Rafael

Let's face it. Once he got the first yellow we all knew he wouldn't finish the game one way or another and we really couldn't have complained if he'd got a yellow for the card waving. I wouldn't, I hate when players do that, we're not scousers ffs.

The second yellow might have been a tad harsh. Some refs would have given him a final warning at that point, not Mike Dean though.
 
Shit decision got him sent off but he had a very good game. Going forward he was probably our best player and he did very well against Bale despite being booked.

Disappointed he got sent off, but he is our best RB and should walk back into the team after his suspension is up.
 
Sultan said:
Rafael got in more dangerous situations than Bale in the game. Shame he lacked composure with his final ball.
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As did Bale in fairness.

I agree though, it's a youth thing. He needs to slow him down sometimes. We've got a ridiculously good talent on our hands. Hopefully his bro can kick on too.
 
Soft sending off...but he has to know better than to run across the man in possession like that. He didn't even put out a foot cynically...

Already on a yellow, away from home, with a ref, happy to book players(both sides tbf), why give him the opportunity?
 
R_Nick said:
That played a part for sure, but at the same time he wasn't exactly being helped out by his team mates giving him options, was he?
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True

Strikers were well below par today.
 
He shouldn't have been sent off today but he needs to get a handle on that hot headed streak. On the plus side he was brilliant going forward, easily our best attacker.
 
He was magnificent today. Rash, but magnificent nonetheless. The only one of ours out there that never seemed intimidated by the pace or pressure. Seemed our most confident on the attack.
 
Lad was outstanding again today. Was our most incisive player by a country mile and along with Vidic was our MOM. The progress he's made and continues to make is a delight to see.

The sad thing is that his performance today will get lost in the controversy of his sending-off and will only fuel the lazy, largely inaccurate perception of him being "rash" and "defensively weak". What bollocks, he's competitive and the defensive side to his game continues to get better and better.

Waving the imaginery card was poor form though. Hate to see it from our own player's and rival player's alike.
 
evra said:
He's good defensively but that's not our problem, Rafael is streaks ahead of him in terms of passing and running with the ball.
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I agree, but to be fair to O'Shea he is still well capable of getting forward & whipping the ball into the box let it be from just beyond the half way line or on the edge of the box.

Of course it would be better for Rafael to line out, but O'Shea lining out for us is not all that bad either, he brings another dimension to the game, like letting the ball do the work.
 
The Black Pearl said:
I agree, but to be fair to O'Shea he is still capable of getting forward & whipping the ball into the box let it be from just beyond the half way line or on the edge of the box. Of course it would be better for Rafael to line out but O'Shea lining out for us is not all that bad either, he brings another dimension to the game, like letting the ball do the work.
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You can't be serious, "he brings another dimension to our game". If anything, it's Rafael who brings a different dimension compared to our other full backs.
 
BTV_is_neutral said:
Soft sending off...but he has to know better than to run across the man in possession like that. He didn't even put out a foot cynically...

Already on a yellow, away from home, with a ref, happy to book players(both sides tbf), why give him the opportunity?
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the spurs player ran across rafael ...

I think the ref has come under unfair pressure before and as a result he's lost the plot. He was happy to send the kid off and spoil the game and for that, he's a cnut.
 
I love his commitment.
He was perhaps the only United player who played with the same urgency as the Spurs players. The flip side to that is he can be rash and dive in and not be calm enough when he gets in good forward positions. He reminds me of Anderson in his first season when he did all the hard work skipping past players at full speed and then not have his brain keep up with legs for the fnal pass or shot.
It should come though as he grows physically and gets more experience. Now he is recognised as first choice we should start to see more mature displays and less recklessness.
 
Lynk said:
Offensively class, defensively poor.
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He struggled against Bale for the first 10 minutes or so, but after that it was a great battle and Rafael held his own. I was worried the entire game about him getting sent off though, he let himself get quite riled up and was rather impetuous at times.

The first yellow was fine, he did get the ball but with him coming in that fast and with his foot in the air it was borderline dangerous. Second was obviously bullshit though.
 
He's a fecking mentalist. It's impossible not to love him for it, he's like an incredibly excited dog on heat who you've accidentally given coffee and then pointed in the direction of 50 bitches.
 
I don't think there's a single person who didn't think he was a certainty to get sent off the second he got booked....Even though it wasn't a card, you could see it a mile off. Like one of those Rooney runs where he looses the ball and then runs 50 yards the other way entirely to hack down the person who took it off him...

He seems to have a knack of combining his best performances with being a rampant mentalist and/or getting sent off.....I thought he was the best player on the pitch gainst Bayern last year...he was given a standing ovation when he was sent off...Which again was harsh...But which again, you could see a mile off.
 
Mockney said:
I don't think there's a single person who didn't think he was a certainty to get sent off the second he got booked....Even though it wasn't a card, you could see it a mile off. Like one of those Rooney runs where he looses the ball and then runs 50 yards the other way entirely to hack down the person who took it off him...

He seems to have a knack of combining his best performances with being a rampant mentalist and/or getting sent off.....I thought he was the best player on the pitch gainst Bayern last year...he was given a standing ovation when he was sent off...Which again was harsh...But which again, you could see a mile off.
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True.

However, you can't take away the competitive streak away from such players, it's what makes them special. We already have Carrick and Giggs acting the nice guys.
 
Mockney said:
He's a fecking mentalist. It's impossible not to love him for it, he's like an incredibly excited dog on heat who you've accidentally given coffee and then pointed in the direction of 50 bitches.
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Good comparison.
 
Mockney said:
Well that's what they say...
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Rafael has too much energy. He'll eventually learn it's not always necessary to make tackles.
 
Sultan said:
True.

However, you can't take away the competitive streak away from such players, it's what makes them special. We already have Carrick and Giggs acting the nice guys.
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No, but you can refine it, as we did with Vidic. My abiding memory of him early in his time with us is his trying to win every ball and of him constantly dragging the player back after he was done for pace. Far cry from the player we have now. You trust that if you improve their judgment they can apply that agressive side at the right times instead of indiscriminately.
 
Brophs said:
No, but you can refine it, as we did with Vidic. My abiding memory of him early in his time with us is his trying to win every ball and of him constantly dragging the player back after he was done for pace. Far cry from the player we have now. You trust that if you improve your judgment they can apply that agressive side at the right times instead of indiscriminately.
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I beat you to it, I think.

See my previous post. I'm trying to backtrack and say the same. :p
 
He's struck a much greater balance between attacking and defending in recent days. Those runs deep into opposition territory are so fecking lethal, though he times them such that he doesn't leave the team exposed as regularly.

There was a time not long where I assumed to myself that we'd almost inadvertantly coach the attacking side of Rafael's game out of him in favour of his defensive side, but there's been no sign of that whatsoever recently.

He's an extremely gifted player - same sort of category of talent, for me, that Rooney and Messi were in at a similar age. It's an incredible decision for the sending off, but Rafael seems to bounce back each time something goes wrong for him.
 
KingEric7 said:
He's struck a much greater balance between attacking and defending in recent days. Those runs deep into opposition territory are so fecking lethal, though he times them such that he doesn't leave the team exposed as regularly.

There was a time not long where I assumed to myself that we'd almost inadvertantly coach the attacking side of Rafael's game out of him in favour of his defensive side, but there's been no sign of that whatsoever recently.

He's an extremely gifted player - same sort of category of talent, for me, that Rooney and Messi were in at a similar age.
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There's generally cover from Fletcher or Carrick when he makes those runs. I think we pretty have a good balance between defence and attack. Will be even better once Valencia is fit.
 
He's always a potential liability, he's been doing well in the last few weeks but he's always got this catastrophic side to his game where he acts without thinking.
 
kietotheworld said:
He's always a potential liability, he's been doing well in the last few weeks but he's always got this catastrophic side to his game where he acts without thinking.
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Ridiculously harsh. Potential liability? Everyone is a potential liability in a game though, based on this season, it's looking less and less likely that it'll turn out to be Rafael. He's not just been consistent, but consistently excellent.

He's also got this wonderful habit of making opposition players look like spackers by lobbing the ball over their heads to get past them.
 
KingEric7 said:
Ridiculously harsh. Potential liability? Everyone is a potential liability in a game though, based on this season, it's looking less and less likely that it'll turn out to be Rafael. He's not just been consistent, but consistently excellent.

He's also got this wonderful habit of making opposition players look like spackers by lobbing the ball over their heads to get past them.
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Spot On.
 
Maybe I am being harsh, but he is always making dangerous tackles, trying to have arguments with people. Look at last season in the game against Bayern Munich where he cost us a great chance of winning the Champions' League, his first booking was a result of blatantly kicking someone because he was angry about a referees decision. Since then he's tried to pick a fight with Tevez, got sent off under stupid circumstances today, and told the referee to feck off.
 
kietotheworld said:
Maybe I am being harsh, but he is always making dangerous tackles, trying to have arguments with people. Look at last season in the game against Bayern Munich where he cost us a great chance of winning the Champions' League, his first booking was a result of blatantly kicking someone because he was angry about a referees decision. Since then he's tried to pick a fight with Tevez, got sent off under stupid circumstances today, and told the referee to feck off.
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He's also put in a good amount of fantastic performances, improved several aspects of his game, and cemented himself as not only first choice right back for Manchester United, but also as one of the best in the league.
 
i thought he was great today both attacking and defensive wise....yes he's inexpirience and enthusiasm come across still too often , which result in petty and needless free kicks but no doubt this kid will be something special once he matures...
 
kietotheworld said:
Maybe I am being harsh, but he is always making dangerous tackles, trying to have arguments with people. Look at last season in the game against Bayern Munich where he cost us a great chance of winning the Champions' League, his first booking was a result of blatantly kicking someone because he was angry about a referees decision. Since then he's tried to pick a fight with Tevez, got sent off under stupid circumstances today, and told the referee to feck off.
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So he's hot-headed? Most of the greatest player's to play the game were/are. With young player's, you are going to get the odd naive decision and a bit of adversity. Rafael is no different but he's learned from the Bayern experience and returned a lot better for it and a more well rounded player. That's what happens with youth, you identify the potential, you nurture it, trust it and stick by it through good and bad, and then eventually you reap the rewards. We've reaped the benefits of Fergie's patience and trust in youth many times in the past, are doing so with Rafael and others this season, and will continue to do so in the future. Today was unfortunate and IMO a poor call from the ref, nothing to do with any flaw Rafa may or may not have in his game.
 
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