He's aready a coach mate, a job waiting for him when he finally calls it a day from playing.
Sir Ryan Giggs
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Yeah I know
. Just trying to point out the progression. Most of the players get their badges not all go into coaching.I don't think Giggs will ever manage us but it'd be an extraordinary fairytale career if he did. Especially if he was successful. How many other people have played an entire career with a single club and had that seamlessly evolve into managing that club as well?
If there's one man that will do it, it's Giggs. Time will tell if he has the traits to become a top manager, but one thing is for sure, he'll have no problem earning the respect of the big players.
There will come a time where he will probably need a break from United. Not in a bad way as getting away from the club but just to get away from it all for a little and assess his options.
Legendary player, one of the finest to ever play the game. Admire him as a player and a professional.
I'm 35 in a month, I've been watching Ryan Giggs play for Utd since I was 11.
You younger lads dint realise what's it's like as you get a bit older and one day all the best players seem to be your age, then a bit younger than you and you realise - you've missed your chance.
As long as Giggsy is still about it keeps the dream alive, makes it ok to still have a poster on your wall and to play, in full kit and boots in your back garden as if it's Wembley.
Hopefully Moyes will give it 10 years, prove himself by winning 3 or 4 titles, and a couple of European cups. Then a fifty year old Giggs will take over having just retired, finishing up his playing time by becoming the first keeper to go an entire season without conceding a goal.
Might sound fanciful but if I'd told you when I was 12 that in 23 years we'd be on 20 league titles and that a 40 year old Giggs would be our best CM you'd have chuckled and told me I was dreaming so who knows.
You younger lads dint realise what's it's like as you get a bit older and one day all the best players seem to be your age, then a bit younger than you and you realise - you've missed your chance.
As long as Giggsy is still about it keeps the dream alive, makes it ok to still have a poster on your wall and to play, in full kit and boots in your back garden as if it's Wembley.
Hopefully Moyes will give it 10 years, prove himself by winning 3 or 4 titles, and a couple of European cups. Then a fifty year old Giggs will take over having just retired, finishing up his playing time by becoming the first keeper to go an entire season without conceding a goal.
Might sound fanciful but if I'd told you when I was 12 that in 23 years we'd be on 20 league titles and that a 40 year old Giggs would be our best CM you'd have chuckled and told me I was dreaming so who knows.
Can't really add anything else about the man to be honest. Without doubt one of the finest players ever to play the game. 40 years of age, but still fully deserving of his place in the side. The way he has changed adapted his game over the years has been simply magnificent and he hasn't looked any less of a player because of it. His fitness levels are immense even now.
Genuine legend of the game and the ultimate professional.
Genuine legend of the game and the ultimate professional.
He makes Dorian Gray look shite
Saw a piece in the paper today saying that, while Giggs is obviously a legend and deserves massive respect, he never actually reached the full limit of his potential. Basically that he had the potential to be up there with the likes of Messi, Ronaldo and Best but he never reached that peak of greatness.
What do ye think of that argument? I wasn't around when Giggs first burst on to the scene, so I can't comment on the potential he had at the time. Could he have reached a higher level than he did?
What do ye think of that argument? I wasn't around when Giggs first burst on to the scene, so I can't comment on the potential he had at the time. Could he have reached a higher level than he did?
There was an interview with him in the Times the other day, can someone with access to it post it on here?
Never reached his full potential ? I think his trophy cabinet alone answers that question. Been a stand out player in every United team he's been a part of.
I suppose a big factor is international football. There are arguments both ways in regards to how that impacted his career, but it's always been difficult to compare him to those players because he hasn't really played at a major international tournament. That's not his fault though. As I said earlier, he's up there with the greatest players ever to play the game. Obviously he started in a different era to the players mentioned, but had he played at he same level internationally, I doubt he would still be at United today. I'll never forget the reception he received in Bilbao a couple of years ago. That alone proves how highly he is respected outside of United.
His achievements won't be repeated again in my opinion.
The international thing sort of is his fault. You can't really slate his reasons for declaring for Wales, but the opportunity to play for England was there.
His achievements are amazing but I'm talking about comparing him to the likes of Messi, Best, Ronaldo. They'll all have amazing achievements by the end of their careers. Obviously Giggs will probably have more but that's a natural result of his longevity rather than him being better (or as good) as them.
Giggs was never at that Messi/Ronaldo level where you can argue he's the best player on the planet, was he? So, I'm wondering if, as this journalist said, he had the potential to reach that level.
Giggs has never been eligible to play for the England National Team.
Was the residency rule not in effect back then? I assumed it was, my bad.
Last week I had a 2 hour argument with someone who literally knows nothing about football, about whether Giggs could have played for England or not.
At this point I think we should just give up and accept that Sir Alex persuaded Giggs not to play for England. Let's not let the truth get in front of a good story.
Absolutely. He was so fast his hamstrings were extremely vulnerable, and although he did many things to protect them the main one was learning to force himself not to open up to full pace.
In terms of performance levels? No, he never reached the height of Messi or Zidane or whoever we consider as Ballon D'Or level players.
But being able to play at such a high level for so long with such loyalty, and be a pretty damn good player too at that, he has as much of anyone's respect as Messi and Zidane do.
To me, players like Messi and Ronaldo are some of the best ever players, and Giggs won't ever be in that discussion. However, if you talk about greatest players which encompasses much more than performance, Giggs is 100% in that discussion.
Shocking defensive performance today. We really shouldn't be relying on him, but it says a lot about our other central midfielders.
Cost us the game with absolute stupidity. 18 yard box with 4 everton players around him and thinks that playing out is the way to go.
Its games like this that make you think he should call it a day. Horrible defensively, fellaini did the work of two men out there.
Frustrated the hell out of me tonight! Was a passenger all game and put is in the shit trying to play his way out of defence with 4 Everton players around him.
I don't like to blame one player but I'm sorry, I have to. That stupid pass to Fellani he attempted which lead to everything was incredibly stupid from him, no need!
Goes to show how he's likely to put in one rare spectacular performance amongst a lot of terrible ones like tonight as had been the case for about 4 years or so.
I've nothing against him, he just shouldn't be playing central midfield for the (former) champions of england. Eventually the nonchalant atttitude rubbed off on Fellaini and thats where we lost the game...when the pair of them were walking about like Everton weren't putting on pressure.
I've nothing against him, he just shouldn't be playing central midfield for the (former) champions of england. Eventually the nonchalant atttitude rubbed off on Fellaini and thats where we lost the game...when the pair of them were walking about like Everton weren't putting on pressure.
For someone who has played for 23 season he makes the mistakes of a schoolboy at times. It's extraordinary. Giving the ball away on the edge of the box, trying fancy flicks when he should clear it then fouling deliberately in the last minute which wasted the rest of the time was particularly idiotic.
He's had a better start to the season than last season, but he makes the same mistakes in central midfield. He's not built on his performances in central midfield at all. It's either a case of a poor flick, nonchalance, long failed ball, or him being high up the field and leaving his partner to defend for him. It's the main reason why I have said that he should be managed properly.
All that experience and he still does stupid things. Twice he had a chance to properly clear the ball in the first half but he was too busy faffing about with it until Rafael came along and hoofed it out for a throw in. You'd think he'd learn from this but ended up dicking about again that cost us.
Don't worry I did notice you were the one to bump this thread (again) last night. It's almost like you wait for the line-up to come out, see Giggs is starting and like a kid at Christmas load this page ready, incase we lose and you can have a pop at him.
I stick up for Giggs whenever posters write him off and say silly things like he should never play for the club again. If anyone thinks that again after last night, I'll defend him, yet again.
And then when he proves those silly posters wrong once more, I feel it should be pointed out.
Don't worry I did notice you were the one to bump this thread (again) last night. It's almost like you wait for the line-up to come out, see Giggs is starting and like a kid at Christmas load this page ready, incase we lose and you can have a pop at him.
I stick up for Giggs whenever posters write him off and say silly things like he should never play for the club again. If anyone thinks that again after last night, I'll defend him, yet again.
And then when he proves those silly posters wrong once more, I feel it should be pointed out.
The post I quoted refers to no one really. Name me one poster who didn't praise his performance against Bayer Leverkusen who also "hates" Giggs?
The double standards on your part is remarkable and actually, I'm usually one of the first members to bump player threads, whether it's at half time or at the end, not to forget that I praise and criticise every player, so the second part doesn't make sense. The line-up part is a puerile explanation, that says a lot about your debating skills. Nice fabrication though. I'm also not like you and praise his performances and suddenly remain quiet when he has a performance like yesterday.
And now you're changing the subject. Those who think Giggs should retire have no idea of what he's still capable of. As I mentioned before, Moyes using Giggs is indicative of Cleverley and Anderson not doing enough to help Moyes out. But your post made me laugh.
Jesus, you love having a dig at people don't you?Ok, first of all if you think I'm going to look back through this entire thread and pick out the posters who posted rubbish about Giggs and then failed to praise him after Leverkusen, you've got no chance. But we both know there are culprits. I'm not the only one to highlight it.
How have I shown double standards? I come on here to praise him for the main reason of showing up the fools who continue to write him off. In the hope that one day, they'll learn not to write off Ryan Giggs. Wishful thinking maybe, but I'll continue to do so. It does piss me off to see (arguably) our clubs greatest ever player get abuse from fans. I'm not saying he's free from critisicm but he should be free from ridiculous/OTT critisicm. The best examples usually pointed out by myself and other posters are - "should never play for the club again" or "I wish he would retire." Although your bizarre criticism that he's "shockingly poor defensively" is becoming one of the best examples. How in the hell do you expect Giggs to be good defensively? Do you honestly think he's picked for his defensive qualities? Has he ever played for Utd because he plays well defensively? No. He plays first and foremost for what he brings to the attacking side of things. Even when he was the best winger in Europe, he had great work-rate and could help out his full back but he was selected for his brilliance going forward.
Now at 40 and playing central midfield, you explext him to be defensively sound? Absolutely mental. May as well have a dig at Makelele for not chipping in with goals.
If he plays terrible, I don't have to come on here and critisize him. Like I don't need to come here and praise him just for a good performance. I don't go into any thread (even Ashley Young) and have a go. I don't particularly stick up for others either but when it comes to club legends, I will.
Ok, first of all if you think I'm going to look back through this entire thread and pick out the posters who posted rubbish about Giggs and then failed to praise him after Leverkusen, you've got no chance. But we both know there are culprits. I'm not the only one to highlight it.
How have I shown double standards? I come on here to praise him for the main reason of showing up the fools who continue to write him off. In the hope that one day, they'll learn not to write off Ryan Giggs. Wishful thinking maybe, but I'll continue to do so. It does piss me off to see (arguably) our clubs greatest ever player get abuse from fans. I'm not saying he's free from critisicm but he should be free from ridiculous/OTT critisicm. The best examples usually pointed out by myself and other posters are - "should never play for the club again" or "I wish he would retire." Although your bizarre criticism that he's "shockingly poor defensively" is becoming one of the best examples. How in the hell do you expect Giggs to be good defensively? Do you honestly think he's picked for his defensive qualities? Has he ever played for Utd because he plays well defensively? No. He plays first and foremost for what he brings to the attacking side of things. Even when he was the best winger in Europe, he had great work-rate and could help out his full back but he was selected for his brilliance going forward.
Now at 40 and playing central midfield, you explext him to be defensively sound? Absolutely mental. May as well have a dig at Makelele for not chipping in with goals.
If he plays terrible, I don't have to come on here and critisize him. Like I don't need to come here and praise him just for a good performance. I don't go into any thread (even Ashley Young) and have a go. I don't particularly stick up for others either but when it comes to club legends, I will.
No, I don't. Look through my posts to see how many "digs" I've taken. I just found it funny you're looking down on people from this superior position when you're doing the same thing as them.
First point, yes I agree with you on that, that there are "culprits", but it works both ways. I don't see why you don't be more objective and criticise players, regardless of status. You criticise members here for not praising him and who also quickly criticise him when he has a bad performance. Fair point, but you have not exactly criticised him either, have you (for his performance yesterday)? The fact that you can't admit he can be shocking defensively in central midfield sums up your stubbornness pretty well. You are either joking, trolling, or I'm not getting your point - you have to be defensively good to play in a two-man midfield. Me saying he was shocking defensively isn't the same as someone wanting him to retire. Like it or not, Giggs can be shocking defensively, and a two-man midfield exposes his weaknesses. You need a central midfield to offer good passing and defensive stability. Giggs plays because he offers what we need next to Fellaini/Jones (midfielders who cover for full backs and are the more defensive-minded in the two-man CM partnership) - he also plays because he offers us what we need in midfield, but his defending is inconsistent. It's like you didn't watch the game yesterday, where he gave away the ball easily and abondoned Fellaini on several occasions. It's also a completely different argument to playing on the wings because CMs can cover for wingers.
No, I don't expect him to be defensively sound at all, in fact I expect him to be defensively average because he doesn't have the legs to constantly recover. And again, you come up with a ridiculous example. Context is key - we played against a side that pressed well, not Leverkusen, but a side that presses you when you're on the ball and commits five players forward when attacking.
Of course you don't need to criticise him, but it says a lot that you choose to post when he has a very good performance. I don't care whether you're a legend or not, it has zero relevance when you're judging a player's performance.You post a massive paragraph about how you need to be defensively good in midfield and then go on to say "I don't expect him to be defensively sound at all, in fact I expect him to be defensively average because he doesn't have the legs to constantly recover."
So why the hell are you having a go at him for being shockingly poor defensively? How can it shock you when you expect it?
And I admitted I stick up for club legends. That's my preference. When I see Giggs at 40 in a 2 man midfield I expect the man next to him to have to do a lot of work. Giggs is there to provide that killer pass.
For what it's worth, I don't think he was that bad yesterday. Not good but by no means terrible. We were pretty unlucky to lose the game overall.
So why the hell are you having a go at him for being shockingly poor defensively? How can it shock you when you expect it?
And I admitted I stick up for club legends. That's my preference. When I see Giggs at 40 in a 2 man midfield I expect the man next to him to have to do a lot of work. Giggs is there to provide that killer pass.
For what it's worth, I don't think he was that bad yesterday. Not good but by no means terrible. We were pretty unlucky to lose the game overall.
The physical requirements of playing in central midfield are high. Giggs can play as a central midfielder clearly, but you have to be selective about which games you play him in. Playing him in yesterday's fixture was suicide. And to be honest, we never know what we're going to get with Giggs in central midfield. It's a shock for me because my brain still can't process the fact that an experienced figure in a high position performs like he's a degraded version of the version we know is capable of playing in central midfield.
Your expectation isn't realistic at all. Both players share the same amount of work in pressing and covering for each other. Sometimes, you get one player doing slightly more (Cleverley for example), but that's fine. With Giggs yesterday, he left Fellaini isolated because he was too high up the field and we looked very vulnerable on the counter. That's Giggs' main weakness in midfield and it's why Moyes should know when to use him (like Bayer Leverkusen away for example).
By all means - but he was hardly spoilt for choice. It was Giggs, Cleverley or Ando. Which makes the choice an acceptable one in my opinion, given recent form and performances from the players in question.
Giggs is just fine to have around. Our problem is not Ryan Giggs. If we had a top class midfielder instead of Cleverley and a reliable, competent one instead of Ando - we could use Giggs in a luxury role, rather than having to actually rely on him in important matches.
I agree (I mentioned this above). Cleverley and Anderson just haven't done enough. Cleverley is passive in midfield at the moment - he's capable of much more, but he's not looked the same ambitious player since 11/12. Anderson should be playing more games, but his performance against West Brom has put Moyes off, or so it seems. Giggs is great to have around, he should keep playing until he can't take the physical requirements any more, but he should be used more intelligently by Moyes. Playing him in a fixture like yesterday - in which Roberto Martínez hinted that he was going to not sit back - was a poor decision.
It turned out that way - yes. But everything gets coloured by the result, that's the way it always is. We could have won that match - with Giggs in CM and all. It was an open match and we created more chances than they did - hard to tell how that would've looked with Cleverley in "keep-it-ticking-over" mode. Fielding Giggs wasn't a tactical error of the sort which in-itself would have prevented us from winning it - that's my opinion at least. Call it a gamble - it usually is with Giggs - which didn't pay off on the night.
The true problem - as we both know all too well - is our lack of better, less risky options.
Giggs should not be starting a league game now...He is perfect coming on with 15 mins to go and we're chasing a goal as his passing and vision and drive is top notch and teams are knackered. But starting and playing 90 mins? Jeez...