Shinji Kagawa

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The only ways he could become a regular as things stand is a formation shift, go with a diamond, which would be daft with all the wingers we have, or go with 3 at the back, even dafter with the quality fullbacks we have.

As much as I'd love to see him as an AM, and Chicha ahead of him, it'd be foolish of Moyes to bench Rooney or RvP right now.

Kagawa? He needs to start working his ass off on the left, plain and simple, force the issue and give Moyes a selection headache.
 
Januzaj is the player I thought Kagawa would be.

I think the most striking thing about Kagawa's game at the moment is how poor his passing is. Obviously it ranks highly from a completion point of view, but then so does Fellaini's. I hope it's just a question of form, but Shinji is playing a lot of miss-hit passes at the moment which are forcing the receiver to check back or alter their runs. And that's when he can be bothered to do anything other than come inside for a meaningless ping pong 1-2 with his back to goal.

I really hope he can sort it out.
 
Dante said:
And that's when he can be bothered to do anything other than come inside for a meaningless ping pong 1-2 with his back to goal.
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This was my criticism of him from last season as well. Whenever people said Kagawa had a good game without getting on the scoresheet, I noticed that he has a tendency to come deep, receive a pass and with the same touch, ping it back where it came from. It's really a meaningless pass and I'm not sure what the point of him doing that is. It's not as if he's making a quick cut to receive the pass in better position as well.

It's no secret that Kagawa is at his best with lots of fluid movement around him, and that's something that we as a team can often be found wanting. Regardless, he has to get back up to speed with the physicality and speed of play in the PL. The Fulham game did him no favours as he looked quite a bit off the boil there. In Europe I expected him to do better, and so far this season he's been proving that right, likely down to the slower speed of play and less physical approach of the continental teams versus the PL teams.

Will be looking forward to seeing him in the Sociedad game coming up to see how he does.
 
I can why he does it. It's obviously a ploy to draw men out of position and to give the initial passer the chance to find a bit of space before he gets the pass back. The problem is that PL defences tend to hold their positions more than European teams', and United often expect the man on the ball to carry the burden of creating something while the rest of the side make the pitch big for him. That's something Januzaj does instinctively for himself, but that Kagawa tries to facilitate others around him to do. We're not really a pass-and-move team like Dortmund; we're more of a pass-and-wait-for-the-man-on-the-ball-to-make-something-happen-before-moving team and that doesn't suit Shinji.
 
Gazza said:
I didn't watch much of Kagawa at Dortmund, but his on-pitch personality since he joined us brings back memories of Poborsky & Cruyff, pieces that just didn't fit our attacking style or seemed too timid around their teammates to impose themselves.
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This was said about Carrick for years and years. People should be more patient with Kagawa. I hope Moyes is and tubes him enough chances to prove himself.
 
Gazza said:
I didn't watch much of Kagawa at Dortmund, but his on-pitch personality since he joined us brings back memories of Poborsky & Cruyff, pieces that just didn't fit our attacking style or seemed too timid around their teammates to impose themselves.
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I agree with the not fitting part, but cruyff certainly wasn't the timid type. He had been playing for Barcelona and holland. He just wasn't very good, was his problem.

Poborsky was a real shame. He had it in him to be a decent player for us.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
This was said about Carrick for years and years. People should be more patient with Kagawa. I hope Moyes is and tubes him enough chances to prove himself.
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There not all going to turn out like Carrick and visa versa. Basically he just needs to step his game up! He could well find himself on the shelf otherwise.
 
Mainoldo said:
There not all going to turn out like Carrick and visa versa. Basically he just needs to step his game up! He could well find himself on the shelf otherwise.
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Not all, yes. But Kagawa has more than enough quality to warrant the patience.
 
Dante said:
I can why he does it. It's obviously a ploy to draw men out of position and to give the initial passer the chance to find a bit of space before he gets the pass back. The problem is that PL defences tend to hold their positions more than European teams', and United often expect the man on the ball to carry the burden of creating something while the rest of the side make the pitch big for him. That's something Januzaj does instinctively for himself, but that Kagawa tries to facilitate others around him to do. We're not really a pass-and-move team like Dortmund; we're more of a pass-and-wait-for-the-man-on-the-ball-to-make-something-happen-before-moving team and that doesn't suit Shinji.
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Spot-on mate. Good call about dragging defenders out of position with dummy movements. I think Shinji does do this a fair bit, and it goes rather unnoticed. Recent one that came to mind was Hernandez's winner against Stoke where I think Kagawa flitted in and drew one of the 2 CBs away.

I really like Kagawa as a player, but he really needs to get up to speed with PL football. Would give anything to see this guy succeed at United as he's clearly very talented. It'll be our loss if he goes.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
This was said about Carrick for years and years. People should be more patient with Kagawa. I hope Moyes is and tubes him enough chances to prove himself.
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I'm patient, I have no great expectations of him either way, but there are definitely similarities for me. It's up to Kagawa to make the right impression in training and bring it to matches, I don't think internet comparisons with Poborsky and Cruyff based on his contributions so far will factor on his chances much.
 
Randall Flagg said:
I agree with the not fitting part, but cruyff certainly wasn't the timid type. He had been playing for Barcelona and holland. He just wasn't very good, was his problem.

Poborsky was a real shame. He had it in him to be a decent player for us.
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Indeed. He turned out to be a far better player than he looked during his spell with us. Had a long career as well - and arguably peaked late. Would have been a very handy player to keep around - but you can win 'em all. Cruyff was simply not good enough, as you say.
 
Randall Flagg said:
I agree with the not fitting part, but cruyff certainly wasn't the timid type. He had been playing for Barcelona and holland. He just wasn't very good, was his problem.

Poborsky was a real shame. He had it in him to be a decent player for us.
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I remember being around 14 or 15 at the time and even then thinking that he was a bit shit from what I'd seen. I don't know whether we got seduced by his name, or what, but he wasn't a very good player at all.
 
Hope he puts in a good performance, but what he needs more then anything IMO is a goal, a good one at that. He desperately needs some self confidence, and to start playing like we know he can or like he did when he was at Dortmund. He's shown glimpses of it here, but far too often he just plays it safe and doesn't want to take up the mantle as the main man on the pitch, when he has the ability to. You can tell the main difference between him and Januzaj when they play on the wing is confidence. Both have bags of ability, but Januzaj has the confidence in himself to be the main man and make things happen, while Kagawa so far seems like he's trying to hard not to make a mistake rather then not be afraid to make a mistake.
 
bosnian_red said:
Hope he puts in a good performance, but what he needs more then anything IMO is a goal, a good one at that. He desperately needs some self confidence, and to start playing like we know he can or like he did when he was at Dortmund. He's shown glimpses of it here, but far too often he just plays it safe and doesn't want to take up the mantle as the main man on the pitch, when he has the ability to. You can tell the main difference between him and Januzaj when they play on the wing is confidence. Both have bags of ability, but Januzaj has the confidence in himself to be the main man and make things happen, while Kagawa so far seems like he's trying to hard not to make a mistake rather then not be afraid to make a mistake.
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That and they are different players with different styles.
 
Who says he cant play on the wing - has been decent so far tonight. Created a great chance for hernandez
 
30mins behind RVP. Caf, you have your wish.
 
Been far better playing in his natural position, naturally.

That being said, he needs to be more adaptable if he's going to make it here.
 
Hopefully showed Moyes enough in that 30mins to show he should be at least 2nd choice in that position.
 
Don't ever play him on left wing again, please. He's literally less than 50% the same player there.
 
Immediately after moving behind the striker he made a few nice touches, which stood out particularly given how invisible he'd been beforehand, but then he kinda faded away again. He won't have done anything tonight to change Moyes's mind about him not being a starter.
 
I thought he was our brightest player even when he was on the wing, although that's not saying much given Rooney and Hernandez's performances.

Beat his man a couple of times and one lead to a tap in that Hernandez should have scored.
 
Looked great in the number 10 position. Would like to see him start there once in awhile, particularly behind rvp or Rooney.
 
IMO, the biggest difference in moving him into the CAM today was not even so much tactical. Kagawa finally showed some confidence and was comfortable on the ball.
 
He actually moved quicker than testimonial pace tonight, so he's improved. Play him behind the striker or not at all.
 
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