All of these threads need to be rolled into one called the incompetence of the hierarchy naming Murtough and Arnold as the key culprits. United have spent 400M under ETH and still it remains an impossible task to judge the direction of this team. The only hope that remains is Ratcliffe / Jassim completely revamping the structure with new DOF and staff so the club can build moving forward avoiding this momentary approach we are accustomed to.
What do we still need? Aka The never ending story
- Thread starter Devil may care
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
All of these threads need to be rolled into one called the incompetence of the hierarchy naming Murtough and Arnold as the key culprits. United have spent 400M under ETH and still it remains an impossible task to judge the direction of this team. The only hope that remains is Ratcliffe / Jassim completely revamping the structure with new DOF and staff so the club can build moving forward avoiding this momentary approach we are accustomed to.
Yet to see whether they are the problem or the owners. But there needs to be accountability somewhere when it comes to how to run this bloody club. Is it an excel formula sheet for wages or do we have actual people looking at industry standard and how much is acceptable against what we can afford?
I don’t mind us paying more because we can afford to but we really should be aware of what is good value against who we are bringing In.
Paying £350k to a kid from Dortmund who didn’t excel in anything is a good idea is nonsense.
We need to find more players who want to play here because we are Utd, like Hojlund, Amrabat, even Mount, rather than so called 'superstars' like Di Maria, Pogba 2nd time, and Sanchez who only came for the money. A team of youth players and bought players who play for the badge, rather than the paycheck might just get us on the right path to eventually start really challenging again. We could then sprinkle it with a superstar or two.
I look at Arsenal under Arteta. Have they got anyone in their ranks just for the money now? Even Rice their record signing wanted to go there this summer and wasnt touting round for the highest paycheck. Suddenly they have become a really good football team.
Out of the present side did Sancho come for the money? Maguire could have left, same as VDB and McTominey, but they would sooner sit on the bench picking up a fortune than play football regular.
I look at Arsenal under Arteta. Have they got anyone in their ranks just for the money now? Even Rice their record signing wanted to go there this summer and wasnt touting round for the highest paycheck. Suddenly they have become a really good football team.
Out of the present side did Sancho come for the money? Maguire could have left, same as VDB and McTominey, but they would sooner sit on the bench picking up a fortune than play football regular.
If you're a Brazilian coach, you haven't made it in football until you've been sacked at least 30 times and had a stint or two in Japan / Kuwait / UAE.
We could call the thread 'couch potatoes guess how much the intelligent agents of professional footballers moving to man united would be happy to accept as wages'
Two Centre backs. Varane is the only good one we have at the club. A back up striker Martial is absolutely done as a footballer injuries have killed him shame
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We really dont know what we need at this point. Firstly we have barely seen any of the new signings, barely seen some of our talented youngsters especially Mainoo. We also dont know if the likes of Casemeiro are declining or just out of form.
One thing that for me was one of the priority squad signings we failed to do is a centre back. Quite a few people questionign Martinez at the moment which is mad to me. Tooe arly to call him the answer after jsut one season, but the criticism seems to be a lot like after his first few games that he is too small etc etc.
But Varane was always likely to miss a lot of games and it has always to be been glaringly obvious that Lindelof is simply not good enough to be starting 20/30games for us at centre back if we are to challenge.
I get hte feelign Ten Hag wanted a cb but the Maguire situation stopped that. However we spent near £60m o Mount to it appears to play at 8 when we have Mainoo and Hannibal and we spent near £50m o Onana when Brighton spent £15m on Verbruggen and several big sides including SPurs, Chelsea and Arsenal bought in new keepers for a fraction of the cost of Onana.
Not saying either siging is worse or better than those or wotn be a success here. But this was a summer where we needed 6/7 signings and there was talk of raising £150m in sales.
We failed miserably on both counts, whether that was the playes here, the manager or the club (prob all three) who knows.
One things annoyed me and it has for a few seasons is this doing one deal at a time, waiting for a sale to happen before noving for a player.
I still feel we could have spent pretty much what we did and potentially got players as good if not better than we did, but mroe importantly cheaper and stll made one or two more deals ad not had to rely on a loan or loan deals.
Its similar to last summer for me under different parallels. We havent moved on close to the number of players we should have and we have over spent on players, half of them the wrogn ones which has stopped us doing more deals.
Just using examples Verbruggen and McAlister cost £50M less combined than we just paid for Onana and Mount....that extra £50m probably buys Todibo at cb and Gift Oba as a second striker,.
Our planning and execution of transfers this summer has been terrible
One thing that for me was one of the priority squad signings we failed to do is a centre back. Quite a few people questionign Martinez at the moment which is mad to me. Tooe arly to call him the answer after jsut one season, but the criticism seems to be a lot like after his first few games that he is too small etc etc.
But Varane was always likely to miss a lot of games and it has always to be been glaringly obvious that Lindelof is simply not good enough to be starting 20/30games for us at centre back if we are to challenge.
I get hte feelign Ten Hag wanted a cb but the Maguire situation stopped that. However we spent near £60m o Mount to it appears to play at 8 when we have Mainoo and Hannibal and we spent near £50m o Onana when Brighton spent £15m on Verbruggen and several big sides including SPurs, Chelsea and Arsenal bought in new keepers for a fraction of the cost of Onana.
Not saying either siging is worse or better than those or wotn be a success here. But this was a summer where we needed 6/7 signings and there was talk of raising £150m in sales.
We failed miserably on both counts, whether that was the playes here, the manager or the club (prob all three) who knows.
One things annoyed me and it has for a few seasons is this doing one deal at a time, waiting for a sale to happen before noving for a player.
I still feel we could have spent pretty much what we did and potentially got players as good if not better than we did, but mroe importantly cheaper and stll made one or two more deals ad not had to rely on a loan or loan deals.
Its similar to last summer for me under different parallels. We havent moved on close to the number of players we should have and we have over spent on players, half of them the wrogn ones which has stopped us doing more deals.
Just using examples Verbruggen and McAlister cost £50M less combined than we just paid for Onana and Mount....that extra £50m probably buys Todibo at cb and Gift Oba as a second striker,.
Our planning and execution of transfers this summer has been terrible
Basically we need to see the end of Glazers. Until then, everything is just a toss of the die
For me we still need
CB - commanding type
CM - to run midfield and can play in different formations. Rice would have been ideal but he’s gone now.
CF - I love the look of Hoylund but he needs help
Nice to have:
Fullback competition
Traditional winger to stretch play and provide chances
CB - commanding type
CM - to run midfield and can play in different formations. Rice would have been ideal but he’s gone now.
CF - I love the look of Hoylund but he needs help
Nice to have:
Fullback competition
Traditional winger to stretch play and provide chances
We need a Casemiro replacement, a Varane replacement. We should get 2 Varane replacements for the emergency that we are in and a marauding rb who offers as much in attack and defence.
This gives us cover to loan out Dalot, a proper Varane cover and a Maguire replacement. We don't want to get a single player in and remove Maguire at the same time, does that give us enough personnel in centre of defence?.
Dalot is a bit young and the manager seems to prefer AWB at rb who restricts the fluidity of our attack from the Right. Thinking back Evra came to us in his mid 20's after the excellent experience he got at Monaco, and Dalot is still young so maybe we should get another RB in and loan the young lad out?.
This gives us cover to loan out Dalot, a proper Varane cover and a Maguire replacement. We don't want to get a single player in and remove Maguire at the same time, does that give us enough personnel in centre of defence?.
Dalot is a bit young and the manager seems to prefer AWB at rb who restricts the fluidity of our attack from the Right. Thinking back Evra came to us in his mid 20's after the excellent experience he got at Monaco, and Dalot is still young so maybe we should get another RB in and loan the young lad out?.
Dalot is 24
Maguire and Evans aren't modern centrebacks. We need to replace them with two others. We can't rely on them as backup.
Left wing back is pretty solid, but we need someone with more ball control on the right. AWB is a fine player, but he's not elite.
Our midfield isn't very mobile and lack the ability to press well and progress the ball. We need two midfielders who do a bit of everything and an understudy for Cas - which could be Mainoo. I don't believe Amrabat will be a success, but I'm hoping he will prove me wrong.
Our forward line needs 2 additions as well. Another striker who can keep the ball up, play with his back to goal and press well, and a right winger.
All in all 5-7 new players, I have yet to see anyone in the youth team that looks capable of filling any of those roles, except maybe Mainoo.
Granted we don't need that many for a decent first XI, but I think we do for a title winning one.
Left wing back is pretty solid, but we need someone with more ball control on the right. AWB is a fine player, but he's not elite.
Our midfield isn't very mobile and lack the ability to press well and progress the ball. We need two midfielders who do a bit of everything and an understudy for Cas - which could be Mainoo. I don't believe Amrabat will be a success, but I'm hoping he will prove me wrong.
Our forward line needs 2 additions as well. Another striker who can keep the ball up, play with his back to goal and press well, and a right winger.
All in all 5-7 new players, I have yet to see anyone in the youth team that looks capable of filling any of those roles, except maybe Mainoo.
Granted we don't need that many for a decent first XI, but I think we do for a title winning one.
I thought he was still 20 yrs old!. Let's see how he does this year before we move him on, I wouldn't mind letting him move on if we get to recruit a better rb.
He will be 25 in March I think. AWB is a few months older
Is that his FIFA rating? Guy is ass.
Man Utd owner did spend a lot of money in player transfer and wages, so at this point I would say a new DOF, a better football management and player recruitment structure.
In order to get those we need new owners as the Glazers are clearly incapable of implementing any of this as we’ve seen over the last 10 years.
May be they just need to hire a new CEO in the mean time while waiting for the result of the Saudi bid? It is clear to everyone now it is a management issue.
They kept Ed Woodward as CEO for years despite being a clueless clown who squandered hundreds of millions and consistently handed out ridiculous contracts to shite players. They aren’t getting rid of Arnold after a couple of years. Nothing will truly change until the Glazers go, it’s as simple as that.
RB
CB
DM
CM
RW
No.10
LW
Where to fecking start…
CB
DM
CM
RW
No.10
LW
Where to fecking start…
And we gave him a new contract so he will be with us until he's 29.
A RB, at least one CB, at least two midfielders, a RW and a striker. Possibly a keeper as well.
I’ll say it all day, we need a commanding CB! Real shame we couldn’t get Kim
A midfielder that can run. I know that sounds like a very basic requirement, but Casemiro and Eriksen have been dribbled past so frequently that we're in desperate need of one.
We also need one that can carry the ball long distances through the lines ala Musiala tonight. But that's a much harder type of played to get. They're in high demand.
We also need one that can carry the ball long distances through the lines ala Musiala tonight. But that's a much harder type of played to get. They're in high demand.
I know it's highly unlikely but if we manage to get a CL place, we should try get Alphonso Davies next summer. His contract runs out in 2025.
CM - no legs on Eriksen and Casemiro.
CB - Varane can't be relied too much when he kept getting sidelined every other week.
ST - to replace Martial next season.
Hopefully Amad can get back soon and show us what he is all about. Then RW would be sorted.
CB - Varane can't be relied too much when he kept getting sidelined every other week.
ST - to replace Martial next season.
Hopefully Amad can get back soon and show us what he is all about. Then RW would be sorted.
I think we have a strong squad. Strong enough for CL anyway. We need to improve now. If the manager has fallen out with Sancho then need to replace him once sold obviously.
These all of the players that need to be replaced and it's necessary to find an upgrade:
Maguire, McTominay, Eriksen(no legs), Lindelof(too passive, not good enough), Martial, Casemiro(no legs anymore), Varane(fitness issues), Lindelof(not good enough), Bruno Fernandes(no ball carrying, ball retention ability whatsoever - this is arguably the most important one), Dalot/Wan Bissaka(one of them), Sancho(if he's fallen out with the manager, but regardless), Pellistri(probably not good enough)...
Haven't even mentioned toothless Antony(who might end up in jail, by the way) and the eternal right wing problem we seem to have...
I've counted about(at least) 12 of them. That's the minimum amount of players we need to replace in order to seriously compete with the best clubs in the world - mainly City, but also Bayern, Real, Arsenal, Liverpool, Barcelona, Brighton
, even Spurs(who are better than us at the moment)...
Maguire, McTominay, Eriksen(no legs), Lindelof(too passive, not good enough), Martial, Casemiro(no legs anymore), Varane(fitness issues), Lindelof(not good enough), Bruno Fernandes(no ball carrying, ball retention ability whatsoever - this is arguably the most important one), Dalot/Wan Bissaka(one of them), Sancho(if he's fallen out with the manager, but regardless), Pellistri(probably not good enough)...
Haven't even mentioned toothless Antony(who might end up in jail, by the way) and the eternal right wing problem we seem to have...
I've counted about(at least) 12 of them. That's the minimum amount of players we need to replace in order to seriously compete with the best clubs in the world - mainly City, but also Bayern, Real, Arsenal, Liverpool, Barcelona, Brighton
, even Spurs(who are better than us at the moment)...Right back Frimpong the best option but Leverkuson are building a good thing under Alonso so be difficult.
2 Centre Backs Lindelof and Maguire are not good enough. Todibo, Scalvani , Antonio Silva. I quite rate Killman at Wolves as a good back up left sided defender but Wolves will probably demand higher fee than he is worth
Striker Really like the look of Hojlund but Martial is done and he needs proper competition . Taremi at Porto could be a good option affordable. Other options Toney, Haller, any suggestions? Striker market is pretty weak atm
Box to midfielder an upgrade on Mctominey . Unless Hannibal can step up and save the club some money. Kone?
Right Winger The never ending problem at this club. Sancho likely wont play again under ETH.Antony situation will likely drag on. Nico Gonzalez. Yeremy Pino, Michael Olise who I personally think is a superstar in the making. Olise be my choice but would feel for Palace as like them and hate to see them lose another good player.
2 Centre Backs Lindelof and Maguire are not good enough. Todibo, Scalvani , Antonio Silva. I quite rate Killman at Wolves as a good back up left sided defender but Wolves will probably demand higher fee than he is worth
Striker Really like the look of Hojlund but Martial is done and he needs proper competition . Taremi at Porto could be a good option affordable. Other options Toney, Haller, any suggestions? Striker market is pretty weak atm
Box to midfielder an upgrade on Mctominey . Unless Hannibal can step up and save the club some money. Kone?
Right Winger The never ending problem at this club. Sancho likely wont play again under ETH.Antony situation will likely drag on. Nico Gonzalez. Yeremy Pino, Michael Olise who I personally think is a superstar in the making. Olise be my choice but would feel for Palace as like them and hate to see them lose another good player.
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Agree with most here. RB, CB, CM, RW and also think we need another LW, getting rid of Sancho and giving Rashford something to think about. Mitoma for me at LW.
Striker would be nice but needs to be world class and I don't know who there is for that.
Striker would be nice but needs to be world class and I don't know who there is for that.
Truthfully we need about 10 players, a mix of starters/depth, whilst releasing/selling a bunch of the dross.
GK - Onana will be our number 1 unless he continues in the vein of form he's been in since he signed.
RB - I don't think either Dalot or AWB are good enough to be a first choice player for the standard we want to get too.
CB - We can't rely on Varane/Martinez as our only capable CBs. We need another starter thrown into the mix beside them, with another depth option.
LB - Luke Shaw isn't reliable. He blows hot and cold. On his day - brilliant. But he can get upgraded/become a rotation option. I don't see Malacia ousting him. Regulion has looked better than Malacia has for us in these 2 matches he's played.
CDM - Casemiro doesn't have the legs to be the undisputed starter here. We need someone who can play with, or start over him. Is Amrabat a mandatory purchase after his loan?
CM - Bruno will still be captain and a starter. You'd imagine Mount will hopefully kick on. Unless Mainoo/Hannibal kick on, we are poor in depth here. McTominay and Eriksen should go in the summer.
LW - Rashford/Garnacho is fine.
ST - Hojlund looks good so far, but we still need another actual #9 to be an option alongside or ahead of him.
RW - I'm not convinced any of the options are at the standard we require. Amad could be, but Sancho needs to go, and if we can get a decent fee for Antony I wouldn't say no either.
GK - Onana will be our number 1 unless he continues in the vein of form he's been in since he signed.
RB - I don't think either Dalot or AWB are good enough to be a first choice player for the standard we want to get too.
CB - We can't rely on Varane/Martinez as our only capable CBs. We need another starter thrown into the mix beside them, with another depth option.
LB - Luke Shaw isn't reliable. He blows hot and cold. On his day - brilliant. But he can get upgraded/become a rotation option. I don't see Malacia ousting him. Regulion has looked better than Malacia has for us in these 2 matches he's played.
CDM - Casemiro doesn't have the legs to be the undisputed starter here. We need someone who can play with, or start over him. Is Amrabat a mandatory purchase after his loan?
CM - Bruno will still be captain and a starter. You'd imagine Mount will hopefully kick on. Unless Mainoo/Hannibal kick on, we are poor in depth here. McTominay and Eriksen should go in the summer.
LW - Rashford/Garnacho is fine.
ST - Hojlund looks good so far, but we still need another actual #9 to be an option alongside or ahead of him.
RW - I'm not convinced any of the options are at the standard we require. Amad could be, but Sancho needs to go, and if we can get a decent fee for Antony I wouldn't say no either.
Remove all toxicity from the club, that starts with the owners.
Agree, not signing a cb was our biggest mistake this last window, will cost us a lot of points with Varanes constant niggles
Maguire not leaving was a big factor also. He has been such a disastrous signing. I can’t see how we off load him now with his wages being so high. He will become the new Phil Jones sit around and do nothing until his deal Expires.
We are almost better off offloading Lindelof to free up a space in the squad for a new CB. As his wages aren’t as high as Maguires and likely would rather play football than waste his career on the bench like Maguire
If we go back to 2 guys for every spot, then my thinking is we look like this next year:
Hojlund, Striker
Rashford, Garnacho
Antony, RW
Bruno, Hannibal
Mount, CM
Casemiro, Amrabat
Dalot, Wan-Bissaka
Varane, RCB
Lisandro, Lindelof
Shaw, Malacia/Reguilon
Onana, Bayindir(?)
and then let's say Pellistri, Mainoo, Evans and Heaton are the extra guys in each area, maybe Gore goes on loan.
So, 4 signings, which is about normal. Spend big on a young RCB to eventually succeed Varane and the box to box midfielder we still need (can be in his late 20s already if we believe in Mainoo or Gore) and medium on a RW to challenge Antony and a reliable backup striker.
Hojlund, Striker
Rashford, Garnacho
Antony, RW
Bruno, Hannibal
Mount, CM
Casemiro, Amrabat
Dalot, Wan-Bissaka
Varane, RCB
Lisandro, Lindelof
Shaw, Malacia/Reguilon
Onana, Bayindir(?)
and then let's say Pellistri, Mainoo, Evans and Heaton are the extra guys in each area, maybe Gore goes on loan.
So, 4 signings, which is about normal. Spend big on a young RCB to eventually succeed Varane and the box to box midfielder we still need (can be in his late 20s already if we believe in Mainoo or Gore) and medium on a RW to challenge Antony and a reliable backup striker.
Bruno G
Todibo
Olise
Toney
Two we should attempt in January if we have investment.
Todibo
Olise
Toney
Two we should attempt in January if we have investment.
If we reach top 4 again as our level then next step is to level up. That means special players. I'd go all out for a CB. 80-100 mill. A Gvardiol player. Composing, strong, dominating. Someone who takes Varanes place. Not a back up Don't know who but if one comes along then go all out for him.
Then blow the rest of the budget on Oshimen if he has another top season. Bid 130. Just get it done. Or if another special striker appears then get them instead.
Then blow the rest of the budget on Oshimen if he has another top season. Bid 130. Just get it done. Or if another special striker appears then get them instead.
Ralf was correct this whole squad bar Bruno, Varane and the new signings need chopping. We still have players that were here under Jose. Attitude problem in the squad that needs sorting bad
Ragnick wanted rid of Rashford. He’s going to be proven right in time.
I wouldn't be confident in a complete swap out. Anyone we bring into the club gets diseased, it's a very unhappy place most of the time. Jose said it was sad club and it still is. New blood is quickly infected.
Bruno was perhaps the most resistant, we got about 12-18 good months before his face and body turned to anguish and grimace.
Bruno was perhaps the most resistant, we got about 12-18 good months before his face and body turned to anguish and grimace.