Luka Modric

Xavi
Fabregas
Busquets
Alonso
Schweinsteiger
De Rossi
Yaya Toure
Pirlo

are all better than him.

Then there's decent argument to say that the likes of Bender, Wilshere, Moutinho and Carrick are on the same level he is at this current time.
 
KM said:
Xavi
Fabregas
Busquets
Alonso
Schweinsteiger
De Rossi
Yaya Toure
Pirlo

are all better than him.

Then there's decent argument to say that the likes of Bender, Wilshere, Moutinho and Carrick are on the same level he is at this current time.
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Agree with that, you missed off Iniesta too. I'd have Modric at 10th on the list.
 
lunchforthesky said:
Agree with that, you missed off Iniesta too. I'd have Modric at 10th on the list.
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Iniesta doesn't play as a central midfield. I forget Javi Martinez who's been performing well for Munich, İlkay Gündoğan who's been excellent for Dortmund.
 
KM said:
Iniesta doesn't play as a central midfield. I forget Javi Martinez who's been performing well for Munich, İlkay Gündoğan who's been excellent for Dortmund.
Click to expand...

Martinez again you can have the CB call, but if this is on current form, then Modric is far from top 10
 
Inspectah deck said:
Vidal too, I'd have him in the top 10 before Modric for sure
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Vidal's a very good midfielder, my reservation with him is that Pirlo has been so ridiculously good for Juventus and Italy the last 18 months that he's been made everyone look a good 20% better than they probably are.

I'm not sure Vidal would look nearly as accomplished without an all time great level midfielder like Pirlo next to him.
 
KM said:
Iniesta doesn't play as a central midfield. I forget Javi Martinez who's been performing well for Munich, İlkay Gündoğan who's been excellent for Dortmund.
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He does some of the time, usually he's at his best there.

Martinez has been a bit disappointing for Bayern although picked up recently and he's quite a limited player.

Gundogan's excellent, much better than Bender (I assume you mean Sven not Lars) who doesn't really deserve a mention.
 
Nah I meant Lars, the Leverkusen one.
 
KM said:
Xavi
Fabregas
Busquets
Alonso
Schweinsteiger
De Rossi
Yaya Toure
Pirlo
are all better than him.

Then there's decent argument to say that the likes of Bender, Wilshere, Moutinho and Carrick are on the same level he is at this current time.
Click to expand...

This is where these threads get bizzare for me.

Those players could be considered better than Modric (although with some of them its perhaps a matter of opinion) - but regardless, how many of those are realistic targets?

This happened in the Bale thread - people criticising a talented player who has a good pedigree and would arguably improve United as they currently stand. If the criticism of a player is that "he's not the best in the world" then that can be levelled at a lot of players, but it seems to be going off on a tangent.

I think the question is whether he'd improve the side - some think so, others prefer what we have, and fair enough. But I don't see how its relevant whether a player is the top player in his position when most of those who are completely unatainable.

As it stands, outside of the players from that list who would be likely targets (Bender and Moutinho), he'd be my choice purely on having had plenty of PL experience and done well.
 
RedRover said:
This is where these threads get bizzare for me.

Those players could be considered better than Modric (although with some of them its perhaps a matter of opinion) - but regardless, how many of those are realistic targets?

This happened in the Bale thread - people criticising a talented player who has a good pedigree and would arguably improve United as they currently stand. If the criticism of a player is that "he's not the best in the world" then that can be levelled at a lot of players, but it seems to be going off on a tangent.

I think the question is whether he'd improve the side - some think so, others prefer what we have, and fair enough. But I don't see how its relevant whether a player is the top player in his position when most of those who are completely unatainable.

As it stands, outside of the players from that list who would be likely targets (Bender and Moutinho), he'd be my choice purely on having had plenty of PL experience and done well.
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Wow, sounds to me as though you have completely missed the point, they are comparing players for their abilities, nothing to do with who is the more realistic transfer target...
 
RedRover said:
This is where these threads get bizzare for me.

Those players could be considered better than Modric (although with some of them its perhaps a matter of opinion) - but regardless, how many of those are realistic targets?

This happened in the Bale thread - people criticising a talented player who has a good pedigree and would arguably improve United as they currently stand. If the criticism of a player is that "he's not the best in the world" then that can be levelled at a lot of players, but it seems to be going off on a tangent.

I think the question is whether he'd improve the side - some think so, others prefer what we have, and fair enough. But I don't see how its relevant whether a player is the top player in his position when most of those who are completely unatainable.

As it stands, outside of the players from that list who would be likely targets (Bender and Moutinho), he'd be my choice purely on having had plenty of PL experience and done well.
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:wenger:

Did you even bother reading the thread?

or have you completely missed the point again?
 
RedRover said:
This is where these threads get bizzare for me.

Those players could be considered better than Modric (although with some of them its perhaps a matter of opinion) - but regardless, how many of those are realistic targets?

This happened in the Bale thread - people criticising a talented player who has a good pedigree and would arguably improve United as they currently stand. If the criticism of a player is that "he's not the best in the world" then that can be levelled at a lot of players, but it seems to be going off on a tangent.

I think the question is whether he'd improve the side - some think so, others prefer what we have, and fair enough. But I don't see how its relevant whether a player is the top player in his position when most of those who are completely unatainable.

As it stands, outside of the players from that list who would be likely targets (Bender and Moutinho), he'd be my choice purely on having had plenty of PL experience and done well.
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Agree with that.

We actually don't have any players you could argue were the best in the world in their position (Messi plays as a striker before anyone brings up RVP), but we're still a brilliant team.
 
I'd put Carrick comfortably above him on current form, and Wilshere just because they're already very close, and Wilshere so obviously has more in his locker.
 
What is the point in naming a few midfielders that are not available or will cost an extortionate amount. We might as well bring Zidane into the discussion.

The point is that if he is available at a cut price, there are very few better options than Modric. The Madrid situation is a speculation but if they'll be looking to offload him at the end of the season, we should be first in line.
 
Jaybezia said:
Wow, sounds to me as though you have completely missed the point, they are comparing players for their abilities, nothing to do with who is the more realistic transfer target...
Click to expand...

I know - but I just think its a side issue, and a lot of these threads go down that route.

Whether or not he's as good as Iniesta or Xavi is irrelevant to me since we'd be highly unlikely to ever sign wither of those two.

It just seems to me to be a common stick to "beat" a player with. In the Bale thread some daft journo or other said he was the best left sided player around - he clearly isn't, but it doesnt take a way from the ability he has, but some spent more time rubbihsing that than actually looking at what the player was doing.

The discussions end up off on a tangent, comparing umpteen other players to one another. I have no problem with it - it just seems bizzare.
 
KM said:
:wenger:

Did you even bother reading the thread?

or have you completely missed the point again?
Click to expand...

I refer to my post above.

Surely the point is discussing whether Modric would be a decent aquisition - not whether he's as good as the "best in the world".

I don't see that anyone is saying he's the best possible signing out there, just that if he were available he might be a viable option. I'm sure if others from that list were likely targets they'd be viable too.
 
Forevergiggs said:
I don't think you are looking it the right way, buddy? Cesc left at the end of the 2010-2011 season and Arsenal improved two points and one position better last season. Does that mean Cesc is not a world class midfielder and Arteta is better than him?

Stop calling him a Spurs level player. I am not Glaston. What does it even mean?

You added Fellani, who will be good addition to our squad but I still don't get the point with the rest. Comparing a world class addition to some good players makes no sense at all.

Where is a similar talent available for less abroad? Name me a better rounded midfielder than Modric?

Like I mentioned in the previous post, there is enough room for Anderson, Cleverley and Modric to co-exist in our squad. I don't get how he is going to negatively affect them.
Click to expand...

All the examples I gave were of similar quality players to Modric in a central midfield position: "Felliani, Cabaye, Dembele or Sandro", I'm sure you only need to look at the transfer forum for several others abroad.

Again Modric is the type of player who has to be at the centre of everything to be effective, I just don't think he is good enough or mentally strong enough to perform that role for a big team, just as he rarely did it against big teams when at Spurs.

lunchforthesky said:
So which club is Welbeck the quality of? Because he's clearly not better than Berbatov? Or is that not how this '<insert team> quality' game works?
Click to expand...

Welbeck is a young player who is improving. If he was 28 I'd say he was Spurs quality - which from now on will be referred to as just "good". A squad is generally filled with players who have the potential to be very good, players who are very good and players who are good but only fulfill a squad role (the likes of Fletcher, Park, O'Shea etc historically). Modric would not fall into any of those categories in my opinion.

lunchforthesky said:
As Glaston just pointed out Anderson is almost the same age as Modric, one is considered one of the best midfielders around, hence why Real Madrid spent £32m on him, one is basically considered an injury prone flop by almost everyone outside the club.
Click to expand...

When Modric was Anderson's age he'd just finished a decent but not great season at Spurs after several seasons in Croatia, whereas Anderson has played 158 times for Manchester United, earning a few improved contracts in the process. Also I think I've said twice Anderson only has the potential to be much better, not that he is.

lunchforthesky said:
This argument is so ridiculous. What do you know about our club finances, who's on what wages or what we can and can't afford? Almost nothing. You don't know what Modric is earning at Madrid, you don't know what he'd ask from us or what Anderson, Carrick, Fletcher or Cleverley currently make in comparison.

Fans get way too caught up in the money side of the game. What you should care about is if Modric is a good enough player to improve our team (which he is) because that's what we the fans make an informed judgement on because unlike club finances we have total transparency for performances on the pitch.
Click to expand...

Refer to the bolded.

lunchforthesky said:
He would replace Cleverley though, who he's clearly better than right now.

Currently we're built around Carrick from a midfield sense, he's having his best season ever but he's still a million miles away from being a Pirlo or a Xavi. Lets not pretend we're currently built around a Pirlo level player and signing Modric would infringe on his freedom to run games for us.

I think Carrick and Modric would be a could partnership and one of the few combos you can make in world football where both players are top level and can still clearly play in a midfield two. Clearly SAF agreed with all of this as he was evidently definitely interested in signing Modric.

I don't think Modric is a player you have to 100% build around for him to be effective too, he's a more dynamic player than that. We're not talking about Riquelme here, he's more like a Deco.
Click to expand...

Carrick and Modric would have nowhere near the legs to play as a midfield two together in my opinion. We'd also be heavily reliant on the wings as neither are adept at creating chances themselves (it'd be interesting to know their combined assists).

Either way here's 10 central midfielders I'd have way before Modric: Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso, Carrick, Toure, Schweinsteiger, Martínez, Pirlo, Ozil, Wilshere.
 
lunchforthesky said:
10 better midfielders then?
Click to expand...

RedRover said:
I refer to my post above.

Surely the point is discussing whether Modric would be a decent aquisition - not whether he's as good as the "best in the world".

I don't see that anyone is saying he's the best possible signing out there, just that if he were available he might be a viable option. I'm sure if others from that list were likely targets they'd be viable too.
Click to expand...

The guy asked for 10 better midfielders than him in the previous page. I just replied to him. Not sure what's your or the other idiot on the page's problem is?
 
finneh said:
Again Modric is the type of player who has to be at the centre of everything to be effective, I just don't think he is good enough or mentally strong enough to perform that role for a big team, just as he rarely did it against big teams when at Spurs.
Click to expand...

He normally is at the centre of everything, as any good central midfielder is. He made more key passes than any other player in the Premier League last season. You are writing him off after a few months at Real Madrid? Nuts. Its actually very hard for central midfielders to dominate big games, unless you are Xavi Hernandez or Andrea Pirlo. Modric played well against us a few times, one standout performance at WHL when he blitzed Fletcher springs to mind.

finneh said:
Welbeck is a young player who is improving. If he was 28 I'd say he was Spurs quality - which from now on will be referred to as just "good". A squad is generally filled with players who have the potential to be very good, players who are very good and players who are good but only fulfill a squad role (the likes of Fletcher, Park, O'Shea etc historically). Modric would not fall into any of those categories in my opinion.
Click to expand...

Modric is a very good player. You think Jose Mourinho is wrong?

finneh said:
When Modric was Anderson's age he'd just finished a decent but not great season at Spurs after several seasons in Croatia, whereas Anderson has played 158 times for Manchester United, earning a few improved contracts in the process. Also I think I've said twice Anderson only has the potential to be much better, not that he is.
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Anderson has never had a season for United equivalent to Modric at Spurs in 2009/10 and 2011/12. He is also unreliable in his fitness, something Luka is not.

finneh said:
Carrick and Modric would have nowhere near the legs to play as a midfield two together in my opinion. We'd also be heavily reliant on the wings as neither are adept at creating chances themselves (it'd be interesting to know their combined assists).
Click to expand...

This is not true. Carrick and Modric are both renowned for their stamina and the ground they cover during games. If both are sitting centrally they would be required to maintain and recycle possession and set the tempo of United's play. The forwards will naturally generate more assists. You need to look at more than that. Central midfielders don't have high assist counts, look at Pirlo he rarely gets forward he doesn't have to, its not what he does. They would allow us to maintain pressure on an opposing team with their ability to dictate. Both are natural playmakers, they allow other players freedom to play their game.
 
Modric is a good CM. But I must say I enjoy his cameos off the bench for Madrid in other positions where he cant even make a simple 5 yard pass at times. He's a shell.

Wont be surprised to see him back in England and Sir Alex is clearly a fan
 
finneh said:
All the examples I gave were of similar quality players to Modric in a central midfield position: "Felliani, Cabaye, Dembele or Sandro", I'm sure you only need to look at the transfer forum for several others abroad.

Again Modric is the type of player who has to be at the centre of everything to be effective, I just don't think he is good enough or mentally strong enough to perform that role for a big team, just as he rarely did it against big teams when at Spurs.



Welbeck is a young player who is improving. If he was 28 I'd say he was Spurs quality - which from now on will be referred to as just "good". A squad is generally filled with players who have the potential to be very good, players who are very good and players who are good but only fulfill a squad role (the likes of Fletcher, Park, O'Shea etc historically). Modric would not fall into any of those categories in my opinion.



When Modric was Anderson's age he'd just finished a decent but not great season at Spurs after several seasons in Croatia, whereas Anderson has played 158 times for Manchester United, earning a few improved contracts in the process. Also I think I've said twice Anderson only has the potential to be much better, not that he is.



Refer to the bolded.



Carrick and Modric would have nowhere near the legs to play as a midfield two together in my opinion. We'd also be heavily reliant on the wings as neither are adept at creating chances themselves (it'd be interesting to know their combined assists).

Either way here's 10 central midfielders I'd have way before Modric: Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso, Carrick, Toure, Schweinsteiger, Martínez, Pirlo, Ozil, Wilshere.
Click to expand...

Wilshere and Martinez are pretty laughable suggestions.

Martinez is a destroyer who's there to guard to defense, has been pretty underwhelming for Bayern and barely ever makes an incisive pass. I assume you've not actually watched him play for Bayern?

Wilshere's never put in the kind of performances in big games that Modric has for Croatia against world class opposition. Not to mention he's been injured for 18 months.

Ozil is not a central midfielder, he's a number 10.
 
Tbf Wilshere was first class against Barcelona in the home leg two-three years ago.

Also I'd wank myself off if we sign Modric and I do think he'll be a top class partner to Carrick.
 
KM said:
TAlso I'd wank myself off if we sign Modric and I do think he'll be a top class partner to Carrick.
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This is my only problem with signing Modric, he still doesn't address our biggest need which is someone to cover for Carrick. Modric would be an improvement on the first 11 but with Cleverleys good form and Anderson beginning to look consistent (when not injured) he isn't needed as much as what I thought he would be this summer.

At this point I'd welcome someone like Wanyama or Strootman, someone capable of partnering Cleverley/Anderson rather than someone who would partner Carrick.

That said, I'd be very happy if we did sign Modric.
 
gza the genius said:
This is my only problem with signing Modric, he still doesn't address our biggest need which is someone to cover for Carrick. Modric would be an improvement on the first 11 but with Cleverleys good form and Anderson beginning to look consistent (when not injured) he isn't needed as much as what I thought he would be this summer.

At this point I'd welcome someone like Wanyama or Strootman, someone capable of partnering Cleverley/Anderson rather than someone who would partner Carrick.

That said, I'd be very happy if we did sign Modric.
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Wanyama or Strootman can't play in a midfield two though, not for a team like ours where 75% of our games involve the opposition letting us have the ball and defending extremely deep, it's just completely wasted in a two.

Not only that but SAF clearly doesn't like destroyers or attacking midfielders/number 10's. Despite destroyers being very popular for the last 10 years we've never signed one and only very, very rarely used one (Phil Neville/O'Shea) and this was almost always because of injury crisis. When we have signed number 10's they generally haven't worked very well for us (Veron/Kagawa so far).

Personally I like both these kind of players and think teams are better for using than them than playing a 2 man midfield (an opinion shared by most current top coaches).

But while SAF is here I don't really see us signing anyone like that. Where as Modric is a player SAF clearly likes and one who can play in a midfield two and do a bit of everything defensively and offensively, which is a SAF style midfielder.
 
I'm always right said:
Was that when Fletcher's illness had started to kick in and he also got completely blitzed by the Wolves midfield amongst many others?
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Who knows? All I can say is Ferguson trusted him to start big games for a majority of that season. If he wasn't fit enough to play football then he wouldn't be on the pitch...its that simple. He just got out-manouvered by Modric...as did Carrick funnily enough.

I remember he wasn't the only one humbled by Wolves that day...outfought.
 
I'm always right said:
:lol::lol:

The old caf "can't play in a 2"... I love it.
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Would you want to play Makelele in a midfield two?

It's a total waste on a spot on the pitch to play someone who doesn't contribute offensively in a two when you're a top team who spend almost all the game on the front foot. What exactly would Wanyama be trying to break up when we're at home to Stoke? Half the PL clubs in the lower half bypass the midfield entirely anyway and just punt long balls up to a big man, or they get the ball wide and cross it in asap.

The entire purpose of Makelele is to A) Mark the opposition number 10 and B) Cover for wing backs when they go forward. Most PL teams don't even use a number 10 they either play two proper strikers or they play three central/more defensive midfielders and get all the creativity from wide areas. Which makes a Makelele type player utterly pointless. So you'd be signing a player purely to mark Santi Cazorla//Lewis Holtby/Oscar and whoever we might meet in the Champions League. The rest of the time they're just stood in front of the back four marking absolutely no one and passing side ways to Carrick who's also stood in front of the back four anyway.

If we sign a midfielder it needs to be a Vieira/Yaya Toure style midfielder who brings a physical presence as well as a lot of mobility but he also needs to be good going forward either through passing or driving runs. Obviously those players are very difficult to find because most midfielders are specialists these days. Strootman and Wanyama are not that kind of player from what I've seen/read.
 
Wilshere would be a brilliant signing as well and is a pretty similar player to Modric but at the moment I think Modric is better. Not that it really matters for this discussion as both are clearly better than our current partners for Carrick and I'd be elated with either if SAF were in the market for a midfielder.
 
Comsmit said:
Who knows? All I can say is Ferguson trusted him to start big games for a majority of that season. If he wasn't fit enough to play football then he wouldn't be on the pitch...its that simple. He just got out-manouvered by Modric...as did Carrick funnily enough.

I remember he wasn't the only one humbled by Wolves that day...outfought.
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Our big problem around that time WAS Fletcher, and don't tell me that "if he wasn't fit enough to play football then he wouldn't be on the pitch"... SAF played Gaz Neville till Gaz himself was so embarrassed that he retired. Irwin was allowed to play on a season too long, and don't get me started on Blanc.

Fletcher was fecked that season and we got bummed pretty much every time he was put in the team, no-one was shocked to find out how ill he was, in fact it explained a lot.
 
lunchforthesky said:
Would you want to play Makelele in a midfield two?
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Check out the old Modric threads and see how many Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime were claiming "he can't play in a 2" right up until he was moved there and starting showing everyone that it really aint the monumentally difficult task you all make out.
 
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