I know that's easy to say about anti-vaxxers but these guys are a hell of a lot smarter and more accomplished than I am.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I know that's easy to say about anti-vaxxers but these guys are a hell of a lot smarter and more accomplished than I am.
Didn't know that about the 60-69's but that makes sense actually, seeing as my mother is only getting her 2nd today.
It's weird seeing the HSE actually be capable at something.
Side note, it really doesn't help Michael that he always crosses his hands like that and looks like Mr Burns.
So that loser Hancock was cheating on his wife while telling us we can’t see our friends & family. Sounds very Tory. cnut.
Hancock? More like He's a cock.
I've never seen someone that's so obviously out of their depth, in every interview or tv appearance.
You only need to watch one interview to see he's absolutely clueless, i'm amazed the British public keep putting up with this shite.
You only need to watch one interview to see he's absolutely clueless, i'm amazed the British public keep putting up with this shite.
This pleases me.
If you talk about it on YouTube they take down your video.
I'm half convinced the British public like people who seem out of depth and are scared of people who actually know what they're doing
Why?
Edit: I've just checked and there are plenty of videos with it in their title. So it's not a case of talk about it and it'll be taken down. Is this one of those conspiracy things where they shout we're being 'censored' whilst being everywhere?
The latest Rogan podcast is all about it, i haven't looked into it but the way the guy goes on about Ivermetcin it sounds far too good to be true it solves everything.
He's trying to paint a picture that it's not being used and ignored because there is no money to be made from it as its a generic drug that is no longer patented.
How true any of this is i have no idea.
Correct.
The whole Ivermectin hysteria is such bullshit. There have been plenty of other off-patent drugs extensively tested against COVID.
They’ve just started a trial in the U.K. on ivermectin so we’ll find out - everything I’ve seen on it has been questionable - small numbers and such - hopefully this’ll help.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57570377.amp
www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57570377.amp
YouTube have been taking down videos because the FDA has not recommended the drug. There was a lot of concern about misinformation, it seems. I'm glad to hear that it can he talked about now. The channel Peak Prosperity, one of the two most popular channels on YouTube for Covid news and analysis along with MedCram, had videos removed that covered the data coming back in regards to it.
Here's an article about some of the censorship.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/youtube-cancels-the-u-s-senate-11612288061
This source seems pretty good too.
https://taibbi.substack.com/p/why-has-ivermectin-become-a-dirty-7bd
@Pogue Mahone
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Quality control
Considering money and people I would say that is a very good bet. We are getting some very good data and peer reviewed analysis coming through now so I would expect some clearer answers soon. I'm glad we are trailing in the UK. A worrying peer reviewed study has come out today that says for every 3 lives saved by the vaccine 2 vaccine deaths are caused so there is no silver bullet. Someone alluded above we have to live with acceptable deaths and that includes from treatments as well as the virus it seems.
If there are possible any more lockdowns in the future there'll be more people citing yet another breach of lockdown rules by a government official as a reason not to give a feck.
Please share. Sounds like complete bullshit.
Link? 14,000 lives are estimated to have been saved so far via vaccination in the U.K. alone. By that maths you’re saying around 9k have died from vaccination…
I've just been in the UK for a few weeks and recently returned to Australia, so I'm in the quarantine hotel. I just received a message from the NHS App to self isolate for two days because I've been in contact with someone with Covid. That seems strange, why only two days does that make sense to anyone?
Probably someone you have been in contact with recently has got a positive case confirmed today.
Probably the contact was 8 days ago?
Probably to do with the day said exposure is supposed to have happened?
It it was 8 days ago, only 2 days left of the isolation period.
Does it say when the contact occurred? It might be that it’s taken a while to get a positive result so by the time they alerted you there’s only 2 days of your isolation period left
that makes sense yeah
that's slightly reassuring if that is the case, I guess.. I've actually had two tests in the last 8 days as well
nah, it's surprisingly sparse of information - doesn't even tell me where it was. But yes I think you are correct, thanks
No need for me to share it then you've obviously made up your mind. Scientists eh? complete bullshitters....
I said it sounds like bullshit. The onus is on you to prove otherwise. Which is obviously impossible without sharing the peer reviewed article you mentioned.
That study says the exact opposite though - 4 deaths per 100k vaccinations it says?
“the NNTV to prevent one death is between 9000 and 50,000”
42m have had one dose - 14,000 and rising lives saved. That is equal to an NNTV of 3,000. But it will continue to grow as time passes - even if no more vaccinations are done - it isn’t fixed. Also depends on COVID prevalence - which without vaccines and restrictions would be through the roof. It also doesn’t factor in hospitalisations - of which 42,000 have been avoided - not sure why they cite serious side effects but not COVID hospitalisation. 4 deaths per 100k sounds very high too…
That’s just me - not in any way scientific - struggles to use an excel pivot - doing back of a fag packet maths in 2 minutes…so I do question who peer reviewed it.
It's not my logic but What expertise do you have over these scientists? I going to hazard a guess that the authors of this study are eminently more qualified that Massive Spanner off redcafe or anyone else on here for that matter. Also the peer review seems to have been accepted but like I said this is not my study.
Well the fact that it's just you and not in anyway scientific is probably why I would likely take the peer reviewed scientific study done and peer reviewed by scientists but that's just me. Who made up the 14,000 lives saved and what data is that based on?
The first one from the WSJ is from the same bloke that invited the Doctor to the Senate and doesn't seem a great character. He has his angle.
The second article is well written though and it does seem the platforms have jumped on the word but they have been clear that it is because these people are telling the public to use a drug not yet proven, even if the evidence is positive so far. Very similar to Hydroxycloroquine.
I’ve read the study and it looks to me as though they haven’t differentiated between deaths caused by the vaccine from deaths from any cause after being vaccinated. Strictly speaking, being run over by a bus after being vaccinated is a reportable serious adverse event. Tells us feck all about the risks of taking the vaccine though.
Even taking that massive liberty, they still conclude an overall net benefit to vaccination (which doesn't get mentioned in the abstract, funnily enough).
As @Mickeza said, the most egregiously misleading way this data is presented is the idea that you can judge the success of the vaccination program simply by looking at NNTV when we know that the consequences of a completely uncontrolled surge has such a severe impact in addition to those who die from covid (hospitals running out of staff or oxygen, the economic and societal harm of prolonged lockdown etc etc etc)
Even taking that massive liberty, they still conclude an overall net benefit to vaccination (which doesn't get mentioned in the abstract, funnily enough).
As @Mickeza said, the most egregiously misleading way this data is presented is the idea that you can judge the success of the vaccination program simply by looking at NNTV when we know that the consequences of a completely uncontrolled surge has such a severe impact in addition to those who die from covid (hospitals running out of staff or oxygen, the economic and societal harm of prolonged lockdown etc etc etc)
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We've had our worst spikes due to the Eid homecoming tradition.
BOR (Bed occupancy Rate) is above 90% in most big cities, people are being treated in hallways and some in parking lot.
Things looks quite serious.
You stay save eh @Kopral Jono
I'ma vaccine hunting tomorrow
BOR (Bed occupancy Rate) is above 90% in most big cities, people are being treated in hallways and some in parking lot.
Things looks quite serious.
You stay save eh @Kopral Jono
I'ma vaccine hunting tomorrow
Agreed – and you can apply this to all the figures they give us – the daily number of deaths are people who died and had a positive test within 28 days of their death. No idea how many are actually caused by Covid.
Any other off-patent drugs extensively banned, demonized and generally dissed for use in treating COVID, apart from Ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine?
Bloody Trump! - if he hadn't mentioned Ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine the hysteria may never have happened.
I don't think they have much experience in immunisation or epidemiology, so it's far fetched to call them experts in those fields.
Dr. Harald Walach
Harald Walach, PhD, is a professor at Poznan University of the Medical Sciences in Poznan, Pediatric Hospital, Poland and a visiting professor at Witten/Herdecke University’s Department of Psychology. He is a health researcher with approximately 200 peer-reviewed papers to his name and broad expertise in various methods of clinical, experimental, and secondary research.
Dr. Rainer Klement
Rainer J. Klement is a medical physicist with ample experience in data analysis and statistics. He is based at the Radiation Oncology Department of Leopoldina Hospital in Schweinfurt, Germany. He is active in medical modeling and evaluating the effect of ketogenic diets in oncology patients.
Wouter Aukema
Independent Data and Pattern Scientist