Specifically avoiding any use of the word "terrorism" and how he stands with the "people of Kashmir" (in a region that a number of countries claim sovereignty over) when the people who died were all Indian citizens. As you can see in the various threads on redcafe this is a seriously contentious issue, which triggers strong emotions in people of Indian or Pakistani descent (i.e. a decent chunk of the UK electorate)

Bearing in mind the Labour party is currently already in the process of tearing itself apart; his decision to tweet about this incident, in the way that he did, is another great example of his uncanny knack for creating divisiveness when unity is needed, now more than ever. What you want from an opposition Labour leader is someone who can heal divisions and bring all the party members together to rally round and oust the Tories. Time and time again, Corbyn fails the basics of this job description.
Click to expand...

I said I’d get back to you with my full thoughts but it doesn’t really boil down to much, I basically agree with everything you said regarding Corbyn, but I was viewing the tweet in isolation and those offended, rather than if someone in Corbyn’s position should be tweeting that.

Like you said it’s a contentious issue for many but I think those offended by that tweet are being overly sensitive (though I have no problem with people thinking it’s a stupid tweet). I agree that he should have mentioned terrorism rather than violence (and think had he done this there’d be less anger) but disagree with your view about his ‘I stand with the people of Kashmir’ remark. I think he’s referring to the situation as a whole rather than just this specific incident, the people of Kashmir have been suffering and what’s happening there is a travesty. Like you said a number of countries are claiming sovereignty so by ‘standing with the people of Kashmir’ remark he bypasses having to support any one nation.

I know a few have complained about this conversation not really belonging in the Corbyn thread but I thought this belonged here as it’s regarding a Corbyn tweet, anymore regarding Kashmir and I will switch thread.
 
The avengers is the greatest crossover i-

1k3da34kknh21.jpg
 
Cascarino said:
I said I’d get back to you with my full thoughts but it doesn’t really boil down to much, I basically agree with everything you said regarding Corbyn, but I was viewing the tweet in isolation and those offended, rather than if someone in Corbyn’s position should be tweeting that.

Like you said it’s a contentious issue for many but I think those offended by that tweet are being overly sensitive (though I have no problem with people thinking it’s a stupid tweet). I agree that he should have mentioned terrorism rather than violence (and think had he done this there’d be less anger) but disagree with your view about his ‘I stand with the people of Kashmir’ remark. I think he’s referring to the situation as a whole rather than just this specific incident, the people of Kashmir have been suffering and what’s happening there is a travesty. Like you said a number of countries are claiming sovereignty so by ‘standing with the people of Kashmir’ remark he bypasses having to support any one nation.

I know a few have complained about this conversation not really belonging in the Corbyn thread but I thought this belonged here as it’s regarding a Corbyn tweet, anymore regarding Kashmir and I will switch thread.
Click to expand...

You know what? I'm probably being a little unfair. I'm just so pissed off with the inept (or, arguably, devious/selfish) way Corbyn has handled the Brexit referendum, from day one, I'm inclined to jump down his throat at any opportunity. So it's definitely possible I'm reading far too much into an innocuous tweet.
 
sun_tzu said:
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/deputy-leader-tom-watson-says-15857976

"Racist bullies drove Luciana Berger out of the labour party"
That's the quote from Tom Watson the deputy leader
Surely jez either has to say he's wrong and sack him... Or admit he's right and sort it out
Over to you jezbollah
Click to expand...
He said: "I have been a member of the Labour Party since I was 15 years old. I love it as an institution. "But I did say there are aspects of it that I don't recognise any more. The harshness, the brutality, the bullying. Yes, it's small numbers of people. We're a half million strong party. And the vast majority of those members are enthusiastic, they just want to live in a fairer country. That's why I joined all those years ago. But there are some new members, a tiny number, that I think are harsh and bullying in their ways. I felt shamed when Luciana Berger felt she had to leave. She was driven out by racist bullies. And that's completely unacceptable in any liberal democracy.

But I still think that the Labour Party is the century-old vehicle that can change lives and give voice to ordinary working people whose voices are not heard by the powerful."
Click to expand...

Mr Corbyn responded to the resignations by saying on Tuesday: "I hope they recognise that they were elected to Parliament on a manifesto that was based around investment in the future, was based around a more equal and fairer society and based around social justice.

"They were elected to carry out those policies, they decided to go somewhere else and I regret that because I want our party to be strong, I want our party to be united around the policies that we have put forward."
Click to expand...

One of these statements comes from from a man who sounds capable of rallying Labour together, despite these recent departees. That man is not Jeremy Corbyn.
 
With all due respect guys you're coming here gunning without much background i assume?

The story of her CLP has already been publically discussed in recent weeks this isn't news. A few members posted stuff on Facebook and they're under investigation, I'm not sure what else you expect to happen?
 
Watson and now Gardiner apologising for the lack of action on antisemitism. There seems to be a distancing from Corbyn going on by some heavyweights
 


Grandpa Simpson gif.

(Much obliged Damo)
 
Last edited:
711 said:
Local telly says it's because of a tweet in 2012. Must have been a pretty bad one for action to be taken so fast.
Click to expand...
It was, quite predictably, about jews.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.