No one has complete freedom under Deschamps that's no a thing and never will be and Pogba isn't the player with the most freedom anyway, that's Griezmann.
Paul Pogba / turned down United offer of 300k as “nothing”
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No one has complete freedom under Deschamps that's no a thing and never will be and Pogba isn't the player with the most freedom anyway, that's Griezmann.
He’s a world class player. Plain as day.
Were choosing to not make the most of that, he will move on and do brilliantly (again) at club level which disproves your point on him being good at only international level.
Bruno is a high work rate no 10. With Ronaldo he will be playing deeper as well. Imo there’s no reason why it cannot work with the right approach and the right partner for Pogba.
There is a LOT of room for improvement in this team, one area is the press and another is maintaining possession. Both areas I believe will improve with a top level DM, both areas also help improve Pogba’s game imo.
That's what I was asking for because almost every report I've read has listed his wages at £290K a week. That isn't insubstantial, but it's from 400K as well.
Right, I'm sure they were misquoted when they said Pogba deserves to leave for a better club.
That doesn’t equate to a media circus. Like I said, you guys get worked up over nothing.
Erm not sure why you’ve gone off on one. Obviously I’m not saying our other midfield options are better and obviously this is with an idea that we’d then go and replace him.
Ironically it’s the guy you defend day and night who’s inadequacies as a coach are the reason we don’t often see a midfield structure in place that would allow us to play Pogba and get the best out of him regularly. It’s also that same coach’s inadequacies when it comes to competing for major honours that are why Pogba has partly ran his contract down as he doesn’t think we can compete for major honours.
Nobody is bigger than United, not Ole and not Pogba. It’s patently obvious to me that no player is worth all the palaver that Pogba brings. To his mouth running agent, to him ducking questions and making deliberately provoking statements on a regular basis.
edit - just seen your other post too…
hmm . I wonder which individuals hired by Manchester United are responsible for fixing these issues you mention in bold.
Sorry I didn't mean it to sound like a direct dig at you, more a general frustration with people seemingly happy to see the back of our single most creative player in the squad even though (imo) we've done very little to get the most out of the large investment we made in this player.
On your point about it perhaps being Ole's fault why we haven't done what I feel is required to get the best from him, there is some truth to that but it's also a fact (to me at least) that you absolutely have to partner Pogba with a top level DM and we simply do not have one. Matic would be perfect if he were 25 but that's not the version of Matic we've had in his time here.
Can we blame Ole for the fact we don't have a top level DM? Perhaps, but at the same time he's been rebuilding pretty much every area of the pitch since he's been here. He's perhaps wrongly focussed on other areas and put his trust in McFred and Matic to do a job whilst he focussed elsewhere, I think I'd be contradicting myself if I said he hasn't because as much as I defend the manager I've also been banging on about getting a top DM for 2 years and how important I felt it was.
I honestly believe at top DM would have allowed Ole to field a more balanced side and focus on results rather than the constant selection dilemma that is our midfield. Without the balance in midfield the areas I mentioned like pressing and possession are very difficult to improve.
So yeah, we can put some blame on the management but that's not what were talking about in this thread, that doesn't mean we should get rid of the player does it. To me it just highlights the things we could have done to get the most from our investment and what a total waste it will therefore be if he does leave on a free.
I agree with pretty much all you are saying. The thing is though none of these other players that have failed to varying degrees are asking for a new contract between £4-500k per week which still isnt signed (and should never be on offer anyway).
Where I would disagree is mentionin gthe VDB experiment though. He was never the right signing in my opinion in the first place. I personally fidn it ludicrous people feel Pogba is so hard to replace when he hasnt consistently doen that much, more than others of course, but people seem to think he is near irreplacable, that is crazy.
While I feel we don’t have the right MF to get the most out of him it be criminal to get rid of him when our MF options are Fred, Mctominay and Matic
I have a feeling Pogba wants to leave United but we will offer him a contract out of desperation that only an idiot would turn down and he will stay.
He started the season well but I don't change my view on him, I want to see the back of him. Far too many average displays and media leaks from him and his agent.
We don't need his circus.
He started the season well but I don't change my view on him, I want to see the back of him. Far too many average displays and media leaks from him and his agent.
We don't need his circus.
For someone throwing out
emojis, you sure are living up to it.‘I want him to come but Raiola can’t be part of the deal, which we all know won’t happen but I’ll keep talking about it anyway’ Houllier indeed.
Ah those goalpost a’changing, did you not say. . .Come back again when Maguire's agents talks about how much Maguire deserves to play for a bigger club.
You said he was a failure for his price & wages, then said you’re not taking into consideration ‘his cnut agent’, so I provide you with one of many [by the ridiculous standards you & others impose] ‘failures’ & your defence is. . . doesn’t count cause he doesn’t have a ‘cnut agent’. The epitome of the disingenuous nonsense people get into in regards to Pogba.
Trouble with posters like yourself is, it’s not actually about Pogba or Raiola. We’ve far more players who underperform & no one seems to be that bothered when DvBs agent discloses agreements with the club in public. There are enough reasons on the pitch to critique the player, fabricating nonsense is unnecessary.
Lets be honest the only way he is staying here is if no one else comes in with a decent wage offer for him and his agent, which I dont actually see happening in the current climate, maybe PSG or Newcastle that will be it, Juventus struggling on the money side according to reports and Madrid will be going all out for Mbappe, for United I don't understand giving him a wage rise, hes not exactly set the place on fire since his return, no one has a clue on his best position, signed player after player to get the best out of him, for me simply the pace of the premiership is to quick for him.
International football is a lot slower than PL, which allows Pogba to dwell a bit, time which he doesn't get in PL.
Because we have Bruno, who is better.
Yet Pogba can't (or won't) play CM as he can't defend to save his life.
for that money....he should go
Yeah we should stick with McFred and shouldn't replace Pogba.
Always felt he should move to city. The De Bruyne Pogba + 1 midfield would be incredible under Guardiola.
If his family's settled in the NW, he should consider it.
If his family's settled in the NW, he should consider it.
You think he has the work rate to thrive in a Guardiola team? Can’t see it myself
Inspired answer. So we only need one class player then, there was me thinking we need class players across the squad…
Let’s shop in the championship now, because we have Bruno.
Blueberry Spaghetti hair.
And Wayne Rooney really likes the 2008 film in which a Clint Eastwood stars as as a war veteran turned vigilante.
I don’t think it’s a case of ‘getting rid of him’. He’s ultimately the one not signing a new deal and who’s stood idle as his agent shits on the club at every opportunity. He doesn’t want to be here, he wants to win trophies. We won’t win trophies and we shoe horn him into a position where we can’t get the best out of him because we have a manager who can’t balance a team properly and who like you more or less said ignored the problem dm position. He had two opportunities to sort it recently. Instead he signed vdb for 45 mill to sit on the bench. Then he signed sancho for 70 million to also sit on the bench. And then plays Paul Pogba in jaden sanchos position. Paul Pogba being here the negatives outweigh the positives regardless of how good he is. Hence why I feel it’s time to just let the relationship end.
But the negatives are largely our own as a club and mismanagement.
Why compound the problem by getting rid instead of properly addressing the issue and retaining a world class midfielder? Surely that’s the proper approach for a big club trying to get back to the top.
I agree there are issues, as I outlined, but as mentioned above these are caused by how we have approached the midfield and through neglecting what’s really been an obvious requirement, something we knew we needed to address before we even signed him.
To me, the natural progression for the squad, both quality wise in personnel and in our approach/balance on the pitch is to finally get that top level DM (that we need regardless of Pogba staying or leaving) … partner them with Paul, then focus on playing with more pressing intent and a higher line, with the goal of retaining more possession and having more grip on games, that we see with France and that would suit both Paul and the squad as a whole… that’s my personal vision for this team Ole has created.
I think we take a step back by losing him and miss an opportunity to go up a gear as a squad with excellent players in midfield (should we get that DM.) we will see how it pans out but my fear is we won’t properly replace Pogba, we still need a top DM and by the time we actually address these positions we will have lost Cavani, and possibly Ronaldo, so the time to create uniform quality across the starting 11 is now.
I think we properly replaced him in Jan '20 when we signed Bruno Fernandes, the player who has made the position Pogba is most suited to his own. Since then Pogba has been playing mostly on the left and we signed another winger in Sancho this summer.
We signed players to replace him, before he leaves. The idea that he will still need replacing is bonkers to me.
You, as a Manchester United fan, have always felt Paul Pogba should go to City?
Er, the players interests are not being discussed, it’s the club’s interests we are concerned about. Pogba has no concern about United’s interests, so why should we care about his?
It's not got Luckhurst's name on it right? So I'm not sure how credible this will be.
For that money they can have him though - it's a lot on wages for a player we can't find the best position for.
Never said that, don't make things up.
We don't need Pogba, that doesn't mean that the midfield is good enough as is.
So you just made irrelevant post then. How is Pogba being defensively weak is relevant to my post saying we need CM to replace Pogba?
Not really because Pogba was rarely ever played as a proper no 10 for us like Bruno was brought in for.
When we signed Bruno nobody thought ‘ah that’s Pogba replaced.’
If Pogba, our most creative midfielder leaves, then he absolutely needs replacing in this team.
Christ, some are happy to see him leave and not even bother attempting to replace him!
Not really because Pogba was rarely ever played as a proper no 10 for us like Bruno was brought in for.
When we signed Bruno nobody thought ‘ah that’s Pogba replaced.’
If Pogba, our most creative midfielder leaves, then he absolutely needs replacing in this team.
Christ, some are happy to see him leave and not even bother attempting to replace him!
Here's the thing, if you let an important player go before you replace him, people will complain that you should have bedded someone in before letting them go. And if you do bed replacements in, then some people will claim that you never replaced the player because you didn't sign anyone after they left. In my opinion we've replaced him and you're in the second camp.
That said replacements are rarely like-for-like. Yes, Pogba was never really played as a pure #10 in earnest, like Bruno is, but he was very often played as the most free of three midfielders. He has played mostly with two of Matic, Herrera or Fellaini behind him when played in CM. Those or McFred. He's not played that much in the base of a two-man midfield.
As such Bruno has taken his position. Now Bruno might be using his freedom to play higher up the pitch (or it might be an instruction, who knows) and instead of 4-3-3 we might be playing more 4-2-3-1, but regardless Pogba's position has gone to Bruno. It hasn't gone to Fred or McTominay, they have replaced Herrera/Matic/Fellaini not Pogba.
If we sign midfielders to play in the base of the midfield after Pogba leaves, that would technically be upgrading on McFred rather than replacing Pogba who doesn't need replacing any more. His position is already gone and now he's being shoehorned into positions that don't suit him (or us) given the formation we play.
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Rich Fay also has some connections to United, so there could be something to this, but the fact that no one else has reported this (including reliable French outlets) means that I can't take this so seriously.
things don’t happen in a vacuum when discussing football. If people deem it perfectly fine for clubs to act in their best interest then they can’t turn around and vilify players for doing the same. Especially when United had ample opportunity to not let things get to this stage.
you want it to be one way, but it’s the other way
Bruno isnt better than Pogba. No chance. Not as accomplished and not as good a footballer.
More consistent and more effective and more productive. Pogba isn't as much of a creator or anywhere close to the goalscorer as Bruno, but he's more talented. Unfortunately for Pogba, he's never found a position where he has settled down in at United.
He plays higher up the pitch, hes supposed to score more. Hes not more consistent, that's make believe nonsense. Bruno's bad games get swept under the carpet cause he runs around alot I think.
Citeh bossed it at Anfield with KdB, Bernardo & Rodri. He’d do fine.