Modric deserves Ballon d'Or, but Ronaldo will get it

Varane is a great shout. Had a fantastic season - champions league and WC winner. If you not even considered for that you don’t have a hope in hell if you are a defender.

There are all great players in their own right but you can’t use goals and assist, it’s not a measure of actual performance. Salah does not take pens yet messi and Ronaldo are probably banging in a load each season as my penalty taker. Goals scored is a bit blunt when you whittle down the choices.
 
If Modric won the World Cup, I would say he should get it.

But let’s face it, Ronaldo deserves it again. The numbers he’s produced combined with the third UCL on the trot makes this a very easy decision for me. I know everyone’s desperate for a “new” winner but you have to face the facts.

If you’re going by trophies won then by that logic Raphael Varane deserves it. I mean he’s won everything Ronaldo has PLUS the World Cup. But they’ll never give it to a CB again lol.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
If he is not the best defender on his team how was he the best player in the World. And it is not American Football offense and defense are not entirely different things.
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Because the margin was so small in club and in international competition he stood out from the rest. I don’t know anything about American football, so I’m not sure what you’re getting at. You claimed goals are all that matters and that’s the only thing that should be recognized in individual awards and I think it’s a simplistic view that’s wrong.

Also, the Ballon d’Or isn’t necessarily about being the best player in the world otherwise Messi would win every time. It’s about achievements over the year, and no one can top Varane there.
 
Sayros said:
Because the margin was so small in club and in international competition he stood out from the rest. I don’t know anything about American football, so I’m not sure what you’re getting at. You claimed goals are all that matters and that’s the only thing that should be recognized in individual awards and I think it’s a simplistic view that’s wrong.

Also, the Ballon d’Or isn’t necessarily about being the best player in the world otherwise Messi would win every time. It’s about achievements over the year, and no one can top Varane there.
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What I was trying to say that the players who score and create goals tend to have the most impact since goals are the most impactful thing in Football. And I personally think the Balon D'Or should just go to the best player even if it means giving it to Messi every season.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
What I was trying to say that the players who score and create goals tend to have the most impact since goals are the most impactful thing in Football. And I personally think the Balon D'Or should just go to the best player even if it means giving it to Messi every season.
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That gets boring quickly though, there is fatigue among voters between him and CR7, which is the only explanation I have on why Modric won the UEFA best player. As some others mentioned, they should just divide it by categories of FW, Mid, Defender, and GK and just do away with the Ballon d’Or. Football is just not the kind of game where you can easily distinguish who is the best player in the world when team achievements are also taken into account, although Messi and CR7 kind of made it easier than it was before then.
 
The FIFA awards have been completely invalidated to me going forward.

No Messi in the final 3 and 3 goalkeepers nominated for the best GK(with none deserving of it).

I wonder what the Ballon D'Or final 3 will be. Modric doesn't deserve to be in there imo. He was clearly better in 2016-2017.
 
Sayros said:
Also, the Ballon d’Or isn’t necessarily about being the best player in the world
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It either is or it isn't. This line of thinking is what made a mess of these individual awards, no one knows what they're for.

If the idea is to award the player that has the most achievements, then you have a problem because it is difficult to weigh the competitions won. How do you weigh the World Cup against the Champions League, or against the Champions League and League double? Or against the Treble? If you want to award the best player of a competition, the sensible way would be to give the award to the player with the highest average rating on the team that won the competition. That way you're actually giving the award for a specific competition and the criteria is clear.

But instead of having this, we have several awards now and no one is sure what they're based on. Champions League, World Cup? Does the league form count at all? Do goals count or goals + assists? What's the formula for when you have more than one player with big honors and an impressive goal + assists count? The truth is, it's a mess and it's been made that way so the awards are PR friendly.

Modrić won the UEFA Best Player award and I'm delighted that he did, he's an incredible midfielder. But what did he win the World Cup Golden Ball for? He wasn't the best player in the World Cup and he wasn't on the winning team, so it's confusing how the criteria changes from one competition to the other. I would be happy if Modrić won the Balon d'Or, but then why is Ronaldo supposed to be among the favorites? He went missing in the most crucial stage of the tournament, but he was the top scorer so I suppose the criteria there is 'be on the winning team + score the most goals'. Or just score the most goals. It's all very confusing, and it takes away from the weight of these awards.

We should have a Best Player award for every competition (CL, EL, WC, domestic leagues etc.) where we would award the best player on the winning team, to satisfy this apparent need that people have to give the award to the player already holding some silverware. I never understood that because we know the best player doesn't necessarily have to be on the strongest team, but anyway. If we take care of that, we could have one last award, the one to top them all, one that would be given to the actual best player in the world, irrespective of nationality, club or silverware. That way we could recognize the player that is in fact the best footballer in the world, without all this other noise and PR work. I know it's naive, but it would be cool to have that. Only then, after some time someone would probably say "Let's shake things up a bit, or Messi will get all of these".
 
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No chance was Salah better than Messi last season. It's a team sport so Messi winning the league and Salah making the CL had a lot to do with the team and leagues they were in. But purely performance wise Messi was comfortably ahead. He was the heart and mind of Barcelona's football, orchestrating things from deep, creating chances and making the difference in the final third. Salah was great but clearly not on Messi levels.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
It's a team sport so Messi winning the league and Salah making the CL had a lot to do with the team and leagues they were in. But purely performance wise Messi was comfortably ahead.
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Salah played better in the CL KO stage though.
 
Schneckerl said:
modric's odds are shortening

Salah played better in the CL KO stage though.
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Liverpool played better. Like Barcelona out performed Liverpool in the league. Barcelona Vs Roma was a shambles whereas Liverpool were superb as a team against City.

But when it comes to the actual football, touch, creativity combined with end product, who watched Messi and Salah with their own eyes and thought Salah was better? It's madness. We've gotten to the point where individual performances don't actually matter and it's all about stats, and only in the CL apparently. The football competition of any relevance.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Liverpool played better. Like Barcelona out performed Liverpool in the league. Barcelona Vs Roma was a shambles whereas Liverpool were superb as a team against City.
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Yeah... I agree when people say that about Argentina, but not buying that excuse here.
 
Schneckerl said:
Yeah... I agree when people say that about Argentina, but not buying that excuse here.
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Then maybe you only look at names/reputation. Every few games, particularly away from home, Barcelona's midfield gets completely overwhelmed and overrun. In the league because it's teams like Betis doing it, Messi manages to bail them out. In the CL it's harder for an individual to magically do that.

Anyway, agree to disagree I guess.

I wouldn't mind Modric winning it over Messi, Ronaldo and Salah. Would be a nice change and he has been the world's best CM for a good 3-4 years now. Plus a non attacker winning it would be cool and maybe make it more fashionable for midfielders and defenders winning it in the future.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Then maybe you only look at names/reputation. Every few games, particularly away from home, Barcelona's midfield gets completely overwhelmed and overrun. In the league because it's teams like Betis doing it, Messi manages to bail them out. In the CL it's harder for an individual to magically do that.
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I'm aware of that happening last year quite alot.
Messi regularly manages to perform v Atletico and Real, nothing especially hard about Rome. I'm not saying he can't have off games, but it doesn't look good that his worst club game of the season just happens to be in the CL knockouts blowing a 4-1 advantage against an underdog and it's Barca's 3rd QF exit in a row.
 
Schneckerl said:
I'm aware of that happening last year quite alot.
Messi regularly manages to perform v Atletico and Real, nothing especially hard about Rome. I'm not saying he can't have off games, but it doesn't look good that his worst club game of the season just happens to be in the CL knockouts blowing a 4-1 advantage against an underdog and it's Barca's 3rd QF exit in a row.
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It is particularly hard when your team goes to pieces. Football is a team sport and that seems to get missed all the time funnily enough. One of my biggest heart in mouth matches watching united was at home Vs Villa where Macheda popped up to save our backsides. We were awful as a team. They looked like scoring everytime they tried. It was horrible stuff and the title was on the line. That's how it works. What should have been an easy match became a torrid affair saved by a young kid. Yes he routinely takes Atletico and Real apart from but every game is different. The odd time Barcelona get overrun and he isn't able to save them is fine in the league because they can recover. Not in the CL. That one time he can't save them, it's over. It's the nature of the beast.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
It is particularly hard when your team goes to pieces. Football is a team sport and that seems to get missed all the time funnily enough. One of my biggest heart in mouth matches watching united was at home Vs Villa where Macheda popped up to save our backsides. We were awful as a team. They looked like scoring everytime they tried. It was horrible stuff and the title was on the line. That's how it works. What should have been an easy match became a torrid affair saved by a young kid. Yes he routinely takes Atletico and Real apart from but every game is different. The odd time Barcelona get overrun and he isn't able to save them is fine in the league because they can recover. Not in the CL. That one time he can't save them, it's over. It's the nature of the beast.
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Exactly. This is lost on many people.

As a team, Barcelona aren't as strong as the results would suggest. Too much depends on Messi, and without him we don't have a chance. This is why the criticism he gets is quite unfair and it's also the reason why Ronaldo seemingly "turned it around" in the last few years. Ronaldo didn't turn anything around, it's just that he had a much better supporting cast that is capable of beating Bayern and Liverpool without him, while Messi's supporting cast can't do that.
So for Messi, it's either bail the team out or go out, there's no third option. For Ronaldo, there is a third option and, come the end of the season, this makes some people doubt Messi's superiority.
The image is distorted and I hope things change this season with Coutinho fully in the team and Dembele settling in, because someone needs to carry some of the burden, at least some of the time.
 
zkap said:
Ronaldo didn't turn anything around, it's just that he had a much better supporting cast that is capable of beating Bayern and Liverpool without him, while Messi's supporting cast can't do that.
So for Messi, it's either bail the team out or go out, there's no third option. For Ronaldo, there is a third option and, come the end of the season, this makes some people doubt Messi's superiority.
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Yeah Ronaldo won the 2016 and 2018 CL with pretty much taking two KO rounds off(Final and SF). Can't think of any superstar player who can afford that luxury.


amolbhatia50k said:
It is particularly hard when your team goes to pieces. Football is a team sport and that seems to get missed all the time funnily enough. One of my biggest heart in mouth matches watching united was at home Vs Villa where Macheda popped up to save our backsides. We were awful as a team. They looked like scoring everytime they tried. It was horrible stuff and the title was on the line. That's how it works. What should have been an easy match became a torrid affair saved by a young kid. Yes he routinely takes Atletico and Real apart from but every game is different. The odd time Barcelona get overrun and he isn't able to save them is fine in the league because they can recover. Not in the CL. That one time he can't save them, it's over. It's the nature of the beast.
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Anyways that part was about Salah not Ronaldo. Fact is he performed great in every single round other than the final where he was injured and that's a tough thing to do even when your team plays well (see Ronaldo). I wouldn't vote him over Messi, but that's the competition he had better individual performances this year.
 
would prob have my top 3 as Ronaldo, Mbappe and Messi. obviously cant finish like that but also whats with the goalkeepers on the list?
 
Vato said:
Ronaldo is such a lil bitch sometimes. For his crying alone, I hope Modric wins it.
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Me too

Really special for Modric to the best in the World. No way Ronaldo can go above Messi on Ballon d'Or's won. This should take the World Cup into account too and Modric beats Ronaldo every day on that score.
 
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Meanwhile Modric said Ronaldo sent a message congratulating him and saying he deserved it and that he hopes to see him soon.
 
Blackice64 said:
Me too

Really special for Modric to the best in the World. No way Ronaldo can go above Messi on Ballon d'Or's won. This should take the World Cup into account too and Modric beats Ronaldo every day on that score.
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My opinion is different regarding that matter. I hope Ronaldo surpasses Messi in Ballon d’Or’s, showing that determination goes above talent... and because I hate Barcelona a lot, and dislike Messi for being basically a white walker with his NT.
 
Colombian Mancunian said:
I hope Ronaldo surpasses Messi in Ballon d’Or’s, showing that determination goes above talent
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Determination? The best PR in the world you mean. A shame Messi was robbed in 2013. Score should be 6-4 at least in Messi's favour right now. And that is being generous to CRonaldo.
 
Can we please stop this narrative. You take Modric off Madrid and they still win the CL. You take Ronaldo away and they don't. Is anybody taking Madrid to win a fourth CL in a row now that Ronaldo has gone? Enough with the Luka Modric hype. Fantastic player - yes. Ballon d'or winner - no.
 
charlton66 said:
Can we please stop this narrative. You take Modric off Madrid and they still win the CL. You take Ronaldo away and they don't. Is anybody taking Madrid to win a fourth CL in a row now that Ronaldo has gone? Enough with the Luka Modric hype. Fantastic player - yes. Ballon d'or winner - no.
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I'd say it would've been the other way round. Real Madrid would've reached the semis without Ronaldo and they effectively went passed Bayern and Liverpool without him since he had no impact whatsoever. Without Modric though.. he was amazing against Bayern.

In my humble opinion, Cristiano was nowhere near being the best player last season. In the previous years he had important goals speaking for him despite not participating much but this season he was anonymous in these matches. Messi, Salah, Modric and for me Neymar, too, were better.

But I think the Ballon D'Or is bullshit anyway, so I don't really care who wins this joke of a prize. Neither Cristiano nor Messi should have as many of them as they currently do. Unless you'd exclude team accomplishments but then the last 10 years would've been pretty onesided.
 
I still will never understand why trophies won as a team influences who wins the Ballon d'or.

A striker could score 40 goals and have a fantastic year but not win anything because the team itself wasn't good enough. Now it just feels like, let's pick the main player from the team who won the Champions league last season.

Its also completely biased towards forwards. I think Modric is becoming a bit overrated, but I will be fair and say that he deserves to win it.
 
JSArsenal said:
I still will never understand why trophies won as a team influences who wins the Ballon d'or.

A striker could score 40 goals and have a fantastic year but not win anything because the team itself wasn't good enough. Now it just feels like, let's pick the main player from the team who won the Champions league last season.

Its also completely biased towards forwards. I think Modric is becoming a bit overrated, but I will be fair and say that he deserves to win it.
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I don't think it used to be like that. I still remember when Rivaldo won it in 1999 when Beckham got 2nd and Roy Keane came in 6th place. Also Henry didn't win it in 2004 (can't remember who did that year) when he probably should have.

I'd like to see Modric win it as I thought he was excellent in the champions league and had a great world cup.
 
Zehner said:
I'd say it would've been the other way round. Real Madrid would've reached the semis without Ronaldo and they effectively went passed Bayern and Liverpool without him since he had no impact whatsoever. Without Modric though.. he was amazing against Bayern.

In my humble opinion, Cristiano was nowhere near being the best player last season. In the previous years he had important goals speaking for him despite not participating much but this season he was anonymous in these matches. Messi, Salah, Modric and for me Neymar, too, were better.

But I think the Ballon D'Or is bullshit anyway, so I don't really care who wins this joke of a prize. Neither Cristiano nor Messi should have as many of them as they currently do. Unless you'd exclude team accomplishments but then the last 10 years would've been pretty onesided.
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Let's just see how well Real Madrid do this year in the CL without Ronaldo.

Having said that just noticed that City are the current favorites with the bookies to win it and we are listed at tenth behind the other 3 English clubs. Sad that!
 
pregra said:
Determination? The best PR in the world you mean. A shame Messi was robbed in 2013. Score should be 6-4 at least in Messi's favour right now. And that is being generous to CRonaldo.
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Ribery was robbed in 2013, same as Sneijder in 2010. Score should have been 4-4, heck, I hope that Ballon D'Or strips them of those titles (on journo votes Ribery and Sneijder won them).
 
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