SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

I live in a small village (7500 inhabitants) where we have 3 somewhat care homes. Somewhat because they have different concepts, from partly day care, appartments with care-as-you-need it and "normal" care facilities.

One of the houses has a Covid outbreak - 23 of 84 patients and 10 workers were tested positive last week and they already have 2 deaths in it. My 91 year old aunt (I call her aunt, she is the niece of my grandfather and cousin of my Mom) is tested positive but as my mom told me has just mild symptoms. She comes from a very healthy background as my grandfather and the five brothers and sisters that were born around 1910 and survived the toddler time and the wars all died 80 and older. And she is a doctor that lived healthy all of her life. So I am not really scared for her.

My parents bought an appartment in the new house of the same organisation. They offer care-as-you-need it there for the people who need it. When they bought the appartment last year they did not need any help - but after a stroke my father gets help every day with washing and dressing. It is him I am scared for.

Until now the fear was somehow just something theoretical - yes, there were cases in the region - but that is not so distant anymore and that scares me.
 
Latest figures for the UK case rate by regions:

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It was great to see the first member of the public getting vaccinated in the UK on the news last night. I hope the government finally get something right and this allows the UK to get back to some kind of normal as soon as possible. It has been (and is) a terrible time and I hope this cam lift people just enough to get through the tough times still to come.
 
So woke up yesterday with a sore throat and nose all closed. Ordered a test kit directly so hope it comes soon.
I am not starting my new job until february so home isolation is no problem anyway.

Thing i was wondering is, i sneeze a alot. Is that a normal symptom?
 
Wibble said:
It was great to see the first member of the public getting vaccinated in the UK on the news last night. I hope the government finally get something right and this allows the UK to get back to some kind of normal as soon as possible. It has been (and is) a terrible time and I hope this cam lift people just enough to get through the tough times still to come.
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Don't forget the Russians, too.

Would you take the Sputnik V vaccine if it was offered in Australia?
 
Dante said:
Don't forget the Russians, too.

Would you take the Sputnik V vaccine if it was offered in Australia?
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Yes because if it was offered it would have to have passed appropriate safety and efficacy trials to get approval.
 
Wibble said:
Yes because if it was offered it would have to have passed appropriate safety and efficacy trials to get approval.
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That's very trusting of authority figures. Not even the Russians themselves are comfortable with it.

Coronavirus: Sputnik V vaccine rushed out to wary Russians
By Sarah Rainsford

Its name alone speaks of Russia's ambition: Sputnik V, the country's leading vaccine against Covid-19, is meant to be a world-beater just like its cosmic namesake.

Back in August, it was the first to be registered for emergency use although it had only been tested on a few dozen people. Now doctors, teachers and social workers are being offered Sputnik V in a mass inoculation campaign ordered by President Vladimir Putin. Its timing, just ahead of a similar launch in the UK, is unlikely to be a coincidence.

But Sputnik V is still in the midst of trials to check that it's safe and actually works, making some Russians wary of receiving it yet. And despite a fanfare over the vaccine's grand rollout, there are still problems scaling up production.

In a sense, this is no "launch" at all. Russian health workers have been getting vaccinated in tandem with the official trials for several months. Teachers have been eligible too, and VIPs including President Putin's own daughter have had the jab. The list is said to total more than 100,000 people.

Bold claims

"All of the staff here have been vaccinated," nurse Oksana Konstantinova confirms, as she removes a tiny glass bottle of vaccine from the deep freeze at a Moscow clinic.

Sputnik V has to be stored at -18C at least in its liquid form. There are plans for a more practical, powder version of the vaccine but it's not yet being made in large amounts.

Why did she accept an experimental jab? "We have to be able to say that the vaccine is safe and necessary in the current situation," the nurse explains. "I was worried a bit. I am human! But I realised it was a fuss about nothing."

Sputnik's backers claim it offers 95% protection against the coronavirus, putting Russia's offering right up alongside the vaccines of teams in the US and Europe. But here, the data released so far is based on interim results only - after just 39 trial volunteers caught Covid. That haste - coupled with such bold claims - has raised eyebrows.

"We hope the vaccine is effective, but it's difficult to trust some of the figures," argues Svetlana Zavidova, whose organisation monitors clinical trials in Russia.
She also lists concerns that Sputnik's developers injected themselves with their own vaccine and that the product was registered for use after such limited trials.

"We don't see the point of such a rush, other than announcing how we beat the rest of the world," Zavidova says. "I think there's a struggle between scientists and politicians, and the latter are winning."
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55221785
 
Dante said:
That's very trusting of authority figures. Not even the Russians themselves are comfortable with it.



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55221785
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I think western media’s coverage of Russian and Chinese tech is extremely cynical and biased.
I don’t know if it is justified in this instance but when I read the news, I do not feel like it can be trusted.

Pfizer getting EUA was reported as being a huge positive milestone but when China or Russia do the same thing, it is reported as rushed/untested.
 
Blackwidow said:
I live in a small village (7500 inhabitants) where we have 3 somewhat care homes. Somewhat because they have different concepts, from partly day care, appartments with care-as-you-need it and "normal" care facilities.

One of the houses has a Covid outbreak - 23 of 84 patients and 10 workers were tested positive last week and they already have 2 deaths in it. My 91 year old aunt (I call her aunt, she is the niece of my grandfather and cousin of my Mom) is tested positive but as my mom told me has just mild symptoms. She comes from a very healthy background as my grandfather and the five brothers and sisters that were born around 1910 and survived the toddler time and the wars all died 80 and older. And she is a doctor that lived healthy all of her life. So I am not really scared for her.

My parents bought an appartment in the new house of the same organisation. They offer care-as-you-need it there for the people who need it. When they bought the appartment last year they did not need any help - but after a stroke my father gets help every day with washing and dressing. It is him I am scared for.

Until now the fear was somehow just something theoretical - yes, there were cases in the region - but that is not so distant anymore and that scares me.
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In Azores, my region (240k pop) only one care home was hit and killed 12 people there, about a third or fourth of its occupants. In a village of 5000 people, that was demolishing, it all happened in three weeks or so. Only three other persons died in Azores in the first wave. The effect of this in those places is magnitudes higher than the general population. Our entire region had 16 deaths in the first wave, with 12 being from the same place.

Even when you think you'll be able to protect them, just thinking about how much you need to take from them to do that, it's depressing all the same. Dreadful disease, can't wait for it to go away.
 
BootsyCollins said:
So woke up yesterday with a sore throat and nose all closed. Ordered a test kit directly so hope it comes soon.
I am not starting my new job until february so home isolation is no problem anyway.

Thing i was wondering is, i sneeze a alot. Is that a normal symptom?
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I have the same thing right now but other than a few anecdotal accounts, no those are not symptoms. It’s probably just a cold or even something like turning your heating up now it’s cold can cause that - my throat is very sensitive to humidity change at home.

i get tested every week through work so I guess I’ll find out soon enough! Glad you got a test too. It’s the right thing to do, even if it’s unlikely
 
Adamsk7 said:
I have the same thing right now but other than a few anecdotal accounts, no those are not symptoms. It’s probably just a cold or even something like turning your heating up now it’s cold can cause that - my throat is very sensitive to humidity change at home.

i get tested every week through work so I guess I’ll find out soon enough! Glad you got a test too. It’s the right thing to do, even if it’s unlikely
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Thanks for the reply. Hope we both negative.
 
Dante said:
That's very trusting of authority figures. Not even the Russians themselves are comfortable with it.



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55221785
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I don'tvtrust the Russians but I do trust that it wouldn't be approved if proper testing did not occur and/or wasn't documented. I suspect the Russians did cut corners which means it wouldn't be approved in Australia.
 
Wibble said:
I don'tvtrust the Russians but I do trust that it wouldn't be approved if proper testing did not occur and/or wasn't documented. I suspect the Russians did cut corners which means it wouldn't be approved in Australia.
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Didn't Sputnik skipped officially phase 3?
 
FireballXL5 said:
Covid-19 vaccine: Allergy warning over new jab

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55244122
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Not particularly surprising given that the workers in question already have severe enough allergies to something else - enough to carry an epipen. In my opinion, it's pretty bold of these guys to get first in line considering they're already atopic. That's an individual decision.

An mRNA vaccine which stimulates an immune response goes a bit overboard in people known to have an overactive immune reaction to other allergens? Meh. The thing that annoys me is that this will be blown out of proportion by anti-vaxxers etc.
 
Camy89 said:
Not particularly surprising given that the workers in question already have severe enough allergies to something else - enough to carry an epipen. In my opinion, it's pretty bold of these guys to get first in line considering they're already atopic. That's an individual decision.

An mRNA vaccine which stimulates an immune response goes a bit overboard in people known to have an overactive immune reaction to other allergens? Meh. The thing that annoys me is that this will be blown out of proportion by anti-vaxxers etc.
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Agreed. I carry an epipen (when I remember) for a paper wasp allergy but I don't react to vaccination. So I'd have the shot but also have a slightly elevated risk of a severe creation. I'd take the risk without a second thought.
 
4bars said:
If I remember well they started to vaccinate in August as approved only in Russia while rolling the 3rd phase. In November their data showed 92% (edit) effectiveness

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-54905330
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I guess if they collected the data from the roll out in a way that was as rigorous as a normal phase 3 trial that might be good enough. However I'd guess most countries would want a proper study rather than what is likely at best normal post-approval monitoring.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
That’s a little disingenuous tbf. I’m sure there’s been days where the number of people dying of, say, heart disease or cancer would make that list.
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Hardly. heart disease and cancer are 1st and 2nd cause of death in US and are around 650,000 a year, meaning under 1,800 a day. could be a huge peak in a day, but statistically unlikely as they are not contagious diseases
 
Pogue Mahone said:
That’s a little disingenuous tbf. I’m sure there’s been days where the number of people dying of, say, heart disease or cancer would make that list.
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Wouldn’t be surprised on such.

But, all these events minus the covid death days were one off tragedies where there was minimal ability for most of the fatalities to have been saved.

But to think that enough is being done by this government & the nation’s populace to stem the tide of these deaths is just not true. The acceptance that this is potentially the norm or should be the cost of doing business is such a shame.
 
Apparently more people per day are dying in the US than they did from 9/11. Just in the number of deaths, that is incredible that it seems to be swept under the rug in the States

Also I think in the UK, I think we have had more civilian deaths due to COVID than during WW2.

If both true, the sheer scale of these numbers is incredible
 
4bars said:
Hardly. heart disease and cancer are 1st and 2nd cause of death in US and are around 650,000 a year, meaning under 1,800 a day. could be a huge peak in a day, but statistically unlikely as they are not contagious diseases
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Well there you go. An average of 1800/day means it’s inevitable there will have been days where the numbers were well over 2k. These things aren’t perfectly evenly distributed.

Anyway, I’m just being pedantic. The US is getting a staggering death toll from covid and the fact that so many are down to blatant mismanagement must be infuriating.
 
acnumber9 said:
I’d argue a 10pm curfew is only going to make people more likely to go back to somebody’s house afterwards.
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In all honesty, those people will likely go back to someone's house regardless.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
Can't remember exactly who I had this debate with at the time in this thread. Some were disagreeing that closing the pubs 1hr earlier would make feck all difference to transmission.

Well...

"'No hard evidence' behind curfew"
https://www.bighospitality.co.uk/Ar...its-Patrick-Vallance-Coronavirus-restrictions
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Is there much hard evidence behind any of the UK's decisions during this? Most of the rules have been done in complete isolation from what the rest of Europe and the world has been doing.
 
Don't see how relevant citing 9/11 is. The US is among a long list countries in the 800+ deaths per million range, when you have a large area counted as one country it will generate large numbers. If the US reaches 1600-2000 deaths per million then that would be out of the norm. Multiple countries have posted around 900 deaths in Europe, per capita that would be around 5k deaths in the US, there's still another ~2k to go before being on par and without going into when the dates actually happened as it's relative and goes back days and weeks for every single day announcement.
 
zing said:
I think western media’s coverage of Russian and Chinese tech is extremely cynical and biased.
I don’t know if it is justified in this instance but when I read the news, I do not feel like it can be trusted.

Pfizer getting EUA was reported as being a huge positive milestone but when China or Russia do the same thing, it is reported as rushed/untested.
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Really? There is big money to be made for anyone who can make an effective vaccine..

If someone does, they'll share their data with everyone.. have it reviewed and start licencing it... or taking orders.

Where is the data for the vaccines from China and Russia? Have they submitted their data for peer review anywhere?
 
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