Manchester City 17/18 discussion | "If you're here for the Champions clap your hands" (#6505)

[Gentleman Jim]

Even the mildest of City fans show their true colours

I'll mildly ask then.
If a City director was a leading powerbroker on the committees of FIFA and UEFA would you not expect them to do all possible to protect the interests of their club?
FFP and retrospective CL co-efficient points seem to have done United no harm.

 

[KM]

I'll mildly ask then.
If a City director was a leading powerbroker on the committees of FIFA and UEFA would you not expect them to do all possible to protect the interests of their club?
FFP and retrospective CL co-efficient points seem to have done United no harm.

What harm has FFP done for City then? Spent 150m last season and is going on to spend 300m this season. Get out of your victimisation phase.

 

[Gentleman Jim]

What harm has FFP done for City then? Spent 150m last season and is going on to spend 300m this season. Get out of your victimisation phase.

The short answer is the 12/13 season.
We had just won the PL and would have liked to have kicked on but it was clear that we had very little to spend without failing FFP.
So we brought in Rodwell, Sinclair and Javi Garcia instead of the players that we really wanted.
We still failed FFP and were hit by a huge fine by UEFA and had a CL squad place taken away.
We are now passing FFP but it's still there and has to be considered.

 

[prath92]

The short answer is the 12/13 season.
We had just won the PL and would have liked to have kicked on but it was clear that we had very little to spend without failing FFP.
So we brought in Rodwell, Sinclair and Javi Garcia instead of the players that we really wanted.
We still failed FFP and were hit by a huge fine by UEFA and had a CL squad place taken away.
We are now passing FFP but it's still there and has to be considered.

You guys spent more than us that summer

 

[Escobar]

And finish 7th.

Nah, I think City will do better than 7th next season

 

[Gandalf Greyhame]

Or he'll leave in 2 years after a 3-year run, but the next manager will have a core of:

Jesus - 23
De Bruyne - 28
Sterling - 25
B. Silva - 25
Sane - 24
Stones - 26
Ederson - 26
Gundogan - 29
and likely Mendy- 26 and Walker - 30 and another CB and maybe another signing too.

Basically just a DM and a CB away from a fine starting XI, and that's with 2 summers left to sign those players and replace any of the above who don't pan out or get injured or leave.

When you put it that way, it's a very good squad. One manager or the other will get maximum out of them, and their maximum can win titles. The Pep lure is helping them build a title winning squad. Hate it, but fair play to them. (not FFP fair, though).

 

[roonster09]

His Porto and Inter teams were world class, although he did build Porto from the ground up,
he inherited a top Inter team and squad from Mancini and added Eto'o, Milito, Sneijder, Quaresma. Inter were easily one of the best teams in Europe in 2010 though he did though a fantastic job on Barca in the semi's.
You look at his Real time as a success I see a failure, a manager who went their to end Barca, and though he won one title he got caned more often than not, failed in the CL and took a team who under Pellgirini finished 3 points behind Barca when he arrived to a team who were 15 points behind, caned twice and absolutely humbled. Of course this wasn't his fault and only his successful season counted right? If your going to compare Enriques to Pep can we say Zidane is better than Jose?

World class teams that did feck all before and after Jose.

People have very short term memory, that Inter team did nothing before and after Jose in CL, in fact they struggled in group stages in 2009-10 season. They failed to win first 3 games, their last group game was do or die. Winner qualifies for next round.

Now they have won the damn thing, people rate that Inter way higher than they were rated back then.

Same with Porto, it wasn't a world class team, it was good team.

 

[MJJ]

Pep left and 2 coaches (3 when you include Roura who took over for a dying Tito) came through - 3 years passed before the treble returned for Barcelona, anything but seamless

There's nothing similar between Zidane & Pep as coaches, Zidane will be remembered as a player not for anything of note as a coach

Winning the CL(maybe twice) and the league in his first full season will get him remembered as a coach. If he keeps going as he is, he will be remembered as a better player and a coach than your beloved.

 

[padr81]

I feel nothing when I think about city and that's the biggest diss possible. All other clubs I can dislike, like or hate. City, I feel nothing.

They are a club funded by a Sugar Daddy, a club that buys multiple 50 million pound players in the hope that one of them becomes the next Ronaldo.

It's disgusting. Any other team would be thinking "well Sterling didn't work out so well, neither did stones and that's 100 million, so we best shift then". Not City, they just pile them up and their players are content with small game time because of the massive money they are on.

Sterling, Sane, Silva, B Silva, De Bruyne, Yaya, Fernando, Gundogan, Jesus, Aguero hell there is probably more in forgetting, Navas and other players.

Every year City go and out and outspend everyone, even when we broke the world record... City still spent more.

Stockpiling until one hits, they can't play them all, but in they come one by one saying they are there for the project because not one of them can say "I love the club" "I'm a fan" "I grew up watching city "z

The club has no soul, no history nothing. I feel nothing for it.

Pep has been hailed as a God of Managing, barca your setup players, clever systems, the man that invented football some would have you believe and what's he done here?

Sold a keeper that has proved he is good enough to win the prem, to buy a 30 million flop and then sell the back up Willy. Scraped top 4 and had defensive issues all season.

So what does that great manager do? Dip into the academy? Create a system that suits the players he has, something Jose does. Jose plays the football his squad can play. Pep buys that squad so they can play he football he wants.

Pep will go out and probably buy another 5 + players costing 50 million and be hailed as a genius when they play well.

Pelgrini won the
League in his first season, Mancini played great football. What's Pep done? Played a distinctly average level of football and gone out and bought an entire new team.

This pep Philosophy is wonderful. Oh shit these lads can't play like Barcelona, lets scrap them all and buy ones that can. Must be nice and easy to spend money the club doesn't make funnelled through oil sheiks, dodgy parented company's / "sponsors" and keep spending until it works and who cares if you have 8 50 million pound players on the pitch because "peps a god".

An utter shit club that doesn't play by the rules. They just buy until they stumble across something

• Feel nothing but writes a novel which is 90 % ranting rubbish. Obviously feel a lot.
• 2nd sentence feels nothing but starts with a hate filled rant.
• Also its the next Messi not Ronaldo
• Gets stupider by saying Sterling and Stones didn't work out. Sterling being really good all season and Stones having his first season.
• Recommends replacing them
• Than hits out at the club for replacing players who don't work out

Your a clever one sunshine.

• Blames City for players saying they love the club even though they dont... so dishonest I mean I'm sure every United player supported United since the moment they were born right.
• Repeats previous rubbish in different fashion.
• Ah no history, here's one to wrap your 12 year old mind around my friend.

First Trophy - Manchester United - 1908
First Trophy - Manchester City - 1904

Even with your hate filled illogical state of mind you can work out which came first can't you? Not that it matters to anyone but you.

• Keeper thats good enough to win the Prem, you know what there was a time David Seaman was good enough to win the Prem. Just read any thread about Hart here by United fans. If you rate Hart as a top keeper, it just confirms what you know about football.
• Oh look a line about no soul in that sentence also, that hits the second bullshit tick a box list of excuses for 12 year olds who know nothing about the club or football.
• Yes he will buy 5 more players, like any manager in his position would.
• Pelligrini took apart a fantastic squad built by Mancini and regressed by wasting money and failing to replace old players for 3 seasons.
• Mancini played decent football, but not in the same world as the football under Pep, yet more faeces you got all over your keyboard.
• Hey you finally said something sensible "The Pep philosophy is wonderful",
• Oh wait, you just ruined it again.
• And finally yet more corruption rubbish. Because you know, these things aren't policed by FFP and you know the police.

The rules of the forum are attack the post not the poster so instead of saying "You sir are an idiot" I'll say "You sir, have just written a very passionate and idiotic rant about a club you claim to feel nothing for which comes across as hypocritical and stupid."

 

[padr81]

World class teams that did feck all before and after Jose.

People have very short term memory, that Inter team did nothing before and after Jose in CL, in fact they struggled in group stages in 2009-10 season. They failed to win first 3 games, their last group game was do or die. Winner qualifies for next round.

Now they have won the damn thing, people rate that Inter way higher than they were rated back then.

Same with Porto, it wasn't a world class team, it was good team.

Because he left a shit storm divided dressing room in his wake at Inter like at Real and Chelsea. His Porto team got picked apart like Monaco will this summer. The bottom line is winning the CL with a great Inter team while fantastic is hardly a Ranieri like feat, when the reason he was brought in was because Mancini failed in the CL and Jose was given the job of rectifying it. Look at the odds, only Barca and yourselves were clear favorites over them. They were the same odds as Real and they beat a Bayern in the final who were twice the odds at the competitions outset. Had Madrid won it, it would be no miracle, had Bayern won it no miracle but because Jose did it was. You can't go into the CL at odds of 10/1 without a world class team especially back then when the big 4 we have dominating now (5 including Atletico) only Barca and United were anywhere near their current level of Europes current best teams. I suggest you look back on how highly that Inter side actually were rated.

His Porto win as I said was fantastic and he built a world class squad there but that Porto side would dismantle most current CL sides (the big 4 aside) and compete with any. Baia, Carvalho, Ferriera, Valente, Deco, Carlos Alberto, Tiago, Maniche the only place they could be said to be anyway not world class was up top and Benni McCarthy wasn't too bad either. It was a monster of a team and the core of a Portugal squad and team (Carvalho, Maniche, Deco right through the middle) who were the best team at the Euro's that summer and who somewhat ironically got Jose'd by Greece in the final.

 

[Werder Herzog]

Think the rest of the league may as well give in now. Archbishop Don Magic Pep has weaved such magic in the transfer window we may as well not even compete. They will be unbeatable next season and i fully expect them to tear apart everyone in every competition, with the signings of Sanchez, Mpabbe,Pele, Beckenbauer why doesn't the rest of football just accept it's fate? The blue moon has well and truly risen.

 

[roonster09]

Because he left a shit storm divided dressing room in his wake at Inter like at Real and Chelsea. His Porto team got picked apart like Monaco will this summer. The bottom line is winning the CL with a great Inter team while fantastic is hardly a Ranieri like feat, when the reason he was brought in was because Mancini failed in the CL and Jose was given the job of rectifying it. Look at the odds, only Barca and yourselves were clear favorites over them. They were the same odds as Real and they beat a Bayern in the final who were twice the odds at the competitions outset. Had Madrid won it, it would be no miracle, had Bayern won it no miracle but because Jose did it was. You can't go into the CL at odds of 10/1 without a world class team especially back then when the big 4 we have dominating now (5 including Atletico) only Barca and United were anywhere near their current level of Europes current best teams. I suggest you look back on how highly that Inter side actually were rated.

His Porto win as I said was fantastic and he built a world class squad there but that Porto side would dismantle most current CL sides (the big 4 aside) and compete with any. Baia, Carvalho, Ferriera, Valente, Deco, Carlos Alberto, Tiago, Maniche the only place they could be said to be anyway not world class was up top and Benni McCarthy wasn't too bad either. It was a monster of a team and the core of a Portugal squad and team (Carvalho, Maniche, Deco right through the middle) who were the best team at the Euro's that summer and who somewhat ironically got Jose'd by Greece in the final.

You are just making up now, his Inter team was divided? That's rubbish.

So winning CL with inter isn't as good as winning PL with Leicester, so we have to down play that achievement. Got it. Like I said, I have told you how shit Inter were in CL that season in group stages, they were in do or die game in GS.

So Jardim don't deserve credit for winning with Monaco as they are going to be stars? When Porto won CL, Deco was hardly a star, that's when they all made their names. They weren't world class players, few of them went on to become world class players later in their careers.

You are just downplaying Jose's achievements which is just laughable.

 

[ZAGREB RED]

If City get a decent keeper in - I don't know much about the Benfica keeper they are buying to be honest - and sort out their back four they could be a formidable team next season as, going forward, they can cause problems for any team. If they can keep Kompany that will be a huge bonus for them.

 

[Adisa]

I personally don't have a problem with City spending whatever they want. We too should do the same.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Pep left and 2 coaches (3 when you include Roura who took over for a dying Tito) came through - 3 years passed before the treble returned for Barcelona, anything but seamless

There's nothing similar between Zidane & Pep as coaches, Zidane will be remembered as a player not for anything of note as a coach

Zidane just won the La Liga title and could be the first manager to win back to back CL's. He's only getting started in his managerial career too but of course in your fanboy head he's done nothing as a coach. Seriously mate you need to tone down this Barca and Pep cult thing you have going on. It's really pathetic and childish.

 

[padr81]

You are just making up now, his Inter team was divided? That's rubbish.

So winning CL with inter isn't as good as winning PL with Leicester, so we have to down play that achievement. Got it. Like I said, I have told you how shit Inter were in CL that season in group stages, they were in do or die game in GS.

So Jardim don't deserve credit for winning with Monaco as they are going to be stats? When Porto won CL, Deco was hardly a star, that's when they all made their names.

You are just downplaying Jose's achievements which is just laughable.

Whose playing it down? It was a fantastic achievement, please don't put words in my mouth. Winning the CL with anyone is, I simply said Inter were one of the best teams in that years CL, entered at odds of 10/1. It doesn't matter how shit they were in the group stages. They had one of the best squads, entered the competition highly fancied and delivered in the end. Those who think Jose turned Inter into champions from some crazy underdogs and went and shocked the world, they are the ones overplaying said achievement. Jose was in charge of one of the favorites and delivered as he so often does. Mancini was sacked precisely for failing to do what Jose did. The CL was demanded by Moratti. It's not a criticism, its exactly why Mancini lost his job, he failed to deliver in Europe with one of the best squads.

I just said Jose built that team at Porto... did you not read my comments and just jump in, in the middle of one of my posts. I've said it repeatedly, I also said it was a great achievement... Really whats laughable is you thinking I'm slaughtering the guy when I'm not even criticizing him, but Porto were seen as many as a dark horse for 2004. That's not downplaying his achievements, its telling the truth.

 

[padr81]

Zidane just won the La Liga title and could be the first manager to win back to back CL's. He's only getting started in his managerial career too but of course in your fanboy head he's done nothing as a coach. Seriously mate you need to tone down this Barca and Pep cult thing you have going on. It's really pathetic and childish.

Fantastic player and proving to be a fantastic coach. To say Zidanes been anything other than amazing is indeed childish. I would say his early achievements are easily on a par with Pep's.

 

[roonster09]

Whose playing it down? It was a fantastic achievement, please don't put words in my mouth. Winning the CL with anyone is, I simply said Inter were one of the best teams in that years CL, entered at odds of 10/1. It doesn't matter how shit they were in the group stages. They had one of the best squads, entered the competition highly fancied and delivered in the end. Those who think Jose turned Inter into champions from some crazy underdogs and went and shocked the world, they are the ones overplaying said achievement. Jose was in charge of one of the favorites and delivered as he so often does. Mancini was sacked precisely for failing to do what Jose did. The CL was demanded by Moratti. It's not a criticism, its exactly why Mancini lost his job, he failed to deliver in Europe with one of the best squads.

I just said Jose built that team at Porto... did you not read my comments and just jump in, in the middle of one of my posts. I've said it repeatedly, I also said it was a great achievement... Really whats laughable is you thinking I'm slaughtering the guy when I'm not even criticizing him, but Porto were seen as many as a dark horse for 2004. That's not downplaying his achievements, its telling the truth.

I said Porto wasn't world class team, they weren't world class players in 2004 when they were making their names at the highest level.

So what happened to the world class Inter team before and After Jose? Why didn't they do anything in CL again?

No, I'm not saying you are criticizing Jose, it's just that you are overrating Porto and Inter team to make it look like it wasn't anything special, saying that team would have torn apart toda'y clubs except big 4 or how world class the players were.

 

[dichinero]

I personally don't have a problem with City spending whatever they want. We too should do the same.

This. But it's quite funny how United fans are so invested in what City are doing in this transfer window. It really is. There is rivalry but it very much feels like people are secretly bricking it that Pep is building a strong team. This thread and the transfer thread is full of FM manager, cheque book manager, dressing room unrest because of too many quality players, 7 attack formations posts etc. It's either bitterness or running scared.
Personally, I'm worried that our rivals are strengthening but it should be enough incentive for us to equally strengthen in like fashion. They will be a force to reckon it no doubt but we have to make sure that they feel the same about us too.

 

[Lowkey]

This. But it's quite funny how United fans are so invested in what City are doing in this transfer window. It really is. There is rivalry but it very much feels like people are secretly bricking it that Pep is building a strong team. This thread and the transfer thread is full of FM manager, cheque book manager, dressing room unrest because of too many quality players, 7 attack formations posts etc. It's either bitterness or running scared.
Personally, I'm worried that our rivals are strengthening but it should be enough incentive for us to equally strengthen in like fashion. They will be a force to reckon it no doubt but we have to make sure that they feel the same about us too.

Its not about bricking it. City just identify targets and don't mess about and get business done early in the window which is how it should be done really. I wish we took the same approach

 

[AmanNits04]

What i hate about Pep is that he is a hypocrite,If he has to spend a fortune on buying players then he should be outright about it and not try to fool media by talking about giving chances to Academy players. Mourinho might be hard to digest but at least he is straightforward about the thing he wants.Mou is not famous for giving game time to youngsters but he did it this year,although it was due to injuries but at least some of our young players go the taste of senior football.i used to hate Pep when he was at barca i hate him even more now. Let's see what he does this year. and what the hell happened to Sterling,he was one of the best talent in English football couple of years ago, Any insight into this city fans?

 

[AXVnee7]

Don't know why he should be given credit for investing in what were established first team players when they were bought, I wouldn't say it's "investing in youth".

If he doesn't win anything next season I'm pretty sure he will be out of the door and rightly so tbh with how much money they're looking like spending.

I think you're missing the point. First of all it is investing in youth. That much is not up for debate. Doesn't matter if they're established first team players or not. David Silva, Aguero etc. were all first team players when they were originally brought to City. But instead of buying players for the here and now, as you'd expect for a 3 year tenure, he has instead gone to build a team for the future. Whether he intends to see that out to its full potential, or leaves it for someone else remains to be seen.

As for the bold statement, I don't think that's likely at all. I'd say there's more chance of Pep walking than being sacked. Man City have been building towards Pep for a long time and they've invested tons of resources to give him the best facilities they can. It would take an unmitigated disaster for them to even consider sacking him.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

What i hate about Pep is that he is a hypocrite,If he has to spend a fortune on buying players then he should be outright about it and not try to fool media by talking about giving chances to Academy players. Mourinho might be hard to digest but at least he is straightforward about the thing he wants.Mou is not famous for giving game time to youngsters but he did it this year,although it was due to injuries but at least some of our young players go the taste of senior football.i used to hate Pep when he was at barca i hate him even more now. Let's see what he does this year. and what the hell happened to Sterling,he was one of the best talent in English football couple of years ago, Any insight into this city fans?

How is Mourinho straightforward about it and Pep fooling people? The bolded bit pretty shows that you're in a biased position in this regard.

 

[Zoo]

This. But it's quite funny how United fans are so invested in what City are doing in this transfer window. It really is. There is rivalry but it very much feels like people are secretly bricking it that Pep is building a strong team. This thread and the transfer thread is full of FM manager, cheque book manager, dressing room unrest because of too many quality players, 7 attack formations posts etc. It's either bitterness or running scared.
Personally, I'm worried that our rivals are strengthening but it should be enough incentive for us to equally strengthen in like fashion. They will be a force to reckon it no doubt but we have to make sure that they feel the same about us too.

Not really, they've been throwing obscene money at it for years.

 

[PepG]

Zidane just won the La Liga title and could be the first manager to win back to back CL's. He's only getting started in his managerial career too but of course in your fanboy head he's done nothing as a coach. Seriously mate you need to tone down this Barca and Pep cult thing you have going on. It's really pathetic and childish.

I agree. Zidane is doing amazing job at Real and these downplaying comments are just typical fanboy reactions. But as i said in Zidane's thread we need to see more how he will evolve as a coach during the years to have more general opinion about his qualities. So far so good.

 

[dichinero]

Not really, they've been throwing obscene money at it for years.

As long as they are not breaking the rules. Its the way of the world these days. José did it at Chelsea, effectively buying the title. You have to spend serious money to get recognition. If a billionaire buys Sunderland, they'd be silly not to do the same. I hate it but that's how it is now. If José does any different, we would be left behind. Simple as.

 

[padr81]

I said Porto wasn't world class team, they weren't world class players in 2004 when they were making their names at the highest level.

So what happened to the world class Inter team before and After Jose? Why didn't they do anything in CL again?

No, I'm not saying you are criticizing Jose, it's just that you are overrating Porto and Inter team to make it look like it wasn't anything special, saying that team would have torn apart toda'y clubs except big 4 or how world class the players were.

Inter were that good and I've given him every credit for building that Porto team from pretty much nothing. The following season Inter did well but were pipped by a resurgent AC if I'm not mistaken, they also eliminated bayern again in the CL but imploded against what was a decent Schalke in the next round (who you guys thrashed I think). In the end Leonardo and Rafa (think it was Leonardo) never improved the squad despite signing Pazzini, Biabiany and Coutinho (2 of the 3 being very average) while AC brought in Robinho, Zlatan, Cassano, Van Bommell etc.. and simply had a better team and squad. Basically Moratti lost the plot at board level. This is a good article on why Inter never kicked on from Joses CL success. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...e-wrong-for-the-nerazzurri-since-2010s-treble

 

[El Jefe]

I liked your first post but I'll quote this one and answer as I can.

Klopp is being judged off a much smaller base than Pep, in reality, his two of the 4 players you mentioned have been new signings and everyone thought Mane was a steal at 30odd million. He also had to play only 40 or so games this season to the rest of the top 6's 50 odd, Pep's 55 and Joses 65 and had a half season e. We'll see how he does if he doesn't spend and has to compete on the same schedule as everyone else next season. Of the players you said went up a level both Mane and Wijndalum are new signings (£60m worth) and of the £81m coming in I'd imagine he played very little part in actually selling those players other than saying "I don't want them". Not Klopp bashing btw I quite like him, but the goal posts are different for Liverpool because the money is smaller. Jurgen has a squad that cost 70m more than Spurs for what its worth, though 220m less than Peps and 300m less than Joses.

Pep has hugely improved Sterling, Kun and dare I say even David Silva this season but the reputation he arrived with is not really anything. People on here said City needed a huge overhaul and now they are blasting the manager for doing it and say he's panicking. Pep said he would "like" to use youth, but has said the gap at City is too big because the reserves or whatever the silly name on our squad is don't get to play real competitive football. This on the same forum where in the Pep thread one person said our squad was so bad we would finish closer to Everton than to United (yes, he was serious and no he didn't mean Everton were coming 6th and United 7th).

He also said he was lucky to get the youth he got at Barca and the one or two he brought through at Bayern. Its like how Ferguson was seen as the greatest promoter of youth, but the reality was he got the class of 92 and after that the production of gems slowed (although never really stopped). On the side of youth too City had about 20 of their most promising youths out of loan. The guy has been totally honest even after the 10 wins in a row Pep was like "Hard times are coming" "I'm not some genius I was lucky to have the players I had at Barca and Bayern" and even went as far as "I'll have more trophyless seasons in my career, whats happened so far in my career is not normal".
Not exact quotes but the exact ones are pretty much the same.

Of course he deserves criticism I've given him plenty myself (especially for 3 at the back) but to suggest Pep see's himself as some football god who was going to the win the prem with Cities u7's like some on here do is completely untrue. He is simply one of the best managers (there's a group of them) he wins when he has the best team and doesn't when he doesn't just like every other manager in football bar the odd exception, (Klopp at Dortmund, Leicester, Jose at Porto). Even when the best/most expensive team don't win, its always one of the 2nd or 3rd who will. To read stupid things like he failed at Bayern where he wrapped up 3 league titles with months to spare just because he lost to Madrid, Barca and Atletico (none of which came from you.) and had it easy at Barca is a joke. Whats even funnier is the people saying he's spending £300m this summer when in reality he's spent £43m, although he may go close to £200m if the stars align and we get every target we've aimed for.

Also wouldn't you say a fairer judgement of that Chelsea side would be to say they won the league quite comfortably over probably the best City side ever the year earlier, with 3 games to spare I believe. Last seasons mutiny is hardly a proper view of their actual footballing ability. They racked up 87 points under Jose that season when something happens twice in 3 years its fair to say the 10th place was the exception. Conte added £120m worth of talent to them for this campaign too.
City for what its worth haven't been in an actual title race since beating Liverpool to the title despite constantly being top 4 and I'll include myself in a group who overrated our squad and didn't see our fullbacks on here decline as much as the did. The reality is Chelsea are better (not something I thought last season) but two emphatic title wins in 3 years say its quote Rafa a fact and needed less than we did. I genuinely though City had a better squad coming into the season but watching games this season its clear we had let 3 key positions fade into nothing and were living off players who peaked 5 years ago plus KDB and Kun.

Great posts btw, and its nice to actually talk about these things with people who say more than Fraudiola and chequebook manager. etc..



That was sarcasm on my part but technically they are Manchester City youngsters regardless of what they cost, also £110m for the 3 of them actually looks cheap now. You just made my night.

I agree with a lot of what you've said. The thing is he had been seen by his supporters as some form of footballing god who was able to do wonders with players. Pep in reality is just like other football managers as you've said. I just hope his die hard fans can admit to that.

I actually have nothing against Pep, I think in the right setting he's a magnificent manager capable of playing absolutely beautiful stuff. My biggest gripe is the inconsistency between his treatment and Mourinho's. Mourinho his whole career has had criticism of buying titles and Pep is on course to do the same. I guess that is a discussion for another thread.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Think he is building a fantastic team, needs his fullbacks so he can squeeze that space then he can really start to defend on the front foot as his teams do. I'd imagine Laporte will be a target to partner Stones, really interested to see how that will work.
They do sort of need a DM, but who that is no idea.

 

[Utdstar01]

I think you're missing the point. First of all it is investing in youth. That much is not up for debate. Doesn't matter if they're established first team players or not. David Silva, Aguero etc. were all first team players when they were originally brought to City. But instead of buying players for the here and now, as you'd expect for a 3 year tenure, he has instead gone to build a team for the future. Whether he intends to see that out to its full potential, or leaves it for someone else remains to be seen.

As for the bold statement, I don't think that's likely at all. I'd say there's more chance of Pep walking than being sacked. Man City have been building towards Pep for a long time and they've invested tons of resources to give him the best facilities they can. It would take an unmitigated disaster for them to even consider sacking him.

Well they are for the "here and now" because they all played a massive part in last season, apart from Jesus who arrived in January but still a huge talent with some expectation.

You never know, they may not have been his first choice signings but he had to settle for the next best options, all the signings he looks to be making this summer are made with the intention of making an immediate impact.

 

[padr81]

@El Jefe - Mourinho does get seen as the villian more than Pep, I think because of stuff like his special one comments. In reality they've both got ego's the size of small islands, I think Pep is arrogant in a different way. The media like to hype guys up to knock them down and weren't too impressed with Jose hyping himself. Tactically Pep has been slaughtered this year, personality wise he seems to have alot more slide than Jose, though Jose in fairness was dealing with the shit in England and at Real Madrid where lets fact it, those are the two places you will get the most shit. Pep had it relatively easy in comparison at Barca and Bayern where the press are more lenient. Pep for what its worth already hates the english media and has done since about 2 weeks into the job.

 

[FCBarca]

Winning the CL(maybe twice) and the league in his first full season will get him remembered as a coach. If he keeps going as he is, he will be remembered as a better player and a coach than your beloved.

Same Zidane who failed miserably as a coach of the youth team at RM, yes

 

[padr81]

Same Zidane who failed miserably as a coach of the youth team at RM, yes

There's zero comparison between that and his senior record. Zidane has had a fantastic start as coach at Real. To retain the CL in your first two year at any club would be an incredible feat.

 

[MJJ]

Same Zidane who failed miserably as a coach of the youth team at RM, yes

How is that relevant to his career at the senior level?

 

[opopop]

I don't get how Man City have been really building for Peps arrival if at the end of it all he is just signing up as many excellent young players as possible. So theyve been building up their transfer kitty then? Thats not as ground breaking as I thought it would be.

 

[padr81]

I don't get how Man City have been really building for Peps arrival if at the end of it all he is just signing up as many excellent young players as possible. So theyve been building up their transfer kitty then? Thats not as ground breaking as I thought it would be.

They've been building everywhere bar the first team because they wouldn't undermine Pellers (though in hindsight they probably should have). What exactly did you think was going to happen with us under Pep? I'm curious..

 

[IrishRedDevil]

=
That was sarcasm on my part but technically they are Manchester City youngsters regardless of what they cost, also £110m for the 3 of them actually looks cheap now. You just made my night.

If you think Sterling was cheap at £50m then we have very different gauges. Granted Jesus and Sane had a decent half season each.

 

[AXVnee7]

Well they are for the "here and now" because they all played a massive part in last season, apart from Jesus who arrived in January but still a huge talent with some expectation.

You never know, they may not have been his first choice signings but he had to settle for the next best options, all the signings he looks to be making this summer are made with the intention of making an immediate impact.

I don't disagree with that, and I've already said there's pressure on Pep to get it right for next season. Mourinho winning 2 major trophies has only intensified that pressure. What Mourinho and Pep do relative to each other will be determining factor in how people view their tenures at the respective clubs. However I think that the overall project is a long term one for the given reasons, and if City go trophy-less again I think it will be the media who want to sack Pep more than the club will. The question for City is, if Pep goes, then who's next? It's not an easy decision by any means and they will be reluctant to sack him at every opportunity.

When I say youth, I don't mean literal kids like Rashford's age. I mean young players who can form the spine of the team for many years for City. He's not just buying players who are going to win him the title, then decline within the next 2-3 years. The players he has bought are ready made to an extent, but still with a long way to progress.

 

[Gentleman Jim]

You guys spent more than us that summer

Subsequent events have proven that the acquisition of RVP and little else was a short sighted decision on your part.
Still, Ferguson got the successful send off he wanted so the plan worked handsomely domestically at least.

 

[padr81]

If you think Sterling was cheap at £50m then we have very different gauges. Granted Jesus and Sane had a decent half season each.

Of course he was. Whether for good or bad (mainly bad) £45m only gets you potential these days not the finished article, not even close. In a world where Mbappe costs £100m after 7 good months, Real Madrid pay £40m for a child (literally a child they can't use for 2 seasons). If you think Sterling was poor you haven't watched much of City this season. Sterling was £44m costing a potential £50, lets take Martial in comparison who is £36m costing a potential £55m I think...
Or Renato Sanches or whomever, potential costs money whether it gets fulfilled or not.

How much would Rashford go for in the current market? 60-70m, maybe more and he has alot less playing time and experience on his cv than Raheem. (Nothing against him, he'll be absolutely world class)
Delle Alli?

Like every deal, we'll use Pogba as an example along with Sterling. Pogba impoves slightly and stays at United 10 years, £89m is a steal. Pogba maintains his current level for 10 years at United, £89m is still good value despite him never reaching BdO status. Pogba waits for 2 seasons than demands a move to Barca who offer a bag of peanuts and Andre Gomes in exchange... Pogba deal was a disaster, likewise with Sterling.

Another 7 years at City even at his current level and its a great transfer, if he kicks on and becomes even better we'll have got him on the cheap. If he regresses and ends up playing left mid for WestBrom in 2019, than its a waste of £50m. As it is currently, it looks like it will be one of the first two options for Raheem. 10 goals and 9 assists in 2016-17. Truth is Sterling wasn't overpriced but Gabby Jesus was a steal at the price or at least looks it so far.

The days of fully fledged superstars costing £50m are gone. You want world class you go with 80 or 90m (see Pogba, Greizmann, Bale). £50m buys you high potential. Good yet never going to be world class players like Perisic are costing £40m for god sake.

£50m these days is the £20m from 2010. Sad but true.