I don't understand the logic that says you should provide your enemy with power, food and water.
They are your sworn enemy who has just carried out attacks on your people killing many hundreds of them and doing unspeakable things to them.
Keir Starmer Labour Leader
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I don't understand the logic that says you should provide your enemy with power, food and water.
They are your sworn enemy who has just carried out attacks on your people killing many hundreds of them and doing unspeakable things to them.
The leader of one of the two major parties in the UK comes out in support of war crimes, and you try to deflect. Meanwhile, if a student says something, you're on their case:
I'm genuinely shocked that you would post this. Do you really not understand?
It's morals not logic.
fecking hell.
Welcome to the Starmer Party 'Future Candidates Programme'.
And why would you (Netanyahu in this case) consider those kids to be your enemies, may I ask?
Feck me, there's shit takes then there's shit takes. This is psychopathic.
Take a step back. Gaza is essentially an open air prison due to Israeli policy. Beyond that, elements within the Israeli state have promoted Hamas so as to split the two parts of (what is left of) Palestine and kill any realistic chance of peace talks. The slaughter at the weekend was indefensible but those hundreds of terrorists do not equate to the entire population of Gaza, nor do imposing medieval siege tactics by a “western” state against 2 million people represent an appropriate response to those killings.
Awful person and politician.
This is such a insane position. The party is pretty much supporting a war crimes.
So in this case you would be happy to provide your enemy with power, food and water while they continue to fire rockets into your country and hold your people hostage?
Which kids?
Around 2 million people live there. Half of them are 18 or younger. Those kids.
At last. A sensible response which I welcome and do understand.
Taking a further step back.
During WW2, would Britain have been expected to provide Nazi Germany with power, water and food while it was bombing Britain day and night killing innocent civilians.
Because if you think so, that is the question Israelis would ask.
And that is not hypothetical.
That is exactly what the Israeli Ambassador asked on channel 4 news.
Log off @Buster15. This is an Onana-like performance from you.
Are you suggesting the entire Palestinian population in Gaza is part of HAMAS?
Of course not.
But unfortunately, when you are at war, you are at war with that whole country.
Israel will turn back on the power and will provide safe routes for essential aid. But not while Hamas is holding its people hostage.
So I am not permitted to express my views according to you?
It was advice. You're free to ignore it and keep digging that hole.
I know you're 105, but this some medieval shit.
Easy for you to say that when it is not you or your family this is being killed by rocket attack. Or who has been taken hostage.
Put yourself in the position of someone who is and still say that.
Ignored.
I'm half expecting Israel to fling the decomposing bodies of dead Hamas into Gaza using trebuchets, in order to spread disease, and for people to queue up to say that, if it was good enough for Attila the Hun, then Israel has the right to do the same.
These events really just expose how morally bereft most people are, and that when it gets down to it, there has been feck all mental evolution in the last 500 years.
Because not every Palestinian is a terrorist
What feckin country? Gaza is a tiny and densely populated strip of land where the average age is 18. The people there trapped in there with no means to escape, they have no military, and are extremely reliant on the aid of charities to provide for their basic needs, and you're talking about cutting off all food, water, medicine and electricity to them. That's not an act of war, its sheer and utter cruelty. The children of Gaza are not the ones firing rockets at Israelis.
You know that do you?
And hopefully Israel will take out those terrorists.
Know what? What have I said there thats contentious or lacks objectivity?
I've been a Labour voter my entire adult life, but he's lost me as a voter after the last couple of days.
The other thing to note is - most UK based Muslim voters vote Labour because of their position on Palestine. That's something like 2-3m votes he'll be potentially losing.
The other thing to note is - most UK based Muslim voters vote Labour because of their position on Palestine. That's something like 2-3m votes he'll be potentially losing.
There are lot's of figures bandied about, but according to the UN, 40% of Gaza's population is 15 or under, maybe some of the older ones have be encouraged to join Hamas many I imagine haven't. But cutting of all fuel, water and food is inhumane in any circumstance. Think of new borns in incubators, people in hospitals, kids trying to study for school.
Gaza is approximately the size of the Isle of White, but with a population of 2.3 million, no one can leave, they are trapped and when Israel told them to leave through the one open route to Egypt, they then bombed it three times in following 24 hours.
In my mind there can be no moral or ethical reason to punish (to the extreme), the entire population and put all their lives at risk. Maybe if they hadn't been so hard on Gaza in the first place Hamas wouldn't have had so much support.
The attack on Israel was, in any right minded person's opinion, horrifying but the response is worse, which is exactly what Hamas and Iran are after.
Yes but dropping concrete buildings on sleeping families is not the answer, or denying medical aid and water.
please don’t misunderstand me, I was repulsed by what happened in Israel, again innocent people being made targets and I somewhat understand the emotional response by them. But the government of both sides need to earn their dues now, not for innocent people to continue to pay the price for governments unable to reach agreements or even talk to each other or renege on deals
It makes sense when you're a country whose existence is under threat. If let's say Germany attacked us again you would absolutely expect us to destroy everything and anything we could to defend ourselves. Israel see themselves as under threat. Whether they are is another question. No doubt Hamas wants to eradicate them, but this is a virtual Western nation vs little more than sticks and stones.
What should he be saying?
"War crimes are bad" would be a start.
It's easy for me to say what Buster? That I'm surprised that a poster who I certainly don't always agree with but who I would generally characterise as a well meaning person who attempts to post in a considered manner would post what you did?
I made no comment on the feelings of the Israeli people but rather on my surprise given the position you took which is that you apparently don't understand what people might have an issue with regarding the entire Gaza strip and it's population being deprived of basic amenities for life and left trapped to suffer and, in many cases, die. I struggle to believe that you don't understand, although you posting in this thread that the positions of Israel and Gaza are in anyway analogous to Germany and our Islands in the Second World War perhaps suggests that, improbable though it seems, maybe you don't.
Am I to not be shocked that you seem to consider the Geneva convention to be inappropriate, or that you don't understand the unique nature of Gaza and the fact that it is in the position in the first place to have it's utilities completing knocked out, and all escape routes blocked, by an encircling state is somewhat egregious? If you follow the logic of your initial post and subsequent replies, it's hard not to conclude, leaving aside the very particular aspects of Gaza and this whole long running horror show of a situation, that you think targeting civilian populations is acceptable and that is, as I said in my reply, genuinely shocking to me. I can't believe it and can only assume, and hope, that your emotions are running high due to the terrible current events.
Me too, I have been prepared to put up with a lot from Starmer as I understand alot of what is being said is about making sure Labour win the next election and to do that you need to appeal to a mostly (small c) conservative population. But this is a step too far, this did not need to be said. I can't see my self voting for him after this.