Paul Pogba

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Anderson's Cat said:
It's media coverage they're getting that gets me though. I don't think either of these players have even started a game for United?
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Nope but remember, everything United gets blown out of alll proportions as we are the most followed team in the world and sell the most shit. Quiet news day at the sports desk, regurgitate some shite from United.

Our media in the UK love nothing better than to rip things apart and glory in their demise, they've been itching to do it with us for years.
 
gambit28 said:
Nope but remember, everything United gets blown out of alll proportions as we are the most followed team in the world and sell the most shit. Quiet news day at the sports desk, regurgitate some shite from United.

Our media in the UK love nothing better than to rip things apart and glory in their demise, they've been itching to do it with us for years.
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I agree, i used to think this ABU lark was nothing but paranoia but recents time i've shown me that i was wrong.
 
RedRichio said:
I'll be waiting for Pogue's apology. Nice summary there in the independent of exactly what I passed on to you last week.
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Bit of a coincidence, isn''t it?

Someone should tell journalists to use Twitter so they can get hold of the same exclusive insider knowledge that you passed on last week. They're missing a trick.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Bit of a coincidence, isn''t it?

Someone should tell journalists to use Twitter so they can get hold of the same exclusive insider knowledge that you passed on last week. They're missing a trick.
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Oh give over. Anyway, the info I was given was by dm not publicly posted. Why not just accept that you were wrong on this one.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
What was the information?
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I said last week that I'd been told that pogba couldn't decide whether to leave, was being offered far less by united than in Italy, was getting assurances from juve that he was in their first team plans but that fergie wouldn't give those assurances and that he'd have to earn it. Meanwhile, raiola is chipping away at him every day and he doesn't want him to resign because united a refusing to pay him a renewal fee (which they shouldnt have to. He's pogba's representative). I got that in a private conversation on twitter with someone I trust and who has occasionally told me titbits in the past which have turned out to be true, most notably fletcher's illness, which I posted on here about long before it was public knowledge.

Pogue played his bullshit card as he always does, only for most of the nationals to run with exactly what I said this morning.
 
RedRichio said:
Oh give over. Anyway, the info I was given was by dm not publicly posted.
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Really? If so, I do owe you an apology. Do people do that on Twitter often? DM people with insider knowledge about football? Or was it a mate of yours? I've never got a single DM. I must be doing it wrong :(

I still don't think the "on the cheap" comment has been substantiated, as all we know is that he's asking for more than the club is willing to pay. Chances are it's the players demands that are excessive.

RedRichio said:
Chap on twitter (not m16) who is usually reliable said that pogba wants to stay but the club are trying to keep him on the cheap
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The bit about the club not wanting to pay the agent is interesting, though. No idea why they would treat this differently to any other contract negotiation though. Probably just the agent being a cock and expecting a payment that other agents wouldn't usually demand.
 
gambit28 said:
18 years old and offered over a million a year in wages, feck me.
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Have'nt seen much of the kid my self because i havent watched much Youth football but do United think or not think he would be worth £3M in three years time? I presume that would be the length of a contract.

It's the big moral dilema, do United pay him what he is asking because they know he will more than likely be worth far more when he is 21 or do they stick to their principles because he is only 18 and untested ?

I can see both points of view!
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Really? If so, I do owe you an apology. Do people do that on Twitter often? DM people with insider knowledge about football? Or was it a mate of yours? I've never got a single DM. I must be doing it wrong :(

I still don't think the "on the cheap" comment has been substantiated, as all we know is that he's asking for more than the club is willing to pay. Chances are it's the players demands that are excessive.

The bit about the club not wanting to pay the agent is interesting, though. No idea why they would treat this differently to any other contract negotiation though. Probably just the agent being a cock and expecting a payment that other agents wouldn't usually demand.
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Fair enough. I got chatting to him about united and after a while he told me a couple of things and every so often, when something of note is happening I just ask him if he knows about it. Sometimes he does, sometimes he doesn't.

I dont know what the standard procedure is re agents fees. Surely as an employee of the player the agent fee should come from him?
 
INF-AMOS said:
Have'nt seen much of the kid my self because i havent watched much Youth football but do United think or not think he would be worth £3M in three years time? I presume that would be the length of a contract.

It's the big moral dilema, do United pay him what he is asking because they know he will more than likely be worth far more when he is 21 or do they stick to their principles because he is only 18 and untested ?

I can see both points of view!
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I reckon their logic is that paying a youngster silly money when he hasn't even started a game for the first-team yet will end up costing them much more than the price of his contract. Their concern will be the precedent it sets for all the other up and coming youngsters at the club. £2m/year is crazy money to be paying kids who are still essentially reserve team players. We've had first team regulars on less.
 
Re the "on the cheap", I guess it's subjective. If other clubs are offering a lot more then in the open market it's on the cheap. I go back to what I said last week. United/fergie feel that players should want to come to united or stay at united because of the club's stature. As a result we offer younger players relative low starting salaries with the promise of a massively increased deal if they establish themselves, Hernandez perhaps being the best recent example. Other clubs are more happy to chick money up front for the chance of a top player.
 
RedRichio said:
Fair enough. I got chatting to him about united and after a while he told me a couple of things and every so often, when something of note is happening I just ask him if he knows about it. Sometimes he does, sometimes he doesn't.

I dont know what the standard procedure is re agents fees. Surely as an employee of the player the agent fee should come from him?
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You'd think so, wouldn't you?

I guess it's the same as income tax. Footballers want to receive every last penny of whatever money is offered to them and expect the club to pay whatever deductions their might be.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I reckon their logic is that paying a youngster silly money when he hasn't even started a game for the first-team yet will end up costing them much more than the price of his contract. Their concern will be the precedent it sets for all the other up and coming youngsters at the club. £2m/year is crazy money to be paying kids who are still essentially reserve team players. We've had first team regulars on less.
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I think it's a very sensible policy, otherwise you'll end up with the situation at city or arsenal where shite players earn fortunes and you can't get rid of them.
 
RedRichio said:
I think it's a very sensible policy, otherwise you'll end up with the situation at city or arsenal where shite players earn fortunes and you can't get rid of them.
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Exactly. Not to mention that diverting a massive chunk of your total spend on wages to youngsters means you can't afford to pay the really top players what it takes to hold onto them (cf Flamini, Nasri, Cashley etc).

The whole salary issue has always been crazy but it seems to be coming to a head again, thanks to the bitters. Our wage bill has gone up 17% in the last year. There's no way that's sustainable. Something has to give.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
You'd think so, wouldn't you?

I guess it's the same as income tax. Footballers want to receive every last penny of whatever money is offered to them and expect the club to pay whatever deductions their might be.
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I don't know united's reasoning but I know there's a general feeling amongst clubs that they shouldn't be paying the agents. I met Peterborough united chairman daragh macanthony a while back and he simply refuses to pay agents when he signs players or for renewals. If the agent asks for a cut he says no thanks and bins the deal. It's a brave stance but you will lose/miss out on a few good players.
 
Its such a difficult situation.

Risk losing 1 of our brightest academy stars that could go onto being a first teamer for the next 10 years, and potential star in the making, but end up opening a shirtstorm of young players trying to barter for higher contracts.

Or get rid of the player fergie has earmarked as our next midfield star and risk losing him to one of our european rivals, only to be rubbed in the face that he could of stayed for a few million a year, rather than having to splash out 40 million to get a modric / sneijder etc.

I can see why fergie is threating on this, but i think we really need to test him sooner rather then later to see if he can handle the top level.

We need to make a big decision but i honestly do think for a boy of his talent we should give a little leway.

If its true he wants 40k a week then there isnt much we can do, but if we could say 20k upfront and then after so many appearances or good performances we would agree to raise it up at the end of the year i think thats a fair deal.

Would be a shame either way to loose him as i have enjoyed watching him throughly in the reserves and youth cup, and to see our famous 3 midfield of pogba, tunnicliffe and morrison almost split up after so much potential is quite dissapointing.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Exactly. Not to mention that diverting a massive chunk of your total spend on wages to youngsters means you can't afford to pay the really top players what it takes to hold onto them (cf Flamini, Nasri, Cashley etc).

The whole salary issue has always been crazy but it seems to be coming to a head again, thanks to the bitters. Our wage bill has gone up 17% in the last year. There's no way that's sustainable. Something has to give.
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The chairman of the arsenal small shareholders association was on the radio a few days ago saying that djorou, denilson, bendtner and chamakh are all on between seventy and ninety grand a week, hence they couldn't sell them in the summer.
 
RedRichio said:
The chairman of the arsenal small shareholders association was on the radio a few days ago saying that djorou, denilson, bendtner and chamakh are all on between seventy and ninety grand a week, hence they couldn't sell them in the summer.
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:eek:

fecking hell, that's pure madness. So, what, that was given on the basis of potential? Umm, what potential?!
 
amolbhatia100 said:
:eek:

fecking hell, that's pure madness. So, what, that was given on the basis of potential? Umm, what potential?!
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I would say chamakhs was a fair deal as he was a free from bordeaux and was scoring quite regularly in the CL, looked a decent acquirement.

But the rest is just pure management.
 
RedRichio said:
I don't know united's reasoning but I know there's a general feeling amongst clubs that they shouldn't be paying the agents. I met Peterborough united chairman daragh macanthony a while back and he simply refuses to pay agents when he signs players or for renewals. If the agent asks for a cut he says no thanks and bins the deal. It's a brave stance but you will lose/miss out on a few good players.
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To be truthful clubs shouldn't be paying agent fee's thats for the player to do.
 
RedRichio said:
The chairman of the arsenal small shareholders association was on the radio a few days ago saying that djorou, denilson, bendtner and chamakh are all on between seventy and ninety grand a week, hence they couldn't sell them in the summer.
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Arsenal have always overpaid young players who they think are talented to keep them at the club. Its why Fabregas moved in the first place.
 
RedRichio said:
The chairman of the arsenal small shareholders association was on the radio a few days ago saying that djorou, denilson, bendtner and chamakh are all on between seventy and ninety grand a week, hence they couldn't sell them in the summer.
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What this causes in the long run is a very tight financial situation should the club fall short for a season or two due to poor performances on the pitch. The revenue takes a hit, the wage bill hits an all time highs and you are forced to sell players - sometimes on the cheap - to pay off the debt and before you know it you are caught between a rock and a hard place. Simple glance at Arsenal's last financial report tells you quite a bit.

gambit28 said:
Whats a dm?
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The equivalent of private message on Twitter.
 
Still that'll be 20k a week that can now go into the coffers for bringing in new talent
 
Skywarden said:
What this causes in the long run is a very tight financial situation should the club fall short for a season or two due to poor performances on the pitch. The revenue takes a hit, the wage bill hits an all time highs and you are forced to sell players - sometimes on the cheap - to pay off the debt and before you know it you are caught between a rock and a hard place. Simple glance at Arsenal's last financial report tells you quite a bit.



The equivalent of private message on Twitter.
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ah.
 
Adam-Utd said:
If its true he wants 40k a week then there isnt much we can do, but if we could say 20k upfront and then after so many appearances or good performances we would agree to raise it up at the end of the year i think thats a fair deal.
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Exactly, and giving players price rises isn't unusual for us (Hernandez is a notable recent example). I'm sure that would be one of Pogba's worries (signing a contract a few years long for what he sees as not much) but it would have been made clear that if he performs on the pitch he would be rewarded.

40k for someone who has had four sub appearances this season in the first team is ridiculous
 
RedRichio said:
I'm inclined to agree. I think we should try and see things from pogba's perspective though and not vilify the kid. He's a teenager struggling with what could be one of the biggest decisions of his life.
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I know, do I want to become a millionare and play for one of the biggest clubs in the world who will pay me even more over the years and make me such a big star, or do I join another club now for more money in the short term as they won't pay my agents fees. Tough call.
 
golden_blunder said:
ludicrous

get rid, move on
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Can we really be that cut and dry about it though?

I mean we really dont know the details behind it, i truelly believe he wants to stay but his agent is obviously telling him "juventus are willing to give you 40k a week and a first team spot in the squad".

Then we are offering him 20k and a few sub appearances here and there, its going to twist his head and make him think twice.

He seems a confident young lad and i have no doubts he will sucseed wherever he goes.
 
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