[BlakeUtd]

I honestly think a lot of our players are letting mou down. He's definitely should take some of the blame because he selects the team. I mean when I watched the highlights it was really clear that our players especially our defense were not focused or aggressive enough and our mid wasn't dominant or creative enough. I feel this happened a lot with LVG. the only difference was that his philosophy was shit. but on several occasions it was clear he felt his players were not carrying out his plans as he envisaged them. Its sort of like writing a good script and having the directors or actors feck it up. the blame will be shared anyway

 

[Kevin]

Wow. I really have touched a nerve with one my response to your cool and great post the other day.
I promise I won't reply you anymore, it seems it really bothers you.
If anything you wont use that fat dwarf thing. Its really cringeworthy. And shite.

I still think it's too early to judge Mourinho, one post was a joke and Rooney is the problem, thought that in midweek too, it's just that it's obvious he isn't the only problem.
But who are you for me to justify to you.

This was just my nice way of saying to get off my case or piss of to be exact.

heh heh heh, loves to dish it out but cannah take the strain. Bit touchy are we? Unlike me, calm and collected and biding my time. Play again next time.

 

[kouroux]

Pogba just has to adjust... his teammates are far less good both tactically and technically than Juve. Just as an example, he's used to Pirlo then Marchisio playing the deep CM role and getting him the ball. The forward that dezoned to combine with him were Tevez and then Dybala. The fullbacks are Evra and Lichsteiner. The defense is Bonucci, Barzagli and Chielini.

Juventus is better at every position across the board other than CF with Ibrahimovic.

France NT is absolutely loaded too.

With Man Utd, the technical ability of players is abysmal. He can't look for his teammates to combine with or to make the correct runs. Pogba has to almost ignore what "should" happen in terms of movement around him and just go. The only one he can anticipate is Ibra right now. That's it.

It will take time. It's hard to play on a great team and then go to one where most players are not very good.

Spot on. This is why I was a little worried with his transfer, too much would be expected from him (regardless of transfer fee) as our team is shit. He'd have to play at a level never seen before to carry us like we need him to.

 

[Ban]

heh heh heh, loves to dish it out but cannah take the strain. Unlike me, calm and collected and biding my time. Play again next time.

Cannah take the strain?

You're just silly now.

Keep track of my work please. It's great to have a fan.

 

[Kevin]

Cannah take the strain?

You're just silly now.

Keep track of my work please. It's great to have a fan.

Ah the green smiley of true mirth... and the best tool to hide the nervosity of victims who refreshed the caf every five seconds whilst staring at the alert box to retort asap... Calm down, see you soon. I laid you bare and touched you everywhere..

 

[Ban]

Like a bad rash. Can't get rid of it.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Ah the green smiley of true mirth... and the best tool to hide the nervosity of victims who refreshed the caf every five seconds whilst staring at the alert box to retort asap... Calm down, see you soon. I laid you bare and touched you everywhere..

the professor strikes again.

 

[sammsky1]

I missed the game as got stuck driving my car (listened on radio)

How painful will it be to watch MOTD or should I give it a pass?!

 

[Twisted Nerve]

I was so optimistic and excited before the season started. So far I have seen nothing which justifies that optimism.
3 dodgy wins against mediocre teams, and then lose against the first decent team we face, then lose 2 more that we should have won.
Out of 6 teams played, we should have pummeled 5 of them. OK, in the last 2 the refereeing was dire, but still doesn't change the shitness.

 

[acrebo]

I missed the game as got stuck driving my car (listened on radio)

How painful will it be to watch MOTD or should I give it a pass?!

Genuinely not worth it. Highlights include Pogba hitting the crossbar and Rashford capitalising on a Watford defensive lapse.

 

[EmPeeKay]

Absolutely shocking. It was another poor, "van Gaal-esque" performance by the team today. There was just no hunger, no desire and no urgency. We were second best in every single department and could have been played off the park in the first half. Mourinho got the line-up wrong and I hope he will learn from this for the next game. Rooney needs to be dropped as he's a busted flush in my opinion. He is not creative enough, he can't run anymore and his passing is poor. But hey, let's not blame him, there were others on the pitch who simply didn't turn up. Mourinho seriously needs to get his finger out and start making a few tough decisions.

 

[Attila]

Oh I'll tell you what &I'm on about. Just a couple of your sarcastic "rocking on my fugly toy horse looking down on you fair weather fan posts from my huge fat nose" quotes in the feyenoord matchday thread:







Your cool and collected dwarf knight on fat pony response then:


Three days later in this thread:





After the feyenoord game in the Rooney thread:


Some more rooney sarcasm in the matchday thread:



Three days later:









Welcome to the fair weather supporter club.

 

[Attila]

Ah the green smiley of true mirth... and the best tool to hide the nervosity of victims who refreshed the caf every five seconds whilst staring at the alert box to retort asap... Calm down, see you soon. I laid you bare and touched you everywhere..

Loling at these posts, too good

 

[Full bodied red]

Couldn’t watch the match today, but was looking at the Match Thread every 5 minutes or so, and now up to Page 13 of the Post-Match Thread. Reading all the posts, it seems that you posters reckon -


De Gea – will need to be our PotY for the 4th year running if we want to make Top 4.


Valencia – still hits every attempted cross against an opponent’s shin. Played RW all his career but Van Gaal reckoned he was not good enough to be our RW, so now we ask him to play RB AND RW at the same time. Genius.


Smalling – where’s the Smalling of last season vanished to ? Still can't tackle, still can't pass the ball. Good at shirt holding, though.


Bailly – seemingly our 1st choice CD these days, but hardly ever mentioned in either thread despite the pounding we took in the first half.


Shaw – our Great White Hope and a future United Legend but should have / could have done better with their goal. Was it because he appears to have been on the pies all summer ?


Fellaini – gives away a stupid penalty, and so our own boo boys out in force yet again. Despite a decent contribution and excellent stats.


Pogba – good 10 minutes just before the interval, otherwise poor yet again. Ah well, that's promising from the world's most expensive player.


Rooney – finished, washed-up, time to go, etc. If he does read redcafe, will probably top himself tonight given the ( lack of ) love and appreciation he gets from United fans.


Martial – worrying, a shadow of last year’s Martial.


Ibrahimovic – too slow for fast counter attacking football, misses more chances than he scores.


Rashford – anonymous for long periods but can score, although strangely he’s rarely selected these days


Young –tries hard, but squad player for Sunderland at best.


Mata – PotY twice at Chelski, misfit of the year twice at OT.


Depay – close to being the worst United player ever.


Mourinho – poor team selection, poor tactics, not much better than Moyes and/or Van Gaal.


Referee – complete cnut as usual these days, third successive game we’ve been on the receiving end of poor decisions costing goals / penalties,


So to sum up our team, our players, our tactics, our manager, and our prospects for the season, then –

Uh….Houston we have a problem.

 

[Precaution]

Jose made them get the train back it seems

 

[Ludens the Red]

Oh I'll tell you what &I'm on about. Just a couple of your sarcastic "rocking on my fugly toy horse looking down on you fair weather fan posts from my huge fat nose" quotes in the feyenoord matchday thread:







Your cool and collected dwarf knight on fat pony response then:


Three days later in this thread:





After the feyenoord game in the Rooney thread:


Some more rooney sarcasm in the matchday thread:



Three days later:









Welcome to the fair weather supporter club.

What an idiot

 

[montpelier]

Today was worse than Thursday = more unhappiness.

Still, at least we're all singing from the same page of the hymn sheet now, .

 

[Ban]

What an idiot

Nice.

 

[Theonas]

Koeman is another one, he gets his team very well coached in record time. Everton look like a serious outfit now. Jose of old could do this, gets a system sorted and the team wins from day 1, we may not have player calibre of his real madrid side but we have players above and beyond everton and the like

I am not really familiar enough with Koeman beyond his work at Southampton but I'll take your word for it. I don't buy into the nonsense that José's tactics are outdated or whatever as if such a thing even exists. I do however think that at Manchester United, like at Real, he is not in a familiar position. His work before was to get teams to spoil the party for the more established elite. At Porto and Inter with the giants of European football and at Chelsea with us and Arsenal at the time. That was his natural habitat, get a team to toughen up, motivate it, perform some man management wonders and establish that mentality of underdog and the whole us against them thing. At Real in the beginning, they forgave everything as they were in a comparably poor state to us now with their European record at the time and how mediocre Barcelona made them look. Once they established themselves though back thanks to him and Ronaldo, he was cast in that very uncomfortable position of being viewed as the equal, being expected to take charge of game and play with authority against the best.

I really think he is feeling the same here. He must be getting fed up at the fawning over Pep and how much praise he is getting and is unwilling to "obviously" go down the reactive solid first route that he knows so well. What we are left with is a man whose best quality is unsuitable, or at least an awkward one to adopt for our club.

 

[The BlackGaijin]

you must be joking?

Actually I agree with him

 

[Theonas]

We looked like we were going to win though. It was like a different mentality. We weren't great against Hull but I knew we'd get that winner, it was like the Fergie days, we were banging on the door and was only a matter of time before we got through. Today felt hopeless though.

Yes we did. I felt it too but my point is that it was more due to the whole narrative around the club as opposed to anything substantial on the pitch. It was portrayed as the perfect marriage with us flexing our financial muscles and getting some proper big names. Add that to the general goodwill of a new manager, new season etc... and the narrative was set. It was no different really to that game vs QPR under LvG after we bought Di Maria and Falcao. On the pitch however, conceding possession to Southampton and defending as deep as we did against them at home is something any top European or domestic side would have regarded rightfully as an average performance at best.

 

[Theonas]

To be honest, Mourinho does have his own approach and adjusts it according to the opposition (like any other manager would). However, compared to the others, he's willing to sacrifice his approach and play a different style if he feels that his approach can't win him the match (see Real Madrid's La-Liga-winning campaign and their victories over Barcelona).

His style involves overloads and combination plays the in wide areas with two quick, tricky dribblers in the wing positions, a target man up front, and a hardworking midfield. His teams often look to punish the opposition by giving them a false sense of security and by keeping his team organised defensively. So far, we've seen the defensive organisation (bar the last few matches), but the rest of Mourinho's approach has been absent ever since he came here. It's as if we're still playing van Gaal football going forward whilst playing Mourinho football defensively. No wonder Mourinho started with Mata: he allows us to overload the wide areas and perform the combination plays that can get our dangerous players into attacking spaces.

Something really is wrong when, going forward, we look really disjointed. This reminds of Chelsea last season who were performing similarly at this stage of the season: sloppy and disjointed going forward but still able to keep the shape at the back (bar some moments when they would concede stupid goals).

It's not that I disagree but what you are describing is kind of the basic of all managerial basics don't you think? I mean by that token, Allardyce and Pulis have a style as well. Having a specific style entails with it a level of stubbornness that will cost you in certain games, there are no two ways about it really. The upside though is that because you work on it obsessively and give it your all, you can become very good at it as it ensures you win more often than not. The success of managers of that ilk is obviously linked to how the ratio of wins/defeats playing the way they do. Pep and Klopp at Dortmubd at least for example can justify their stubbornness and gladly accept it when they lose. Someone like Martinez or Wenger in recent years would be the opposite example. Mourinho's adaptability is the reason he can't produce a team that plays with a clear vision and structure. He simply doesn't put the work it needs either because he is not good at it or because he doesn't care and prefers to take any short cut possible to get the very next win.

 

[stu_1992]

Christ that was poor today. I mean like really bad. Struggling to think of anyone who played well. I know there has been a lot of talk about tactics/systems, but honestly the players are just playing so poor that this needs to be addressed first. The quality of passing in the last 2 league games is among the worst I've ever seen from us. So many unnecessary fouls too. And yes, Rooney was by far the worst. Noe hyperbole.

 

[Jaybomb]

Pathetic performance but I actually called a loss beforehand. Rooney in central midfield is a fecking pathetic choice. But you can check the various Rooney threads for my opinion on that.

The only players I was remotely impressed with today were Fellaini and Zlatan. They tried really hard to make something happen.

Also, this has to be said but Chris Smalling is desperate. Last season when he was playing decently, I stuck to my opinion on him and I got slated for it. Looks like today I was right. We take Blind out and put this donkey back in and we lose 2 on the trot. He had absolutely no understanding with Bailly. Probably of Smalling's lack of brain and because they're too similar in terms of attributes. Blind brings intelligence, positioning and composure to that back line and when you take him out, it's a shambles. And people actually think this fool should be our captain? If Rojo had the performance that Smalling had today, he would be burned at the stake. And I don't think I've ever really seen Rojo have as bad of performance as I have seen multiple times with Smalling.

Also, why the feck is Ashley Young still playing for us in 2016?

 

[surf]

I would question the coaching, the motivation, the tactics and the team selection. Time for Mourinho to earn his corn and do whatever it takes.

 

[xplatformjedi]

The midfield is REALLY letting the team down. I've watched two of Leischester City's, three Liverpool, two Chelsea and two ManChitty games this season (that weren't played against the Reds) and in every single one of those games the movement of the ball in the middle of the pitch has been much crisper, quicker and more like controlled attacks than anything I've seen Manchester United do.

The Reds are winning/scoring due to players making a big play here or there, instead of the team moving the ball well...setting up plays and then capitalizing on a defenses mistakes. One touches have no meaning behind them.

It's clear. ABUNDANTLY clear that the Reds are missing two midfielders that can compliment Pogba.

Add to that... at least 10 teams in the league have a better #10...

...and add to that Bailly and Blind are a better defensive pairing that Smalling and Bailly, who are too similar.

So much work to do for the team to even stay in the top 10.

 

[mayonnaise]

Even in our first three wins we had spells during the games where I thought we looked a little suspect, waiting to get found out, and its's happened/happening. Players are standing around expecting things to happen, panicking under pressure, pathetic attempts at pressing.

I've noticed this loop, literally in the first seconds after kick off after the striker passes the ball to the centre back, instead of keeping the ball and string a few passes together get everyone comfortable, set the rhythm of the game etc... the CB hoofs the ball to one of the wingers and we lose the ball straight away. Whenever I see that I know we're in for a shitty first half, after the opposition run down the other end and create a chance the whole team goes in to this dazed frenzy like a boxer recovering from a knock down.

It just sets a negative tone for the whole game, there's still a long way to go I'm staying positive. Jose still doesn't seem to know his best team, constant changes isn't helping either, We could do with Schweinstiger's (or carricks) experience and composure in midfield to be honest, see absolutely no benefit in freezing him out....looks like he's being made a sacrifice of the previous regime.

 

[Nakhon Phanom]

Even when they lost against City at least they put in a decent shift in the second half to make a match of it.
This time around there was nothing.No plan,no co-ordination.Is it down to low confidence or they believe there own hype that they are better than they really are and just need to turn up,
Rooney was absolutely shocking in the second half (not much better in the first).What does he have to do to be substituted or left out ? Score 3 own goals ?
Smalling was poor in the second half of last season and was the same last night.I know Blind made a howler against City,and is not an ideal choice,but is currently the better option to play with Bailly,imo.
They paid a huge amount of money for Pogba and need to slot him into his best position smartish.At present,he's worth nearer 8.9m than 89m.
And Herrera didn't even get a game after being,arguably,the best player against City and Feyenoord.
I know he got injured but Martial looks a shadow of the player he was last season.
At least they have got Rashford....maybe time to give Fosu-Mensah a game as well.....Ibramhovic was poor,also,but still could have had a couple of goals being thwarted by a great save and just missing the net,hitting the side netting in the first half.
Leicester at home next Saturday.....big,big game.....lets at least have some effort,pressing the opposition from the off.

 

[CS@SG]

Make me wonder what did he promise the board during interview?

This isn't a Mourinho team. Not even close. He is trying too hard to make the team he thinks we want, rather than play to his own strengths.

These three results should not be a surprise to amybody. If you let opponents get at your back four time and time and time again there is a high likelihood that you'll concede chances, give away goals, and lose matches.

Oddly enough we hired Mr Rigid Team Shape but we get the opposite. Gaping holes. 11 strangers on a pitch. No real sign of a plan here. Difficult to use the 'needs more time' excuse when Pep has our rivals whipped into shape in no time at all. Mourinho needs to go back to what he knows.

Carrick needs to be reintroduced immediately. He'll plug that giant hole in midfield and we'll look twice the team.

Rooney must be dropped. His confidence is shot. I don't think he is finished but at the moment he is holding the team back. Get him a head doctor and take half a stone off him - see what happens.

In our defence I do believe it will take some time to wean these players off of the robotic system we had last season. We have a LOT of quality here though. If we are still being troubled this much by the likes of Watford in 4 months time then we will have every right to be questioning what is going on

 

[Perrick Dubois]

That whole performance was so Van Gaalian'esque. It had the stench of LVG's reign seeping out of every orifice. Spend most of the game putting out fires and then when we finally wrest some control back and look on the front foot we get broadsided with a full deck and taken to the bank.

This team is definitely in the in-between mode and I don't think coaching attacking football can just be dialed in and turned on or off. There are genuine deep-seeded flaws that are left over that are still obvious. Hesitation facing goal, reluctance to move the ball forwards and with any kind of conviction. It still feels very much like Van Gaal's "stand about and then hope for the best" type approach is rooting us to the ground.

It will take time and we have to be patient, people seem to really only have two modes these days. Full gas paranoia or full gas euphoria. We're still building and I think a couple of these crap results are going to appear while we're still getting our attacking cohesion together. Just throwing players together and expecting it to work is never the answer, we have to build a rapport and build the confidence of this lot back up slowly and surely with stronger bonds. We saw some signs of life in that period between Watfords two goals but that is going to need some serious ignition over the next few weeks. Some tough games coming up.

 

[Sarni]

Stop the world, I want to get off.

It took Louis five matches into the season before we unraveled at Leicester. I expected a much longer honeymoon under Jose.

Five games in which we lost to Swansea at home, drew to Burnley and Sunderland and got hammered by MK Dons. Some honeymoon that was indeed.

 

[chicha14]

Please can he bench Rooney and Fellaini... Please Jose! You have better options than them, especially with Fellaini, we need Carrick back! Fellaini slows down all of our play and Rooney just breaks everything up with his long hopeful passes!

We need speed and precision!

 

[fatboy]

Of our 3 losses, this one hurts the most because it was the most winnable.

The only silver lining i see is, hopefully this match will make Jose realise that Rooney needs to be dropped, and that Rashford can play alongside Zlatan in the starting 11.

And really we've been unlucky with big refereeing decisions of late. Hopefully it blows over soon.

 

[Acole9]

Just when you thought it couldn't get much worse it has. Although our defence was our best area last season it has really been shown up so far. Mourinho doesn't think Smalling is good enough it would appear and Blind is not a long term solution for that position.

 

[Shiva87]

So much work to do for the team to even stay in the top 10.

Woooahhh! Hold on there. Perhaps you'll regret this in a couple of days...

 

[MrSingh2002]

It has to be...

De Gea
Valencia Bailly Smalling Shaw
Fellaini Pogba
Rashford Mkhitaryan Martial
Ibrahimovic

Or

De Gea
Valencia Bailly Smalling Shaw
Fellaini Schneiderlin
Pogba
Rashford Ibrahimovic Martial
​

Rooney just does not feature in our best 11. We either push Pogba forward and give him freedom to roam or keep it as it is and bring Mkhitaryan in as a straight swap for Rooney.
Mourinho has to man up and do what he did with Mata at Chelsea. Its what we're ALL waiting for.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Why were we so unbelievably shit after the scored the second? I mean, we had been really shit already, managed to then start playing somewhat okay-ish, then it all went to shit. The ball didn't leave our half in the last 6 minutes... when has that ever happened before?

 

[Adam-Utd]

Jose made them get the train back it seems

Funny that they are on the right line for the "warner bro's studio tour" Rooney actually reminds me of Pinky and the brain

 

[VorZakone]

Jose made them get the train back it seems

Warner Bros studio tour

 

[MartialsBeard]

Im speechless after yesterday, post match I had to rush off to watch Palace and wow what a difference, they played with a plan, snapping the ball about routinely and sharply.

We have a severe mental block and it stems from the starting line up, time and time again we are failing in the transition, loose passes, the wrong passes the ball over hit, confidence destroyed its an utter utter shambles and I can only blame the players.

Rooney is the obvious weak link, he is an utter embarassment and should be dropped immediately, no other big club would accept absolute dog shit like that from a reported captain, he should have been slung off at half time. I honestly think he cost us the game with his slow passing and general slowing down of play.

HOW MANY times did we have 4 vs 3 situations and we would rush forward, stop, wait for everyone else to catch up and then start trying to play through them.

Im furious. Until Rooney is dropped I am struggling to see how we will improve. HE SIMPLY CAN NOT DO IT. EVEN Mata would be better, or any other pseudo no.10.

Im sick of it. Northampton is a must win and I just cant see anything but a dug out embarassment.

Jose should send a message to the players, if they can not do it then others need to be selected, play some of the reserves, Tuanzebe, Fosu Mensah, Rashford, Carrick, just a complete shake up.

I think we should go like this.

DDG
Valencia-Bailly-Blind-Shaw
Carrick
Fosu-Mensah-Pogba
Mata-Ibrahimovic-Rashford​