So you do think a destroyer would've helped a Barca beat a parked Chelsea team.
And you think Barca wouldn't win the EPL.
Mmmm.....
Luka Modric / Signs for Real Madrid
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So you do think a destroyer would've helped a Barca beat a parked Chelsea team.
And you think Barca wouldn't win the EPL.
Mmmm.....
Yes, I agree with that - just not your point about Chelsea!
Modric is a very good "nice to have". A midfielder with more steel and defensive nous (not necessarily a DM, could be a well-rounded CM) is a necessity. Modric, for all his merits, is not that player.
We struggled to keep up against stronger teams (need Carrick + AN Other). Furthermore, the one lucky break we had with injuries was Carrick. Had he been out for any amount of time we would have struggled, significantly. He is no spring chicken either, so we may as well start looking at his eventual replacement.
Martínez>M'Vila>Fellaini, that's 15-25M
If we have money left I'd be delighted if we could get Modric as well, but first things first.
We struggled to keep up against stronger teams (need Carrick + AN Other). Furthermore, the one lucky break we had with injuries was Carrick. Had he been out for any amount of time we would have struggled, significantly. He is no spring chicken either, so we may as well start looking at his eventual replacement.
Martínez>M'Vila>Fellaini, that's 15-25M
If we have money left I'd be delighted if we could get Modric as well, but first things first.
Are you seriously saying this Barca team, the team that many considered amongst the greatest ever isn't balanced? They were denied by the bar 4 times in those two games, and shit finishing cost them. We haven't had a destroyer in our midfield since Keano as well, we haven't done too badly have we? The physical aspect is incredibly overrated, who gives a feck if the opposition keeps fouling us, if they don't have the ball they can't do anything.
There is a reason Barca have been so successful and lose so few games, no matter the opposition. They play the same against everyone, and they keep possession against everyone, tire the opposing team out and frustrate them. Its like because Chelsea beat them by pure luck, that everyone forgets how they embarassed us in the 2011 champions league final. Why wouldn't we want to have more players capable of keeping the ball under pressure and moving with it. Give me a player who is capable of keeping possession and is more creative over a defensive player who is there to break apart the opposition any day.
A destroyer like Fellaini would be a step back for us IMO, whereas a player like Modric would be a huge leap forward for us. He'd give us more creativity through the middle, something we have lacked the last few years. Last season our creativity came 100% from the wings. I remember the Blackburn game, where we just kept giving it to Valencia to cross it in, it's like we had no idea what else we could have done.
I think that Barca were actually stronger when we met them then with Sanchez and Fabregas. I also think that, yes, they would find EPL tougher then the Liga
Im not suggesting a destroyer and Felliani is not a destroyer but a box to box player. I have been screaming for quality in CM for 2 yrs now. However, I acknowledge the need for balance between steel and technique
Something within these lines
------------De Gea-------------
Rafael----Rio------Vidic----------Evra
---------Carrick---Modric/Felliani-------
Valencia-------Kagawa---------Nani
-------------Rooney----------------
Instead of a 4-4-2 with Modric partnering Carrick, Kagawa and Nani on the flanks and the polish guy leading the line with Rooney.
He didn't say that, he said that despite having a vastly superior midfield -from a technical standpoint- an inferior one could neutralise it and nick the game.
It is not a case of Barca could have beaten Chelsea if they had that sort of player (which actually, they do). It is a case of, at the highest level, being able to field a midfield that is solid and dominant enough to deal with one as gifted as Barca's. We don't have that midfield.
We had it in 2009 but Fletcher was suspended, and it showed. We didn't have it at Wembley and we got shat on, and very often over the last season our midfield was run over completely. Modric is not the right solution to that problem, he would just be a great addition to a strong aspect of our team.
this + we play in the EPL where football is much more physical then in Spain. We have to consider that, whether we like it or not.
Modric is not being bought in to be a destroyer/DM. He is like Scholes, a playmaker. He will be bought in to replace Scholes and we can give him one year to learn from the master and settle into our team so he can eventually take over when Scholes retires next season.
In that case yeah I agree, I wasn't the one suggesting a 4-4-2, I was actually suggesting that exact lineup 1 or 2 pages back (without the /fellaini). Definitely don't want us to shove Kagawa out wide and stick with a 4-4-1-1/4-4-2, Rooney needs to become our #9 (not literally, he can keep the 10 on his shirt), and we need to switch to a 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 type formation. It would be a huge improvement for us.
Also for those saying Rooney can't play as the lone striker, or we don't create enough opportunities with it, I think that's purely down to the players we had and Sir Alex isn't exactly the best with utilizing it (or at least he hasn't shown it so far). We need our wingers higher up in that lineup helping Wayne out, and Kagawa at the head of a triangle of Carrick-Modric-Kagawa.
I think we all agree on that
It's really a matter of priorities. Personally, I would love it so long as we address the... let's call it "midfielder that can play ball but can also perform defensive duties to a high standard" (ridiculous I know, but we are sure not looking for a De Jong, which is what people seem to interpret).
Ideally we would be bringing him in now and having him and Scholes together for a year rather than be up shit creek next Summer (we are in a much stronger negotiating position now as well).
It's really a budgetary issue. Personally, I would splash out this Summer and have a quieter one next year. We would be sorted for the long term for every single position other than fullback.
This, also people seem to forget that Modric is already proven to be a class player in the premier league.
So we agree.
In my opinion Felliani would be useful against physical sides or when we're defending a result. Under such circumstances having Carrick-Felliani + one between Modric/Kagawa in a 3 CM midfield would ensure a solid but technically gifted midfield capable to both defend and attack. Of course I acknowledge our budget limits. I mean getting Felliani, Modric and Kagawa at one go (+ a left back to cover Evra), would cost a bomb. However if I had to choose between the Lewandoski guy and Felliani, then Id rather choose the latter then the former.
As I've been saying throughout the past year, I think that if we tackle the CM problem then we've got a truly competitive side capable to seriously mount a challenge on three fronts (EPL, CL and FA)
I think we all agree on that
It's really a matter of priorities. Personally, I would love it so long as we address the... let's call it "midfielder that can play ball but can also perform defensive duties to a high standard" (ridiculous I know, but we are sure not looking for a De Jong, which is what people seem to interpret).
Ideally we would be bringing him in now and having him and Scholes together for a year rather than be up shit creek next Summer (we are in a much stronger negotiating position now as well).
It's really a budgetary issue. Personally, I would splash out this Summer and have a quieter one next year. We would be sorted for the long term for every single position other than fullback.
I agree. In my opinion if we sort CM out with real quality then we can easily have 2-3 quiet summer markets.
I think our cheapest DM/box-to-box midfielder option would be Strootman. And when has Felliani been linked to us recently? Martinez is going to be expensive and it looks like he is staying there/we have no interest. M'Vila maybe but again, it looks like there is no interest from our side.
So we agree.
In my opinion Felliani would be useful against physical sides or when we're defending a result. Under such circumstances having Carrick-Felliani + one between Modric/Kagawa in a 3 CM midfield would ensure a solid but technically gifted midfield capable to both defend and attack. Of course I acknowledge our budget limits. I mean getting Felliani, Modric and Kagawa at one go (+ a left back to cover Evra), would cost a bomb. However if I had to choose between the Lewandoski guy and Felliani, then Id rather choose the latter then the former.
As I've been saying throughout the past year, I think that if we tackle the CM problem then we've got a truly competitive side capable to seriously mount a challenge on three fronts (EPL, CL and FA)
Yeah, I'm not sure why we would even think about getting another striker in. Kagawa is more than capable of playing there if things get that desperate, and we already have Rooney, Welbeck and Hernandez fighting for 1 spot if we make the switch to a 4-2-3-1 like most of us suspect we will.
Anyway I just saw that apparently PSG are thinking about getting Modric as well, but I doubt Modric would go there over to United if he has the option.
Yes but PSG will be willing to pay more in terms of transfer fees and wages. Modric has to make the smarter decision if it comes down to us and PSG.
PSG said to be interested - "news" planted by Spurs for the negotiation we appear to be having with them over Modric, or are we gearing-up to battle with yet another sugar daddy?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2157872/Paris-Saint-Germain-weigh-Luka-Modric.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2157872/Paris-Saint-Germain-weigh-Luka-Modric.html
I think it will come down to if Modric really wants to stay in the prem, because despite the money, Ligue 1 is a considerably weaker league then the premier league. Much different to a sugar daddy in the premier league.
Agree Martínez is very unlikely and would probably bugger off very quickly. M'Vila I have a soft spot for, could be a monster for us and that would be Carrick's eventual replacement sorted. The problem with Fellaini is he would be relatively overpriced. Strootman I've seen little of but like what I hear.
Any one of those will do for me. If on top we could get Modric that would be a muppet's dream.
In practice, I think it is very unlikely we would do both. Not just budget, which I think we can smooth by being more thrifty next Summer, but we have too many question marks (Fletcher, Cleverley, Anderson - fitness) and players in last season (Scholes, Giggs, Park?).
Calling them deadwood would be wrong, but a year from now 4-5 of them may well be. In the meantime, if you get Modric + CM + already have Carrick, then you are bound to stunt all three question marks trying to find fitness and keep the golden oldies as luxury squad players (less of an issue).
I can't see SAF doing that, he is the loyal type and won't give up on a youth prospect he has spoken highly of (Clevs) or a great servant like Fletcher. He will probably take one now and leave the other for next Summer once everything is clearer, and if that is the case Modric would be the wrong choice as he is the one who would keep Cleverley, Ando and Scholes benched.
Moussa Dembele to replace Fletcher. Physicality Dribbling skill against pressing opponent. Goals contribution from midfield and not over-priced.
Wouldn't mind him at all if we also got Modric. As the only midfield addition it would be the least I expect (i.e. satisfactory but no fireworks).
We need Mordic. He would be a classy addition, especially for the CL...
I am flabbergasted having clicked that link at the amount of absolute bullshit on the Express' website. Appalling journalism. It's not even journalism, it's just lies and sensationalism
I hear PSG are interested; game over.
Do you want to be filthy rich, living in Paris and playing in the CL every year?
Do you want to be filthy rich, living in Paris and playing in the CL every year?
What's this got to do with Modric?
The garlic-snorting, stripey-jumper-wearing barstards:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/luka-modric-targeted-by-paris-saint-872958
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/luka-modric-targeted-by-paris-saint-872958
We have had a bid knocked back?
That's a Levy plant.
1 player whose 37, and knows that his body simply can't do much more than a game every 10 days.
Plus 2 players who we simply can't rely on to stay injury free, in their careers. Whether it be luck, or whatever, you simply need cover, and we look incredibly thin next year, if we have a 4231, in which the '2' is covered solely by Carrick, Scholes, Anderson and Cleverley.
I think a team with Carrick, Modric and with Kagawa sitting in front of them, is far more balanced than the 442 with Carrick and Scholes last year. That team saw us not getting the ball for a good 10 whole minutes at WHL. I can't believe that people don't rate Modric, when we have a Scholes in our team, and many of the older CAF would've seen him for the best part of 20 years, and admired his qualities in spreading the play. The rest of England were slow to appreciate him; why some are doing to same to Modric, who is a similar player, except with a little more defensive capability, and at this age, definitely more running capability, and almost a good passing set as Scholes, is criminal.
De Gea; Rafael, Vidic, Rio/Evans/Smalling, Evra; Modric, Carrick; Nani, Kagawa, Valencia; Rooney
seems a very good lineup. It's certainly more defensively sound that last season, and with more quality throughout the pitch. I wouldn't mind so much if Rooney played the 2nd striker / #10 role alongside Kagawa pretty much; we don't need a targetman. Also, Rooney's simply too good to have isolated; I hope and think we'll have him closer to the play. Get your best players seeing more of the ball and you'll have a better chance of winning the match.
Yes, I can see the point in getting in cover to eventually phase out Carrick, and at least take some strain off him for the next season or 2 (Few 25- year olds in the deep lying playmaker position, esp. with the defensive responsibility he has from that position are as good as him, including Javi Martinez), but how people don't see that literally the only option we may have sitting NEXT to Carrick for big chucks of the season, may be Scholes, or someone even worse, there, like Giggs, is mind blowing.
Yes, we are stuffed if Carrick is injured. But we are even more stuffed in the position next to him; we simply NEED someone reliable to be there. Cleverley and Anderson can both have plenty of minutes if they stay uninjured, the season is long, and I'm sure that position will see some rotation, but they are injury prone, and Scholes should not be our only semi-reliable option in that position. Furthermore, you could raise questions about the quality of Anderson and Cleverley, at the moment. Tom is inexperienced et al, and Anderson is rather inconsistent!
He's just being realistic. I doubt that we'll add 2 new CM + Kagawa to the team. As Antohan said we'll probably add just 1 new CM and see how the trio Ando/Fletch/Clev, new guy and Kagawa perform in CM. Dont forget that we still need to add a new left back to the team (to act as cover/competitor for Evra).
I'll stick by my guns - Both positions do need cover / replacements, but I'm more worried about getting a player to challenge for Scholes's position, than a player to cover/challenge for carricks.
Modric / M'vila / Martinez all seem like good targets, although admittedly I've only watched the former for more than 1-2 games (I watched Europa, so a little of Martinez). M'vila's passing percentage was around 90%+, so I'm sure he can certainly spread the play well, or at least get the simple passes right (Carrick was doing Scholes-esque passes throughout the season, although this got curbed a little when Scholes came back - he let him do those crazy 40 yard crossfield passes), and I'd be happy with any of them, on paper (The litmus test is watching them, obviously!).
With a player more in the mould of Carrick, we do get a player that can play alongside him, as well as covering for Carrick himself, so that is useful. Furthermore, those targets ARE younger.
But in the medium term; the next 4-5 years, I think a Modric player would bode very very well for our fortunes; like having a young Scholes joining the team, and then us supplementing our midfield for a "Carrick" type player next season.
That's my preference, although SAF knows best, and obviously the availability of players will help dictate which type of player he may look to gain more cover for.
Just a small (pedantic) thing; but if we get Clyne, we have cover / replacement for Evra and Rafael, as Clyne can play either full back position (not ideal, but hey. Evra's still great). Also, if we get Powell, and another midfielder say Martinez for example, that's 2 CM's
I'll stick by my guns - Both positions do need cover / replacements, but I'm more worried about getting a player to challenge for Scholes's position, than a player to cover/challenge for carricks.
Modric / M'vila / Martinez all seem like good targets, although admittedly I've only watched the former for more than 1-2 games (I watched Europa, so a little of Martinez). M'vila's passing percentage was around 90%+, so I'm sure he can certainly spread the play well, or at least get the simple passes right (Carrick was doing Scholes-esque passes throughout the season, although this got curbed a little when Scholes came back - he let him do those crazy 40 yard crossfield passes), and I'd be happy with any of them, on paper (The litmus test is watching them, obviously!).
With a player more in the mould of Carrick, we do get a player that can play alongside him, as well as covering for Carrick himself, so that is useful. Furthermore, those targets ARE younger.
But in the medium term; the next 4-5 years, I think a Modric player would bode very very well for our fortunes; like having a young Scholes joining the team, and then us supplementing our midfield for a "Carrick" type player next season.
That's my preference, although SAF knows best, and obviously the availability of players will help dictate which type of player he may look to gain more cover for.
Just a small (pedantic) thing; but if we get Clyne, we have cover / replacement for Evra and Rafael, as Clyne can play either full back position (not ideal, but hey. Evra's still great). Also, if we get Powell, and another midfielder say Martinez for example, that's 2 CM's
Personally I look at it this way, we have cleverly,anderson,scholes and giggs who can play in midfield but require somebody next to them to do the defensive work for them(more so in the case of the latter two). Right now we only have carrick who can do this job and if he gets injured we would be in a lot of trouble. If we add another defensive minded player or box to box player that can help relieve him of this pressure. Furthermore we can then utilize scholes in our big games as well by playing him alongside carrick and a runner to make up for the problems being caused by his age. Although this would mean leaving kagawa out but in some games it might be better to have scholes starting instead of him.
Modric can always be signed next year(one year less on his contract) or we can sign someone younger who wont cost us a total fortune. That being said I would be thrilled if we sign him as he is a quality player who would improve our team massively but would prefer a player who would add more steel to our midfield first. This will also give petrucci a chance to show us what he can do if he goes out on loan and pogba if he decides to sign for us.
Powell has been playing league two football recently(I think) so dont expect anything from him for a couple of years at least. Ditto with clyne as I think he might go out on loan first next year when fabio comes back.
I'm starting to believe that some of you haven't watched any Modric or United over the past 2-3 years. What we lacked last season is a central midfielder who can control the tempo of the game and keep the ball when they are pressed. Take a look at the big matches we've lost this season and a lot of it was down to our inability to hold onto possession of the ball or create anything through the middle of the park.
We don't need a destroyer cause Carrick is more than good enough to shield the defense. If we were to purchase Modric he will solve a lot of our midfield problems, and it's not as if he is strictly an attacking midfielder because he gets up and down the pitch a lot if you watch him. The most similar player to Scholes that's currently playing in the PL.
We don't need a destroyer cause Carrick is more than good enough to shield the defense. If we were to purchase Modric he will solve a lot of our midfield problems, and it's not as if he is strictly an attacking midfielder because he gets up and down the pitch a lot if you watch him. The most similar player to Scholes that's currently playing in the PL.
Carrick and Modric next to each other would be quality.
I disagree with some of what you say. Our back four being too easy to get at was also a problem for me.
I disagree with some of what you say. Our back four being too easy to get at was also a problem for me.
As opposed to Filthy rich playing in the champions league and living in Manchester?
Paris aint THAT special.
Stop using the word destroyer, no one uses it for Carrick, not sure why it is being used for his backup and eventual replacement.
1) Kagawa already goes some way to addressing the creativity from central midfield. When thinking about last season, think how much of what was lacking is being sorted.
2) Modric would be great, we all agree.
3) The problem as it stands is we have Scholes, Anderson and Cleverley for the "non-defensive" midfield position Modric would occupy. We only have Carrick for the other. Carrick + any of those three + Kagawa is a very good midfield for most games but may be bullied by stronger midfield pairings, whether you add Modric or not doesn't change that.
4) If Carrick ever got injured we would have Modric + one of Scholes/Ando/Clev/Jones which is a car crash, a disaster waiting to happen.
5) If we got someone like M'Vila (let alone Martinez) we would be safe when Carrick is out and even if Fletcher/Clev/Ando continue to be unavailable we could play him alongside Carrick with Kagawa in the hole and that would be perfectly fine. In fact, you would probably play both against the likes of City or Chelsea.
Thus, the need for that sort of player is more critical than Modric and should be prioritised. Now, if all of Fletcher/Ando/Clev were fit then you have way too many midfielders and Modric stunting the last two, which I can't see SAF doing.
Of course, it would be great to say "let's just sign both types" but with so many players potentially "being like a new signing" I think SAF will roll the dice to some extent and, if he did, I'd rather he rolled it by not signing Modric now.