Kagawa was careless at times, he was "frustrating". Scholes was way off.
My point is, why isn't anyone criticizing them in the appropriate threads?
Luis Nani | 2012/13 Performances
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Kagawa was careless at times, he was "frustrating". Scholes was way off.
My point is, why isn't anyone criticizing them in the appropriate threads?
Had Hernandez put away one of the many chances Nani created, are you telling me this thread would be full of praise? Would it feck.
And there's some people, like the berk behind me, who doesn't understand flair players.
Get a grip Nani lovers. This game showed him up perfectly. A really shit first half and a really good second half. There's no 7 or 8 out of ten with him. His penalty was rank and if Fergie was expecting Robin to take it, even more so. He's too greedy. He should by this age know how to pick out the right pass and play it way, not behind the player. He seemed on a mission after he missed the penalty, one which was lucky not to lead to a red card with the diving and over-zealous challenges. 4/10 first half, 9/10 second half.
He laid the ball on a plate 4 times for the strikers to fluff it and miss a sitter, he created 2 or 3 other 'chances' throughout the game. I don't know what else you want your winger to do? Is it his fault that our attackers were missing chances for fun tonight? What wingers don't drift in and out of games?
Granted, it was a crap penalty, and he does give the ball away. But that doesn't alter the fact that he was our most productive attacking player, with Kagawa...
Granted, it was a crap penalty, and he does give the ball away. But that doesn't alter the fact that he was our most productive attacking player, with Kagawa...
Another thing that pissed me off was his attitude after he was denied a penalty. I have no doubts it was one, but he took ages to get to his feet while Gala were breaking, a break they would've scored from if not for De Gea
Maybe he just doesn't like Nani? But I didn't hear him so you might be right. I just think being frustrated with a player who can be very frustrating is going to happen. Like I said above he does some very simple things poorly and people may overreact because of how good he can be. It's a consistency thing. Flair players can be consistent, look at Barca, they mostly play simple quick ball until the time is right. Nani feels he has to explode every time. Like the way he commits to a shot and the chance fades and you know full well it's not on but does it anyway. It's nothing to do with 'flair' as much as inconsistency. And while he does almost always create, this inconsistency and poor decision making can slow us down as a team. He can do all this and still be man of the match. He's an odd one.
Have you met him? Didn't think so.
I meant the point about not understading flair players, unless you only spoke about your mate.
Other than the penalty miss he was excellent tonight. Creating 4 or 5 clear cut chances and was part of all of our best play. What game are some of you muppets watching? Watch it again!
People should stop commenting about a player or a game they didn't watch or did "watch" with a bad stream which they can't identify a player because of such bad quality. We have a lot of haters here.
Sometimes with Nani both can be true.
At his best, he could be Ronaldo, at his worst, Milne. Nuff said.
The same game everyone is watching, 4/10 in the first half if i'm being generous, 9/10 after the penalty miss.
Excellent in the second half, creating chances after chances, did his bit of defending and looking very motivated. That 2nd pass to Hernardez's was
. First half was meh, before he disappeared at the end of it, misplaced passes, delayed passes, lost possessions, hollywood shot, hindered our momentum and then disappeared for the rest of the first half. Scholes had a blah game too by his standard, that 3 balls he lost in the first half that leads to Gala attacks, one which nearly result in a goal were a criminal offence. As for Valencia, just like what everyone is saying.. his end products! I'm just commenting on what i watched, so to see others branding me as hater is rather amusing. Never got into this debate about any players but today i realised Nani is so precious to some of you.
If he can create four golden chances per game i'm happy with that.
Shocking pen though.
Shocking pen though.
Ultimately, when you create, what, 5 or so chances for our other players with sublime vision/skill, there must come a point whereby all the other stuff goes out the window. If Van Persie, Kagawa and Hernandez convert their chances, Nani goes down as having several assists with a MOTM performance. Really, I have no idea how anyone can be disappointed with him given what he offered in the second half!
I think this thread is a good example that people can have their minds made up before actually judging what is on display. It may also be a credit to Nani's level of talent that this performance causes mixed reviews.
I think this thread is a good example that people can have their minds made up before actually judging what is on display. It may also be a credit to Nani's level of talent that this performance causes mixed reviews.
Nail. On. Head.
Yeahh agreed, don't think he had a great game at all, surprised by the comments. He needs to cut down on the shooting as well, looks like he's desperate to score when occasionally there are better options.
It was a weird game from him because even though he set up three good chances which is loads, he actually could have set up a few more but for some great defending, remember one especially where he tried to slip a ball through on the edge of the area but it was just cut out. Feck knows how he was getting all this space, but on another day he could have had 3 or 4 assists.
That said other parts of his game were poor especially in the first half with some sloppy passing. Also some of the chances he was creating weren't actually that hard, like the pass for Evra, so just looking at the number of chances he created gives a distorted view on how well he actually played. He was decent, but wasn't amazing at all IMO. Whereas Valencia on the other wing was beating players to get into good positions, before poor final ball let him down.
Just finished watching the game.
Nani had some of the usual feck ups but was overall very good. He beat too many players and played too many nice exchanges to be labelled poor.
His dribbling is insane. Best dribbler in England I'd say.
Nani had some of the usual feck ups but was overall very good. He beat too many players and played too many nice exchanges to be labelled poor.
His dribbling is insane. Best dribbler in England I'd say.
Yeah agree with this, espcially with the latter part. I think particularly in the media unless Nani had a stormer and we clearly dominate most are hesistant to praise him. He's seen as the player with the questionable end product who frustrates, where as someone like Valencia is seen as the reliable player. Charlie Nicholas on ssn was saying Nani was poor and Valencia was one of our best players tonight, even the most subjective of poster on here could really say that. It's the same with the criticism De Gea gets whilst Hart's mistakes are usually brushed off as an unusual moment. Even with Scholes today there were a couple of times he gave away the ball and the commentators just went "that's unusual for him", yeah it was the first time after that it just became clear he was struggling with the pressure.
Nani has the misfortune of being one of those players who will easily be criticised. Thing is I can understand it from people who don't watch him regularly or those at other clubs who just don't like him, but I am genuinely suprised by the amount of stick he gets on here. As you said 4/5 great chances created by him and they weren't easy chances, they required good/smart passes and for some of them great technical abaility to control the ball at pace.
He had some frustrating moments and made a big mistake on the pen but he also worked hard for the team, linked up well and created some super chances. Had other players had better days I doubt he'd have got the stick he has.
That's probably why there are so many different opinions on this player? "The lovers" throw all his poor plays out of the window as long as he puts in some sublime passes, thus making his game tonight excellent whereas "the haters" took in all his passage of plays/performances for 90 mins and simply remember that he got a poor half therefore commented as it should be?
For me, that's two Nani out there today. One if the first, the other in the second. Not disappointed in him, hope he can carry his 2nd half performances against Liverpool instead of the first half.
I don't think so, it's just because he's annoying. Watching that game with no preconceptions, he was just very frustrating. The fact that he was occasionally brilliant doesn't make it less annoying, if anything it's the opposite. When you feck up a penalty at 1-0 with a silly run up that tends to stay long in the memory, particularly after spending the first half fannying about plenty (like trying nutmegs in your own half instead of just playing the simple ball) while doing very little. I think he's the only player in our team that plays with arrogance (he seems humble off the pitch though) and yeah, some of the time he backs it up...but then quite often he doesn't. Valencia on the other hand just does his job in such an unfussy way that even if he does have a poor game, you can't fault how he's gone about it. He has poor games just like Nani but never because he's been lackadaisical or careless, he's just been off form.
And it's also because he is more talented than almost everyone else in our squad that it is annoying that he doesn't show it as often as people hope/want/expect. He's quite possibly the most technically gifted player in our team, capable of defence splitting-passes, wonderful goals and sublime control...does that really all translate into end product as often as it should? I expect Nani to be a much better player than Valencia because he's much more gifted but I don't see that. He's a matchwinner though, someone who can create something out of nothing and just a wonderful technician, so he's worth putting up with. At times it looked like Nani was the only one on the same wavelength as Kagawa which just makes it all the more baffling and annoying when he makes such stupid decisions.
They were big moments, he set up the majority of our best chances. But still frustrating
Thing is I can understand the idea that with Valencia him having a bad day is more because things haven't gone in his favour where as with Nani it can be more individual choice and it's true that he can be very frustrating but it's just what you get from flair players. They are selfish, they will do things that annoy you and will annoy their team mates but as you said they can be match winners.
This wasn't a great night for Nani but it was still a good one where he produced a number of great, clear cut chances. I genuinely can't think of a flair player out there bar someone like Messi and Ronaldo who constantly produce. It's just not what happens and both of them are so far ahead of everyone, not to mention Ronaldo it as selfish as they come.
If you want a player of this type than you/we have to put up with this because they'll never always go for the right option. We could get someone who might play like Valencia but then we'd be sacrificing a dimension of the team, something that makes us different. That's why beckham and Giggs were so great, you had the constant/reliable supply from Beckham and the magic of Giggs. Now I'm not saying Nani is as good as giggs nor valencia Beckham, but the combo is similar and both are great in their own right, but both are very different in terms of what they do and together they give us great options in attack, you wouldn't want two of each. As a consequence though you accept that from Valencia you're not going to get much variety or something different when plan a isn't working and with Nani you accept that at times you're gonna want to slap him and tell him to play it easy.
This wasn't a great night for Nani but it was still a good one where he produced a number of great, clear cut chances. I genuinely can't think of a flair player out there bar someone like Messi and Ronaldo who constantly produce. It's just not what happens and both of them are so far ahead of everyone, not to mention Ronaldo it as selfish as they come.
If you want a player of this type than you/we have to put up with this because they'll never always go for the right option. We could get someone who might play like Valencia but then we'd be sacrificing a dimension of the team, something that makes us different. That's why beckham and Giggs were so great, you had the constant/reliable supply from Beckham and the magic of Giggs. Now I'm not saying Nani is as good as giggs nor valencia Beckham, but the combo is similar and both are great in their own right, but both are very different in terms of what they do and together they give us great options in attack, you wouldn't want two of each. As a consequence though you accept that from Valencia you're not going to get much variety or something different when plan a isn't working and with Nani you accept that at times you're gonna want to slap him and tell him to play it easy.
There is something there with him - on here, in the media, from pundits, etc... Frustration definitely sticks in the mind with Nani, yeah. The fact is that he was our most threatening player tonight, so to see people saying he was awful (in the match day thread, for example) makes me wonder whether pre-formed judgements do come into the equation, clouding perception in the process. Personally, I'm more inclined to react positively to the vision and creativity he displayed tonight as opposed to the more frustrating facets of his performance. They completely cancelled them out in my opinion. It's different to when Ronaldo was in his last season here...his all round game and creativity was not at the level of Nani's tonight, yet he'd score a goal and all the frustration and wasting of possession would be forgotten. Nani just doesn't seem to get that sort of leeway, which is probably something to do with the difference between the two in terms of previous individual contributions amongst other things.
That penalty was annoying, granted.
Nani under performs given his talent, no doubt. It's probably the sort of thing that would sound ridiculous to other fans, but he's easily capable of being in that bracket below Messi in my opinion (don't say it too loud but, if he was willing to adapt to their pressing game, he'd be an amazing signing for Barcelona...
). Really, he's a pretty unique player - I can't think of another player like him with his level of ability.
Edit: Whilst it is somewhat true to say 'occasionally brilliant' given how long a football match goes on for, it seems an incomplete description given that he actually provided solid output on several occasions. It's not like he just dallied around and chipped the ball over someone's head every now and then - he provided clear cut opportunities. Players like Nani are put in the team to make things happen, and he did that a lot tonight. I can't wait to see more of him with Kagawa, because there's something potentially amazing there.
You have to expect that from an attacking winger like him though. His job isn't really to keep the ball. We want him putting in dangerous crosses and passes to try and set up goals and when he is not doing that to run at defenders. You can't expect any player to not lose the ball when doing this. If half of these type of attacks lead to something I'll be very happy, but the defenders are expected to cut out and stop a decent proportion.
Exactly!!!
Takes shit penalties. Why players do that step-stop-step-pause-step-step-stop-strike I will never understand.
Nani used to take good penalties...he is pretty poor now.
Rooney is the best...Giggs too.
We just need to spend more training time on taking penalties. We seem to be getting a few these days.
Rooney is the best...Giggs too.
We just need to spend more training time on taking penalties. We seem to be getting a few these days.
played some nice through balls in the second half, how the feck wasn't that a penatly he cleary got chopped
all in all glad he has started the last two matches and done well in both of them..
He might get a bollocking for stealing that penatly from RVP tho
all in all glad he has started the last two matches and done well in both of them..
He might get a bollocking for stealing that penatly from RVP tho
I hope nani is always as frustrating as tonight and gives us 4 or 5 goal scoring opportunities, thanks. I think I agree with kingerric, many times even ronaldo has a bad game but he compensates with a moment of brilliance and people say goals win you matches, thats why he is world class etc. Nani is never given that kind of leeway, admittedly he is no ronaldo . If you take out those moment of brilliance he still was great tonight. There were moments where he was a poor. But what I find amazing is people are saying "he was brilliant at times" while it should be "he was poor at times". It just sums up the overall caf's attitude towards him. He has just got that tag on his head.His overall play was great yesterday. There were moments where he made some bad passes but otherwise he was always involved with the general play of the team. If it was some other player people would be saying atleast he was always an attacking threat. He was poor at the start of the season and we knew he will take some time before coming back to his best. This is the first match that it looks like he is almost there, he will be more sharp in the coming matches and he probably won't make as many mistakes, yet instead of pointing out the improvement, people are too busy labelling him "frustrating".
I disagree with people saying he made those mistakes because he is a flair player because most of his mistakes were related to him missing a simple pass. I expect him to be more sharp.
As for penalty yes it was a disappointing penalty but I don't let any missed penalty affect my overall assessment of a player. Players miss penalties, if people think he is shit at penalties then they shouldn't be worried because he probably won't take many penalties, I don't see how it affect his overall assessment though. It was just disappointing at that very moment. I don't judge players by there penalty taking abilities although each to his own, I guess.
I disagree with people saying he made those mistakes because he is a flair player because most of his mistakes were related to him missing a simple pass. I expect him to be more sharp.
As for penalty yes it was a disappointing penalty but I don't let any missed penalty affect my overall assessment of a player. Players miss penalties, if people think he is shit at penalties then they shouldn't be worried because he probably won't take many penalties, I don't see how it affect his overall assessment though. It was just disappointing at that very moment. I don't judge players by there penalty taking abilities although each to his own, I guess.
That's it in a nutshell, inconsistency is very frustrating, and when a player demands a major pay rise as well it becomes even more frustrating
Stop this shit. There's no inherent agenda against Nani. It's getting annoying how anyone who doesn't praise Nani is now termed as against Nani on the Caf.
Not for Portugal he doesn't. Weird that his last 2 for us have been so shit.
Reading through this thread I can't believe we're back here again with Nani, some of you will just never take a shine to the lad. If you're gonna slag him off after being our most productive player in a game then there's no point in any of us actually trying to discuss him, your minds are made up.
Mental really considering what he's produced the past few seasons, but that's fickle football I guess.
He doesn't play as a left winger these days does he, he was all over the place(literally) in the first half. Will be interesting to see his heat map in the match.
One word, Tevez
Not sure what it achieved though. Regarding Berbatov, I defended him in the when he was the top scorer, if you get your head out of your arse, you'll see that I didn't defended him at all last season.
Err retarded to post that quote without even posting the context it was posted.
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