Agree to disagree I guess. Everton surely didn't change formation because of the equaliser, why would they? The match plan was working, why would you think they change it? They went deeper when Ronaldo entered the field, and then they brought Davies just after Pogba came on. From that point on, we only went for long balls because the center of the pitch was theirs.
We are an awfully coached team
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
At least Barca knew what they were doing when they hired Pep. They knew his philosophy from Barca B team and knew which style he would implement and if it will suit their players. They didn't expect such huge success but Pep was hired based on scientific basis.
We hired Ole based on honeymoon period and completely emotional basis. The plan from the start was Ole as caretaker and new manager in summer, but then the club witnessed the honeymoon period and threw all plans out of window. The reality is I don't see the basis United hired Ole as permanent manager on except hoping the honeymoon period will extend forever.
If we had waited till the end of the season and witnessed they way we finished such season with 2 wins out of our last 10 games, there's no way in hell Ole would have been hired permanently.
That's the problem in it.
The board has really messed up on multiple occasions with Ole, just not take the time to let things pan out and rushed to give him a contract twice.
No idea why people quote the Guardiola comparison when it’s a complete and wild outlier.
It’s like suggesting you should spend your money on lottery tickets because someone else, in another country, once won the lottery…
The simple, glaringly obvious, common sense logic that a global juggernaut like Utd employing the manager of fecking Molde, who got Cardiff relegated, would end in failure is so blatant it’s almost surreal.
As I said, he’s actually done surprisingly well considering his level as a coach!
The thing is, you can look deeper at manager’s record even if they’ve been in crap leagues or with crap teams.
It was obvious Brenten could coach a team to play good progressive football, just as it seems obvious Potter can also.
I don’t think Ole showed in any previous job that he had those capabilities.
Quite right - except to prove my point Potter hasn’t, and won’t relegate Brighton as Ole did with Cardiff.
He just relied on the individual brilliance of Bruno for so long. It's astonishing that after such a long time, we still don't have a style of play and still rely on players creating individual moments.
How did Molde play under him when they won things?
Our last 6 games:
- YB - lost
- West Ham - saved by DDG
- West Ham - lost
- Villa - lost
- Villareal - saved by DDG and Ronaldo
- Everton - draw (should’ve lost)
This is relegation form
- YB - lost
- West Ham - saved by DDG
- West Ham - lost
- Villa - lost
- Villareal - saved by DDG and Ronaldo
- Everton - draw (should’ve lost)
This is relegation form
Has he lost the players, not literally
I am not sure that Guaridola case has the same
probability as winning a lottery. Wasn't Zidane the same? But either way, you have to admit that an experienced, highly decorated manager can also end up being a disaster. The point here is that past success is weak indicator of future one
There are not many managers more decorated than Mourinho and Van Gaal but in my opinion their time with us was even worse than Ole's in that the sense of hopelessness was worse. They did win Europa League and FA Cup respectively, but we all know that the only trophies that truly matter for a club like United are EPL title and UCL.
We are not Everton to get excited by anything else. Besides, Ole only lost Europa League on weird penalties, that is a statistical fluke and had he won it, we would still be critical of him
Nope. No sign of that whatsoever beyond VDB's sulky bench antics.
Mourinho and LvG both brought Silverware to United and both had worse players than Ole currently has.
Ole has failed more than either of them. Though you (and I) LIKE him more doesn’t change that fact.
We’ll agree to disagree.
He will lose the dressing room soon. Many of our players want to compete. At some point being nice, doesn't cut it. Ronaldo his not going to be smiling his way through another slug of a season.
Get rid of this guy now ffs!
Get rid of this guy now ffs!
Yet Ole defendants will preach of how this is all part of the process. His underwhelming runs have been disregarded throughout his tenure, it’s bizarre. He didn’t warrant the job.
The worst thing about this, for me personally, is that despite being someone who has thought Ole isn't up for it since Summer '19, Ole comes across as a genuinely good person.
With Mourinho, he had a bit of a nasty side to him. With van Gaal, he seemed strong enough to not give a toss (though I never wanted him out). With Ole, he seems like such a genuinely good person, a "nice guy" that calling for his sacking, despite it making sense, just hurts a little bit added with the fact that he's a United legend.
It's a massive shame it hasn't worked out for him. A real, real massive shame. I so wish it did work out for him with us because of his character and because of his history with United.
A shame it has to come to an end sooner or later.
With Mourinho, he had a bit of a nasty side to him. With van Gaal, he seemed strong enough to not give a toss (though I never wanted him out). With Ole, he seems like such a genuinely good person, a "nice guy" that calling for his sacking, despite it making sense, just hurts a little bit added with the fact that he's a United legend.
It's a massive shame it hasn't worked out for him. A real, real massive shame. I so wish it did work out for him with us because of his character and because of his history with United.
A shame it has to come to an end sooner or later.
Yeah, he only needed to outspend nearly the rest of the league just to get top 4.
So Pep was hired because he was known in Barca B, Ole was hired because he also managed our youth team (so arguably was also known) + he knocked out star-packed PSG in two legs of UCL, with a much weaker United.
Sure, there was emotional aspect to it, but if you remember - everybody and their mothers wanted him and I am not sure it was any more of a gamble than hiring Pep. The diffence is that Pep worked out and Ole - less so. There was no more science in either of the cases
Ronaldo knows exactly what he’s doing when he storms off down the tunnel, apparently Pogba wasn’t too far behind him either. If we have a true ‘down tools’ performance then I agree, this won’t go on much longer.
Pogba didn't seem all too happy after Villareal. Ronaldo was seen sulking after the Everton game. Who knows what he is thinking, but I doubt they'd put up with this "go out and have some fun, lads" type of management for much longer.
The fans wanted him, yes. But the club should not have been bullied into making a rash decision like hiring him permanently before the season was over. If they were just smart enough to have some patience and not give in to sentimentality mid-season then he would have been let go.
But this is the same club that rewarded him with a 3 year extension a few months ago, so they don't really think long term
Ronaldo, Bruno, Pogba, Sancho and Greenwood can't play together as a collective, under Solskjaer at least. Off the ball our attack gets bypassed with ease like it's an empty pitch. If we're going to play Ronaldo, Bruno and two of Sancho, Greenwood and Rashford, throw Pogba in there and that's a terrible defensive unit. The 2 in midfield behind those 4 have to be very disciplined positionally and do a good job of closing down to make up for the lack of it, so that should count Pogba out. The problem is the alternative Solskjaer sticks to is McFred, two unreliable players. For now I think Matic and DVB needs to be used a lot more often as they're technically better and more consistent, and will give the side a better balance.
Pep was hired from the start as a permanent manager. Ole was hired as a caretaker. He was never meant to be the manager next season. He was just meant to manage till the end of the season till we hire a new manager and apparently a DOF next summer. He was just hired permanently because he started so well in the first 3 months. If there was any plan for Ole from the start, why didn't we just appoint him permanently from the get go ?
Whatever you look at how things panned out, appointing Ole permanently was just a knee jerk decision based on 3 months of good results and nothing else. Barca didn't hire Pep as a caretaker.
Won’t be sacking him before the run we have surely! Bring in a new guy who has to beat all the big guns straight away? Another disjointed performance with all that talent though.
Any club with ambition would have him gone tonight, although they probably wouldn’t have him to begin with.
A sad reflection on the state of the club. Show what their priorities are.
A sad reflection on the state of the club. Show what their priorities are.
Ultimately back then already the brand of football wasnt good enough especially the mast 10 games.
Beating PSG was fun, but and a great achievement but you must be very optimistic to suggest that knockout was showing what a genius Ole was and we werent incredibly lucky.
I honestly thought we played better today, despite the dissapointing result
Still though, if you want to compete for the league you got to beat those midtable teams at home, and we're not doing that right now
Still though, if you want to compete for the league you got to beat those midtable teams at home, and we're not doing that right now
The funny thing is that most of them have not known United changing managers like nappies between Sir Matt and SAF. SAF was not sacked because he had a top class track record before he came to United. Ole has none. It is mind boggling that one of the world's biggest club has a manager who has no clue how to manage at this level and never had managed a big club and has not won anything of note.
There's just times during the game where you see this huge area in the middle of the playing space where there's not a single United player. I wonder about that. There's literally zero players fitting into those spaces.
Agree. We have inept club management and it will be very hard for any manager to succeed in these conditions. With his latest actions, Ole is showing that he himself is also not good enough, but the root problem is the club management. Unfortunately, it seems like even after Woodward's departure we are not gonna get anybody decent
When we take only 5 points out of next 7 games, all hopes will be gone and painful reality will sink in.
The crazy thing is, by attempting to draw similarities between OgS & SAF they’re doing the great man a disservice.
Title of this thread says "awfully coached" but most of the discussion is about Ole. Can we mention elephant in the room, please? Coaching is not the same as managing.
1. The fact that our starting midfield is McFred, an impotent clueless combo, is poor management. Manager picks them. Manager didn't buy replacement and did not sell them.
2. The fact that Luke Shaw was blindly running towards Doucouré, completely abandoning his position on the left side, and leaving Townsend alone for the goal, is horrible coaching. How can Luke Shaw, starting LB of United and England international be so clueless in positional defense? It's mortifying. Means our defense is not properly coached and drilled.
We can complain about Ole's skills all we want but look at our coaching staff - how much confidence do they give you?
1. The fact that our starting midfield is McFred, an impotent clueless combo, is poor management. Manager picks them. Manager didn't buy replacement and did not sell them.
2. The fact that Luke Shaw was blindly running towards Doucouré, completely abandoning his position on the left side, and leaving Townsend alone for the goal, is horrible coaching. How can Luke Shaw, starting LB of United and England international be so clueless in positional defense? It's mortifying. Means our defense is not properly coached and drilled.
We can complain about Ole's skills all we want but look at our coaching staff - how much confidence do they give you?
They were selected by Ole.
This is what dragged us through that period. He’s never tactically had a clue but was often rescued by the individual brilliance ofBruno
We’re a team that for all intents and purposes has nothing more than a waving, smiling, mascot in charge
Well, this has been typical in many games this season. On many occasions when we have the ball near the byline, there are acres of space vacant in the middle with no one available for the pass or approaching the ball. Bruno and Pogba/other CM are either too far up front or closer to the corner of the pitch. We seem to have no defined shape in our play mostly, especially in the buildup.
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This. A lot of fans have been mixing up cause and effect.
SAF got time because he was a great manager. That doesn't mean that giving a manager time will make them great.
If the root problem is the club hiring managers not suited or not capable of managing us then I'm in agreement but saying it would be very hard for any manager to succeed is a fallacy. Just because Mourinho (rightly) was refused Perisic and ( not so much) Maguire and Ole was refused (If we were ever in for him) Rice doesn't mean the club hierarchy are holding us back.Agree. We have inept club management and it will be very hard for any manager to succeed in these conditions. With his latest actions, Ole is showing that he himself is also not good enough, but the root problem is the club management. Unfortunately, it seems like even after Woodward's departure we are not gonna get anybody decent
Look at the team thats been assembled for Ole. A top manager (insert your own name) would have this team flying without too much change and I find it very hard to understand and I'm not talking about you personally but in general, that people can't grasp this simple concept.
Ole for all his positiveness isn't up to going toe to toe with the best managers over the course of the season. I think there's very little doubt about that. We came second last season and there's no taking that away from Ole but I think most would agree that the results were a lot better than the performances which in no way sustainable for any period of time. It's also not a knee-jerk reaction from the last 4 games but for all of Ole tenure which has definitely had it's highs but by far outweighed by the lows at least performance wise.
You could blame the club hierarchy for putting Ole in this position but as far as holding Ole back I just can't see it.
Yikes