RIP Paul Allen

Silva said:
this one's pretty easy - the internet was kept shit and developed slower directly because of the monopolistic position and refusal to allow third party clients, software systems were kept shit by the micromanagement of managers like paul and bill who are not good enough to be involved in software development at that level - they were good at capitalism, at stuffing out competition and bankrupting them, they were not good at making the product they sold
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Both of them are recognised as programming prodigies (especially Allen). You are mistaking them for Jobs and Zuckerberg (the first didn't even know how to code, while the second was nothing special at it).
 
Silva said:
he was on the board of directors until 2000
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That's why I had the active part. He had a lot of stocks, but he had no part on running the company (it was Gates who made the company the juggernaut it is today).
 
Revan said:
Both of them are recognised as programming prodigies (especially Allen). You are mistaking them for Jobs and Zuckerberg (the first didn't even know how to code, while the second was nothing special at it).
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yeah by their marketing people, they bought their operating systems and were gifted their user interface - if that's what it takes you be a prodigy in something i must be a chess grandmaster because i bought a chess board
 
Silva said:
yeah by their marketing people, they bought their operating systems and were gifted their user interface - if that's what it takes you be a prodigy in something i must be a chess grandmaster because i bought a chess board
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Good for you.

You probably need to come in real world first though.
 
Eboue said:
Jesus, this tired shit again? I literally criticize Republicans daily.

..............
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But you're hatred seems to be for the Democrats. I'm not knocking you pal, if I was in a war of words or ideals I would want someone like you in my corner.
 
Silva said:
also if you're going to wade into threads with things like that can you please lose your civility bullshit, it was antagonistic, unnecessary and the exact kind of thing you accuse other people of doing. hubris doesn't go well with projection.
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But, let's be honest, it's also entirely true. I've not seen him post about someone or something that didn't agree with his own personal views without uttet contempt.
 
GiddyUp said:
But you're hatred seems to be for the Democrats. I'm not knocking you pal, if I was in a war of words or ideals I would want someone like you in my corner.
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saying the democrats are an awful institution isn't a seal of approval for the republicans, they are both right wing economically and work together to maintain a political system that does not give people on the economic left a political home
 
GiddyUp said:
But you're hatred seems to be for the Democrats. I'm not knocking you pal, if I was in a war of words or ideals I would want someone like you in my corner.
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You need to read more of my posts before saying that. Even the posts in this thread, where I say that centrists and libs can still be reached but Republicans are evil and beyond help.

It's true that I have nothing but contempt for democratic politicians but as much as normal people libs annoy me i see them as potential allies.
 
Silva said:
also if you're going to wade into threads with things like that can you please lose your civility bullshit, it was antagonistic, unnecessary and the exact kind of thing you accuse other people of doing. hubris doesn't go well with projection.
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It is a recurring theme that he talks only about bad things of people who are successful. Never about something good someone has done.

And well, he tags me all the time about these kind of things, and in the end, it ain't your business.
 
ivaldo said:
But, let's be honest, it's also entirely true. I've not seen him post about someone or something that didn't agree with his own personal views without uttet contempt.
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You're off base. I argue with @fishfingers15 and @Pogue Mahone a bunch but I dont have any ill feelings towards them, we just disagree. Same with almost everyone on here. I have contempt for people with actual power who make the world worse, not regular people who post on redcafe.
 
We are cooking ourselves quite rapidly but let’s be nice and get along with the billionaires and the worst of society that they enable.

Reaching for a common ground is a nice idea in theory, but it’s intellectually feeble. When the Church said Earth is the center of the universe, the people who knew better didn’t settle. Just because there exists an equilibrium doesn’t mean it’s correct or desirable.
 
Raoul said:
You'll see this sort of sentiment on both the alt-right and Trump crowds as well as on the regressive-left. Basically, people's brains have been coopted by network homophily to where they are disincentivized from independent thought, and are instead incentivized to embrace groupthink that will result in them being accepted into their clan of choice (whether on the left or right), and its usually undergirded by a moral or noble position.
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Who are the 'regressive' left?
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
Reaching for a common ground is a nice idea in theory, but it’s intellectually feeble. When the Church said Earth is the center of the universe, the people who knew better didn’t settle
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You’re equating science with politics and morality.
 
Silva said:
oh man i really hope he doesn't completely undermine this by giving money the political party in his country that has spent decades undermining climate science
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Or the real world might be slightly more complex than that, and people donate money to both sides, and have views on different things which don't align with either side, or some of those views align with one party and some with the other.

And last I checked 4m is a bit more than 100k. Trust me, I asked the dean of mathematics at the university I work.

BTW, which side so far has done anything real (not symbolic bullshit that exists only in paper) about global warming?
 
Silva said:
when i became a university dean i didn't expect my day to day work to be telling people what number is bigger
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I just wanted to be sure, cause I got really confused why people are criticising a guy who gave 100k to a Party (where most of people there 'think' that global warming is not a big problem) instead of praising him for donating 2 billion dollars to good causes, including doing something about global warming.

Either that or cause I just saw John Oliver's episode on Iran.
 
Raoul said:
Well summarized here and applicable to both Europe and the US.

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Hmm, I think he has a few valid points, for instance the dominance of identity politics from left activism and some of the consequences of that. But his brief comments on free speech make me suspicious of him being a radical free speech absolutist that doesn't quite understand the nuances. I don't buy this argument about "free speech" being silenced by the left at all.

Makes me think of this recent article on Tucker Carlson that exposes some of the dishonesty of these "censorship" claims on the right:


“Is this censorship,” I manage to ask, “or just consequences? Doesn’t speech have consequences?” But Carlson dodges.

“You agreed there are some things we are not allowed to say because of diversity,” he says.

“No, I don’t agree with that.”

“You did.”

“No. No. No. No.”

“Because consequences. Yeah you did.”

So apparently, by asking, I’m censoring.

I think about the power imbalance. This man. Who has money. Status. 2.7 million viewers. He holds the attention of the president. And me? I might be “the liberal elite,” but I buy groceries at Wal-Mart, live in Iowa, and after 12 years of working as a writer, I still can’t get many outlets to even respond to my pitches.

Carlson’s PR person was concerned about silencing, too. She demanded that Carlson be able to respond to every criticism in this piece. And then, if the people who made those criticisms had a response, that Carlson be able to respond to that.

“You want him to have the last word?” I asked.

“Yes!” she shouted. She was shouting at me, too.

I told her he has a show. He has a large audience. He has a website. He has a Twitter following. I was sure he’d be able to find a way to respond without an endless feedback loop. She insisted. She didn’t want him to be silenced.

But Carlson isn’t being silenced. He’s plenty loud enough. And anyway I don’t want to silence him. I don’t want to end free speech, I just want to tell him speech has consequences.

What happened to make a rich white man the vox populi? How did I, a mom in the Midwest who can’t afford health care, become the humorless, censoring, liberal elite? How are the winners still insisting they are losers? What happened to this whole mess of a world? So I listen and listen. But I get no answers."

https://www.cjr.org/the_profile/tucker-carlson.php
 
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oneniltothearsenal said:
Hmm, I think he has a few valid points, for instance the dominance of identity politics from left activism and some of the consequences of that. But his brief comments on free speech make me suspicious of him being a radical free speech absolutist that doesn't quite understand the nuances. I don't buy this argument about "free speech" being silenced by the left at all.

Makes me think of this recent article on Tucker Carlson that exposes some of the dishonesty of these "censorship" claims on the right:


“Is this censorship,” I manage to ask, “or just consequences? Doesn’t speech have consequences?” But Carlson dodges.

“You agreed there are some things we are not allowed to say because of diversity,” he says.

“No, I don’t agree with that.”

“You did.”

“No. No. No. No.”

“Because consequences. Yeah you did.”

So apparently, by asking, I’m censoring.

I think about the power imbalance. This man. Who has money. Status. 2.7 million viewers. He holds the attention of the president. And me? I might be “the liberal elite,” but I buy groceries at Wal-Mart, live in Iowa, and after 12 years of working as a writer, I still can’t get many outlets to even respond to my pitches.

Carlson’s PR person was concerned about silencing, too. She demanded that Carlson be able to respond to every criticism in this piece. And then, if the people who made those criticisms had a response, that Carlson be able to respond to that.

“You want him to have the last word?” I asked.

“Yes!” she shouted. She was shouting at me, too.

I told her he has a show. He has a large audience. He has a website. He has a Twitter following. I was sure he’d be able to find a way to respond without an endless feedback loop. She insisted. She didn’t want him to be silenced.

But Carlson isn’t being silenced. He’s plenty loud enough. And anyway I don’t want to silence him. I don’t want to end free speech, I just want to tell him speech has consequences.

What happened to make a rich white man the vox populi? How did I, a mom in the Midwest who can’t afford health care, become the humorless, censoring, liberal elite? How are the winners still insisting they are losers? What happened to this whole mess of a world? So I listen and listen. But I get no answers."

https://www.cjr.org/the_profile/tucker-carlson.php
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"I can't really go to a lot of restaurants anymore because I get yelled at," he said on a National Review podcast released Monday. "I don't feel threatened, but having someone scream, 'feck you!' at a restaurant, it just wrecks your meal."

Carlson said he only goes to one restaurant these days. "I go there because I love it and nobody hassles me," he said. "I can't wait for this revolution to end, so I can go back out to dinner." (He's known to be a regular at The Palm, a steak house.)
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making these people's lives difficult works
 
Silva said:
do you ever read your posts back?
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He didn't give those money to them to continue not doing anything about global warming. As I said, world is complex and there are plenty of causes - many of them conflicting with each other - to be in support or opposition of someone.

Still he has given 2b to good causes. For every dollar he gave to a Party - which in my opinion has most of their policies wrong, and is totally wrong on global warming - he has given 20000 dollars to good causes. More good than bad, I would say, but unsurprisingly, that became the talking point of the entire thread. Cause you and Eboue are unable to see good in people which don't perfectly align with your opinions, which is the vast majority of people in the world.
 
Revan said:
He didn't give those money to them to continue not doing anything about global warming. As I said, world is complex and there are plenty of causes - many of them conflicting with each other - to be in support or opposition of someone.

Still he has given 2b to good causes. For every dollar he gave to a Party - which in my opinion has most of their policies wrong, and is totally wrong on global warming - he has given 20000 dollars to good causes. More good than bad, I would say, but unsurprisingly, that became the talking point of the entire thread. Cause you and Eboue are unable to see good in people which don't perfectly align with your opinions, which is the vast majority of people in the world.
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What part of the Republican agenda did he want to support then? Putting children in cages? Putting rapists on the court? Crushing unions?
 
Revan said:
He didn't give those money to them to continue not doing anything about global warming. As I said, world is complex and there are plenty of causes - many of them conflicting with each other - to be in support or opposition of someone.

Still he has given 2b to good causes. For every dollar he gave to a Party - which in my opinion has most of their policies wrong, and is totally wrong on global warming - he has given 20000 dollars to good causes. More good than bad, I would say, but unsurprisingly, that became the talking point of the entire thread. Cause you and Eboue are unable to see good in people which don't perfectly align with your opinions, which is the vast majority of people in the world.
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how many times do we have to write that the reason we refuse to build shrines to these people is because they are a symptom of a system that allows them to make enough money where giving 2 billions dollars is less money than the taxes they avoided, that the reason is because they help propagate the system by giving lots of money to politicians to maintain the status quo? i don't care how much money he gives to charity because he should never have had that much money to begin with
 
Eboue said:
What part of the Republican agenda did he want to support then? Putting children in cages? Putting rapists on the court? Crushing unions?
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nah he just wants to own the lefty nazi's, gg eboue you got owned by a billionaire who cares about any actual issue you're being rude about a very talented man you naughty boy
 
Silva said:
how many times do we have to write that the reason we refuse to build shrines to these people is because they are a symptom of a system that allows them to make enough money where giving 2 billions dollars is less money than the taxes they avoided, that the reason is because they help propagate the system by giving lots of money to politicians to maintain the status quo? i don't care how much money he gives to charity because he should never have had that money to begin with
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I don't know any details about Paul Allen and I'm not getting into this petty discussion but the bolded part bugs me - 90% of the people which are regarded as "tax avoiders" actually do nothing wrong and adhere to every single tax law. If you have a problem with the system in place, it's the legislator's fault and not the tax payer using the system to his advantage.
 
RobinLFC said:
I don't know any details about Paul Allen and I'm not getting into this petty discussion but the bolded part bugs me - 90% of the people which are regarded as "tax avoiders" actually do nothing wrong and adhere to every single tax law. If you have a problem with the system in place, it's the legislator's fault and not the tax payer using the system to his advantage.
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he gave money to party that gives the biggest tax breaks to billionaires and creates the most loopholes for his class, he also gave money to an institution that exists purely to promote lower taxes for him and his class, i have nothing but contempt for people like him, his death is not a sad day

i do also blame the politicians, they should be jail for accepting bribes and propagating a system built on bribery, american legislators don't even hide how bought and owned they are, frequently putting their names on bills that were written by the lobbyists that line their pockets, this is not a good system and needs to be burned to the ground and it's biggest funders need to face the consequences of their actions
 
Raoul said:
Well summarized here and applicable to both Europe and the US.

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This is really a stretch. Here are his main points:

1) Censorship - He says the left are not liberals. Correct. We don't claim to be.
2) Post factual - He offers very little to support his claim, saying only that some German newspapers withheld information on sexual assault. Not nearly enough evidence to support his assertions.
3) Violence - "Saying it is okay to riot and destroy private property isn't liberal". Again, the left is not the same as liberal. I don't know much about this guy so correct me if I'm wrong but it certainly seems like he is more worried about violence to cars and shops than the day to day violence perpetrated by the state against the poor both within the country and around the world.
4) Group identity - "Kill all white men". This is just a right wing talking point. It wouldn't be out of place from any random white supremecist with 11 followers on twitter.
 
Silva said:
he gave money to party that gives the biggest tax breaks to billionaires and creates the most loopholes for his class, he also gave money to an institution that exists purely to promote lower taxes for him and his class, i have nothing but contempt for people like him, his death is not a sad day

i do also blame the politicians, they should be jail for accepting bribes and propagating a system built on bribery, american legislators don't even hide how bought and owned they are, frequently putting their names on bills that were written by the lobbyists that line their pockets, this is not a good system and needs to be burned to the ground and it's biggest funders need to face the consequences of their actions
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Well, agreed on the second paragraph. As for the first, I don't believe that one bad act makes the person himself bad, and ultimately he did something (wrong) out of self-interest which billions of people do every day, just not on that scale.

Truth is you don't get so ostentatiously rich without doing some shady stuff from time to time.
 
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