SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

I’m in between AZ doses and it’s annoying how it seems every week there’s news that makes AZ look more and more shit compared to Pfizer. How much is it going to matter?

Thankfully both parents are Pfizerized.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Interesting. Thank. Like you said, very small samples size but reassuring all the same.
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An update to this:

Eight per cent of unvaccinated Covid-19 patients here in the past seven weeks had their condition worsen to the point of requiring supplemental oxygen, said Health Minister Ong Ye Kung on Monday (May 31).

In contrast, during the same time period, only one out of 93 - slightly over one per cent - of those who were vaccinated faced a similar situation, said Mr Ong, who co-chairs the multi-ministry task force (MTF) tackling the coronavirus outbreak here.

Acknowledging that these statistics, which reference locally transmitted cases, did not constitute "a full-scale empirical study", Mr Ong said that as more data becomes available, the protective benefits that Covid-19 vaccination will give an individual will become clearer.

https://www.straitstimes.com/singap...ts-developed-severe-form-of-disease-in-last-7
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TLDR -- Vaccination helps alleviate symptoms. Out of the 93 fully vaccinated people who were infected over the last month or so, only 1 required supplemental oxygen. And that 1 case was already having medical complications before contracting COVID.
 
OleBoiii said:
Has there been any research on whether the summer heat affects the spread of covid? Last summer here in Norway we basically went 3-4 months with almost no restrictions(apart from international travel and 1 meter distancing in bars etc). We had new reported covid cases every day, but things never really spiralled out of control. I wonder why that is?

If the heat does matter, then why has things gotten so out of control in India? Is it because of the mutations? Higher population density?
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I don't think we have the full answers for that yet but it wouldn't be a surprise if there was an effect. However, I'd guess that with such an infectious virus summer alone wouldn't stop or even hugely mitigate an outbreak and that vaccination will be needed to do the heavy lifting.

Possible beneficial factors in summer (all may not apply to covid)
  • +UV increasing Vitamin D production
  • +UV and +temperature reducing how long viruses live on surfaces
  • + temperatures unusual mean the air is less dry and mucus membranes defend against respiratory viruses better and aerosol transmission usually occurs more often when the air is cold and dry.
  • human behavior - less time sent indoors where the virus spreads best and more open windows etc
  • reduced covid and other viruses in summer decreases sneezing and coughing which is the primary method of transmission
  • school summer holidays are usually in summer which further reduces viral spread
 
NYAS said:
I’m in between AZ doses and it’s annoying how it seems every week there’s news that makes AZ look more and more shit compared to Pfizer. How much is it going to matter?

Thankfully both parents are Pfizerized.
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Yeah it seems like the fact that AZ has been so prominently used in the UK may cause a sticking point going forward. while it’s obviously not ineffective it does seem to be the least effective of the jabs used. It still is predicted to be 60% effective against the Indian variant after too jabs but obviously that’s getting to the levels were its basically a coin toss where it is going to be effective or not. But still a lot better than nothing.
 
massi83 said:
You could at least tag your fellow spurs fan, when you are talking about him.
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For fecks sake, had a good chuckle at this! Poor guy hasn't been on since Jan, hope he's coped OK with the terrible season.
 
Nytram Shakes said:
Yeah it seems like the fact that AZ has been so prominently used in the UK may cause a sticking point going forward. while it’s obviously not ineffective it does seem to be the least effective of the jabs used. It still is predicted to be 60% effective against the Indian variant after too jabs but obviously that’s getting to the levels were its basically a coin toss where it is going to be effective or not. But still a lot better than nothing.
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As far as I understood, effectiveness on protecting you to get COVID differs depending on the vaccine and variant but all of them protects you 100% against severe illness (AZ included) that is the main goal of these vaccines.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Worth noting that B117 (which originated in the UK) has become the dominant variant in Israel, so they’re not exactly watertight when it comes to importing foreign variants. Although now they’re basically fully vaccinated it makes it extremely difficult for any new variant to get a foothold, never mind dominate.

We do have some real life effectiveness data coming out of Israel re Uk and SA variants (B117 and B1351) which is generally reassuring. We can’t be 100% certain but it does seem a reasonable assumption that the vaccine resistance we’ve seen from B1351 will be similar with the Indian variant (B16172) because they have the same mutation that theoretically helps them evade the vaccine.
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All very very true and like I said, I'm sure Pfizer will work superbly against B16172.

Just that it's currently too early to say that the lack of a spike on Israel is due to them using Pfizer as opposed to AZ. Not only does the new variant in the UK seem to be spreading at least partly amongst the unvaccinated but the huge Indian diaspora in the UK (and the recent Gaza war) means that I doubt it has had anywhere near the same opportunity to spread in Israel as it has in the UK.

Of course, this isn't to absolve the UK government in their again almost criminal irresponsibility in delaying putting India on the red list. fecking idiots.
 
Started having a mild cough and feeling sluggish since yesterday. The quick test returned negative but took the PCR test last night anyways and waiting for the results. I'm about 70% sure I probably caught it as I went to a bar on Friday and there's no other way for me to have cold-like symptoms in the summer.:nervous:

So far not too bad and I'm working from home and hope it stays that way.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
Started having a mild cough and feeling sluggish since yesterday. The quick test returned negative but took the PCR test last night anyways and waiting for the results. I'm about 70% sure I probably caught it as I went to a bar on Friday and there's no other way for me to have cold-like symptoms in the summer.:nervous:

So far not too bad and I'm working from home and hope it stays that way.
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Hopefully it’s nothing - have you had a dose of any vaccine yet?
 
africanspur said:
All very very true and like I said, I'm sure Pfizer will work superbly against B16172.

Just that it's currently too early to say that the lack of a spike on Israel is due to them using Pfizer as opposed to AZ. Not only does the new variant in the UK seem to be spreading at least partly amongst the unvaccinated but the huge Indian diaspora in the UK (and the recent Gaza war) means that I doubt it has had anywhere near the same opportunity to spread in Israel as it has in the UK.

Of course, this isn't to absolve the UK government in their again almost criminal irresponsibility in delaying putting India on the red list. fecking idiots.
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Yeah, you do make a fair point. I can’t help wondering what other countries got a big influx of travellers from India earlier this year? There must be a few of them around? Why aren’t we hearing about a huge surge of this variant from other countries? Is this because the UK is so much better at generating this sequencing data? Or much worse at enforcing self isolation and quarantine for travellers?
 
4bars said:
As far as I understood, effectiveness on protecting you to get COVID differs depending on the vaccine and variant but all of them protect you 100% against severe illness (AZ included) that is the main goal of these vaccines.
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Is this still true? there is very minimal reporting regarding the numbers who have had to jabs who have got ill. The reports that came out last week said something along the lines of: not many of those who are in hospital have had 2 jabs and some of those have underlining health issues. Which is very vague. Obviously, it leans towards vaccines being very effective(at least against the kent variant) at preventing severe illness but would also imply it's not 100%.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yeah, you do make a fair point. I can’t help wondering what other countries got a big influx of travellers from India earlier this year? There must be a few of them around? Why aren’t we hearing about a huge surge of this variant from other countries? Is this because the UK is so much better at generating this sequencing data? Or much worse at enforcing self isolation and quarantine for travellers?
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I would suspect a mixture of the 2. I would also add in that there is a cultural problem in the UK in regards to not paying attention to the quarantine rules.

You add all 3 together and you get a problem
 
Nytram Shakes said:
Is this still true? there is very minimal reporting regarding the numbers who have had to jabs who have got ill. The reports that came out last week said something along the lines of: not many of those who are in hospital have had 2 jabs and some of those have underlining health issues. Which is very vague. Obviously, it leans towards vaccines being very effective(at least against the kent variant) at preventing severe illness but would also imply it's not 100%.
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It isn't. There's plenty of evidence to suggest that in our area.
 
Anecdotal yes but just a bit of reassurance hopefully for the AZ vaccine recipients in here
I've been working at a GP practice, as a clinician for 111 triage and in A&E, haven't admitted anybody so far with severe covid, nor consulted somebody for that matter that turned out to be covid positive who's had two doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine - working in Leicester and Leicestershire - the former a hotspot currently for the Indian variant.
 
Nytram Shakes said:
I would suspect a mixture of the 2. I would also add in that there is a cultural problem in the UK in regards to not paying attention to the quarantine rules.

You add all 3 together and you get a problem
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Where's the evidence to support that? It's a sweeping generalisation
 
Nytram Shakes said:
Yeah it seems like the fact that AZ has been so prominently used in the UK may cause a sticking point going forward. while it’s obviously not ineffective it does seem to be the least effective of the jabs used. It still is predicted to be 60% effective against the Indian variant after too jabs but obviously that’s getting to the levels were its basically a coin toss where it is going to be effective or not. But still a lot better than nothing.
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That 60% number is getting a lot of air time, but it's probably biased by the fact the data was collected closer to the time of the AZ 2nd doses than the Pfizer 2nd doses, on average. Immunity builds over time, so we may well expect the 60% to be revised up in further PHE technical briefings.
 
Inigo Montoya said:
Where's the evidence to support that? It's a sweeping generalisation
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it is very much is a sweeping generalisation and very flawed I’m sure in many cases.
But everyone I know who has been abroad and should of isolated when there back has in no way stuck to the guidelines
 
Last Tuesday I got my 2nd Moderna shot. My wife got hers the next day. The kids brought something home from school. My eldest one started with a temp and then developed a cough. The youngest one has like a delayed reaction to him but again temperature then a cough.
my wife developed a cough straight after her shot which we put down to a side effect but it’s dragged on. I developed a cough a couple of days ago and my oximeter is quickly swapping between 96/95/94/93. Whereas a week ago it was 99/98. Don’t tell me bloody COVID has sneaked in at the last moment
 
lynchie said:
That 60% number is getting a lot of air time, but it's probably biased by the fact the data was collected closer to the time of the AZ 2nd doses than the Pfizer 2nd doses, on average. Immunity builds over time, so we may well expect the 60% to be revised up in further PHE technical briefings.
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why did the collect the AZ closer to the time? how much closer to the jab date was the data collected ?
 
Nytram Shakes said:
Is this still true? there is very minimal reporting regarding the numbers who have had to jabs who have got ill. The reports that came out last week said something along the lines of: not many of those who are in hospital have had 2 jabs and some of those have underlining health issues. Which is very vague. Obviously, it leans towards vaccines being very effective(at least against the kent variant) at preventing severe illness but would also imply it's not 100%.
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It's not 100%, nothing is, but running some numbers on the recent data released suggests it's still comfortably above 90%

 
Nytram Shakes said:
why did the collect the AZ closer to the time? how much closer to the jab date was the data collected ?
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Pfizer jabs were generally done earlier - it was approved first - and so the second doses came earlier as well. We've only very recently gone through the big wave of 2nd doses for the big vaccination surge in February, so there's a lot of recent 2nd doses, that would skew toward AZ.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
Started having a mild cough and feeling sluggish since yesterday. The quick test returned negative but took the PCR test last night anyways and waiting for the results. I'm about 70% sure I probably caught it as I went to a bar on Friday and there's no other way for me to have cold-like symptoms in the summer.:nervous:

So far not too bad and I'm working from home and hope it stays that way.
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Test returned positive.:mad:
 
golden_blunder said:
Last Tuesday I got my 2nd Moderna shot. My wife got hers the next day. The kids brought something home from school. My eldest one started with a temp and then developed a cough. The youngest one has like a delayed reaction to him but again temperature then a cough.
my wife developed a cough straight after her shot which we put down to a side effect but it’s dragged on. I developed a cough a couple of days ago and my oximeter is quickly swapping between 96/95/94/93. Whereas a week ago it was 99/98. Don’t tell me bloody COVID has sneaked in at the last moment
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With a temp and a cough you should really have got your kids tested, that’s for sure. Sounds like the whole family could do with getting tested now. A cough is not a typical side effect of the vaccine.

The good news is that even that one dose you got should give you decent protection against severe covid, in the worst case scenario.
 
golden_blunder said:
Last Tuesday I got my 2nd Moderna shot. My wife got hers the next day. The kids brought something home from school. My eldest one started with a temp and then developed a cough. The youngest one has like a delayed reaction to him but again temperature then a cough.
my wife developed a cough straight after her shot which we put down to a side effect but it’s dragged on. I developed a cough a couple of days ago and my oximeter is quickly swapping between 96/95/94/93. Whereas a week ago it was 99/98. Don’t tell me bloody COVID has sneaked in at the last moment
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This is exactly what happened in my case right after (3 days) I had the vaccine, you should get tested. Seems like it’s one of those unfortunate ones.
 
lynchie said:
Pfizer jabs were generally done earlier - it was approved first - and so the second doses came earlier as well. We've only very recently gone through the big wave of 2nd doses for the big vaccination surge in February, so there's a lot of recent 2nd doses, that would skew toward AZ.
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Ow ok. Some of the testing may have been done at a significantly shorter period after the second dose of AZ than the Pfizer and so it’s possible that is why the AZ has been tested to be only 60% effective against the Indian variant ?
 
My neighbours went to London last week and met with a group of friends. The whole lot of them now have Covid. Spoke to my neighbour (over our fence, nowhere near the guy), who's in his late 20's and he looked like sh*t and we've heard lots and lots of coughing coming from next door over the weekend.

Quite scary to think it is so close, hopefully they both get better soon and it doesn't get any worse for them.
 
Volumiza said:
My neighbours went to London last week and met with a group of friends. The whole lot of them now have Covid. Spoke to my neighbour (over our fence, nowhere near the guy), who's in his late 20's and he looked like sh*t and we've heard lots and lots of coughing coming from next door over the weekend.

Quite scary to think it is so close, hopefully they both get better soon and it doesn't get any worse for them.
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One of our neighbours (back of their house faces back of our house) all had it. The dad was hospitalised. Noticed a “welcome home dad” thing on his front window, wasn’t sure what it was for at the time but next door neighbour told us. It’s still out there and people should exercise common sense
 
golden_blunder said:
One of our neighbours (back of their house faces back of our house) all had it. The dad was hospitalised. Noticed a “welcome home dad” thing on his front window, wasn’t sure what it was for at the time but next door neighbour told us. It’s still out there and people should exercise common sense
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Absolutely. We went out yesterday, drove to the peak district with all kids and the dog. We realised we'd not all been for an outing together like that for over a year so decided to 'just do it'. It was insane, literally 1000's of people all crammed along this one stretch of river with zero social distancing and the scenes around the toilets were the stuff of infection nirvana. Much as we wanted to enjoy the countryside for the day, we left and drove back home.

We've been discussing having a couple of UK mini breaks late August, we've changed our minds.
 
Volumiza said:
Absolutely. We went out yesterday, drove to the peak district with all kids and the dog. We realised we'd not all been for an outing together like that for over a year so decided to 'just do it'. It was insane, literally 1000's of people all crammed along this one stretch of river with zero social distancing and the scenes around the toilets were the stuff of infection nirvana. Much as we wanted to enjoy the countryside for the day, we left and drove back home.

We've been discussing having a couple of UK mini breaks late August, we've changed our minds.
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The problem is everyone goes to the same places. Local websites have items like '10 places to visit in lockdown' which are the prettiest parks, beauty spot picnic sites and so on, and everyone goes to them. I'd suggest regarding such lists as '10 places not to visit in lockdown' personally. Get a map out, ordnance survey are brilliant, and pick your own places, if you've never heard of them so much the better.
 
711 said:
The problem is everyone goes to the same places. Local websites have items like '10 places to visit in lockdown' which are the prettiest parks, beauty spot picnic sites and so on, and everyone goes to them. I'd suggest regarding such lists as '10 places not to visit in lockdown' personally. Get a map out, ordnance survey are brilliant, and pick your own places, if you've never heard of them so much the better.
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Totally agree and we suspected it would be busy but Dovedale is one of my favourite places on the planet and it was all a bit last minute so we rolled the dice. Still, gave Mrs Volumiza a chance to say 'I told you so' :)
 
Volumiza said:
Absolutely. We went out yesterday, drove to the peak district with all kids and the dog. We realised we'd not all been for an outing together like that for over a year so decided to 'just do it'. It was insane, literally 1000's of people all crammed along this one stretch of river with zero social distancing and the scenes around the toilets were the stuff of infection nirvana. Much as we wanted to enjoy the countryside for the day, we left and drove back home.

We've been discussing having a couple of UK mini breaks late August, we've changed our minds.
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That’s crazy. It might be Costa Del back garden this year for that very reason!
You probably didn’t see it, but the pictures of people out drinking in the streets of Dublin and Galway were shocking. Makes you think why do you bother locking pubs
 
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