Tottenham Hotspur vs. Manchester United

[walsh]

That's true. But you have to remember that we have to match their results when they don't drop any and better their results when they do. So far we are struggling to keep up with them, so I would say that 9 points is starting to look like a mountain we won't be able to climb. You never know though.

I agree that it will be a tough ask, they're a quality team this year. If you look at our next month or so of fixtures, we really have the opportunity to start racking the points up. Arsenal haven't played City or Chelsea yet.

 

[The Man Himself]

We are trailing the top by 9 points, we shouldn't be happy at losing more points in a game that we could have won. How ridiculous is it to give Nani 10 minutes to change the match and don't get me started on Ashley young!

Even Spurs can say that they could have won the game. Maybe Young wasn't an inspired of subs but we didn't have many attacking options on bench and maybe Moyes saw Kagawa tiring a bit. I would really make proper assessment of team on 31st Dec when everyone would have played 19 games. If we are around 4-5 points from top then, there is still a chance. This was probably our toughest fixture on paper for this busy month.

 

[An Irish Red]

I have faith in him, this is new to all of us. I don't understand the lack of trust in Moyes other than simply because he just isn't Sir Alex.

Away to Leverkusen and Spurs in a week, a 5-0 win and a 2-2 draw really isn't bad.

Being honest, I really don't have much faith in him at all. I've never thought he was right for us as I don't think he has the mentality for it.

When you see a lot of united fans now talking about trying to scrape fourth, when we are the reigning champions, it says to me that deep down a lot of people share my concerns.

 

[Ronnie O'Sullivan]

It's December. I'd be more worried if it was March and we were trailing by 9 points. I'm disappointed with today's result, but I'm still far from writing us off.

For all you know we could be worse off in March and trailing by even more points. In hindsight a 2-2 draw at Spurs isn't a terrible result but they just lost 6-0 to citeh, we beat Leverkusen 5-0, and we could not carry the momentum forward. There appears to be a lot of stuttering at the moment. Moyes needs to fine tune the team and turn these draws into wins, only then can we challenge for the top places.

 

[Summit]

just keep an eye on that 4 or 5 off the top target. we do that...we will be fine...but we must get a couple of midfielders...or we are fecked.

Aye. Although 8th in the league looks bad at this stage, we are only a few points off the top 4. You'd have to guess that Everton, Southampton and Newcastle won't be up there come the end of the season. My biggest worry atm is those kopites. No shit.

 

[hp88]

If that isn't our target for the season then that is a small time mentality from Moyes. We are the current champions of England and retaining the title isn't our target?

If we hadn't have lost Fergie last season I would agreed with that. Retaining the title is hard task and I am sure Moyes and the boys are giving it 100% to make it happen but I think it's a unrealistic target.

 

[bosnian_red]

Top 4 was always going to be our target. Sometimes change managers regularly so it's not a big deal, but after losing a manager who's been here for over a quarter of a century then obviously we'll be in transition a bit. Top 4 is a must, but we need to strengthen the midfield with probably 2 quality midfielders and 1 for cover, and sell the ones we currently have. Cut our losses with Fellaini, sell Cleverley and Anderson. None are anywhere close to being good enough, and never will be.

 

[Shark]

I agree that it will be a tough ask, they're a quality team this year. If you look at our next month or so of fixtures, we really have the opportunity to start racking the points up. Arsenal haven't played City or Chelsea yet.

It's not just Chelsea and City that they have to worry about though. There's an awful lot damaging fixtures that they are yet face. Liverpool and Arsenal's fixture list has been kind so far, it has to be said.

 

[Summit]

I agree that it will be a tough ask, they're a quality team this year. If you look at our next month or so of fixtures, we really have the opportunity to start racking the points up. Arsenal haven't played City or Chelsea yet.

And that's my point mate. After our tough start people on here (including me) were saying that our next 5 games are a given etc...This season we haven't capitalised on the games we know we should be winning, so it's hard to look at a group of fixtures and see where we will make up the ground.

 

[mic.m]

Another dull performance punctuated by Wayne Rooney's good form. I wasn't expecting a win. That mid-week result/performance fooled everyone. Moyes is safety first. We spend the last 30 minutes of every game sitting back. I doubt we will win midweek because our midfield will be 2 of Fellaini, Cleverly and Giggs. This season is about finishing in the top 4. Expecting a title challenge from this team and manager is too much.

 

[QuackQuack]

If we hadn't have lost Fergie last season I would agreed with that. Retaining the title is hard task and I am sure Moyes and the boys are giving it 100% to make it happen but I think it's a unrealistic target.

I'm sure we have come back from a bigger deficit under fergie. Id just like to see Moyes go for a win rather than being pleased with a draw. We used to fight til the end but now we seem to give. For example, I dont think we have had a late winner under Moyes so far and that's quite telling.

 

[JaffyJoe]

We are in transition, some fans here are spoilt. So what if we don't win the league this season, do we honestly have a team that is good enough too?? Fergie won but that is Fergie almost all managers will come up short in comparison to him. The draw was fair, the more damaging result was drawing against Cardiff. 4 points out of these two games would have been fine. We need to go for it against Everton.

 

[2 man midfield]

it's a pretty shit one though, Spurs are crap, and it's mostly the performance that annoys me, never looked like we wanted to win it, or particularly gave a feck (apart from Rooney, as usual).

Dire.

Yep, what annoyed me was around the 86th minute mark, the ball went out for a United goal kick. Smalling jogs off, De Gea ambles over to fetch the ball. then we proceed to show exactly zero urgency for the remaining minutes of the game. It's this that annoys me, and possibly why Moyes has these negative accusations thrown at him.

 

[Drifter]

Missed the game but looks like it may have been a good one.Although the result was disappointing.

 

[DevilRed]

Not the worse result ever but considering the circumstances, this is dropped points. Pretty even match and they scored two really good goals.

Whats worrying is that we were actually playing an open and attacking style of football but couldn't really match spurs in chances created.

Rooney was man of the match but everyone else wasn't exactly outstanding. Our central midfield was absolute dross. Especially cleverly who was partly responsible for the 2nd goal.

 

[An Irish Red]

We are in transition, some fans here are spoilt. So what if we don't win the league this season, do we honestly have a team that is good enough too??

Of course we do, we are the reigning champions.

 

[Melvyn]

We are in transition, some fans here are spoilt. So what if we don't win the league this season, do we honestly have a team that is good enough too?? Fergie won but that is Fergie almost all managers will come up short in comparison to him. The draw was fair, the more damaging result was drawing against Cardiff. 4 points out of these two games would have been fine. We need to go for it against Everton.

Problem isn't that I'm angry we won't win the league this season. 5 times out of the past 7 years is incredible when you think about it and us fans shouldn't be so spoilt if we fail to win this season. It's the underlying problems behind our losses this season which don't look like they will be fixed even if we bought good players. Moyes' defensive mentality, accepting a draw is a good result, defensive substitutions, late substitutions. He still thinks that what is acceptable at Everton is acceptable at Manchester United.

 

[hp88]

I'm sure we have come back from a bigger deficit under fergie. Id just like to see Moyes go for a win rather than being pleased with a draw. We used to fight til the end but now we seem to give. For example, I dont think we have had a late winner under Moyes so far and that's quite telling.

I think we are capable of beating any side in the league home or away, Moyes just needs to stop worrying about dropping points and go in for the kill.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Of course we do, we are the reigning champions.

I don't, I think others underperformed and Fergie got the utmost out of these players.

 

[Shark]

I don't, I think others underperformed and Fergie got the utmost out of these players.

RVP won us the title last season. Rafael and Carrick were also brilliant.

They're all missing at the moment..

 

[QuackQuack]

We are in transition, some fans here are spoilt. So what if we don't win the league this season, do we honestly have a team that is good enough too?? Fergie won but that is Fergie almost all managers will come up short in comparison to him. The draw was fair, the more damaging result was drawing against Cardiff. 4 points out of these two games would have been fine. We need to go for it against Everton.

I personally wouldn't be too bothered if we didn't win the league but the fact that we have resorted to finishing in the top four rather than putting in a challenge is what I find disappointing. I don't think anyone is being spoilt for wanting that, I mean we are the current champions of England and we should be putting nothing less than a decent challenge.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Problem isn't that I'm angry we won't win the league this season. 5 times out of the past 7 years is incredible when you think about it and us fans shouldn't be so spoilt if we fail to win this season. It's the underlying problems behind our losses this season which don't look like they will be fixed even if we bought good players. Moyes' defensive mentality, accepting a draw is a good result, defensive substitutions, late substitutions. He still thinks that what is acceptable at Everton is acceptable at Manchester United.

Moyes has to grow into it, here is a different mentality from Everton, you can't expect him to just jump in the hotseat and do well from day one. The team he is using is still Fergie's, give him a few transfer windows to put his own stamp on the team and we will see dividends. He is a student of the game from what I have read of him and things will get better. Right now he would rather draw than lose because we are playing catch up and one point is better than one, like Fergie said he will do exceptionally well to win a title his first year here. Give him time, he will come good.

 

[JaffyJoe]

RVP won us the title last season. Rafael and Carrick were also brilliant.

They're all missing at the moment..

Agreed, our rivals weren't as good either. Moyes has to find the right balance which will take time. Fans have to be patient there will be growing pains. He will grow into the job and begin to understand what it really takes. He has been a solid manager but he hasn't ever really been a winner, it's a whole new philosophy to him. Like I said pre-season i'm happy with 3rd and a place in the Champions League quarter finals. Anything else is a bonus to me.

 

[JaffyJoe]

I personally wouldn't be too bothered if we didn't win the league but the fact that we have resorted to finishing in the top four rather than putting in a challenge is what I find disappointing. I don't think anyone is being spoilt for wanting that, I mean we are the current champions of England and we should be putting nothing less than a decent challenge.

I hear you, there is still time is what I would say. When I get frustrated I loo up and realise we are only in December. There is time for us to mount a challenge. He needs to bolster the midfield in winter, he is doing ok with what he has. A few results which should have gone our way and we are right in there. We will get better, believe me.

 

[ItsEssexRob]

Lots of bullishness here, but you can talk about Arsenal having tough fixtures over and over but they're winning them.

Cardiff away was tough before yesterday then suddenly it became easy when they won it.

United look much more likely to drop points than Arsenal at present, even when Arsenal did lose to what should have been a damaging defeat they just put their heads down and won 3 games on the trot for a combined 7-0, and now instead of being 7 behind, United are 9 behind.

Anyone who seriously believed or expected United should be challenging for the title based solely upon the fact they won it at a canter last season and have the same team are not really very clued up on football, it was clear a mile off that United will need a couple of seasons to adjust to the biggest change any team has had for decades.

United will finish in the top four however its highly likely to be in 4th position.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

RVP won us the title last season. Rafael and Carrick were also brilliant.

They're all missing at the moment..

Though I use this often, I am getting a feeling this is a excuse. Smalling is doing well for Rafael and Rooney is stepping in for RvP. Jones for Carrick is a bit dicey, but even with Carrick I don't think we would have fared better. Infact I think Jones once he becomes a more finished product can be a upgrade on Carrick. I think he had a couple of shots at goal yesterday, which Carrick rarely does!

Moyes subbing was a bit odd too. Not just this match, but everytime a sub is made the whole team is shuffled about. The only person who deserved to be subbed out first was Cleverly being totally unimpressive and he stayed on. Once the 3 subs were done, we lost all width and weakened the midfield further as Hernandez does not provide the midfield support as Kagawa.

Evra needs support. He is the only performer in that andasking him to handle both Walker and Lennon is just too much. Nani & Young cannot establish themselves.Either give them a run of games to prove themselves or sell them off. The constant on/off is neither helping them nor the team.