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Rival Fans: Why are Utd so unpopular?
- Thread starter Lentwood
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Real Madrid's average home attendence tends to fluctuate between 68,000 to 78,000 depending on how well they are playing that season. Barcelona had an average home attendence of 83,749 last season, more than either United or Madrid. I still don't think we are the biggest club in the world though.
Borussia Dortmund have an average attendance of 80,520 - a higher sellout rate than even United. Does that make Dortmund the most popular club in the world?
This argument doesn't hold up very well.
24 countries actually, not 50. And I would like to see your source for the bolded claim above.
"Real Madrid has more than 1,800 club-affiliated supporters’ groups called peñas all around the world with approximately 174 million members."
If your argument is that the average league game for Manchester United has higher viewing figures than Real Madrid or Barcelona, then yes that is true. The Premier League is more popular than La Liga, I'm not going to deny it. That does not however mean that Manchester United is bigger than Real Madrid or Barcelona.
The Champions League is a bigger than any domestic league. It's the most prestigious trophy in club football, and Real Madrid absolutely dominate Manchester United in that competition. 11 European Cups to 3, and they've won just about every relevant encounter in the past 20 years or so (2000, 2003, 2013).
Barcelona have 5 European Cups to United's 3, and we've won our 2 most recent encounters in the final. Don't you think those two finals in 2009 and 2011 had an effect on the perception of the casual football fan? I feel that, in the eyes of the public, we became a bigger club than you at Wembley 2011.
United are a huge club globally, no doubt about it, but I simply cannot agree with the "biggest club in the world" claim. It doesn't hold up to scrutiny.
I'd be very surprised if Real only have 6 supporters clubs worldwide. Even City have loads more than that and many of them pre-date the 2008 takeover but we're nowhere near as big as Real Madrid.
In any case, I don't see why numbers of fans/supporters clubs worldwide should be the only barometer when deciding which club is the biggest. Who has the most fans in Ulan Bator or wherever, while discounting other significant things like trophy count is silly, and when it comes to trophy count Real comfortably win out on that. Also, implying that Real's non-Spanish fans are fairweather fans while United's aren't is equally silly as every club has fairweather fans and a case could easily be made that United have as many as Real, if not more. Real Madrid, Barcelona, and United are all huge clubs in their own right with huge support bases.
Tell you something though, I did a tour of the Bernabeu in 2012 when I was over in Madrid for a few days. The trophy room was very impressive but the room where the manager held his press conferences (Mourinho at the time) was shocking - the carpet under the manager's chair was literally threadbare
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I believe middle American high school girls sum it up best when they say;
"They hate us 'cause they ain't us"
"They hate us 'cause they ain't us"
A good starting point for while United are hated would be some replies in this thread.
I've never said United are the bigger club or more successful. I've only said that United have more fans than Real Madrid or Barcelona. And for that, things like domestic attendance does matter (I think there's a big cultural difference in football support between Spain and England; for the English, attendance is almost a religious duty - hence the huge away support while Madrid or Barca fans barely travel etc) .
Anyway if you admit that the Premier League is more popular then it's natural there'd be more United fans.
I'd be very surprised if Real only have 6 supporters clubs worldwide. Even City have loads more than that and many of them pre-date the 2008 takeover but we're nowhere near as big as Real Madrid.
In any case, I don't see why numbers of fans/supporters clubs worldwide should be the only barometer when deciding which club is the biggest. Who has the most fans in Ulan Bator or wherever, while discounting other significant things like trophy count is silly, and when it comes to trophy count Real comfortably win out on that. Also, implying that Real's non-Spanish fans are fairweather fans while United's aren't is equally silly as every club has fairweather fans and a case could easily be made that United have as many as Real, if not more. Real Madrid, Barcelona, and United are all huge clubs in their own right with huge support bases.
Tell you something though, I did a tour of the Bernabeu in 2012 when I was over in Madrid for a few days. The trophy room was very impressive but the room where the manager held his press conferences (Mourinho at the time) was shocking - the carpet under the manager's chair was literally threadbare
Yea, I was surprised as well..I had taken that from their website. Obviously United has fairweather fans as well, my sense is that the proportion is lower. It's difficult to measure quality of fans but when local Madrid fans whip out the white handkerchiefs at the first sign of trouble or when thousands show up for a bloody player unveiling - it does make it easier.
you live in a different country, it's a totally different kettle of fish. I was brought up to believe you supported your local team or where you were from and I still believe in that as do most of my mates. I've a mate from London who is a 'spurs fan, he won't let his kids support them for the same reason. No one likes a glory hunter.
I agree with the wider point you are making but on the other hand it seems a bit extreme to actively try and encourage your kids not to support City. First of all, and no disrespect to City, you haven't won a major trophy in the last two seasons and you probably won't this year. Yes you are a very good side but it's hardly like supporting City guarantees bragging rights and success. Also, as you will well know, with being a top side comes greater expectation so a draw at home to Everton feels like how say a Hull fan feels when they get beat 3-0 (if not worse). Secondly, looking at how mine and my Dads lives have changed as we have got older because of a divorce, living nearly 3hrs apart and a serious illness if it were not for Utd and us sitting next to each other at home games season after season who knows whether we would be as close. It's something we will have in common now no matter what and wherever I may be living when my kids arrive I will definitely be bringing them up to be Utd fans whether we are European Champions or bottom of League 2 (might be nice - would save a bit of cash!)
It's interesting you ignore and deflect all the talk of glory supporters including deleting the question asking if you started supporting before or after the club had it's success. It's pretty obvious you're sensitive to this as it's probably quite close to the truth.
I didn't have any issue with United either, I said I dislike glory supporters, and it's obviously hit a truth nerve with yourself.
Tell me how difficult it's been for you supporting the 3rd most successful club in the country? Cry me a river. Are you a glory supporter too or is that only reserved for the most successful club?
I've known nothing but being a United supporter. It wasn't a choice. If that was the case with you then we're the same. Though I don't spend my evenings on a Arsenal website trying to diminish their achievements with paranoid and bitter nonsense. Go figure.
Of course he is. I suspect he's a 90s Arse fan.
To answer the question simply, we're NOT unpopular; quite the opposite actually. The question is why do some folks really, really dislike us?
The reason it seems United are disliked is the natural envy other people have of those more successful than them (or the team they support) And remember there's 91 other teams or so there's plenty of envious supporters to go around. No other team can boast our fabulous history, heartache AND success. Rivalry between teams has been prevalent for over 100 years but as the world got "smaller" and media coverage expanded, especially post-war, it was became easier for the average supporter to know what was going on elsewhere and so the envy of all things United grew.
What happened in Munich and the exposure it brought caused many neutrals to feel sorry for the babes of course, and we became the "second" team for many. How could they not want to be part of the story that is United ?
For many, it was a true learning experience. The full story of how Sir Matt, having finished his stint supporting the war effort decided he wanted to build a team virtually from scratch and from largely local kids and by building a scouting system to scour the British Isles for young talent. He was one of the first to recognise that the Europeans had taken "our" game and improved it. There was more emphasis on foot skills ... passing & dribbling became more important than kick & run. This, despite a certain person by the name of Hughes who worked for the FA at the time who was promoting the long ball based on accumulated statistical data. Sir Matt wanted to emulate the Europeans and compete in Europe against the wishes of that same FA ... and over a ten year period starting in 1946 or so, he did just that with the babes. Contrary to the FA's wishes Sir Matt successfully pushed his way into Europe with the best team the world has ever seen (sounds like a song? :-)
Lord knows how many European & domestic trophies that team would have gone on to capture. I think you only have to look at the class of '92 to draw some comparison although Sir Bobby might tell you the Babes were far better equipped to win everything and would therefore have been greater than Beckham et al. But alas it was not to be.
So eat your hearts out scousers. Yes with all the support we have gathered over the years there are some real idiots that claim to be "fans" but are no more than thugs. You too have many villains as do many British teams The loss of practically our entire team in '58 is the only reason you subsequently won as much as you have (compared to us)
Don't get me wrong, your record is impressive. Arguably the second best history with the second best fan base. Yes you won a lot; more than most. Your success under Shankly cannot be denied AND it's why you're "not our favourite" team either. And yes, we suffered a little envy (of your success) ourselves. But that is all behind us now.
It's easy to rationalise why the envious might dislike/hate United by referencing conspiracy theories about Sir Matt tapping-up players back in the day or by having enough money to buy players other teams couldn't or Fergies extra time heroics but never discount the allure of Manchester United & all it stands for. Nobody can deny the desire of virtually every professional footballer to want to join United and play at Old Trafford.
History lesson over, I'll get me coat
The reason it seems United are disliked is the natural envy other people have of those more successful than them (or the team they support) And remember there's 91 other teams or so there's plenty of envious supporters to go around. No other team can boast our fabulous history, heartache AND success. Rivalry between teams has been prevalent for over 100 years but as the world got "smaller" and media coverage expanded, especially post-war, it was became easier for the average supporter to know what was going on elsewhere and so the envy of all things United grew.
What happened in Munich and the exposure it brought caused many neutrals to feel sorry for the babes of course, and we became the "second" team for many. How could they not want to be part of the story that is United ?
For many, it was a true learning experience. The full story of how Sir Matt, having finished his stint supporting the war effort decided he wanted to build a team virtually from scratch and from largely local kids and by building a scouting system to scour the British Isles for young talent. He was one of the first to recognise that the Europeans had taken "our" game and improved it. There was more emphasis on foot skills ... passing & dribbling became more important than kick & run. This, despite a certain person by the name of Hughes who worked for the FA at the time who was promoting the long ball based on accumulated statistical data. Sir Matt wanted to emulate the Europeans and compete in Europe against the wishes of that same FA ... and over a ten year period starting in 1946 or so, he did just that with the babes. Contrary to the FA's wishes Sir Matt successfully pushed his way into Europe with the best team the world has ever seen (sounds like a song? :-)
Lord knows how many European & domestic trophies that team would have gone on to capture. I think you only have to look at the class of '92 to draw some comparison although Sir Bobby might tell you the Babes were far better equipped to win everything and would therefore have been greater than Beckham et al. But alas it was not to be.
So eat your hearts out scousers. Yes with all the support we have gathered over the years there are some real idiots that claim to be "fans" but are no more than thugs. You too have many villains as do many British teams The loss of practically our entire team in '58 is the only reason you subsequently won as much as you have (compared to us)
Don't get me wrong, your record is impressive. Arguably the second best history with the second best fan base. Yes you won a lot; more than most. Your success under Shankly cannot be denied AND it's why you're "not our favourite" team either. And yes, we suffered a little envy (of your success) ourselves. But that is all behind us now.
It's easy to rationalise why the envious might dislike/hate United by referencing conspiracy theories about Sir Matt tapping-up players back in the day or by having enough money to buy players other teams couldn't or Fergies extra time heroics but never discount the allure of Manchester United & all it stands for. Nobody can deny the desire of virtually every professional footballer to want to join United and play at Old Trafford.
History lesson over, I'll get me coat
The real question is why do we hate our rivals?
I think you're a decade behind with that, pal. I supported United thru the 60s and beyond. Back then they were everyone's 2nd favourite team. (Cliched but largely true). The tide starts to turn in he 70s and went into overdrive after Fergie and success. Hoolies? United weren't the worst, we just had more than anyone else and went to other grounds and were the majority. We'd outnumber the middling clubs and only at Newcastle, Leeds and Merseyside were we well outnumbered - but even then would take 15,000'or so. It changed after Hillsboro but the resentment was established. The 67 title clincher at West Ham was like a home game and they've never forgiven us. Munich? You hear about it far more these days than you did back in the 60s. It didn't start to be romanticised until the 70s at the peak of the red Army days.
Another Salford Red, btw.
Stop leading the younger fans astray.
When did United bring 15,000 to Anfield ? That would mean United having the whole Anny Road end and possibly others in the Kop or stands. I was only a kid in the 70's but would know if United brought 15,000 as stories get passed down. In the late 70's - early 80's Anfield was a no go place for visiting firms. Only United , City , West Ham and Chelsea used to put the effort in. The rest shit out . When firms did start showing up they got twatted and never showed up again until the police escort was introduced.
My only recollection of away fans being on the Kop apart from Everton ( who kicked off at the end of the game in 87/88 ) was United in the Easter game ( 3 - 3 ) in 87/88. A little firm of United where in the corner by the Kemlyn and shouted United United when youse scored. Fair play as that must of took some balls that. Anyway they got sussed obviously a few scuffles broke out and they got escorted out into the Kemlyn and round the back to the United end or maybe just kicked out by the bizzies. It may have been the latter as word went round the Kop that they were outside and a lot of little firms bounced out looking for them.
So glad the days of that shit are over. Most of the pricks arrested these days are the type that can't handle their drink and prob get arrested any night out, nothing to do with football thankfully.
And there was me thinking this was a thread inviting rival fans to express their reasons - no matter how misguided and unpalatable in your opinion - for not liking United. It's not like he's deliberately signed up to this forum to take the piss.
Also, in reference to something else you said in the conversation with the Arsenal fan - there seemed to be an implication on your part that the Class of '92 were there at the start of United's successes under Ferguson yet those early trophies were won with a team that was almost entirely bought - an English record amount of money was spent by United in the summer of 1989 despite you only finishing 10th the previous season - and the Class of '92 came later once United had pretty much cemented their place at the top. So to claim Arsenal bought their trophies that were won around the same time and United did it "the right way" is misleading, especially when you look at how many academy graduates made up Arsenal's first title-winning squad for 18 years in 1989 compared to how many made up United's first title-winning squad for 26 years in 1993.
I must admit that I'm surprised the Arsenal fan didn't point this out to you. Maybe he is a 90's gloryhunter after all
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And there was me thinking this was a thread inviting rival fans to express their reasons - no matter how misguided and unpalatable in your opinion - for not liking United. It's not like he's deliberately signed up to this forum to take the piss.
Also, in reference to something else you said in the conversation with the Arsenal fan - there seemed to be an implication on your part that the Class of '92 were there at the start of United's successes under Ferguson yet those early trophies were won with a team that was almost entirely bought - an English record amount of money was spent by United in the summer of 1989 despite you only finishing 10th the previous season - and the Class of '92 came later once United had pretty much cemented their place at the top. So to claim Arsenal bought their trophies that were won around the same time and United did it "the right way" is misleading, especially when you look at how many academy graduates made up Arsenal's first title-winning squad for 18 years in 1989 compared to how many made up United's first title-winning squad for 26 years in 1993.
I must admit that I'm surprised the Arsenal fan didn't point this out to you. Maybe he is a 90's gloryhunter after all
Yeah and we're still doing it. Should we in some way be ashamed that we'd rather invest our self made money in our team than become some property investment portfolio like Arsenal
The answer is in the opening post.
"As a Utd fan growing up in Derby"
Says it all, really...
"As a Utd fan growing up in Derby"
Says it all, really...
Here's one reason we're so unpopular:
"Regarding whether the match with their north-west rivals, whose 18 titles puts them second to United's 20, is still English football's biggest game, Mourinho said 'I don't know. I know Manchester United is the biggest club in this country. I know, you know, everybody knows. I am sorry. It is easy to know.'"
As other posters have rightly pointed out - and who cares what other teams' supporters think - we're the best. Top man, Jose!
No-one likes us, we don't care - and we've got a few more trophies than Millwall.
(Apologies if this brilliant quote has been turned up in another thread!)
"Regarding whether the match with their north-west rivals, whose 18 titles puts them second to United's 20, is still English football's biggest game, Mourinho said 'I don't know. I know Manchester United is the biggest club in this country. I know, you know, everybody knows. I am sorry. It is easy to know.'"
As other posters have rightly pointed out - and who cares what other teams' supporters think - we're the best. Top man, Jose!
No-one likes us, we don't care - and we've got a few more trophies than Millwall.
(Apologies if this brilliant quote has been turned up in another thread!)
And there was me thinking this was a thread inviting rival fans to express their reasons - no matter how misguided and unpalatable in your opinion - for not liking United. It's not like he's deliberately signed up to this forum to take the piss.
Also, in reference to something else you said in the conversation with the Arsenal fan - there seemed to be an implication on your part that the Class of '92 were there at the start of United's successes under Ferguson yet those early trophies were won with a team that was almost entirely bought - an English record amount of money was spent by United in the summer of 1989 despite you only finishing 10th the previous season - and the Class of '92 came later once United had pretty much cemented their place at the top. So to claim Arsenal bought their trophies that were won around the same time and United did it "the right way" is misleading, especially when you look at how many academy graduates made up Arsenal's first title-winning squad for 18 years in 1989 compared to how many made up United's first title-winning squad for 26 years in 1993.
I must admit that I'm surprised the Arsenal fan didn't point this out to you. Maybe he is a 90's gloryhunter after all
Terry Phelan Wimbledon £2,500,000 25 Aug, 1992
Steve Finney Preston Free 12 Feb, 1993
Alan Kernaghan Middlesbro £1,600,000 20 Sep, 1993
Carl Griffiths Shrewsbury £500,000 29 Oct, 1993
David Rocastle Leeds £2,000,000 22 Dec, 1993
Uwe Rosler Dyn Dresden £750,000 02 Mar, 1994
Paul Walsh Portsmouth £750,000 10 Mar, 1994
Peter Beagrie Everton £1,100,000 24 Mar, 1994
City spent £9.2mil in season 93-94.
This was a record as well.
Don't see City fans mentioning this much.
Yeah and we're still doing it. Should we in some way be ashamed that we'd rather invest our self made money in our team than become some property investment portfolio like Arsenal
That wasn't really the point I was making (about being ashamed to spend big money). In any case, most of that spend in 1989 was way beyond what you were making at the time and plunged you millions into debt. Edwards wouldn't have been so keen to offload the club onto Knighton otherwise - if United were such a cash cow back then, then he wouldn't have been looking for a buyer. That came later when, funnily enough, Knighton was the one who had said you should be making far more money out of your global support base than you actually were.
What's City got to do with a discussion about United and Arsenal?
Also, since when was Terry Phelan signing for us in August 1992 part of the 1993-94 season?
Not only that, where are you getting £2 million for David Rocastle from? We signed him in a straight swap for David White.
Lastly, I'll happily admit that we've spunked shit loads of money on players down the years and plenty of them turned out to be utter gash. Just looking at that list, £1.6 million for Kernaghan was a laughably ridiculous figure.
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I always fancied myself a rather handsome chap, but now I know I'm not because "Ruffian" has declared it so
We definitely got the sympathy vote from most neutrals & the resurgence of Sir Matt to build a team good enough to win the league in'67 followed by the European Cup in '68, just 10 years post Munich was remarkable and appreciated by all but a few.
I must say I too started to feel more animosity on the terraces in the late 60's. Before that I was taken to games with dad where we'd stand in the paddocks & I don't recall much in the way of trouble or even bad language in the songs? And because dad married a Londoner that included matches away at places like Fulham & West Ham. By the late 60's and early 70's it was more about Leed's & Revie's bullies. We sang derogatory songs about Citeh of course & they were still more the rival as expected, while Shankley's Liverpool had just arrived after being promoted just before our 63' cup FA win. They enjoyed some success in the 60's it must be said, but I only remember singing the "you'll never walk again" song. As the mid 70's rolled around that changed!
You're right; I remember away games at places like Forest & Blackpool and there being enough of us at the ground early enough to "take their stand" but wouldn't even think about it at Maine Rd, St James or Anfield and the like. There were however, always enough of us to be the dominant force at the "away end" at just about any other club and like now, away attendance records were always the highest when Utd came to town. As for 15,000 ... hmmm that seems like a lot? OT held I think 61,000 in 1970 and the Stretty probably had about 20,000 of us standing. If 15,000 supporters were travelling they wouldn't all be the type to try & get into the "wrong end". The exception maybe would be games in London where there were / are huge numbers of "Cockney Reds". That's the reason for the dominance at Upton Park in '67.
I was no hooligan and certainly not a skin (long hair & prog rock was my schtick) But I'll tell ya, getting off the trains for an away game & not being afraid to wear the scarf was a feckin' rush I'll never forget!
Munich? You hear about it far more these days than you did back in the 60s. It didn't start to be romanticised until the 70s at the peak of the red Army days.
Another Salford Red, btw.
Nobody dissed Munich back then that I recall either. It was still too fresh in the mind perhaps. When did the airplane shit start exactly & by who first?
Not surprised it didn't take long for Ruffian to get banned.
Can't say when it first started but around 1973/4 a Liverpool fan told a snarky joke about it to me.We definitely got the sympathy vote from most neutrals & the resurgence of Sir Matt to build a team good enough to win the league in'67 followed by the European Cup in '68, just 10 years post Munich was remarkable and appreciated by all but a few.
I must say I too started to feel more animosity on the terraces in the late 60's. Before that I was taken to games with dad where we'd stand in the paddocks & I don't recall much in the way of trouble or even bad language in the songs? And because dad married a Londoner that included matches away at places like Fulham & West Ham. By the late 60's and early 70's it was more about Leed's & Revie's bullies. We sang derogatory songs about Citeh of course & they were still more the rival as expected, while Shankley's Liverpool had just arrived after being promoted just before our 63' cup FA win. They enjoyed some success in the 60's it must be said, but I only remember singing the "you'll never walk again" song. As the mid 70's rolled around that changed!
You're right; I remember away games at places like Forest & Blackpool and there being enough of us at the ground early enough to "take their stand" but wouldn't even think about it at Maine Rd, St James or Anfield and the like. There were however, always enough of us to be the dominant force at the "away end" at just about any other club and like now, away attendance records were always the highest when Utd came to town. As for 15,000 ... hmmm that seems like a lot? OT held I think 61,000 in 1970 and the Stretty probably had about 20,000 of us standing. If 15,000 supporters were travelling they wouldn't all be the type to try & get into the "wrong end". The exception maybe would be games in London where there were / are huge numbers of "Cockney Reds". That's the reason for the dominance at Upton Park in '67.
I was no hooligan and certainly not a skin (long hair & prog rock was my schtick) But I'll tell ya, getting off the trains for an away game & not being afraid to wear the scarf was a feckin' rush I'll never forget!
Nobody dissed Munich back then that I recall either. It was still too fresh in the mind perhaps. When did the airplane shit start exactly & by who first?
Your mate, who lives in London, supports Spurs but won't let his kids support Spurs?
I find football fans of super teams, me too, quite strange: all us claim we are not glory hunters but still say WE win when speaking about the club success. Truth is, we are not personally related in any sense with the work (and the success, when it comes) of the super clubs we support. It is just a circus and many times too much a feel-good for our shite life.
Yet to be given a good reason for this, even more so now when players are rarely from the area.
I have absolutely no love for Newcastle United even tho I'm from here, I actually seriously disliked the fans claiming they were a big club because they can second a few times.
The club has done feck all for me, I have no connection to the players so why should I be forced to support them, I got no thrill from watching them play I didn't care if they lost, no offence but your mate sounds like a Cnut if that's the case
I'd love for Swansea to get the unfair media coverage and refereeing performances you lot get
You're right in that success is the main reason some don't like United
From my personal experience it's mostly the results of success.
You get more bandwagoners and others have to deal with it is a major part. Everyone knows how annoying it is when they've got that friend in a group who loves to spout off about football and how great *insert team here* is. Yet when you actually talk to them about football, they barely know who any players, coaches, heck teams in other countries are. A lot of these people end up being United fans.
Then there's the weird levels of arrogance that come off as so misplaced recently.
For example my group of friends and family is some Tottenham, some Arsenal, plus a smattering of Forest, Wolves, and Liverpool. Then there's the United supporters. I can literally have a half decent football conversation about players with Arsenal supporters. ARSENAL SUPPORTERS about how Kane, Alli, Alderweireld, whoever perform, but as soon as a United fan overhears it? It's all, "wouldn't get into the United team though", "if he was any good we would have bought him from you. You're a selling club. Everyone knows it." It's mind numbing, we literally have to avoid all football talk around them.
Now I realize not all United supporters are like that, you're a testament to that, but for someone who would have to deal with that kind of smug know-nothing attitude all the time I could see why they'd dislike United.
You get more bandwagoners and others have to deal with it is a major part. Everyone knows how annoying it is when they've got that friend in a group who loves to spout off about football and how great *insert team here* is. Yet when you actually talk to them about football, they barely know who any players, coaches, heck teams in other countries are. A lot of these people end up being United fans.
Then there's the weird levels of arrogance that come off as so misplaced recently.
For example my group of friends and family is some Tottenham, some Arsenal, plus a smattering of Forest, Wolves, and Liverpool. Then there's the United supporters. I can literally have a half decent football conversation about players with Arsenal supporters. ARSENAL SUPPORTERS about how Kane, Alli, Alderweireld, whoever perform, but as soon as a United fan overhears it? It's all, "wouldn't get into the United team though", "if he was any good we would have bought him from you. You're a selling club. Everyone knows it." It's mind numbing, we literally have to avoid all football talk around them.
Now I realize not all United supporters are like that, you're a testament to that, but for someone who would have to deal with that kind of smug know-nothing attitude all the time I could see why they'd dislike United.
He called me King CnutThe Liverpool fan not you
And there was me thinking this was a thread inviting rival fans to express their reasons - no matter how misguided and unpalatable in your opinion - for not liking United. It's not like he's deliberately signed up to this forum to take the piss.
Also, in reference to something else you said in the conversation with the Arsenal fan - there seemed to be an implication on your part that the Class of '92 were there at the start of United's successes under Ferguson yet those early trophies were won with a team that was almost entirely bought - an English record amount of money was spent by United in the summer of 1989 despite you only finishing 10th the previous season - and the Class of '92 came later once United had pretty much cemented their place at the top. So to claim Arsenal bought their trophies that were won around the same time and United did it "the right way" is misleading, especially when you look at how many academy graduates made up Arsenal's first title-winning squad for 18 years in 1989 compared to how many made up United's first title-winning squad for 26 years in 1993.
I must admit that I'm surprised the Arsenal fan didn't point this out to you. Maybe he is a 90's gloryhunter after all
I personally have no problem with clubs spending their own money. I respect Arsenal for self-funding their success.
I just find it odd to have a go at United for similary spending their own money. Especially when that spending was typically supplemented with a healthy dose of organic youth development, rather than simply buying an entire side. Spending your own money and bringing through youth players. If you hate a club for that, it comes across as incredibly bitter.
But then it's not that which people hate, it's the success it led too. If we'd been doing the same thing but plodding along 'doing a Spurs', no one would've passed any remarks.
This.
And this. I have a mate who is this kind of "supporter" and it's actually infuriating at times. We used to live together in Uni, and while i and some other mates (a United, Arsenal and a Pool fan) watched United matches in the weekend, he would casually pop his head in and ask "are we winning?" and then leave. Of course our Pool and Gunners supporting mates gave us a lot of shit for this
Well United haven't always been entirely self-funded as I pointed out further up but aside from that, I actually do agree that having a go at United (or any other club for that matter) for spending big money on players is bizarre when there are fans up and down the country moaning at their own clubs for not spending enough.
Although not totally related, there was a thread in the newbies some years back about Pompey's financial problems. It was around the same time as Rooney's stand-off with United in 2010. When news broke that he'd signed a new contract, an Arsenal fan on the Pompey thread said something along the lines of: "Shocking - Portsmouth are in the shit and there's Rooney getting a new deal". Now I don't like Rooney and I don't like United either but even I couldn't let that one go and asked him why the need to make a connection between the 2 events. What surprised me was that this had come from someone who was normally a decent poster.
Not just fans of ABU, Sunday Supplement today had a discussion on Costa and a couple of the highly paid journos on there were suggesting that as Costa and Jose both have Mendes as their agent that Jose would have had something to do with Costa's "strike". If Jose had suggested something along these lines he would be charged with bringing the game into disrepute, fined, banned and who knows what else-the journos won't have anything to answer.
I hope Mendes, Costa and Jose hear about this allegation and sue the cnuts!
I hope Mendes, Costa and Jose hear about this allegation and sue the cnuts!