Why do Utd fans keep saying they are glad he does enough to keep himself in a job because he won't seriously challenge for trophies? You guys happy that both your rivals are winning them all like? 
Mikel Arteta | Lego Pep watch
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
But we also had an atrocious run of form under Arteta as well.
Why did the board continue backing Arteta?
The level of investment in Arteta far exceeds Emery. It's not even close. And we didn't even get Emery's preferred targets.
The board will likely still keep Arteta even if he fails to finish top 4. We both know that. Arteta has been a disaster last year and they still kept him.
How is that fair on Emery or Wenger?
I think that when he has his his full squad they play some great football in attack. (They caused Liverpool plenty of problems a couple of weeks ago)
Their squad is paper thin though. They are really missing Partey,Tierney and Tomiyasu.
Tavares is maybe the worst fullback in the league and Soares isn't much better and none of their midfield replacements are as good as Partey.
I wouldn't lavish him with praise just yet but I wouldn't say he is doing a bad job either.
All in all I'd say if he manages to secure 4th and he brings in reinforcements they may have a chance of finishing 4th again next year. (If the Gabriel Jesus links have legs it would be a perfect signing for them)
Realistically United should be taking that place but if Ten Hag doesn't hit the ground running then they may get another shot at it.
Their squad is paper thin though. They are really missing Partey,Tierney and Tomiyasu.
Tavares is maybe the worst fullback in the league and Soares isn't much better and none of their midfield replacements are as good as Partey.
I wouldn't lavish him with praise just yet but I wouldn't say he is doing a bad job either.
All in all I'd say if he manages to secure 4th and he brings in reinforcements they may have a chance of finishing 4th again next year. (If the Gabriel Jesus links have legs it would be a perfect signing for them)
Realistically United should be taking that place but if Ten Hag doesn't hit the ground running then they may get another shot at it.
Everybody would have thought a 2nd place finish for us last season be excellent if you offered it up in pre-season. But the performances of teams around you in the league matter and dropping a bunch of stupid points towards the end of the season is a red flag for the following season. If only we’d acted on it.
Going nowhere. I can’t remember the last time a team conceded so many chances against us. I’m seeing nothing but top four battles, which is probably acceptable to the majority of the fan base as long as they play some kids and try to pass it around.
Because you guys would be a strong outfit with a better manager. With arteta the 4th place spot will always be up for grabs. Liverpool and city are playing on a different level right now. It's the 3rd and 4th spot to be fought for. And Arsenal with arteta gives us a hope to stabilize things. Just like you would have loved Ole to continue managing us. Simple logic.Why do Utd fans keep saying they are glad he does enough to keep himself in a job because he won't seriously challenge for trophies? You guys happy that both your rivals are winning them all like?
They haven't finished in top 4 since 2016. Top 4 is a pretty good season for them.
Will be harder next year with them back in europe so need to stock the squad up more and get in a good CF.
Will be harder next year with them back in europe so need to stock the squad up more and get in a good CF.
Exactly. When rivals are actively championing you to keep your manager, you know that no one thinks they're going to do feck all. Even with second place last season, everyone still saw Ole as nowhere near good enough.
Why are people talking as if they'd be much better off if they had a different manager? A top manager with an ego wouldn't even operate with that squad.
Look at their side today, the entire forward line, parts of the defence, the keeper are all learning on the job in terms of being at a club like Arsenal. They're all young or taking a big step up.
He's doing a good job, it's just total nonsense to suggest otherwise. They weren't great today mind, we should have got a result.
Look at their side today, the entire forward line, parts of the defence, the keeper are all learning on the job in terms of being at a club like Arsenal. They're all young or taking a big step up.
He's doing a good job, it's just total nonsense to suggest otherwise. They weren't great today mind, we should have got a result.
Glad Nketiah is being given chance today again. He provided lots of energy up front. Hopefully he will stay for next season.
Talent wise you have to upgrade if you want to improve but yes lovely attitude. Wish some of our players had the same attitude.
You’re not wrong, they’ve kind of fallen into their position recently. But when they have their first 11 they play some good stuff, Arteta’s big signings have all worked out so far, if he gets it right in the summer and adds some much needed depth I think they’ll get top 4 again.
Plus I’m invested in Arteta now, the guy’s an asshole but I said last year they’d get top 4 and very few agreed with me. Flying or falling in style, it’s gonna be a correct prediction. And I’ll plant my flag again, they’ll get top 4 next season and Swansea will go up automatically.
It depends if Lacazette stays. I have no idea how much fund arsenal has for summer given there is a need to increase squad depth.
In my view, it's quite clear that the Kroenke vision has been quite consistent. They want what they paid for: a club which consistently gets Top 4, but nothing more than that (or, to be fair, nothing more than that without breaking the financials that govern the family investment).
They backed Wenger when they thought he was the cheapest and surest way to deliver this, moved past him when he stopped being able to offer that, plumped for Emery when they thought tinkering was needed, and they back Arteta now because they have come to realise that securing Top 4 status means both investment and radicalism. But that won't last unless Arteta shows progress.
Our fans would sack Arteta earlier imo.
The way our fans were laughing about Arteta earlier and having their mouth shut is quite interesting.
The way our fans were laughing about Arteta earlier and having their mouth shut is quite interesting.
Where does this myth comes from that Our Fans get managers sacked earlier than they deserve it's actually quite opposite infact they show way too much patience and support .
And Arteta shutting up his detractors give me a break let's wait till end of the season shall we before hailing him .He is a poor manager whose team play poorly most of the time and Arsenal aren't building anything with him just like United weren't with Solskjaer , they would eventually realise their mistake and sack him probably 10-15 games in next season .
Last edited:
what are you on about? He’s shit
They are about as bad as us tbh
Wait… What exactly has he achieved? I’m confused. He hasn’t even made the top 4 yet so what’s with the “he’s shutting people up”. Just because he beat a shit United in a game that we probably should have won.
I'm not sure of people are judging us too much on yesterday's performance. We won 3-1 but the performance in general was poor from us yesterday.
We started yesterday with Tavares, Cedric, Elneny & Nketiah. Think all those might struggle to get a regular game for relegation threatened teams. The lack of quality creates a lack of composure, even panic on certain occasions.
We've basically won the last 2 games by making the games crazy games, playing off emotion and hoping for the best. We've had a great deal of luck in both games as well. However, in general with a full team we play with a lot more control and composure. It's why most Arsenal fans are still behind Arteta, because they've seen that a fair bit during the season.
We started yesterday with Tavares, Cedric, Elneny & Nketiah. Think all those might struggle to get a regular game for relegation threatened teams. The lack of quality creates a lack of composure, even panic on certain occasions.
We've basically won the last 2 games by making the games crazy games, playing off emotion and hoping for the best. We've had a great deal of luck in both games as well. However, in general with a full team we play with a lot more control and composure. It's why most Arsenal fans are still behind Arteta, because they've seen that a fair bit during the season.
Arteta needs to make use of what he has. We don't have quality back up for Tierney, Partey, Tomiyasu but it is what it is. To me 4th place or not he is doing a great job this season already.
May be Nketiah will be given more chance for the next few games and I won't be surprised if he becomes as our main striker next season. You need to give the young player a chance. It is up to him to convince Arteta in the remaining games.
I don’t understand how he can simultaneously be so bland and devoid of personality, while also being so eminently dislikeable.
Eddie shouldn't be anything more than a backup for us if we have any ambition going forward. Spalsh the cash on that forward and get quality back up and start selling at decent value, not paying players to leave.
Edu has a long summer ahead of him.
That's just wrong. His personality is not having a personality.
The Arsenal XI playing yesterday would probably be, no doubt. But Arsenal are not going to set out with that midfield in crucial matches unless they have to. The midfield is crucial to Arteta's project, and the failure to achieve a balanced midfield has been a big part of United's dismal season.
Arteta has been lucky in some ways; but it's not going to last long. If he doesn't make progress next season, our really good talent will drop off in form or go elsewhere. He needs a genuine goalscoring threat, cover for the key players in our spine, and ways to maintain attacking energy through the centre, rather than relying on the wings. If he doesn't solve or compensate for these issues, he will fail, and we will have a big problem. But he has done a decent job with most of these things so far.
United fans mocked "unproven" managers. The fanbase hates anyone that aren't a "proven winner". Arteta was mocked because "how dare a top 6 club hire an inexperienced manager".
But United fans are utterly incapable of understanding context. Solskjaer had one of the richest club in the world at his resource, throwing hundreds of millions at different players. Arteta, or any manager at Arsenal do not have the same luxury.
Arsenal can throw money around, but their targets are more limited. No CL means they had to throw more money at even mediocre players. The Arsenal squad is mid-table at best, with paper-thin depth. The club has no quality strikers. (Compared that to United which had like 6 decent strikers).
You have the 5th biggest net spend in the last decade and were the biggest spenders last summer.
You've also spent obscene money on players like Ramsdale, White, Lokonga while Arteta sold/loaned out superior alternatives.
In regards to no quality striker who's fault is that?
Not an Arsenal fan, but I've followed all big clubs closely.
I think United fans will understand it's not merely about "superior alternatives". Squad building isn't football manager where you can recruit all the top players and make them work. Squad personality matters a great deal. Players like Pogba, despite being a top talent, clearly aren't contributing to squad harmony.
The players Arteta sold or loaned out were players with attitude issues that simply don't fit well at Arsenal. Having players that constantly argue against the manager...players that turn up late for training...no matter how good they are, they need to be shipped out.
Aubameyang was given an expensive contract when every football fan in the world is saying he can't be sold...only to have him decline/uninterested in playing after getting that big contract. Arteta and Arsenal thought they have a top striker...only to have that striker suddenly decline in form in the next season.
And United fans will know how hard it is to shift players on expensive contract and had a massive decline in ability. Sanchez was extremely hard to shift out from United. But at United, the club has the money to replace him.
Part of a managers job is to deal with big egos (It's why Ancelotti has been so successful despite not being great tactically). During our last two titles we had to deal with a man child up front in exchange for 20 goals and the previous three we had a squad not exactly known for their submissive nature. Fergie brought Cantona in and tailored his man management towards his character, and got rewarded with his first of many titles.
When all these supposedly uncontrollable egos are performing elsewhere then there's only one place to look. Aubameyang has banged them in under every manager he's played for since Saint Ettiene apart from one.
I just find it ironic that United fans (I know you aren't), are banging on about their toxic dressing room and how it needs a resuffle etc etc etc, but then have a go at Arteta for doing exactly that. Very confusing.
As for Auba, he has a history of attitude problems, that's why we were the only ones in for him really when we signed him, also the time he protested playing for Dortmund until he got his move. He was banging goals in for us too, including times where Arteta was manager..
It really isn't surprising that Auba is scoring goals for Barca, but wait a year and we'll see. I have a very strong feeling Barca fans will be wanting him gone. Auba starts strong, he has done for a while.
And, do Klopp and Pep have many unprofessional egos at City/Liverpool out of interest? Auba acts like a kid, and I have nothing against that, it's quite nice at times, but for a club captain to turn up late to training and games consistently, that's just a no, end of.
People forget Arteta is at the start of his managerial career too, he doesn't have the respect of Klopp/Pep/Other top managers. He has to get that in other ways. He tried with Auba far too long, and eventually said no. If we're going to build the club back, we need to do so with the right characters.
In turn it's the managers job to exert control and show the players who the boss is. Both Fergie and Guardiola took no prisoners when it came to players not getting with their program. Fergie shifted a world class Mcgrath, a future PL winner in Strachan (well when it was the First Division), Roy Keane, England internationals like Ince (because he showed up with a number plate 'The Govenor') and the world class Beckham amongst many others. Guardiola shifted world class players like Ronaldinho, Deco, Etoo and benched Aguero for not pressing enough.
I was upset about the treatment of Guenduzzi, Pepe and Saliba. I previously blamed Arteta for Auba's form. But we have come together as a coercisive unit who are willing to fight for every ball and have every body willing to put their body on the line to defend. The attitude of the team is very good. When we had Auba starting his head would drop and we were much worse. Guenduzzi pissed about in training by all accounts as much and while talented he wasn't getting with the program.
Football fans have very short-term memories, we should all go to the doctors for a check-up!
Prior to the season United had one of the best attacks in European football and were nailed on for a title challenge, or so I saw here. Now apparently the entire/most of their team is garbage and are Conference league level.
No one in their right mind, including every arsenal fan (except probably Ty) had Arsenal anywhere near involved a top 4 race. It was out of the question.
Yes Arteta has spent a lot of money, but he spent it on a lot of young, inexperienced players with a view of challenging in a few years. Very rarely do you see loads of players be brought in and make an impact in their first year, let alone a newly gelling team full of kids. What they’re doing in their first season is remarkable stuff and top 4 would be a huge achievement for the players and manager, who is also young and inexperienced. Very exciting time to be an arsenal fan!
Never seen a manager celebrate a penalty miss quite as much as he did.
I think it was this, the VAR haranguing and cheerleading, and the constant forays out of the technical area have made him seem like a massive gobshite, when he didn't bother me before.
What no one seems to appreciate is we are a de-facto under 23's team. To qualify as an under 23's team you can have only three players above 23. White and Tierney turned 24 this year, but lets for arguments sake they are a few months younger. Pretty much all season we have had no more than three players over the age of 23 in the first team. Its normally been Lacazette, Xhaka and Partey. On the weekend it was Cedric, Elneny and Xhaka, but even still Cedric and Elneny are not leaders.
So were essentially an under 23's team and Arteta has done very well to have us in this position, especially when this is the first season of the revamp following PEA exit and the inclusion of Ramsdale, White, Tomiyasu and Odegaard into the first team, plus elevated roles and expectations for ESR, Saka, Martinelli. Its safe to say we are at the beginning of a cycle. Whist this is Arteta's third full season in charge it feels like a new beginning.
Still alot to fix. We are short of a striker. Short in numbers overall. Plus the Cedric/Tavares as back up wingbacks is a horror show. Tavares has to be the worst wing back in the league. Even worse than Telles and Emerson Royal.
But I dont understand the hate Arteta gets. He is on the verge of qualifying for the CL with the Arsenal under 23's.
So were essentially an under 23's team and Arteta has done very well to have us in this position, especially when this is the first season of the revamp following PEA exit and the inclusion of Ramsdale, White, Tomiyasu and Odegaard into the first team, plus elevated roles and expectations for ESR, Saka, Martinelli. Its safe to say we are at the beginning of a cycle. Whist this is Arteta's third full season in charge it feels like a new beginning.
Still alot to fix. We are short of a striker. Short in numbers overall. Plus the Cedric/Tavares as back up wingbacks is a horror show. Tavares has to be the worst wing back in the league. Even worse than Telles and Emerson Royal.
But I dont understand the hate Arteta gets. He is on the verge of qualifying for the CL with the Arsenal under 23's.
I think some of our fans make too much of the age bracket of our players. The contention is that it's a disadvantage and the players will peak later and hence we'll be a better side. Some of the young players may also drop off. Dele Alli was scoring 18 league goals and making 7 assists as a 22 year old. Where is he now? On the bench at a relegation outfit in his supposed prime years.
There is scope to improve the striking position but we're certainly not a team that caters to our striker for the most part. I personally would start Nketieh to the end of the season and give him a new deal if he scores a few more.
He chose that team and then he decided to recruit no one in January while everyone was begging for a striker
Don't get me wrong, it's exciting to see young players develop, but it can't be an excuse for not finishing top 4.
Well yes, it 100% can be. The expectation at the start of the season was, we'll bring in young players who can develop here as a group and build to challenge for the top 4 in a year or two.
The fact that we are ahead of that position is great, but the weaknesses are still there from the original expectation. They lack experience in various situations which is important, as does Mikel tbh.