Ole & United vs. Frank & Chelsea: who will have the better season?

El Zoido said:
OGS hasn’t had a decade of experience, Molde barely even counts. It’s a totally different game. What experience does he bring from Molde that is applicable to managing a club like Man Utd? Hardly anything tbh.
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It's not just Molde though, is it? He's not only managed the Prem, he was also the Man United reserve team manager (surely that would give him some insight into how things work at Old Trafford).

I'm not saying he has an Ancellotti like CV but it's not nothing!
 
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Lampard needs to be given time before people start offering judgement about him. Having said that I really doubt if Roman will offer him that patience if he were to finish outside top 4. January window could be very crucial for Chelsea and Lampard.
 
roonster09 said:
They are struggling for goals now, their style of play is good and they commit more players for attack but for some reason they are not scoring enough goals and in some games they are not even creating good chances.
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Its because Tammy is easily marked out of games against physical defenders.
Ive been consistent on Chelsea throughout this entire season. They havent got enough goalscorers across the front line and they havent any thrust through midfield. The midfield ends up passing it wide and they have one target in the middle who is too beanpole like to challenge for headers.
Frank was very condescending to us about being a counter attack side after the 4-0 so its lovely to see irony in play here.
 
AshRK said:
Lampard needs to be given time before people start offering judgement about him. Having said that I really doubt if Roman will offer him that patience if he were to finish outside top 4. January window could be very crucial for Chelsea and Lampard.
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At the start of the season, hardly anyone had us finishing in the top four. Unless we spend loads next month, I can't see Frank being under any real pressure to get a top four spot.
 
duffer said:
Lampard does seem to be used on here by Man United fans as a stick to beat OGS with, to the point that it's turned many against Lampard.

I personally don't think it's a fair comparison, one is a rookie and the other had a decade of managerial experience.

Lampard v Gerrard and OGS v someone who had been managing for around a decade (Brendan Rodgers?) would make more sense.
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Chelsea were always going to get a rough patch - and I still can't see Chelsea ending in front of Spurs unless they sign really wisely in january.
 


One thing is conceding to a well drilled counter but conceding in this manner is just shocking. The first 11-12 moves seemed like they were happening in slow motion. Really passive defending.
 
cyberman said:
Its because Tammy is easily marked out of games against physical defenders.
Ive been consistent on Chelsea throughout this entire season. They havent got enough goalscorers across the front line and they havent any thrust through midfield. The midfield ends up passing it wide and they have one target in the middle who is too beanpole like to challenge for headers.
Frank was very condescending to us about being a counter attack side after the 4-0 so its lovely to see irony in play here.
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I disagree ,infact I find Tammy's all-round game to be the biggest plus point with him, not Firmino level but very good when you consider he was being marketed as a Lukaku/Michy type who scores but does feck all else.
 
Dancfc said:
I disagree ,infact I find Tammy's all-round game to be the biggest plus point with him, not Firmino level but very good when you consider he was being marketed as a Lukaku/Michy type who scores but does feck all else.
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I don’t think the poster is knocking his all round game, just saying he’s your only source of goals....mark him well and Chelsea will struggle to score
 
T00lsh3d said:
I don’t think the poster is knocking his all round game, just saying he’s your only source of goals....mark him well and Chelsea will struggle to score
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I disagreed with the comment he's marked out easily by physical defenders, I don't really think that's the case atall. I can't remember many if any games he's been on the outside of a game and only a few days ago bullied Alderwierld (admittedly not the prime version but still).

He's been one of the surprises of the season for me.
 
AshRK said:
Lampard needs to be given time before people start offering judgement about him. Having said that I really doubt if Roman will offer him that patience if he were to finish outside top 4. January window could be very crucial for Chelsea and Lampard.
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I don't think he's under any real pressure to be honest. He still hasn't had the benefit of a transfer window and he's overachieved with this group so far.
 
duffer said:
At the start of the season, hardly anyone had us finishing in the top four. Unless we spend loads next month, I can't see Frank being under any real pressure to get a top four spot.
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I don't think fans will put any pressure on him but I am not sure if Roman follows the same ideology. He has sacked managers who performed reasonably well in the past, won't surprise if he does the same with Lampard at the end of the season, although that would be really harsh.
 
AshRK said:
I don't think fans will put any pressure on him but I am not sure if Roman follows the same ideology. He has sacked managers who performed reasonably well in the past, won't surprise if he does the same with Lampard at the end of the season, although that would be really harsh.
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Unless we really shit the bed and finish 10th I can't see it but as you say, with Roman you never know. I'd be utterly gutted if he's not given until at least the end of next season.
 
AshRK said:
I don't think fans will put any pressure on him but I am not sure if Roman follows the same ideology. He has sacked managers who performed reasonably well in the past, won't surprise if he does the same with Lampard at the end of the season, although that would be really harsh.
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Can't see it.

People need to apply context a bit more I'm my opinion. We sacked a lot of managers with the old guard were in or around their prime pretty much for that reason if that makes sense, with such players at peak age there's no mitigating circumstances for bad results, so if you're below Aston Villa in February with those set of players like Scolari waa of course you're out on your ear.

The only way Frank is in any sort of danger is if these performances carry on for the next couple of months.
 
Dancfc said:
Can't see it.

People need to apply context a bit more I'm my opinion. We sacked a lot of managers with the old guard were in or around their prime pretty much for that reason if that makes sense, with such players at peak age there's no mitigating circumstances for bad results, so if you're below Aston Villa in February with those set of players like Scolari waa of course you're out on your ear.

The only way Frank is in any sort of danger is if these performances carry on for the next couple of months.
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Your points are fair enough and that is why I said fans would not put pressure and neither should he be sacked but with Roman you never know. He does not work on emotions, he has shown in the past he can be ruthless. I am not saying Roman will surely sack him, but I would not be surprised if he does sack him if Chelsea finishes outside top 4.
 
AshRK said:
Your points are fair enough and that is why I said fans would not put pressure and neither should he be sacked but with Roman you never know. He does not work on emotions, he has shown in the past he can be ruthless. I am not saying Roman will surely sack him, but I would not be surprised if he does sack him if Chelsea finishes outside top 4.
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In all honesty I'm more worried about the average fans lack of patience than Roman's. They won't call for Lampard's sacking but I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see this season's Jorginho being primed for a hostile pasting if results don't improve.

On the Chelsea forum I use numerous fans vowed to show patience if academy players were playing and now the time has come to put that vow into practice they're not only regaining on it but going after the young boys themselves.
 
duffer said:
It's not just Molde though, is it? He's not only managed the Prem, he was also the Man United reserve team manager (surely that would give him some insight into how things work at Old Trafford).

I'm not saying he has an Ancellotti like CV but it's not nothing!
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I mean he's literally been learning from Sir Alex for years, that's not a nobody to be learning from.

But the main takeaway from Ole is that he's had some success in Europa with Molde vs far superior opposition, including consecutive draws v Ajax
 
duffer said:
Lampard does seem to be used on here by Man United fans as a stick to beat OGS with, to the point that it's turned many against Lampard.

I personally don't think it's a fair comparison, one is a rookie and the other had a decade of managerial experience.

Lampard v Gerrard and OGS v someone who had been managing for around a decade (Brendan Rodgers?) would make more sense.
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It’s easy to know what side of the fence you’re on in regard to Ole anyway.
 
Dancfc said:
I disagree ,infact I find Tammy's all-round game to be the biggest plus point with him, not Firmino level but very good when you consider he was being marketed as a Lukaku/Michy type who scores but does feck all else.
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But he doesnt score or provide the player that others play off of which is crininal when you dont have other goalscorers.
I read he has 3 goals in 10 weeks, thats not near good enough.
You just dont trouble the CBs enough, theyre too comfortable when not being moved around.
 
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duffer said:
At the start of the season, hardly anyone had us finishing in the top four. Unless we spend loads next month, I can't see Frank being under any real pressure to get a top four spot.
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Let's be honest though at the start of the season it seemed Lampard was probably only in place for a year as no other manager would touch Chelsea what with the transfer ban compounding the loss of Hazard

The landscape has changed now, has Lampard shown enough that even without a top 4 finish that Chelsea stick with him or will they as assumed in the summer replace him with a more renowned manager?
 
charlenefan said:
Let's be honest though at the start of the season it seemed Lampard was probably only in place for a year as no other manager would touch Chelsea what with the transfer ban compounding the loss of Hazard

The landscape has changed now, has Lampard shown enough that even without a top 4 finish that Chelsea stick with him or will they as assumed in the summer replace him with a more renowned manager?
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It's not really changed that much, we've gone from being banned for 2 windows to 1. We still lost Hazard. I never got the impression Lampard was a temp appointment (anymore than any of our managers!).

Also, I don't think any manager would have been put off by a transfer ban. Provided the expectations were realistic, there's only a handful of managers in the world who would turn us down and that's nothing to do with the ban.

If Lampard spunks £200 mil in January and we still keep losing at home to shite teams and finish 8th or something, then he'll be under pressure for sure.
 
cyberman said:
But he doesnt score or provide the player that others play off of which is crininal when you dont have other goalscorers.
I read he has 3 goals in 10 weeks, thats not near good enough.
You just dont trouble the CBs enough, theyre too comfortable when not being moved around.
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His recent goal record kind of back ups my point. If he was offering nothing outside of goal numbers he'd be getting absolutely roasted from all angles right now (like Lukaku once his goals dried up at United). Tammy's hold up play and movement is very good which has led to some excellent assists (Burnley, Watford) alongside some excellent games despite not scoring/assisting (Spurs) and is doing well leading the press although does tire a bit late on.

The difference with him playing compared to Michy and Giroud is night and day.
 
duffer said:
It's not really changed that much, we've gone from being banned for 2 windows to 1. We still lost Hazard. I never got the impression Lampard was a temp appointment (anymore than any of our managers!).

Also, I don't think any manager would have been put off by a transfer ban. Provided the expectations were realistic, there's only a handful of managers in the world who would turn us down and that's nothing to do with the ban.

If Lampard spunks £200 mil in January and we still keep losing at home to shite teams and finish 8th or something, then he'll be under pressure for sure.
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It's changed in the sense that Lampard has done much better than many expected, but yes like you said that won't mean much if he spends and current results don't change
 
Ole's got to go and beat Frank again to have a chance at top 4!

Going to be a terrible game of football.
 
Props to Lampard for having the balls to drop kepa recently, it's things like this that when comparing the two managers shows up Ole for not having a back bone to drop de gea over the past year during some awful spells and he even had a far better back up keeper than what Chelsea have to pull such a move.
 
So far Lampard has been better overall, but Ole has won 2/2 games vs Chelsea.
Can he get a third one even without Rashford?
 
Paul_Scholes18 said:
So far Lampard has been better overall, but Ole has won 2/2 games vs Chelsea.
Can he get a third one even without Rashford?
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We’re still unbeaten against Chelsea under ole, we beat them last season in fa cup, this season in league and league cup
 
DJ_21 said:
We’re still unbeaten against Chelsea under ole, we beat them last season in fa cup, this season in league and league cup
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I know. Think we have 6 in a row since they beat us overall.
Don't feel as good this time. No Rashford who loves playing against them.
No Pogba either who have enjoyed playing them.

Not sure how we should really hurt them. James and Martial on the counter I guess.
 
Well probably lose to you again. We can't deal with sides who park the bus and hit us on the break with speed merchants.
 
Paul_Scholes18 said:
I know. Think we have 6 in a row since they beat us overall.
Don't feel as good this time. No Rashford who loves playing against them.
No Pogba either who have enjoyed playing them.

Not sure how we should really hurt them. James and Martial on the counter I guess.
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Hopefully Bruno should be more focused on attacking in the number 10 role as matic should be playing and will have a more defensive role. I’m confident we can get a win against them, there lacking defensively and we’ve improved a bit defensively.
 
duffer said:
Well probably lose to you again. We can't deal with sides who park the bus and hit us on the break with speed merchants.
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While that's about the only thing we are decent at, we'll be missing Rashford who is very important in that tactic and you'll most likely dealing with Mata and Lingard instead.
 
Bruno is going to have a field day against that back line. Neither Chelsea keeper look convincing.
 
Beats me as to how Chelsea figure a past it willy is better than kepa even if kepa's massively out of form. The fact that they paid 70M for a dud like karius notwitstanding.

I'd say united are going to win the match though, even without Rashford. Chelsea's defending is shocking.
 
Pedro and Willian still starting big games in 2020 is not going to get it done. They looked far better with Giroud on, he holds the ball up for all his failings. Jorginho and Kovacic is too one paced (Kovacic is quick but he plays slow), Mount is a project and they have a dodgy backline.

Long way off challenging.
 
Bobski said:
Pedro and Willian still starting big games in 2020 is not going to get it done. They looked far better with Giroud on, he holds the ball up for all his failings. Jorginho and Kovacic is too one paced (Kovacic is quick but he plays slow), Mount is a project and they have a dodgy backline.

Long way off challenging.
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Pedro, Willian, Giroud all to go in the summer. Think Sancho arrives with Ziyech. Chilwell and a top striker. Dont think Kepa gets replaced permanently or sold
 
On the handful of games I've seen of Chelsea this season I think they move the ball pretty well and are quite good in their attacking patterns, they just don't finish them off well enough. I'd say they have a clearer style of football than ours but like I said I've not seen enough to really make a proper judgement on their style of play. Not signing a striker in January could cost them big time.
 
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